Summoner Sigil - Discussion Thread

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.

sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players

Aside from the usual Kabam shills, this is CLEARLY getting a negative response. Listen to the feedback and let’s compromise! I understand a subscription is going to happen but it’s being done wrong, clearly.
The Black Market, energy and inventory perks should be STANDARD for all, let the subscription INCREASE their respective value.
Players shouldn’t have to pay for access to these, let them pay for increased value to these.
Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a shill?

here is the thing, you guys cannot even agree on what is the issue with the deal, it is not a problem with the deal, it is a problem with you wanting more free stuff. Shoot the Black Market is not even QOL which most of the people in this thread has stated is fine with being in the deal and not free. The other players only want QOL stuff.
The issue with the deal is Kabam capped inventory and we’ve asked for increase for years, same with energy and an idea like the proposed Black Market and all of these being griped about and wanted for years but now behind a paywall.
Is a subscription with added benefits good, yes.
Should things we, as a community, have asked and begged for years to be implemented but only if you pay, no.
So what exactly should be included? Things no one wants? If you want it pay for it, if you dont the game runs just fine without it. QOL is the primary things that should be in these deals, not other things, otherwise it is either useless or gives a massive competitive advantage.
As per my last post.. lol
The things that should be standard are the Market, energy and inventory perks. Let the subscription ADD to the perks.
Out of those 3 the only thing that they are not ADDIng to the perks are the market. The energy and inventory
“Perks” are in addition to what you currently have. Again the problem you are having is not what is going on, but that you want more for free.
As per my previous post..
The 3 that I mentioned being available to all player and subscription INCREASES the perks.
Another 25% inventory, better Market trade-ins and 4 min energy refill.
Is it that hard to see what I’m saying?
Why should they be offering these for free?

Is it hard to understand that?
No worries. I posted earlier that the community has been begging for years for these specific changes: energy refill faster, raise the inventory limit and give us a market to trade stuff we don’t have use for something of use.
Kabam said “we can’t/unable/won’t do that” for years, now they can buuuut only if you pay.
Just because the community begged for it, they have to be given for free? Like WHAT?
Yes. Why would a business decide to NOT listen to their customers, they have the ability to implement these changes and decided to do it but only if we pay.
They did listen. It just isn't what you were expecting.
They clearly have heard our input but decided to put our(the community) suggestions available behind a paywall.
The proper way to handle suggestions and subscriptions is to make the desired changes available to all and the subscription amplify the perks of said standard subscriptions.

That's YOUR opinion. Not necessarily how it always works. There isn't a standard and up to the company.

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.

Actually you said it directly to me.

Lormif

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.
sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players

And you dont see Kabam doing it either, but still bethesda and ubisoft also typically charge $60 for a game that gives you a couple months worth of enjoyment then you have to buy another game. This game gives you way more value than any of those studios do for the buck.

UlfricFrost

Excuse my ignorance, what is included in this package that summoners have been asking for? I understand the gold quest, but I haven't seen the rest really be asked for.
They’ve pretty much just pay walled quality of life improvements which is insanely stupid in my opinion

Agreed! Makes me sick they’ve pulled this.

There isn't anything in the game that's mandatory to pay for, in order to play the game. There are optional purchases that provide added benefits, but that's the same as any other Mobile Game I can think of.

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.
sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players
And you dont see Kabam doing it either, but still bethesda and ubisoft also typically charge $60 for a game that gives you a couple months worth of enjoyment then you have to buy another game. This game gives you way more value than any of those studios do for the buck.

lol if you think 6 months of sigil subscription is better than games like skyrim or assassin's creed. also i fail to see how can even compare quality of console gaming with mobile gaming.

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.
sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players

So other companies have to make a good game in order for people to buy it/play it but Kabam, who has made a good game, has to go one further and has to make better in game decisions as just having a good game isn't enough?

You cant honestly sit there and say no one Will complain. This community complains about everything, even free stuff. Go look at the mega thread for the 3 month calendar. Go look at threads for the free 5* AG we got at Xmas. Nothing but complaints.

DNA3000

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.
sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players
So other companies have to make a good game in order for people to buy it/play it but Kabam, who has made a good game, has to go one further and has to make better in game decisions as just having a good game isn't enough?

You cant honestly sit there and say no one Will complain. This community complains about everything, even free stuff. Go look at the mega thread for the 3 month calendar. Go look at threads for the free 5* AG we got at Xmas. Nothing but complaints.

I'm unaware of any game with official forums in which there were no complaints. I'm not even aware of any game with official forums in which there were few complaints. Some people literally get more enjoyment out of complaining about a game than playing it, so I don't think it is possible for a game to garner no complaints.

But setting that aside, no two people want the same thing from a game. For every person that wants the game to give out more rewards, there are people who think it gives out too many. For every player that wants less grind, there are players that want more opportunity to grind. There are players that want the game to be easier, that want it to be harder, that want it to be harder in different ways. Part of what makes this inevitable is there is a single player component to the game and a cooperative multiplayer component and a competitive component. When you give things away or make it easier to get things, you dilute the value of accomplishing things in the game and reduce the competitive edge that it is possible to get. Some people want that. Some people explicitly want the opposite. The game has to try to offer something for everyone, but it cannot offer everything for everyone, and if it offers everything for someone, there won't be any other players of the game.

The game needs and targets players that want something the game offers, and is willing to accept the fact that many other things won't be what they want. If they need everything to be as they wish, they'll have to look for a more narrowly targeted game than this one which casts a much wider net.

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.
sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players
So other companies have to make a good game in order for people to buy it/play it but Kabam, who has made a good game, has to go one further and has to make better in game decisions as just having a good game isn't enough?

You cant honestly sit there and say no one Will complain. This community complains about everything, even free stuff. Go look at the mega thread for the 3 month calendar. Go look at threads for the free 5* AG we got at Xmas. Nothing but complaints.

why do you think everyone is complaining. everyone is entitled to their personal opinions so calling other people whiners is not right. and even if they are giving opinions or complaints( according to you) why do you feel the need to reply to their every post. just stop

ESF

Hopefully this is just a test run and no one buys it so they realize what can make them money and adjust appropriately.
It is kind of interesting to me that no one (that I can recall) has either guessed, stated, or conjectured the purpose to the VIP subscription program in the first place, beyond "Kabam greedy, make more money." I'm pretty sure it is designed to make money, but so is every other cash offer. But in fact, making more money than they do now is I think incidental in the short term. I suspect there's a specific target they are aiming for, and I'm curious to see if anyone else guesses what that target is, and whether Kabam succeeds in hitting it.

I will say this: the response to the announcement has been more *positive* than I had originally guessed. Sure, there are a lot of complaints, but compared to other announcements in the past the actual *number* of complaints is far less, and there are a lot more mixed reactions here and elsewhere than I initially thought there would be. That suggests to me the program is going to be more popular with more players than might be obvious. In that respect, I think the test is more likely to succeed than fail.

I hope it is popular, because that would hopefully mean people at Kabam are actively engaged in the further development of the game and that it lasts well into the future.

I think if Kabam were truly greedy, man...to me, they leave money on the table every single month. People can disagree, but I'd open my wallet for far more things than they currently offer.

For example: I posted about a month ago about OG Iron Man. I would like the character to be buffed but realize that it's probably not going to happen any time soon, if ever.

I also would like OG Iron Man's skin to be updated, like the Extremis version from the comics or even the Endgame version. I liked that one.

So, if Kabam offered me an "OG Iron Man Upgrade Kit" for $19.99 that contained an updated skin and buffs, I'd pay that and be done with it.

That's what I ultimately hope this subscription service becomes: If it's popular and evolves, I want to customize and personalize my favorite characters.

Maybe that will never happen. Maybe I dream too big.

But one thing I know is that it will never happen if Kabam isn't financially rewarded for doing so and if a subscription service gets me what I want, then a subscription service is what I will support

Lormif

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.
sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players
And you dont see Kabam doing it either, but still bethesda and ubisoft also typically charge $60 for a game that gives you a couple months worth of enjoyment then you have to buy another game. This game gives you way more value than any of those studios do for the buck.
lol if you think 6 months of sigil subscription is better than games like skyrim or assassin's creed. also i fail to see how can even compare quality of console gaming with mobile gaming.

Sure what? That is the third time you have accused me of saying something I didn’t. I said this game offers more bang for the buck than those games, I didn’t mention anything about the Sigil... you have been able to play upwards of 4.5 years for free, compared to a couple months of those other titles for $60, it isn’t even close... I am starting to think you don’t want to have an actual legit conversation.

In any event, this is becoming tiresome. This isn't a Thread on who should or shouldn't participate based on the prejudice that people are Trolls and anything they say is derailing. Believe it or not before this side-bar, we were actually discussing the subject. That doesn't have to mean we're all in agreement, and if others have a different perspective, that doesn't mean they're trying to derail things. They just don't agree. I'm personally going back to what we're here to discuss. Not who should and shouldn't participate. Part of being respectful is keeping those views to ourselves. That's about all I have to say on that.

So stop arguing just to argue.
We were discussing the topic until the Company shills started in. If the same handful of pro-company people would stop direct attacks on people’s input this post would be more constructive. The same handful of people immediately go after any pro player comment, pushing the pro Company agenda. We get it you are undercover employees with game and forum accounts lol
Chill. People have a right to discuss, it’s a forum lol
You literally just called people "company shills" and then in the next sentence complain about people making direct attacks and making posts more constructive, and then dismiss people trying to discuss this and how it us unfair to your right to discuss.. I am not sure you understand anything you are saying.
I sure did. Also didn’t name anyone directly.
You really think that is important. You made a non constructive post dismissing people trying to discuss this on the forums. You literally did what you are complaining others are supposedly doing. How about stop the name calling and discuss it.
wow you are the one that's filling up 10 pages of the thread with your buddies who always tell everyone else to not complain about anything kabam does and you are blaming one person who just don't want to hear your pro kabam agendas. seriously bruh!
I never once told anyone not to complain, nice strawman, and what about the other people filling up 20 pages of a threat with shill, money grab and the like, do you think we like hearing these things constantly either? Seriously Bruh! It is two ways.
so why don't you stop so others can stop name calling too. plus the way i see it if you have given your opinions just enjoy man if you think other players don't hear you why do you feel the need to reply them.
I have never done any name calling, and 90+% of the people I have been replying to are people who replied to me. This is a discussion board, discussions are allowed. If you want to express your opinion in an echo chamber there are lots of other options.
let me rephrase if people are name calling you and others who support this sigil idea why not just stop bcoz people who made up their minds that this is bad won't be listening to you no matter what. also all i hear is kabam needs to make money somehow i don't get it. what are you kabam's marketing team?? why should i care about kabam's revenue or profits or whatever i just want in game improvements as a player that's it
Why do you keep asking me about things I supposedly stated that I never actually stated.. That being said it is a valid argument, because they do need to make it. Why do you have to accuse me of being part of their marketing team?

You should care about their revenue and profit if you want the game to continue, improvements that cost the game its ability to function will lead to a dead game.
sorry as player i should only care about game and what i am getting in game. i don't see bethesda or ubisoft saying pls have mercy on our revenue stream and all and buy our game. they make a good game everyone will buy it. that being said if kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one will complain. but you do have to admit one thing though players have been posting for gold realms and inventory increase for more than a year now i think kabam should have done it as a goodwill gesture for all players
So other companies have to make a good game in order for people to buy it/play it but Kabam, who has made a good game, has to go one further and has to make better in game decisions as just having a good game isn't enough?

You cant honestly sit there and say no one Will complain. This community complains about everything, even free stuff. Go look at the mega thread for the 3 month calendar. Go look at threads for the free 5* AG we got at Xmas. Nothing but complaints.
why do you think everyone is complaining. everyone is entitled to their personal opinions so calling other people whiners is not right. and even if they are giving opinions or complaints( according to you) why do you feel the need to reply to their every post. just stop

Which is it? I'm entitled to my own opinion or I have to stop posting?

I responded directly to your comment where you said "if Kabam make better in game decision about free and paid stuff no one would complain." I simply pointed out that will never happen.

Also, I didn't call anyone a whiner. I pointed out things that were completely free that all you had to was log in and people complained out it. It's not made up, it's 100% facts.

Worknprogress

Look, I understand people not liking this I just think the degree of reaction is completely unwarranted. Even Mr f2p himself BG said this was basically nothing and actually said he wished there were more offers of this type than ones that actually give people a legitimate advantage like most of their shard/sig/rank resource offers in his stream last night.

You have the right to dislike something but all the silly hyperbole claiming this to be the beginning of the end, epitome of greed, etc...is just silly. It's a pretty typical overreaction by some of the community unfortunately that some of us that look at things a bit more logically just get quite tired of seeing.

DNA3000

I think if Kabam were truly greedy, man...to me, they leave money on the table every single month. People can disagree, but I'd open my wallet for far more things than they currently offer.

Free to play games need the people spending to think they are getting a good enough advantage for their money, and they need the people not spending to think the spenders are not getting too much of an advantage with their money. You have to balance the two, so you can't just try to get as much as possible from the spenders. It would chase away everyone else. It amuses me to no end that the Youtubers constantly telling the world that Kabam's offers suck are serving a valuable purpose in MCOC's monetization system. They are without realizing it selling the story that the game isn't pay to win. They often *say* the game is pay to win, but every time they say all the cash offers suck they are psychologically priming their viewers to believe the opposite.

Now, about planning for the future. Most whales aren't born whales. Some like COWhale just materialize out of thin air and splash into the game. But most whales start off as minnows. If you want whales, you need to protect the minnows. So how do you cultivate and protect the minnows? Maybe you want to figure out a way to give them something to spend on that gives them a small advantage over the free to play players - so they think they are getting something for their money and might want to spend more over time - but whatever it is, it can't be something the whales can abuse and completely overwhelm the minnows, because then their spending will seem pointless.

Gee, I wonder what such a thing might look like.

Look, I understand people not liking this I just think the degree of reaction is completely unwarranted. Even Mr f2p himself BG said this was basically nothing and actually said he wished there were more offers of this type than ones that actually give people a legitimate advantage like most of their shard/sig/rank resource offers in his stream last night.

You have the right to dislike something but all the silly hyperbole claiming this to be the beginning of the end, epitome of greed, etc...is just silly. It's a pretty typical overreaction by some of the community unfortunately that some of us that look at things a bit more logically just get quite tired of seeing.

I agree. 100%. Unfortunately, that's the machine that Announcements go through. Things go into the system of overreaction, and it's amplified and driven by YouTube and other Social Media. Buzz Terms like "money grab, slap in the face, milking the Whales, insult to the Player Base", and the new one "quality of life" (a term that makes me uncomfortable because it's more appropriate for a case like Terri Schiavo), are thrown in. Then things become blown way out of proportion. Those terms are very specific in evoking reactions.
The problem is, that's just how things go here. There are some of us that don't overreact in the same capacity. We're usually labeled. Lol. At the end of the day, it's an Offer. A Subscription every month that includes benefits. Some think it's an insult because they believe these benefits should come for free. I don't really agree with that perspective because the benefits are not essential for game play.

Starhawk

This game makes more than enough money that this subscription service is completely unnecessary
I don't think most businesses work this way...
no offence as player i don't have to care about how they do their business that's their problems. as a player i only want to see improvements in the game that benefits me so everyone who's saying they will run out of business if they will give freebies is complete bs.

if they based their business on benefiting you the game wouldn't exist anymore.

username92847

I havent been on forums for what feels like 2 years, but this Sigil Subscription is an important issue.
No surprise to me, nothing on forums has changed. Rather then being united against an issue with kabam's lawful but awful business practices & the slippery slope that they are on... I see post after post of sqauwking & finger pointing between players over opinions, word definitions, forum TOS rules, & obvious derailment attempts.

I am embarrassed to admit how much real cash, i blew on this game over the years, but lets just say, i often ponder all the things, i could have bought with the money.
Its NOT the cost.
its the belief that we shouldnt have to pay for features, that should just be part of the game.

IF WE STANDBY & ALLOW KABAM TO DO THIS UNCHECKED ... THINGS WILL GET WORSE. PERIOD.

Frankly, after 12.0 & the many MANY examples kabam has giving us, Im surprised everyone doesnt clearly see where this train is going....

Let the derailment continue or not,
the choice is up to us.

This game makes more than enough money that this subscription service is completely unnecessary
I don't think most businesses work this way...
no offence as player i don't have to care about how they do their business that's their problems. as a player i only want to see improvements in the game that benefits me so everyone who's saying they will run out of business if they will give freebies is complete bs.
if they based their business on benefiting you the game wouldn't exist anymore.

their business runs bcoz of the playerbase try hard to give valid points

Worknprogress

I havent been on forums for what feels like 2 years, but this Sigil Subscription is an important issue.
No surprise to me, nothing on forums has changed. Rather then being united against an issue with kabam's lawful but awful business practices & the slippery slope that they are on... I see post after post of sqauwking & finger pointing between players over opinions, word definitions, forum TOS rules, & obvious derailment attempts.

I am embarrassed to admit how much real cash, i blew on this game over the years, but lets just say, i often ponder all the things, i could have bought with the money.
Its NOT the cost.
its the belief that we shouldnt have to pay for features, that should just be part of the game.

IF WE STANDBY & ALLOW KABAM TO DO THIS UNCHECKED ... THINGS WILL GET WORSE. PERIOD.

Frankly, after 12.0 & the many MANY examples kabam has giving us, Im surprised everyone doesnt clearly see where this train is going....

Let the derailment continue or not,
the choice is up to us.

This is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about. Absolutely ridiculous.

This game makes more than enough money that this subscription service is completely unnecessary
I don't think most businesses work this way...
no offence as player i don't have to care about how they do their business that's their problems. as a player i only want to see improvements in the game that benefits me so everyone who's saying they will run out of business if they will give freebies is complete bs.
if they based their business on benefiting you the game wouldn't exist anymore.
their business runs bcoz of the playerbase try hard to give valid points

Lol no, not at all.

ezgoing

I personally will just ignore the Sigil offer. I can live without those enhancements, and i certainly won’t fork out money to enrich Kabam. As it is, I am not even buying the $5 monthly unit card. So on this point, i agree with the “Kabam supporters” that the Sigil offer is not that big a deal.

This being said, i do agree with the views that Kabam could do worse with more paywalls in future. “Kabam supporters” cannot possibly say this will never happen, at most they should just reserve their judgement.

Hence the true value of this thread is to let Kabam know they should never ever go down that path. Or there will be hell to pay.

For those who say Kabam is a business and needs to make money. Really, it will be more believable and sympathetic if Kabam is actually bleeding.

For those who say F2P should be contented to even have a largely free game to play. And that F2P are riding on the coat-tails of P2P to prop up the Kabam business. Let’s just say that MCOC will lose a big chunk of its competitiveness once the seasoned F2P players give up on this game. Kabam needs to strike a balance with both sets of players.

Worknprogress

I personally will just ignore the Sigil offer. I can live without those enhancements, and i certainly won’t fork out money to enrich Kabam. As it is, I am not even buying the $5 monthly unit card. So on this point, i agree with the “Kabam supporters” that the Sigil offer is not that big a deal.

This being said, i do agree with the views that Kabam could do worse with more paywalls in future. “Kabam supporters” cannot possibly say this will never happen, at most they should just reserve their judgement.

Hence the true value of this thread is to let Kabam know they should never ever go down that path. Or there will be hell to pay.

For those who say Kabam is a business and needs to make money. Really, it will be more believable and sympathetic if Kabam is actually bleeding.

For those who say F2P should be contented to even have a largely free game to play. And that F2P are riding on the coat-tails of P2P to prop up the Kabam business. Let’s just say that MCOC will lose a big chunk of its competitiveness once the seasoned F2P players give up on this game. Kabam needs to strike a balance with both sets of players.

I'd never say that they won't do it. I've admitted they have quite the poor track record in fact. All I said is that getting upset today about something that's theoretical when there's no actual evidence it will actually happen yet, is pretty silly.

Regardless of whether they're bleeding or not, they are a business and business always look for ways to increase revenue. Do I agree with most let alone all of their decisions? Absolutely not. Don't completely agree with this one. I just don't think it's worth getting upset and claiming the sky is falling.

ezgoing

My post wasn’t targeted at yours. But I roughly scanned through to know there are several kabam supporters in this thread.

I don’t disagree that there is some over-reaction here. But people are entitled to their opinions. People over-react plenty in real life too. Do businesses, governments ignore them and think they are just whining? Pretty sure they don’t when the dissent is huge enough. And as i was saying, the true value of this thread is for Kabam to tread very carefully in future, because a seemingly “harmless” sigil offer can already elicit such negative reactions.

I personally will just ignore the Sigil offer. I can live without those enhancements, and i certainly won’t fork out money to enrich Kabam. As it is, I am not even buying the $5 monthly unit card. So on this point, i agree with the “Kabam supporters” that the Sigil offer is not that big a deal.

This being said, i do agree with the views that Kabam could do worse with more paywalls in future. “Kabam supporters” cannot possibly say this will never happen, at most they should just reserve their judgement.

Hence the true value of this thread is to let Kabam know they should never ever go down that path. Or there will be hell to pay.

For those who say Kabam is a business and needs to make money. Really, it will be more believable and sympathetic if Kabam is actually bleeding.

For those who say F2P should be contented to even have a largely free game to play. And that F2P are riding on the coat-tails of P2P to prop up the Kabam business. Let’s just say that MCOC will lose a big chunk of its competitiveness once the seasoned F2P players give up on this game. Kabam needs to strike a balance with both sets of players.

I'd never say that they won't do it. I've admitted they have quite the poor track record in fact. All I said is that getting upset today about something that's theoretical when there's no actual evidence it will actually happen yet, is pretty silly.

Regardless of whether they're bleeding or not, they are a business and business always look for ways to increase revenue. Do I agree with most let alone all of their decisions? Absolutely not. Don't completely agree with this one. I just don't think it's worth getting upset and claiming the sky is falling.

Biollante442

It offers some interesting things such as The Black Iso Market, but I'm gonna pass because I don't really see any long-term worth being added into this subscription. There's no 10% discount on purchasing units in the store, there's no bonus discounts on the unit deals they offer every other week, not even something as simple as an 'upgraded cavalier crystal' that does not include 3* champions in the crystal'. The only thing that I see that is truly interesting is the energy refill, but that's not even enough to convince me to even hesitate on not buying it. Sorry, but I will pass on this.

LeNoirFaineant

Glad the Mods approved that comment I made yesterday and 5-10 pages ago lol

Wow! I agree with allot of other players. Most of this should be part of a quality of life update especially the inventory increase. Making money off of crystal openings is understandable and whatever bundles that you have for sale. But this as a whole is a slap in the face. Shame on you Kabam for putting a much needed update that should be free to all players behind a paywall. You join the despicable ranks along with EA and Activision.

Wow. This is page 20 and this is the first "slap in the face" I have come across. That must be a forum record. I doubt they feel shamed, and I, for one, don't feel slapped.

So...you don't think the game is worth anything, yet you're here, we're here, and have been here through it all? Evidently it's worth something.

Oesername123

So...you don't think the game is worth anything, yet you're here, we're here, and have been here through it all? Evidently it's worth something.

I didn't say the game isn't worth anything. I said it isn't worth $10 a month. Especially for a game that that developers feel they can modify the game as they please.