She-Hulk Heavy Speed Bug Fix [Title Edited for Clarity]

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Comments

  • Agentk24Agentk24 Posts: 22
    Will champs still be able to spam heavies at the wall
  • AleorAleor Posts: 1,312 ★★★
    edited August 27
    Also what about magik sp2 power steel? It isn't described anywhere in the game. A lot of others as well. If you are using it as an argument, first make in game descriptions full and correct. Overall I as a summoner don't feel appreciated atm, wich is quit ironic, cause every day I see calendar giving me some useless stuff
  • JohnHSJohnHS Posts: 485 ★★★
    Here's a bright idea: Say this wasn't intended, and nerf her, and then 'buff' her in honor of the announcement of the She-Hulk TV series.
    Because nerfing characters who just got a lot of attention I'm sure will help sales.
    Geniuses.
  • jnikolas92jnikolas92 Posts: 121 ★★
    I can't stress enough that the issue is not with the actual "bug" of She Hulk. The reasoning that Kabam and the game team relayed to us is fair, and reasonable.
    The issue is with the play experience this has created. The lack of warning and interaction regarding She Hulks gameplay, even with MANY forum posts discussing how she's a great option for The Champion boss, other end game fights, even AW as well as well as videos on youtube showing the entire community as well.
    We see a great champ, and choose to use our rare resources ranking them up.
    and then all of a sudden we find out that those rare and valuable resources are essentially burned?
    The truth of the matter is, people ranked up she hulk based on what they saw, and what they understood as not a bug, since there was zero indication of it being so.
    Now that the game team has said there will be a change being made, and why...we move forward. We understand that as a natural process of the game.
    Due to a lack of communication and interaction (which could have easily been done via. Mod/Admin interaction within the forusm) the issue now is people who ranked up She Hulk are left in the dust, with valuable earned resources burned with no way to move forward.
    Regardless of the reasoning, the reality of the situation is that many summoners are feeling ripped off. and rightly so.
    Simply put, there needs to be compensation, like @Kabam Miike has once said, to rectify this situation and to make things right.
    we're already being made wary with the integrity of our champs and rank ups are being treated moving forward, but allowing us to rank down she hulk to move forward goes a LONG way with how this issues been treated so far.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Posts: 8,636 Guardian
    SparkAlot said:

    Hey everybody,

    We’re sorry that this update came as a surprise. The Ability to chain into a Heavy Attack from a combo is not one that is intended for any Champion, and we have never advertised it as one (except for Wasp, who has a built in short Passive stun to ensure that she is able to do it). No Champion should be able to Combo into a Heavy attack with 100% reliability, unless explicitly stated in their Ability description.

    This was not something that was listed as an ability or an exception for She-Hulk. She was not built, tuned, or tested, around this unintended interaction. This was identified as an issue and resolved.

    We apologize for the confusion caused by this interaction.


    Mike, the better fix for this would be to do what Kabam usually does, and that is change her description to allow this behavior.

    We all know she had the ability for years, so, following what Kabam has done to other champs to match their actual abilities, like, the recent fix to Symbiote Supreme , where the description was changed to show 50% instead of 100%, it makes more sense to fix She-hulk the exact same way, just change it & tell everyone about her "lost" ability.

    I know you said "She was not built, tuned, or tested, around this unintended interaction." however, that means she wasn't tested or tuned at all, since she ALWAYS had it, so, ???
    Kabam doesn't "usually" do that: sometimes the mechanics are bugged, and sometimes the descriptions are just plain wrong.

    The problem here seems to be that there's a design rule we were not aware of, that makes this kind of chaining "outside the rules" for how champions are supposed to be implemented. When a bug is inside the rules in general but unintended for the champion specifically, Kabam can make an executive decision to allow the bug to stand. But when a bug is outside the rules that's more dangerous to keep around, because everything else in the game gets implemented as if the rule was true and that can sometimes cause nasty problems down the road. An example would be the accidentally passive stun in Archangel's abilities. No one really cared until content was created on the assumption that stuns could be always resisted. Then AA's unresistable stuns broke it because those stuns were not factored into the content.

    Designers can't remember all the exceptions to all the rules: that's why the rules exist in the first place, so a few general rules can substitute for hundreds of individual behaviors. If the heavy chaining is outside the design rules like they say, which is actually likely, then giving She Hulk a pass will set an invisible land mine that some future piece of content will step on one day. This game doesn't need any more of those.
  • Ace_03Ace_03 Posts: 828 ★★★★
    edited August 27
    The main takeaway from this is this:

    Don't rely on champions, abilities, tricks and moves that are considered "cheese". Anything not within the logic of the game and sound gameplay will eventually be fixed.

    Take the safe route and use/rank champions that are reliable, IMO any champion who is extremely proficient, at some point might be looked at and tweaked, build a balanced roster of different tier of champions, with different kits of utility.

    And for specific, end-game difficult fights, look for 1 than more option to deal with it, if you can't then wait until you do.
  • JohnHSJohnHS Posts: 485 ★★★
    Ace_03 said:

    The main takeaway from this is this:

    Don't rely on champions, abilities, tricks and moves that are considered "cheese". Anything not within the logic of the game and sound gameplay will eventually be fixed.

    Take the safe route and use/rank champions that are reliable, IMO any champion who is extremely proficient, at some point might be looked at and tweaked, build a balanced roster of different tier of champions, with different kits of utility.

    And for specific, end-game difficult fights, look for 1 de more option to deal with it, if you can't then wait until you do.

    I'd think that an ability that she's had consistently for two years is fairly reliable.
  • Nerfed2DefNerfed2Def Posts: 286 ★★
    @jnikolas92 perfect post sir.

    @Omegatron
  • AleorAleor Posts: 1,312 ★★★
    Ace_03 said:

    The main takeaway from this is this:

    Don't rely on champions, abilities, tricks and moves that are considered "cheese". Anything not within the logic of the game and sound gameplay will eventually be fixed.

    Take the safe route and use/rank champions that are reliable, IMO any champion who is extremely proficient, at some point might be looked at and tweaked, build a balanced roster of different tier of champions, with different kits of utility.

    And for specific, end-game difficult fights, look for 1 de more option to deal with it, if you can't then wait until you do.

    Fyi, they can change any described mechanic, like when they removed aa passive stun, yet wasp has it now
  • Nerfed2DefNerfed2Def Posts: 286 ★★
    They can do whatever they want and I agree. They should refund items to players for those changes. Easy.
  • McMorliMcMorli Posts: 2

    Hey everybody,

    We’re sorry that this update came as a surprise. The Ability to chain into a Heavy Attack from a combo is not one that is intended for any Champion, and we have never advertised it as one (except for Wasp, who has a built in short Passive stun to ensure that she is able to do it). No Champion should be able to Combo into a Heavy attack with 100% reliability, unless explicitly stated in their Ability description.

    This was not something that was listed as an ability or an exception for She-Hulk. She was not built, tuned, or tested, around this unintended interaction. This was identified as an issue and resolved.

    We apologize for the confusion caused by this interaction.

    It's not 100%, only when the opponent is in the corner. And in this case there are a lot of champs which can do the same. You only change she hulk because this is the only champion which combines some good stuff and so also a 3* version can do a lol star lord without getting hit. Or a r2 she hulk can do act 6 bosses.

    I also did the champion with a r3 version and i ranked her r5 with the rank up gem from the new variant a few days ago because of the things she can do. And now you tell us that is was not intended. Give me my r5 rank up gem and the r4 material back and take your she hulk ... Than i can rank my wasp r4 for the quantum trinity. Or will you fix ghost next?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,480 ★★★★★
    McMorli said:

    Hey everybody,

    We’re sorry that this update came as a surprise. The Ability to chain into a Heavy Attack from a combo is not one that is intended for any Champion, and we have never advertised it as one (except for Wasp, who has a built in short Passive stun to ensure that she is able to do it). No Champion should be able to Combo into a Heavy attack with 100% reliability, unless explicitly stated in their Ability description.

    This was not something that was listed as an ability or an exception for She-Hulk. She was not built, tuned, or tested, around this unintended interaction. This was identified as an issue and resolved.

    We apologize for the confusion caused by this interaction.

    It's not 100%, only when the opponent is in the corner. And in this case there are a lot of champs which can do the same. You only change she hulk because this is the only champion which combines some good stuff and so also a 3* version can do a lol star lord without getting hit. Or a r2 she hulk can do act 6 bosses.

    I also did the champion with a r3 version and i ranked her r5 with the rank up gem from the new variant a few days ago because of the things she can do. And now you tell us that that is was not intended. Give me my r5 rank up gem and the r4 material back and take your she hulk ... Than i can rank my wasp r4 for the quantum trinity. Or will you fix gbost next?
    If a 3* can do LoL SL, then that's a sign something is off.
  • Ace_03Ace_03 Posts: 828 ★★★★
    JohnHS said:

    Ace_03 said:

    The main takeaway from this is this:

    Don't rely on champions, abilities, tricks and moves that are considered "cheese". Anything not within the logic of the game and sound gameplay will eventually be fixed.

    Take the safe route and use/rank champions that are reliable, IMO any champion who is extremely proficient, at some point might be looked at and tweaked, build a balanced roster of different tier of champions, with different kits of utility.

    And for specific, end-game difficult fights, look for 1 de more option to deal with it, if you can't then wait until you do.

    I'd think that an ability that she's had consistently for two years is fairly reliable.
    March 2016 she was released and she's always had that ability, that's more than 2 years.

    I should know, she was my 1st 4* from arena and overall my 6th 4* ever. What I meant with my post, is that anything that is *too* reliable can and will most likely be tweaked at some point.

    There is a pattern and you can figure out why this is happening.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,480 ★★★★★
    Agentk24 said:

    McMorli said:

    Hey everybody,

    We’re sorry that this update came as a surprise. The Ability to chain into a Heavy Attack from a combo is not one that is intended for any Champion, and we have never advertised it as one (except for Wasp, who has a built in short Passive stun to ensure that she is able to do it). No Champion should be able to Combo into a Heavy attack with 100% reliability, unless explicitly stated in their Ability description.

    This was not something that was listed as an ability or an exception for She-Hulk. She was not built, tuned, or tested, around this unintended interaction. This was identified as an issue and resolved.

    We apologize for the confusion caused by this interaction.

    It's not 100%, only when the opponent is in the corner. And in this case there are a lot of champs which can do the same. You only change she hulk because this is the only champion which combines some good stuff and so also a 3* version can do a lol star lord without getting hit. Or a r2 she hulk can do act 6 bosses.

    I also did the champion with a r3 version and i ranked her r5 with the rank up gem from the new variant a few days ago because of the things she can do. And now you tell us that that is was not intended. Give me my r5 rank up gem and the r4 material back and take your she hulk ... Than i can rank my wasp r4 for the quantum trinity. Or will you fix gbost next?
    If a 3* can do LoL SL, then that's a sign something is off.
    No it’s not that’s due to her slow and petrify
    I just don't think a 3* should be taken into LoL at this stage in the game. Also, if you're saying it's because of Slow and Petrify, neither of those have changed.
This discussion has been closed.