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Guaranteed crit VS. cannot be crit ?

Greed_Exodus

So I know so many interactions in the game don’t make sense and maybe kabam can word it better or explain it better in champs kits, but it’s so funny to me that a champ who has guaranteed crits cant crit a guy cause he can’t be crit, it’s so confusing…

Comments

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/415859/guaranteed-crit-vs-cannot-be-crit

Its not that hard... Champs that can inflict bleed can't make champs with bleed immunity bleed....

Average_Desi

Can't always triumphs.. mostly.

Although there are times when you can crit a glanced attack. Though that's a rarity

ahmynuts

Sometimes the game asks you to employ common sense when the game itself doesnt always deserve to do that due to every mechanic having many intricacies and nuances

SummonerNR

@DNA3000 has done some game mechanics posts years back, and this topic (guaranteed vs can’t) was included in those somewhere.

DNA3000

As BringPopcorn mentions, there is a priority to the effects. Remember that we are reading English (or some other human language) descriptions for the effects, while the game implements an algorithm. The computer does not get confused by "always inflict bleed" and "immune to bleed". It doesn't sit there trying to figure out what the devs meant, because that's not the actual instructions it was given. What it was told is "this action always triggers a bleed effect without any other prerequisites" and "this target is immune to bleed effects" and resolves those without problem. The bleed is triggered, and then immediately fails to be applied to the target. Both things are true, and both make sense. It is only when we deliberately try to make them confusing that they get confusing. Nothing has a guaranteed bleed, because no such guarantee exists. Actions can have a guaranteed trigger for a bleed effect but the target doesn't have to accept that bleed effect.

Similarly, an action can have a guaranteed crit. However, that doesn't mean that the target must accept the effects of that crit. They can be instructed to ignore critical damage or critical effects. Generally, things like immunities take precedence for the simple reason that the game tends to give the target the last word. It is like the game is playing Calvinball, and the attacker says "I hit you with my super duper awesome punch that knocks out everyone" and then the defender says "but I use my ultrafast whiplash block that deflects the blow harmlessly." The target generally gets the last word on what happens. The game figures out what the attacker does, then figures out how the defender responds. The attacker can trigger a bleed, but the target can be immune to bleed effects. The attacker can generate a critical, but the target can be immune to cries. Its a bit more complicated than that, but that mental model works most of the time.

The devs could replace all the normal language descriptions of effects with technical ones that were unambiguous but then only people like me would ever understand what was happening in the game. Regular players would not be able to, or even want to, parse those descriptions to figure out what things did in the game. Take Defensive Ability Accuracy Reduction. There is no such thing, because there's no such thing as "Defensive Ability Accuracy." DAA is a convenient fiction. DAAR is an ability accuracy reduction that specifically triggers during a very specific set of circumstances within a specific set of animation frames. When those circumstances are met the target's ability accuracy is reduced. All ability accuracy, not just "defensive" ability accuracy. If you hit Void at just the right moment, you can prevent his intimidating presence debufffs from triggering, even though that's not a defensive ability. But if we told the players this instead of DAAR, it would be too complicated for the overwhelming majority of players to wrap their heads around.

DAAR is actually very simple. In fact, the technical description is simpler than the fiction. However, it requires a lot of prerequisites to understand. Most players will never have that prerequisite scaffolding to understand it properly, except as the convenient fiction of DAAR.

SkyLord7000

Wait that’s how DAAR works. There’s gotta be a better name for it.

phillgreen

The target determines the outcome is about the most succinct explanation of all the silly things that happen in the game.

Java_Junkie

@DNA3000 explanation is spot on as always, but bonus points for the Bill Watterson nod!