Green Goblin as a Tech Champion [Merged Threads]

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Comments

SlyCat42 wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

JJW wrote: »

Kabam, your bio for Green Goblin says his principle enhancement is the serum he took.

So,
Serum =/= Science?
Serum == Technology?

Well, if he was making use of the Serum's abilities while fighting, then making him a Science Champ would make more sense. As we have stated before, his method of fighting does not take advantage of his Serum, but of the Oscorp technology. This is just one of the reasons that he is a Tech Champion.

I don't agree or disagree with making him tech. Was just reading the thread over and wanted to comment.

I always assumed the class relationship is not based on how they fight, but their origin story. I mean, Hulk smashes things, but he's science because of his history not his fighting style. Otherwise Hulk would be skill because he uses his fists.

So, what I think people are saying is that Green Goblin became who he is because of the Goblin serum and so people assumed that meant he was a science champion.

I can see why Kabaam would go for making him Tech since he uses a lot of technology, but that's why people are confused.

I don't care about the origin story or what their fighting styles are. It's just been almost a year now with no new science champs, and we've hade our fill of techs recently.

It's obvious that they don't care about balancing the classes with new and exciting champs.

DNA3000

JJW wrote: »

Kabam, your bio for Green Goblin says his principle enhancement is the serum he took.

So,
Serum =/= Science?
Serum == Technology?

It doesn't say that. I'm staring right at the picture you posted, and it doesn't say his "principal enhancement" is the serum. It explicitly states that he used a serum which made him very strong and very crazy. The very next statement says he's armed with Oscorp advanced weaponry.

SlyCat42

I am also seeing a lot of people complain about some of the previous class choices, but a lot of the other ones make sense.

Falcon -- Primarily a military person with some glider wings, uses guns to fight as their main weapon (at least in the movie version).

Ant-Man/Yellow Jacket - They do use technology empowered suits, but the shrinking ability comes from a chemical.

Agent Venom - Granted this is a toss up, but I think the reasoning is because Flash is military and uses military weapons and guns to fight.

I have no idea about Karnak though, seems like he should be Cosmic, but then again I don't know anything about Karnak other than that he is related to Black Bolt. In game he just seems like a fighting hobo.

Well, here's hoping that Doc Oc is actually a science champion.

neb

I think the disconnect occurs when people think class is based on the source of their power. Kabaam has clearly stated that class is based on how they fight in the contest. I was upset initially when gg was revealed to be tech but to be quite honest after hearing the explanation if he was any other class it wouldn't make sense. Tech champs all seem to have a form of power control and or heal blocking utility. The lines between classes have become a bit blurry I'll admit. Psylocke could be mystic even. Scarlet witch could be mutant etc.

DNA3000

SlyCat42 wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

JJW wrote: »

Kabam, your bio for Green Goblin says his principle enhancement is the serum he took.

So,
Serum =/= Science?
Serum == Technology?

Well, if he was making use of the Serum's abilities while fighting, then making him a Science Champ would make more sense. As we have stated before, his method of fighting does not take advantage of his Serum, but of the Oscorp technology. This is just one of the reasons that he is a Tech Champion.

I don't agree or disagree with making him tech. Was just reading the thread over and wanted to comment.

I always assumed the class relationship is not based on how they fight, but their origin story. I mean, Hulk smashes things, but he's science because of his history not his fighting style. Otherwise Hulk would be skill because he uses his fists.

So, what I think people are saying is that Green Goblin became who he is because of the Goblin serum and so people assumed that meant he was a science champion.

I can see why Kabaam would go for making him Tech since he uses a lot of technology, but that's why people are confused.

I've never made that assumption. Under that assumption, Daredevil would be science. Magik should be mutant because her mutant abilities come first and are also the cause of her entering Limbo in the first place. Picking class based on origin would cause you to pick classes that could be extremely far removed from anything the champion actually does. Technically, Unstoppable Colossus should be mutant under that idea because his origin is identical to Colossus, given that they are the same person.

And no, using your fists isn't congruent with skill. Anyone who believes that would have to believe that all champions are skill. We don't equate the Skill class with the use of any skill, but only extraordinary skills. Joe Fixit using machine guns is using a skill, but not the kind of skill that would be consistent with being a skill class champion.

Skill also doesn't mean a total lack of use of anything besides your body. Falcon is skill. Elektra is skill. Black Panther is skill. Hawkeye is skill. Most of the skill champions actually use weapons a lot: that's what they are actually skilled at doing. In fact, I cannot think of a single Skill champion that doesn't use a weapon at least some of the time: even Daredevil uses his billy clubs when performing special three attacks.

One last thing: I don't think anyone is saying that fighting *style* is important. Kabam Miike mentioned "method of fighting" which is for the most part using his immense physical strength in the case of the Hulk. The Hulk in-game is showing some non-zero amount of fighting skill, but a huge amount of physical power. Of the two, his physical strength which is associated with Science is far more important overall in my opinion.

mutamatt

neb wrote: »

I think the disconnect occurs when people think class is based on the source of their power. Kabaam has clearly stated that class is based on how they fight in the contest. I was upset initially when gg was revealed to be tech but to be quite honest after hearing the explanation if he was any other class it wouldn't make sense. Tech champs all seem to have a form of power control and or heal blocking utility. The lines between classes have become a bit blurry I'll admit. Psylocke could be mystic even. Scarlet witch could be mutant etc.

I agree completely. Classes can go either way in a lot of cases. Tech isn't really full of power control champs, iron man and ultron have armor and regen.

But when you have a champ that could be tech or science, and it's been almost a year since the last science, and the last 3 champs you released are tech, clearly the champ should be science.

Primmer79

mutamatt wrote: »

I agree completely. Classes can go either way in a lot of cases. Tech isn't really full of power control champs, iron man and ultron have armor and regen.

But when you have a champ that could be tech or science, and it's been almost a year since the last science, and the last 3 champs you released are tech, clearly the champ should be science.

I agree. I think that decision shouldve been made when the character was being designed though. They're classifying him based of how he attacks in game. Knowing the amount of tech coming out, they shouldve had in mind already to make him a science and redesign him. It sounds like if he was just labeled science now, he'd be out of place.

Viper1987

Supaflyazn wrote: »

Viper1987 wrote: »

Supaflyazn wrote: »

In true Director of Shield fashion, Kabam you Mother f*kers...
@Kabam Miike @Ad0ra_ You are going to make me sit on this 5* Science Awakening gem that I spent my hard earned money on, because you decided to make the crystal a random class, instead of letting us choose what 5* Awakening gem class best suits us... I can't believe you would make Green Goblin a Tech! I have been waiting for him or Doc Oc ever since I got this damn Science Awakening gem from that deal in June, and as it stands right now... this gem seems pretty useless!!!

The deal was on the 4th of July, so not even a month. Also, the mods don't determine the classes of champs so stop throwing a temper tantrum like a 2 year old.

Alright @Viper1987 I'm assuming you got what you wanted? Look man, I'm not throwing a temper tantrum... it's just not the ideal that I was hoping for. Especially since rumors are that Doc Oc is Tech? That would be the straw that broke the camel's back... Do you know how long I and a lot of the community have been waiting for a good Spider Man enemy to come out? They give us Carbage and now when I get my hopes up for Green Goblin, and his leaked abilities look formidable, I find out he's a Tech. You'd be pretty pissed too, if the only 5* Awakening Gem you had acquired was a Science, and you can't do a God damn thing with it!!!

Actually, no I did not get what I wanted. I have wanted a mystic gem forever, but kept getting tech awakening. I am not happy about it, but I don't go yelling at the mods. You didn't get a science champ like you wanted, so now you are throwing a tantrum about it. It has nothing to do with a "good Spider Man enemy" because you have Venom, Electro, Rhino, and Vulture that came out and they are all good in their own ways. Green Goblin and Doc Oc still look like good Spider Man enemies coming out, too. It boils down to you wanting a 5* science champ, you didn't get him, so now you are acting out. I am not trying to personally attack you, but I feel it is a bit disrespectful to yell at the mods who have no say in the design/class designation of champs. Kabam does a lot of things wrong and they still have a lot to fix (HELLO, PARRY AND PURE SKILL?! UPDATE!!), but it does not help when you yell at them for things not in their power. It clutters the forums and distracts from constructive conversation.

GroundedWisdom

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

Kronos987654321

mutamatt wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

Alright everybody, I understand that you guys don't like the explanation that I gave, and it wasn't very informative. I'll talk to team and get back to you guys about the reasoning behind this. I imagine that it has to do with the way his abilities in game translate to the dynamics of the classes, but I will be back with information.

In the mean time, can we please remember to keep things civil and discuss things like adults? Remember the rules of the forums, and do not let this go off the rails.

i think the basis of the frustration is that its been almost a year since we have seen a science feature and that has seriously put people with a science awakening gem at a disadvantage.

Not just gems, but t4cc just sitting and expiring.

Etaki_Lirakoi

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

GroundedWisdom

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

The view that one Class is stronger than the other. It's subjective, and depends on preference, position in the game, who you're using, what Rank, what you're using them for, etc. The majority of issues is because people are using Mystics in the Top Tier with War, and fighting them in Top Tier AQ, as well as dealing with MD. There's an entire game to consider at all levels of gameplay to look at. Not just the higher levels.
As for the idea that people are justified in being upset, I never dispute someone's right to their own feelings. However, my point still stands that making a Champ simply because a Class is needed is not respective to the process that goes into creating Champs. The Class is specific to the in-game design, not the other way around. There are more factors that come before needing a Class.

mutamatt

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

Batty_Numppo

I'm gonna be the odd one out here. I do think Green Goblin should be science, but I don't care that he's tech.

I also think Doc Oc should be tech - I don't see any reason why he should be Science. The fact that he's smart doesn't make him one, otherwise Tony Stark and countless other champs should be science too, when they obviously should be tech. I almost feel like the push for Doc Oc to be Science is the result of the entire Spider-verse being mostly science, and little else.

I ALSO think this summer's surge of tech is warranted in order to not only bring it up to other classes, but also to take it beyond them, so that tech won't have to be messed with for awhile and other classes can be enhanced without tech perpetually playing catch-up.

But most of all, I don't understand the uproar. Yeah, Quake was the last science champ released FOREVER ago, and arguably the only super-good science champ. I'm sitting on science awakening gems like many others, but class has never been a deciding factor for me when valuing a champ's strengths and abilities. I sure as hell want more good science champs, but I get the reasoning to this class decision and it's not worth it to me to counter it, let alone protest it.

GroundedWisdom

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Etaki_Lirakoi

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

mutamatt

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

So you're basically saying that I have other science champs, deal with it. Having to face that reality is something that owners of other gems don't have to deal with.

I could awaken my antman, but that would be a stupid decision.

the issue here is that science has been ignored for too long. Many people were looking to the Spider-Man homecoming release to bring science champs, either in June, July, or August. Instead of one science it looks like we are getting 5 techs and a cosmic.

What faith are we supposed to have that science will be represented soon if they completely ignored the class with the release of a movie showcasing one of the class's iconic characters?

GroundedWisdom

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

How long are we going to keep hearing about 12.0? It has nothing to do with when they're going to put out a Science Champ. Different situations altogether.

Etaki_Lirakoi

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

How long are we going to keep hearing about 12.0? It has nothing to do with when they're going to put out a Science Champ. Different situations altogether.

But it isn't, it's part of the plan up to 2020, and it was the worst decision they've ever made. This could also be a bad decision in the plan that players have the chance to voice there displeasure about.

GroundedWisdom

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

How long are we going to keep hearing about 12.0? It has nothing to do with when they're going to put out a Science Champ. Different situations altogether.

But it isn't, it's part of the plan up to 2020, and it was the worst decision they've ever made. This could also be a bad decision in the plan that players have the chance to voice there displeasure about.

I never said people didn't have the right to voice themselves. I explained the process that I believe goes into making a Champ, and I said it wasn't a personal attack on anyone wanting a Science Champ.

Etaki_Lirakoi

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

How long are we going to keep hearing about 12.0? It has nothing to do with when they're going to put out a Science Champ. Different situations altogether.

But it isn't, it's part of the plan up to 2020, and it was the worst decision they've ever made. This could also be a bad decision in the plan that players have the chance to voice there displeasure about.

I never said people didn't have the right to voice themselves. I explained the process that I believe goes into making a Champ, and I said it wasn't a personal attack on anyone wanting a Science Champ.

... I didn't dispute the first part, I don't know why you're saying that now. I'm just saying Kabams plans aren't the best decisions, and this science issue could be one of them.

Supaflyazn

Viper1987 wrote: »

Supaflyazn wrote: »

Viper1987 wrote: »

Supaflyazn wrote: »

In true Director of Shield fashion, Kabam you Mother f*kers...
@Kabam Miike @Ad0ra_ You are going to make me sit on this 5* Science Awakening gem that I spent my hard earned money on, because you decided to make the crystal a random class, instead of letting us choose what 5* Awakening gem class best suits us... I can't believe you would make Green Goblin a Tech! I have been waiting for him or Doc Oc ever since I got this damn Science Awakening gem from that deal in June, and as it stands right now... this gem seems pretty useless!!!

The deal was on the 4th of July, so not even a month. Also, the mods don't determine the classes of champs so stop throwing a temper tantrum like a 2 year old.

Alright @Viper1987 I'm assuming you got what you wanted? Look man, I'm not throwing a temper tantrum... it's just not the ideal that I was hoping for. Especially since rumors are that Doc Oc is Tech? That would be the straw that broke the camel's back... Do you know how long I and a lot of the community have been waiting for a good Spider Man enemy to come out? They give us Carbage and now when I get my hopes up for Green Goblin, and his leaked abilities look formidable, I find out he's a Tech. You'd be pretty pissed too, if the only 5* Awakening Gem you had acquired was a Science, and you can't do a God damn thing with it!!!

Actually, no I did not get what I wanted. I have wanted a mystic gem forever, but kept getting tech awakening. I am not happy about it, but I don't go yelling at the mods. You didn't get a science champ like you wanted, so now you are throwing a tantrum about it. It has nothing to do with a "good Spider Man enemy" because you have Venom, Electro, Rhino, and Vulture that came out and they are all good in their own ways. Green Goblin and Doc Oc still look like good Spider Man enemies coming out, too. It boils down to you wanting a 5* science champ, you didn't get him, so now you are acting out. I am not trying to personally attack you, but I feel it is a bit disrespectful to yell at the mods who have no say in the design/class designation of champs. Kabam does a lot of things wrong and they still have a lot to fix (HELLO, PARRY AND PURE SKILL?! UPDATE!!), but it does not help when you yell at them for things not in their power. It clutters the forums and distracts from constructive conversation.

@Viper1987 I can't use Venom and Rhino for anything other than Arena fodder... Electro is okay on AW, but in Tier 1 and Tier 2 Defense people have figured him out... and I didn't get Vulture, so I can't comment on him. No, what it boils down to is I want a GOOD Science champ. Green Goblin and Doc Oc looked like they would have made good Science champs... I need a good utility champ, and am not going to settle for any Science champ that comes along. Not on such a high level, it wouldn't do me any good. I'd settle for 5* Hulk but the odds are not in my favor on a normal 5* Crystal, so I refuse to spend hard earned 5* shards on ****...

Kpatrix

With the way both look to rely heavily on buffs, even as science champs they wouldnt be good counters to MD. I was really hoping GG would be science, with all the recent tech champs it's almost impossible to get enough tech t4c to rank them all up. I'm swimming in cosmic and science cats, and don't really like my options, possibly Angela or 5* sym Spidey unduped to r3 for his high crit rate and damage. I could go with hulk or one of my Spidey, but I want someone new who could boost my defense a bit. Everyone is getting used to Juggs, dormammu, Hyperion, and NC.

GroundedWisdom

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

How long are we going to keep hearing about 12.0? It has nothing to do with when they're going to put out a Science Champ. Different situations altogether.

But it isn't, it's part of the plan up to 2020, and it was the worst decision they've ever made. This could also be a bad decision in the plan that players have the chance to voice there displeasure about.

I never said people didn't have the right to voice themselves. I explained the process that I believe goes into making a Champ, and I said it wasn't a personal attack on anyone wanting a Science Champ.

... I didn't dispute the first part, I don't know where you're getting that from. I'm just saying Kabams plans aren't the best decisions, and this science issue could be one of them.

I never said people can't express themselves. I have the same right. My feelings are that it's a bit worn out to keep mentioning 12.0. It was a change in the direction of the game, not Watergate. Lol. Six months later, "Remember The Alamo.....and 12.0!". Just my feelings. Anyone can say what they like. I just feel that it's mentioned well after the fact, and it does not apply to the subject. The reality is it's their product and they can take it in whatever direction they choose. I'm not worried. They will have more Science Champs. Just not GG.
Don't take me personally by any means. You're entitled to your feelings. I'm tired of hearing about 12.0 with every issue that comes up. Those are my feelings.

Etaki_Lirakoi

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

How long are we going to keep hearing about 12.0? It has nothing to do with when they're going to put out a Science Champ. Different situations altogether.

But it isn't, it's part of the plan up to 2020, and it was the worst decision they've ever made. This could also be a bad decision in the plan that players have the chance to voice there displeasure about.

I never said people didn't have the right to voice themselves. I explained the process that I believe goes into making a Champ, and I said it wasn't a personal attack on anyone wanting a Science Champ.

... I didn't dispute the first part, I don't know where you're getting that from. I'm just saying Kabams plans aren't the best decisions, and this science issue could be one of them.

I never said people can't express themselves. I have the same right. My feelings are that it's a bit worn out to keep mentioning 12.0. It was a change in the direction of the game, not Watergate. Lol. Six months later, "Remember The Alamo.....and 12.0!". Just my feelings. Anyone can say what they like. I just feel that it's mentioned well after the fact, and it does not apply to the subject. The reality is it's their product and they can take it in whatever direction they choose. I'm not worried. They will have more Science Champs. Just not GG.
Don't take me personally by any means. You're entitled to your feelings. I'm tired of hearing about 12.0 with every issue that comes up. Those are my feelings.

I know it's an analogy, but comparing something as recent as 6 months ago to something almost 200 years ago seems a little to... inaccurate? Like an exaggeration? Besides, the past isn't meant to be forgotten, it's meant for us to learn from the mistakes made then and improve our present and future.

RagamugginGunner

12.0 almost killed the game and it's understandable that ppl are still don't trust them . Going 10 months w/o a science champ and releasing 6 tech champs in the last few months (two of which could/should easily been science) has people nervous.

It's not secret that Kabam makes boat loads of money off mystic bosses and MD in AW and Dormy in AQ. It's clear to me that they do not want an OP offensive champ (like Starky) to be science and hurt their bottom line.

CammonRo

12.0

Never forget

GroundedWisdom

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

mutamatt wrote: »

Etaki_Lirakoi wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

The process is not based on need from what I've gathered. It's unique to the Champ. Meaning, it's based individually on how they draw the majority of their strength in The Contest. It's not logical to create a Champ simply because the Class is needed. There will be other Science Champs. From what I recall, there was a time when Science was pretty common. There's alot of forethought that goes into making a Champ. The Class is not the central focus.

At this point though, it's a bit of a balance issue, strongest class being mystic, weakest being science, the one that's supposed to have an edge over mystic. A lot of people were hoping that Goblin or Doc would be Science, and it doesn't seem like either will be.

You can say this class choice is logical all you want, which I agree it does make sense, it's also logical to assume people might be annoyed that one class hasn't gotten an extra champ in almost a year AND it's probably one of the more "needed" in this time, to buff the class and try to bring out a more even playing field with champions in this current time of mystic domination, both offensively and defensively.

I will also add to that, when you beat the "hardest content in the game" and you are rewarded with an extremely rare, class-specific item, you are very deliberate with how you use that item. You are not going to waste that item on a champion that can be awakened by normal means easily.

Ignoring the need for new science champions de-values that extremely rare item for 18% of LOL finishers.

I agree that changing his class now would be a bad idea, I agree that the class should be selected during the design phase. It is just poor game management to allow one class to go unrepresented for an entire year.

The part that some may be missing is that we don't know their plans in the near future. Everything in its own time. The design happens true to the process. It's not a deliberate attempt to slight anyone with a Gem. I'm assuming it has very little to do with that at all, actually. Just that more Science Champs will be coming down the road. For that matter, no one is forcing anyone to hold on to Gems. We still have Science Champs. That's a preference.

Correct, we don't know what the plans for the future are, that doesn't mean they're good though. The 12.0 update is the big thing that comes to my mind. They could have a science right around the corner, or it could literally be another year.

Basically being told we're in good hands by people who've made major mistakes before isn't a very comforting sentence.

How long are we going to keep hearing about 12.0? It has nothing to do with when they're going to put out a Science Champ. Different situations altogether.

But it isn't, it's part of the plan up to 2020, and it was the worst decision they've ever made. This could also be a bad decision in the plan that players have the chance to voice there displeasure about.

I never said people didn't have the right to voice themselves. I explained the process that I believe goes into making a Champ, and I said it wasn't a personal attack on anyone wanting a Science Champ.

... I didn't dispute the first part, I don't know where you're getting that from. I'm just saying Kabams plans aren't the best decisions, and this science issue could be one of them.

I never said people can't express themselves. I have the same right. My feelings are that it's a bit worn out to keep mentioning 12.0. It was a change in the direction of the game, not Watergate. Lol. Six months later, "Remember The Alamo.....and 12.0!". Just my feelings. Anyone can say what they like. I just feel that it's mentioned well after the fact, and it does not apply to the subject. The reality is it's their product and they can take it in whatever direction they choose. I'm not worried. They will have more Science Champs. Just not GG.
Don't take me personally by any means. You're entitled to your feelings. I'm tired of hearing about 12.0 with every issue that comes up. Those are my feelings.

I know it's an analogy, but comparing something as recent as 6 months ago to something almost 200 years ago seems a little to... inaccurate? Like an exaggeration? Besides, the past isn't meant to be forgotten, it's meant for us to learn from the mistakes made then and improve our present and future.

Comparing the addition of Science Champs to the 12.0 fiasco is an exaggeration itself. That's the point I was making. The subject is brought up eveytime there is an addition people aren't happy about. It's done. We're well past it.

neb

Those who forget their past are doomed to repeat it.

CammonRo

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Comparing the addition of Science Champs to the 12.0 fiasco is an exaggeration itself. That's the point I was making. The subject is brought up eveytime there is an addition people aren't happy about. It's done. We're well past it.

No. No we're not.