Question about Lionheart

YoMovesYoMoves Member Posts: 1,284 ★★★★
in Strategy and Tips
The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

Comments

  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    I really need this to be explained. Is a parry stun going to degen me with despair?

    OR is a pain in the ass as is. Not being able to heal block him is going to make him sooo much harder.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    edited May 2019
    What do you mean by “beat up on”?

    Void will trigger the degen.

    Despair should not but was in the beta which is likely the cause of the node being absent for map 7s introduction. This was likely corrected and why we are seeing Lionheart being added back in.

    It’s meant to encourage healblock.
  • Kabam DKKabam DK Moderator Posts: 221
    edited May 2019
    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
  • Crimson8399Crimson8399 Member Posts: 763 ★★★
    Aside from greed why keep making these character deterrent nodes? I thought the point of the game use a wide variety of champs not you have to bring this champ or u get wrecked.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • TacoScottyTacoScotty Member Posts: 407 ★★
    edited May 2019
    so based on mod response, I assume it is limited to debuffs which in isolation impact healing rate. This would be void’s petrify, CAIW petrify (synergy)... if their are specific other buffs out there other than petrify which in isolation impact healing rate? Poison / DrV? Be nice to just have a list like:

    Petrify: Void (intimating presence), CAIW (tech synergy), Wasp (L2)..
    Poison: DrV (L1), Abom, Ultron prime, ...

    Is there any other debuff?

    I assume if despair is ok, the utility mastery which reduces healing while stunned is ok as well?

    Also i was under impression despair is capped at 90% / 6 debuffs - does petrify push over 100% as others mention?
  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
    No, reversing healing cause you to degen. It’s possible to reverse healing with petrify. Or was unless somethings changed.
  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
    No, reversing healing cause you to degen. It’s possible to reverse healing with petrify. Or was unless somethings changed.
    I really appreciate you're guessing but I'd rather get it from a mod who actually knows.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
    No, reversing healing cause you to degen. It’s possible to reverse healing with petrify. Or was unless somethings changed.
    I really appreciate you're guessing but I'd rather get it from a mod who actually knows.
    I’m not guessing. Despair does not reverse healing, petrify will reverse healing when paired with despair and enough debuffs or other circumstances like CAIW being paired with a tech *unless they changed that, but that is doubtful since petrify is the mechanic Void uses and causes degen. This was all figured out during the beta which people made videos on.
  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
    No, reversing healing cause you to degen. It’s possible to reverse healing with petrify. Or was unless somethings changed.
    I really appreciate you're guessing but I'd rather get it from a mod who actually knows.
    I’m not guessing. Despair does not reverse healing, petrify will reverse healing when paired with despair and enough debuffs or other circumstances like CAIW being paired with a tech *unless they changed that, but that is doubtful since petrify is the mechanic Void uses and causes degen. This was all figured out during the beta which people made videos on.
    It was broken in the beta, which is why they didn't release it. We don't know how it will actually function as it's been "fixed" since then.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    edited May 2019
    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
    No, reversing healing cause you to degen. It’s possible to reverse healing with petrify. Or was unless somethings changed.
    I really appreciate you're guessing but I'd rather get it from a mod who actually knows.
    I’m not guessing. Despair does not reverse healing, petrify will reverse healing when paired with despair and enough debuffs or other circumstances like CAIW being paired with a tech *unless they changed that, but that is doubtful since petrify is the mechanic Void uses and causes degen. This was all figured out during the beta which people made videos on.
    It was broken in the beta, which is why they didn't release it. We don't know how it will actually function as it's been "fixed" since then.
    Well your question was answered then despair does not count.

    I was giving a warning about pairing despair with petrify which can reverse healing which will cause Lion Heart to trigger. CAIW with tech and enough petrifies will cause healing to be reversed which will also trigger it.

    If you have enough incinerates on OR with despair and the parry while having petrify you will reverse healing and trigger the degen. CAIW can function in similar ways but is far easier to trigger the degen if paired with a tech on his team.
  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
    No, reversing healing cause you to degen. It’s possible to reverse healing with petrify. Or was unless somethings changed.
    I really appreciate you're guessing but I'd rather get it from a mod who actually knows.
    I’m not guessing. Despair does not reverse healing, petrify will reverse healing when paired with despair and enough debuffs or other circumstances like CAIW being paired with a tech *unless they changed that, but that is doubtful since petrify is the mechanic Void uses and causes degen. This was all figured out during the beta which people made videos on.
    It was broken in the beta, which is why they didn't release it. We don't know how it will actually function as it's been "fixed" since then.
    Well your question was answered then despair does not count.

    I was giving a warning about pairing despair with petrify which can reverse healing which will cause Lion Heart to trigger. CAIW with tech and enough petrifies will cause healing to be reversed which will also trigger it.

    If you have enough incinerates on OR with despair and the parry while having petrify you will reverse healing and trigger the degen. CAIW can function in similar ways but is far easier to trigger the degen if paired with a tech on his team.
    That's assuming petrify also triggers the degen, which hasn't been confirmed yet.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    RagamugginGunner said:

    Kabam DK said:

    YoMoves said:

    The community seems to have a general question about the new Lionheart node for Omega Red in map 7 of alliance quests that's not entirely explained.

    The node's wording is kinda poor-what counts for Lionheart? Does Heal Block count to be beat up on? Does Void count? Does the Despair mastery count? If Despair counts, that means we either have to turn the entire Assassin mastery tree off, or never debuff a character with Aggression: Regeneration. Some qualification would be much appreciated.

    Void counts
    Heal Block does NOT count (Heal Block is what this Buff is meant to encourage)
    Despair Mastery does NOT count.
    SO spamming sp1s with Hype with despair still works? What about Cap Beardo?
    Prolly don’t want to be doing that if you parry with Hype while OR is heavily debuffed and petrify is in your mastery tree or if awakened CAIW and paired with a tech champ or has petrify in his masteries. Once you reverse that healing you’re going to have a bad time.
    Well he said that despair doesn't count, which is why I'm asking. Does putting enough debuffs on the enemy to heal block him cause me to degen?
    No, reversing healing cause you to degen. It’s possible to reverse healing with petrify. Or was unless somethings changed.
    I really appreciate you're guessing but I'd rather get it from a mod who actually knows.
    I’m not guessing. Despair does not reverse healing, petrify will reverse healing when paired with despair and enough debuffs or other circumstances like CAIW being paired with a tech *unless they changed that, but that is doubtful since petrify is the mechanic Void uses and causes degen. This was all figured out during the beta which people made videos on.
    It was broken in the beta, which is why they didn't release it. We don't know how it will actually function as it's been "fixed" since then.
    Well your question was answered then despair does not count.

    I was giving a warning about pairing despair with petrify which can reverse healing which will cause Lion Heart to trigger. CAIW with tech and enough petrifies will cause healing to be reversed which will also trigger it.

    If you have enough incinerates on OR with despair and the parry while having petrify you will reverse healing and trigger the degen. CAIW can function in similar ways but is far easier to trigger the degen if paired with a tech on his team.
    That's assuming petrify also triggers the degen, which hasn't been confirmed yet.
    Petrify reverses regen you can confirm that yourself right now, it’s the mehanic Void uses. Reversing regen triggers degen, that’s the node.
  • UltimatheoryUltimatheory Member Posts: 520 ★★★
    Yeah it would be great to get some mod clarity on this. Does Mastery combo of Despair+Petrify count as heal reversal in this scenario? Beta testing implies yes but if Despair was changed was the Petrify mastery as well?
  • Anurag1606Anurag1606 Member Posts: 1,184 ★★★
    TacoScotty said:

    so based on mod response, I assume it is limited to debuffs which in isolation impact healing rate. This would be void’s petrify, CAIW petrify (synergy)... if their are specific other buffs out there other than petrify which in isolation impact healing rate? Poison / DrV? Be nice to just have a list like:

    Petrify: Void (intimating presence), CAIW (tech synergy), Wasp (L2)..
    Poison: DrV (L1), Abom, Ultron prime, ...

    Is there any other debuff?

    I assume if despair is ok, the utility mastery which reduces healing while stunned is ok as well?

    Also i was under impression despair is capped at 90% / 6 debuffs - does petrify push over 100% as others mention?

    Voodoo is out. Omega being poison immune.
  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    Anymore Mod info on Lionheart?
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • hiddenblizzardhiddenblizzard Member Posts: 506 ★★
    zeezee57 said:

    I don't run map 7 and don't plan to so this won't impact me in the least, but am I the only one who finds it off putting they release champs with these abilities, the community loves them and burns tons of resources ranking them with these game modes in mind and then they release nodes like this to make then unplayable against?

    Indomitable was fine because it stunted the ability without making the character unplayable against it. Why the need to take it a step further and force all these R5 Voids to the bench in such an important game mode when the only reason he's R5 in the first place is because you guys created him to excel in these exact situations?

    What do you expect? If void could do that with ease then will map 7 be any difficult?
  • RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Member Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    hiddenblizzard said:

    zeezee57 said:

    I don't run map 7 and don't plan to so this won't impact me in the least, but am I the only one who finds it off putting they release champs with these abilities, the community loves them and burns tons of resources ranking them with these game modes in mind and then they release nodes like this to make then unplayable against?

    Indomitable was fine because it stunted the ability without making the character unplayable against it. Why the need to take it a step further and force all these R5 Voids to the bench in such an important game mode when the only reason he's R5 in the first place is because you guys created him to excel in these exact situations?

    What do you expect? If void could do that with ease then will map 7 be any difficult?
    As someone who rights every OR with Void in my BG, it's definitely not easy. Taking him down w/o getting hit or triggering 10 spores or Deathfield is really hard. I guess I wasn't using enough items for Kabam so they decided to remove one of the best counters to OR from the conversation. Can't wait to see the "Robots gain spores 4 times faster" node in season 7.
  • xNigxNig Member Posts: 7,336 ★★★★★
    Sorry to dig up an old thread.

    This isn’t about Map 7 but rather, about the Lionheart node.

    I’ve tried AA against Annihilus on Buffet/Lionheart in AW and his neuros trigger the Lionheart degen.

    Is this working as intended or an unintended interaction between Neurotoxins and the node?
  • YoMovesYoMoves Member Posts: 1,284 ★★★★
    Are you sure it's the Neuros and not Poison?
  • xNigxNig Member Posts: 7,336 ★★★★★
    Hmmm.. oh yea makes sense. Never thought of that. Thanks for pointing out that possibility.
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