So, my alliance mates did barely any work on my line. I end up with 15 million points, each on them togerher had less than 2 million combined.
Got you beat for alliance mate contributions. But it also doesn't bother me.
This is due to the champ pool being..well ****.. due to the nodes.
Speaking of nodes:
Pierce & Crit nodes on 160m health defenders that eat health in one combo through block, when you need to parry/block half the time?
And why include damage over time champs, whose DOT doesn't scale at all? No point in having champs in a pool that don't do damage themselves once all charges are available.
You know what would have avoided this too? A public beta.
So, my alliance mates did barely any work on my line. I end up with 15 million points, each on them togerher had less than 2 million combined.
Got you beat for alliance mate contributions. But it also doesn't bother me.
This is due to the champ pool being..well ****.. due to the nodes.
Speaking of nodes:
Pierce & Crit nodes on 160m health defenders that eat health in one combo through block, when you need to parry/block half the time?
And why include damage over time champs, whose DOT doesn't scale at all? No point in having champs in a pool that don't do damage themselves once all charges are available.
You know what would have avoided this too? A public beta.
Storm and Doom are in the pool, however, they are totally useless against Ultron.
So, my alliance mates did barely any work on my line. I end up with 15 million points, each on them togerher had less than 2 million combined.
Got you beat for alliance mate contributions. But it also doesn't bother me.
This is due to the champ pool being..well ****.. due to the nodes.
Speaking of nodes:
Pierce & Crit nodes on 160m health defenders that eat health in one combo through block, when you need to parry/block half the time?
And why include damage over time champs, whose DOT doesn't scale at all? No point in having champs in a pool that don't do damage themselves once all charges are available.
You know what would have avoided this too? A public beta.
Storm and Doom are in the pool, however, they are totally useless against Ultron.
Everyone in my alliance (2 BGs) using Doom hasn't broken 4m in fight points. Those with storm, under 10m. They can do missions but the damage is poor - possibly the buffs they chose, but that shouldn't be. Buffs for any role should always benefit the role.
The most frustrating thing for my ally is we had a member join our 1 raid BG without permission or communication and double up a path when we needed the 10th man to take the third vanguard role since we had two tacticians. Since he did that we won't get exploration rewards. Not to mention it made getting through the 3 path fights a real pain.
The RNG chest rewards feel bad, I would much rather have a guaranteed reward. I get RNG has and will always be a part of the game, but crystals are different than what this is. 20k titan shards vs .25 t6cc shouldn't be a thing. No other mode has rewards set up that way.
Only having 2 revives allotted hurts too. If you're perfect you can clear it with just that. But I'm not. Sometimes I just play bad. And these fights are punishing. Having to use 1% AQ revives or pay 200 units for a raid revive is terrible.
The glory but was awesome. By far the most enjoyable thing about this week for me. I am thinking I probably won't do raids in the future.
So I put up 28 mil points. Got 2 25% t6cc and 1 50%. Someone theoretically could get 60k titan shards and not even get 1 mil. That’s a huge discrepancy.
So I put up 28 mil points. Got 2 25% t6cc and 1 50%. Someone theoretically could get 60k titan shards and not even get 1 mil. That’s a huge discrepancy.
Thats an alliance matter... Not a game one. It's the same with war, its like saying an enthusiastic boss killer should get more rewards than the rest.
I pretty much waited till raids was done for the week.
All I have to say is Meh...
It's another mode which I doubt I'll play again for a very long time.
For the more casual alliances, it's overly complicated for a phone game, and just using the information provided in game, makes very little sense. I should not need to hop on forums, watch youtube videos, and ask so many questions of friends and alliance members. It's first raid, give us a bit of walk through kind of like how it is when you first start playing.
A game mode explicitly designed so you will get KO'd is fine.... BUT there needs to be more affordable ways to revive. 2 revivies/day just isn't enough, especially since they expire from stash so quickly. 200 units for 50% and if you are using a highly ranked 6* ect. you are probably buying level 6 revives at 45 units a pop.
Crossfight, role charges, ect.... far to complicated to figure out which thing you finally were awarded.
The fact the final boss being noded where yall 3 lines have to be in a spot to attack is very off putting. It's basically an automatic 16 seconds to death if the other 2 lines are still up which means there's likely no way you are going to alternate between specials fast enough to have a meaningful run.
I get it though, it's not for casual alliances, and that has been very clear.
I mean in a way that doesn't end with our discussion just getting deleted, or getting a childish rebuke from a moderator?
Hey OP, if you want to provide feedback on the game mode, you can just do that. Take a look around, there's lots of direct feedback from players, and we're taking it all into account. We also don't just shut things down if people are critical of us. That's a false narrative that people have made up and try to cling to. There's a lot of critical feedback out there, and it's just as valid as the positive feedback.
We have A LOT of feedback to review, and we'll be sure to address as much as we can when we have something to say. The team is already looking at changes we can make going forward, and I want to thank everybody who gave actionable and constructive feedback. Don't expect to hear anything right away, but I want to work with the team to come up with something that we can share as sort of a mini-roadmap for changes you can expect in the short and long term of Raids.
So I put up 28 mil points. Got 2 25% t6cc and 1 50%. Someone theoretically could get 60k titan shards and not even get 1 mil. That’s a huge discrepancy.
Thats an alliance matter... Not a game one. It's the same with war, its like saying an enthusiastic boss killer should get more rewards than the rest.
Where in AW do players in the same alliance get different rewards outside of crystals they open from shards? It's not an alliance matter, it's a game mode matter.
Felt on the first session of raids. It was not bad as an experience unfortunately you have to be 30 good and we were only one great group. Result 260k of gold.
My overall impression of raid - 10% cap is stupid, better to force rotating who's fighting than cap the damage being done - Revives need to be better somehow. War has basically unlimited revives for 1 loyalty - Should have war like boosts, something like additional block proficiency and indestructible - Increase fight time on at least the boss, war is 5 minutes and these fights are levels above that - Cost seems too high - Difficulty is definitely not Map 9 level
For essentially being post testing beta testers of a mode that had more than a few bugs and very bad choices like the block mission that conveniently goes Block > Block > Block quite often. The rewards were abysmal, I put up north of 40m excited for a chance at the big rewards, 25% t6cc 3x. Just stinks man.
I mean in a way that doesn't end with our discussion just getting deleted, or getting a childish rebuke from a moderator?
Hey OP, if you want to provide feedback on the game mode, you can just do that. Take a look around, there's lots of direct feedback from players, and we're taking it all into account. We also don't just shut things down if people are critical of us. That's a false narrative that people have made up and try to cling to. There's a lot of critical feedback out there, and it's just as valid as the positive feedback.
We have A LOT of feedback to review, and we'll be sure to address as much as we can when we have something to say. The team is already looking at changes we can make going forward, and I want to thank everybody who gave actionable and constructive feedback. Don't expect to hear anything right away, but I want to work with the team to come up with something that we can share as sort of a mini-roadmap for changes you can expect in the short and long term of Raids.
I posted this after my original thread that was a little more critical was not on the forum. If it wasn't deleted, then apologies.
I mean in a way that doesn't end with our discussion just getting deleted, or getting a childish rebuke from a moderator?
Hey OP, if you want to provide feedback on the game mode, you can just do that. Take a look around, there's lots of direct feedback from players, and we're taking it all into account. We also don't just shut things down if people are critical of us. That's a false narrative that people have made up and try to cling to. There's a lot of critical feedback out there, and it's just as valid as the positive feedback.
We have A LOT of feedback to review, and we'll be sure to address as much as we can when we have something to say. The team is already looking at changes we can make going forward, and I want to thank everybody who gave actionable and constructive feedback. Don't expect to hear anything right away, but I want to work with the team to come up with something that we can share as sort of a mini-roadmap for changes you can expect in the short and long term of Raids.
Hope you read this, but here's a mid tier alliance view (Gold 2 last season) of what needs to be changed.
1. Dumb node combos/defenders - As many have said, requiring us to block thanos while he has 4 pierce buffs has nothing to do with skill or challenge, it's just dumb unavoidable damage. Either remove his pierce buffs or change block to something else (like gain a buff or something).
Same thing with Maestro, I have no problem getting degen if you don't fully evade his sp1, but the fact that a single messup on evading his sp1 will cause instant death is also really dumb. Especially when Maestro's ai is very agressive with his sp1 so you have to evade over 10 of them each fight which really increases the chance of making a mistake. Please scale back the damage his degen does so that we can at least take a couple mistakes and keep fighting.
My group never got to Kang so I have no critiques of him but he seems to be fine overall from what I've heard.
2. Revives: 2 revives a day (and yes only 2 no one in their right mind would spend 200 units on a revive) is not enough. I know raids is targeted for more higher tier alliances but I feel like a couple more wouldn't hurt the difficulty of the content.
3. Enjoyment: My experience with raids was basically: pick up two revives, do two fights, usually messing up on one and barely doing any damage, then wait 24 hours to get the two more revives, rinse and repeat. That....... really isn't very fun at all. 2 fights a day for a week isn't super exciting an honestly makes me want to do normal AQ instead. I don't really know the solution to this but It really just isn't super exciting with its current format, even if you do manage to get a good chunk of damage of the defender.
4. Rewards: Again, like most have said having RNG based rewards for something so challenging is just a really dumb way to get people excited for this. Selectors, not rng is the way to go.
Raids has a lot of potential and I look forward to doing it again, but next month I hope a lot of meaningful changes will be made. Like everything in this game usually the first release is a bit of a rough one, but over time I trust you guys will get it right.
I mean in a way that doesn't end with our discussion just getting deleted, or getting a childish rebuke from a moderator?
Hey OP, if you want to provide feedback on the game mode, you can just do that. Take a look around, there's lots of direct feedback from players, and we're taking it all into account. We also don't just shut things down if people are critical of us. That's a false narrative that people have made up and try to cling to. There's a lot of critical feedback out there, and it's just as valid as the positive feedback.
We have A LOT of feedback to review, and we'll be sure to address as much as we can when we have something to say. The team is already looking at changes we can make going forward, and I want to thank everybody who gave actionable and constructive feedback. Don't expect to hear anything right away, but I want to work with the team to come up with something that we can share as sort of a mini-roadmap for changes you can expect in the short and long term of Raids.
no one in their right mind would spend 200 units on a revive
My biggest issues were: 1) having to coordinate alliance mates to very specific windows each and every day. 1 of my mates has a new child and a new job. The other has limited availability due to time zone. 2) the ability to do damage wasn't obvious at first, I did the prompts, and was still doing next to no damage. An R3 7* venom should be doing some damage. Took several days of revives to figure all that out 3) after clearing Maestro, and picking up the first chest, I was completely demoralized, and just stopped playing. I logged in only to keep the charges up for my mates.
I spent a lot of units on regular alliance heals and used stashed revives since 2 per day was woefully under the needed amount.
Getting rid of 10% cap (maybe 15-20%)... I got frustrated with Maestro throwing his sp1 constantly, causing me to degen since his animation also causes so much lag I couldn't reliably evade it.
As far as AQ compensation... I have always felt it needs to be based on contribution. As an officer, I've routinely had to spend hours a week trying to get the same 3-4 under performing members to join/contribute to AQ. it's chafed me having them get same rewards as the people that worked hard.
Maybe add a prize if you manage to push the boss to the 10% damage threshold? Either an RNG aq item or a small aq item selector? Or even a chance at another free 100% revive? Or a small progression related chest? Just something extra that rewards you for your hard work.
Given that this is a once a month event, the rewards need to reworked. There is big gap between 1/4 T6cc and 20k titan shards. The T6cc should be changed to a full random class. The minimum 7* shards should be bumped up to 7500.
You won't feel as bad if you pulled a full T6cc.
Agree with all the posters about changing some of the fight mechanics and tweaking the available champs for each role.
I mean in a way that doesn't end with our discussion just getting deleted, or getting a childish rebuke from a moderator?
Hey OP, if you want to provide feedback on the game mode, you can just do that. Take a look around, there's lots of direct feedback from players, and we're taking it all into account. We also don't just shut things down if people are critical of us. That's a false narrative that people have made up and try to cling to. There's a lot of critical feedback out there, and it's just as valid as the positive feedback.
We have A LOT of feedback to review, and we'll be sure to address as much as we can when we have something to say. The team is already looking at changes we can make going forward, and I want to thank everybody who gave actionable and constructive feedback. Don't expect to hear anything right away, but I want to work with the team to come up with something that we can share as sort of a mini-roadmap for changes you can expect in the short and long term of Raids.
I’m not a games developer and this is a genuine question. Is it not easier for the developers to get it right first time, then it is implement something that has so many substantial issues that it requires road map to fix? I’m thinking this is a very similar situation to Battle Grounds implementation.
I appreciate the game can’t be developed by committee. It just seems that a large portion of the player base could have provided the game team with some insight into the pitfalls of the game design long before it was released. The team could then choose what feedback to adopt or ignore. It can’t be good a feeling to see something brand new in the game so universally criticised. This comes off the back of a massive win from Necropolis to give some balance. But original Battle Grounds was poorly received, July 4th massively overtuned, Necropolis was great, Cyber Week undertuned, Banquet undertuned, Raids poorly received. It feels like there is a disconnect between Kabams aims and what players want. I don’t think the answer is the players need to get over it, but I do think Kabam needs to have more of what there customers want (both FTP and paying) at the heart of game design. Figuring out how to monetise it should be secondary. If people are having fun, they’ll always be a way to add monetary cost, but enjoyment first.
Hopefully the pain points get sorted out, the main ones for me are…
Pierce buff on defenders… it’s just too much, one fight I took 32k damage from a single parry.
Rng in chest rewards - this should be removed, it isn’t fair. Make it a selector or something, so you can choose between shards, cats, iso or gold.
Having to wait on others before you can fight - the game had moved away from this in AQ. Please find a way of removing it. The composition of member timezones in my Bg meant there was a final group of 3 that only had a short window each day when they could all be on. Gave them no leeway.
Attacker KO when damage cap is reached… come on, this just isn’t fair. If you insist on punishing us for playing well, at least raise the damage cap and fight timer.
Revives - the x2 revives per day feels stingy. Consider raising to 3. Reduce cost of the 60% revive because 200 units is extortionate.
I mean in a way that doesn't end with our discussion just getting deleted, or getting a childish rebuke from a moderator?
Hey OP, if you want to provide feedback on the game mode, you can just do that. Take a look around, there's lots of direct feedback from players, and we're taking it all into account. We also don't just shut things down if people are critical of us. That's a false narrative that people have made up and try to cling to. There's a lot of critical feedback out there, and it's just as valid as the positive feedback.
We have A LOT of feedback to review, and we'll be sure to address as much as we can when we have something to say. The team is already looking at changes we can make going forward, and I want to thank everybody who gave actionable and constructive feedback. Don't expect to hear anything right away, but I want to work with the team to come up with something that we can share as sort of a mini-roadmap for changes you can expect in the short and long term of Raids.
. Figuring out how to monetise it should be secondary. If people are having fun, they’ll always be a way to add monetary cost, but enjoyment first.
I appreciate the sentiment, but can you honestly say you believe the community would be fine if Raids was completely free to begin with and then they added tons of ways to monetise it? That sounds like a disaster to me personally.
Unfortunately, fun and monetisation needs to be there at launch and then tweaks made if necessary. Adding monetisation later would cause a storm on the forums, and possibly kill the game mode in the eyes of the community
Comments
Speaking of nodes:
Pierce & Crit nodes on 160m health defenders that eat health in one combo through block, when you need to parry/block half the time?
And why include damage over time champs, whose DOT doesn't scale at all? No point in having champs in a pool that don't do damage themselves once all charges are available.
You know what would have avoided this too? A public beta.
The RNG chest rewards feel bad, I would much rather have a guaranteed reward. I get RNG has and will always be a part of the game, but crystals are different than what this is. 20k titan shards vs .25 t6cc shouldn't be a thing. No other mode has rewards set up that way.
Only having 2 revives allotted hurts too. If you're perfect you can clear it with just that. But I'm not. Sometimes I just play bad. And these fights are punishing. Having to use 1% AQ revives or pay 200 units for a raid revive is terrible.
The glory but was awesome. By far the most enjoyable thing about this week for me. I am thinking I probably won't do raids in the future.
It's the same with war, its like saying an enthusiastic boss killer should get more rewards than the rest.
All I have to say is Meh...
It's another mode which I doubt I'll play again for a very long time.
For the more casual alliances, it's overly complicated for a phone game, and just using the information provided in game, makes very little sense. I should not need to hop on forums, watch youtube videos, and ask so many questions of friends and alliance members. It's first raid, give us a bit of walk through kind of like how it is when you first start playing.
A game mode explicitly designed so you will get KO'd is fine.... BUT there needs to be more affordable ways to revive. 2 revivies/day just isn't enough, especially since they expire from stash so quickly. 200 units for 50% and if you are using a highly ranked 6* ect. you are probably buying level 6 revives at 45 units a pop.
Crossfight, role charges, ect.... far to complicated to figure out which thing you finally were awarded.
The fact the final boss being noded where yall 3 lines have to be in a spot to attack is very off putting. It's basically an automatic 16 seconds to death if the other 2 lines are still up which means there's likely no way you are going to alternate between specials fast enough to have a meaningful run.
I get it though, it's not for casual alliances, and that has been very clear.
@Sparhauk
Hopefully our “ccp”
Community tells them.
Because they can care less on forums and on twitter.
It’s literally insane. And how tone raid rewards are
lol yall remember the apology on gifting rewards? We need it for raid and in need of major changes…
Can’t believe what happened & what was giving for raids rewards
We have A LOT of feedback to review, and we'll be sure to address as much as we can when we have something to say. The team is already looking at changes we can make going forward, and I want to thank everybody who gave actionable and constructive feedback. Don't expect to hear anything right away, but I want to work with the team to come up with something that we can share as sort of a mini-roadmap for changes you can expect in the short and long term of Raids.
- 10% cap is stupid, better to force rotating who's fighting than cap the damage being done
- Revives need to be better somehow. War has basically unlimited revives for 1 loyalty
- Should have war like boosts, something like additional block proficiency and indestructible
- Increase fight time on at least the boss, war is 5 minutes and these fights are levels above that
- Cost seems too high
- Difficulty is definitely not Map 9 level
1. Dumb node combos/defenders - As many have said, requiring us to block thanos while he has 4 pierce buffs has nothing to do with skill or challenge, it's just dumb unavoidable damage. Either remove his pierce buffs or change block to something else (like gain a buff or something).
Same thing with Maestro, I have no problem getting degen if you don't fully evade his sp1, but the fact that a single messup on evading his sp1 will cause instant death is also really dumb. Especially when Maestro's ai is very agressive with his sp1 so you have to evade over 10 of them each fight which really increases the chance of making a mistake. Please scale back the damage his degen does so that we can at least take a couple mistakes and keep fighting.
My group never got to Kang so I have no critiques of him but he seems to be fine overall from what I've heard.
2. Revives: 2 revives a day (and yes only 2 no one in their right mind would spend 200 units on a revive) is not enough. I know raids is targeted for more higher tier alliances but I feel like a couple more wouldn't hurt the difficulty of the content.
3. Enjoyment: My experience with raids was basically: pick up two revives, do two fights, usually messing up on one and barely doing any damage, then wait 24 hours to get the two more revives, rinse and repeat. That....... really isn't very fun at all. 2 fights a day for a week isn't super exciting an honestly makes me want to do normal AQ instead. I don't really know the solution to this but It really just isn't super exciting with its current format, even if you do manage to get a good chunk of damage of the defender.
4. Rewards: Again, like most have said having RNG based rewards for something so challenging is just a really dumb way to get people excited for this. Selectors, not rng is the way to go.
Raids has a lot of potential and I look forward to doing it again, but next month I hope a lot of meaningful changes will be made. Like everything in this game usually the first release is a bit of a rough one, but over time I trust you guys will get it right.
1) having to coordinate alliance mates to very specific windows each and every day. 1 of my mates has a new child and a new job. The other has limited availability due to time zone.
2) the ability to do damage wasn't obvious at first, I did the prompts, and was still doing next to no damage. An R3 7* venom should be doing some damage. Took several days of revives to figure all that out
3) after clearing Maestro, and picking up the first chest, I was completely demoralized, and just stopped playing. I logged in only to keep the charges up for my mates.
I spent a lot of units on regular alliance heals and used stashed revives since 2 per day was woefully under the needed amount.
Getting rid of 10% cap (maybe 15-20%)... I got frustrated with Maestro throwing his sp1 constantly, causing me to degen since his animation also causes so much lag I couldn't reliably evade it.
As far as AQ compensation... I have always felt it needs to be based on contribution. As an officer, I've routinely had to spend hours a week trying to get the same 3-4 under performing members to join/contribute to AQ. it's chafed me having them get same rewards as the people that worked hard.
You won't feel as bad if you pulled a full T6cc.
Agree with all the posters about changing some of the fight mechanics and tweaking the available champs for each role.
I appreciate the game can’t be developed by committee. It just seems that a large portion of the player base could have provided the game team with some insight into the pitfalls of the game design long before it was released. The team could then choose what feedback to adopt or ignore. It can’t be good a feeling to see something brand new in the game so universally criticised. This comes off the back of a massive win from Necropolis to give some balance. But original Battle Grounds was poorly received, July 4th massively overtuned, Necropolis was great, Cyber Week undertuned, Banquet undertuned, Raids poorly received. It feels like there is a disconnect between Kabams aims and what players want. I don’t think the answer is the players need to get over it, but I do think Kabam needs to have more of what there customers want (both FTP and paying) at the heart of game design. Figuring out how to monetise it should be secondary. If people are having fun, they’ll always be a way to add monetary cost, but enjoyment first.
Pierce buff on defenders… it’s just too much, one fight I took 32k damage from a single parry.
Rng in chest rewards - this should be removed, it isn’t fair. Make it a selector or something, so you can choose between shards, cats, iso or gold.
Having to wait on others before you can fight - the game had moved away from this in AQ. Please find a way of removing it. The composition of member timezones in my Bg meant there was a final group of 3 that only had a short window each day when they could all be on. Gave them no leeway.
Attacker KO when damage cap is reached… come on, this just isn’t fair. If you insist on punishing us for playing well, at least raise the damage cap and fight timer.
Revives - the x2 revives per day feels stingy. Consider raising to 3. Reduce cost of the 60% revive because 200 units is extortionate.
Unfortunately, fun and monetisation needs to be there at launch and then tweaks made if necessary. Adding monetisation later would cause a storm on the forums, and possibly kill the game mode in the eyes of the community