“War is too easy”

I’d love for people to stop complaining about war and how BS is turning out to be. I bet they are the same ones who said that war was too easy. I give kudos to Kabam for showing a lesson to people who think that know better than the own creators of the game. I’d love for Kabam to increase the rewards however because it is really clear that we need to use items at times to win. Because if you think about it when Kabam introduced the new revamped war map and scoring everyone and their mom complained,a few updates later now, they still are (I’m using “they” because I never complained I just rolled with the punches and accepted the fact that war was different). Kabam will still increase the difficulty of war by making the nodes more “interactive” if you will. However we will be doing triple the work compared to what we did the very first time war changed yet receiving the same rewards. It is ironically unbelievable how those that complained just made it harder on themselves while receiving the same payout. Good job everyone
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Comments

  • xNigxNig Posts: 2,536
    KyrieRed wrote: »
    I’d love for people to stop complaining about war and how BS is turning out to be. I bet they are the same ones who said that war was too easy. I give kudos to Kabam for showing a lesson to people who think that know better than the own creators of the game. I’d love for Kabam to increase the rewards however because it is really clear that we need to use items at times to win. Because if you think about it when Kabam introduced the new revamped war map and scoring everyone and their mom complained,a few updates later now, they still are (I’m using “they” because I never complained I just rolled with the punches and accepted the fact that war was different). Kabam will still increase the difficulty of war by making the nodes more “interactive” if you will. However we will be doing triple the work compared to what we did the very first time war changed yet receiving the same rewards. It is ironically unbelievable how those that complained just made it harder on themselves while receiving the same payout. Good job everyone

    You don’t have to 100% you know?
  • xNig wrote: »
    KyrieRed wrote: »
    I’d love for people to stop complaining about war and how BS is turning out to be. I bet they are the same ones who said that war was too easy. I give kudos to Kabam for showing a lesson to people who think that know better than the own creators of the game. I’d love for Kabam to increase the rewards however because it is really clear that we need to use items at times to win. Because if you think about it when Kabam introduced the new revamped war map and scoring everyone and their mom complained,a few updates later now, they still are (I’m using “they” because I never complained I just rolled with the punches and accepted the fact that war was different). Kabam will still increase the difficulty of war by making the nodes more “interactive” if you will. However we will be doing triple the work compared to what we did the very first time war changed yet receiving the same rewards. It is ironically unbelievable how those that complained just made it harder on themselves while receiving the same payout. Good job everyone

    You don’t have to 100% you know?

    That was the point of the increased Nodes.
  • How was it the community's fault?
  • The_OneThe_One Posts: 2,402
    edited November 2017
    The biggest problem with war is that we just lost yesterday's war by 123 points to diversity.
    We got more defender kills than them 55-49, both got 3 boss kills but we got 100% and they only got 99%
    Now I know that not being fully diverse is our fault and we need to work on it but it shouldn't decide a war.

    Skill should decide a war and our opponents needing to revive and one of our bosses getting 12 kills is not skill
  • It's Not, it never was.

  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 15,412
    edited November 2017
    Snizzbar wrote: »
    The_One wrote: »
    The biggest problem with war is that we just lost yesterday's war by 123 points to diversity.
    We got more defender kills than them 55-49, both got 3 boss kills but we got 100% and they only got 99%
    Now I know that not being fully diverse is our fault and we need to work on it but it shouldn't decide a war.

    Skill should decide a war and our opponents needing to revive and one of our bosses getting 12 kills is not skill

    To be honest, if Defender Kills count for nothing and you're paying attention to those instead of Diversity, it's a preventable Loss. It takes skill to finish a Map. The difference is no one is penalized for dying.

    WHY IS BEING PENALISED FOR DYING A BAD THING

    1. It changed the focus of Wars and became the single focus of metrics.
    2. The game is changing and will only amplify that in the future.
    3. People are spending hard-earned and purchased Resources to increase their chance of losing.
    4. War is not about dying the least. It's about working together as an Ally.
    5. It discouraged Players from making an effort and progressing.
    6. No reasonable game would penalize Players for making purchases.
    7. It created a very minimal focus on a select few number of Champs, hence Diversity.
    8. It created a separation between Players that was never really intended. "Skill" is what it's been labeled.
    9. Trying should never be a nail in the coffin.
    10. Relying on Defender Kills is not skill at all.

    Shall I continue?

  • That's exactly the point. This isn't something that has been the case from the onset. It became a larger problem as newer Champs were released, and gained more Kills. These changes were after almost 2 years of the game evolving and growing. It was never meant to be about Defender Kills alone.

    that doesn't change the fact that dying less should be rewarded..
  • gohard123 wrote: »

    That's exactly the point. This isn't something that has been the case from the onset. It became a larger problem as newer Champs were released, and gained more Kills. These changes were after almost 2 years of the game evolving and growing. It was never meant to be about Defender Kills alone.

    that doesn't change the fact that dying less should be rewarded..

    There's a difference between reward and penalty.
  • KyrieRed wrote: »
    I’d love for people to stop complaining about war and how BS is turning out to be. I bet they are the same ones who said that war was too easy. I give kudos to Kabam for showing a lesson to people who think that know better than the own creators

    What the hell are you talking about? Are you 8?

    War being BS and being too easy are not mutually exclusive, you know. And because I’m not a chief, so I cannot comment on steak, lol?

    To be fair, Defender kills and diversity are mutually exclusive, so Kabam chose the latter one over the former. That way, war is predetermined even before it starts. Well, top alliances only have to share def rating, then we don’t even have to fight the war. So yes, it’s BS format.

    And best alliances know how to win either way. It’s just a lot less fun, so we complain. What’s wrong with that?
  • CrusherCrusher Posts: 230
    Delta_14 wrote: »
    Snizzbar wrote: »
    The_One wrote: »
    The biggest problem with war is that we just lost yesterday's war by 123 points to diversity.
    We got more defender kills than them 55-49, both got 3 boss kills but we got 100% and they only got 99%
    Now I know that not being fully diverse is our fault and we need to work on it but it shouldn't decide a war.

    Skill should decide a war and our opponents needing to revive and one of our bosses getting 12 kills is not skill

    To be honest, if Defender Kills count for nothing and you're paying attention to those instead of Diversity, it's a preventable Loss. It takes skill to finish a Map. The difference is no one is penalized for dying.

    WHY IS BEING PENALISED FOR DYING A BAD THING

    1. It changed the focus of Wars and became the single focus of metrics.
    2. The game is changing and will only amplify that in the future.
    3. People are spending hard-earned and purchased Resources to increase their chance of losing.
    4. War is not about dying the least. It's about working together as an Ally.
    5. It discouraged Players from making an effort and progressing.
    6. No reasonable game would penalize Players for making purchases.
    7. It created a very minimal focus on a select few number of Champs, hence Diversity.
    8. It created a separation between Players that was never really intended. "Skill" is what it's been labeled.
    9. Trying should never be a nail in the coffin.
    10. Relying on Defender Kills is not skill at all.

    Shall I continue?

    1. No it didn't. Defender kills could make the difference (the "tie-breaker" that Kabam is struggling so much to implement satisfactorily in the new system), but wars were mostly decided by boss clears/exploration. It was not routine for alliances to clear all 3 bosses in the way it is now, and wars were frequently winnable without doing so.
    2. This is just a bunch of words, which don't actually make a point. "The game is changing", so what? "will only amplify", so what? You're not making a cogent argument here.
    3. Using resources only increased your chance of losing if you failed to use them strategically. Champ on low health? Heal up before the next fight. Your team is KO'd? Don't just use repeatedly level 1 revives. People used resources when they felt the potential gain out-weighed the risk. If you're advocating a system where those who are prepared to invest the most resources win, then we may as well forego the actual fighting and simply each put up our maximum amount of units (or loyalty, or glory, or whatever other indirectly connected currency you wish to use).
    4. I can agree that war is certainly not about dying the least now. But in relation to the old system; that is your opinion, not fact- presenting it as such is misleading and dishonest.
    5. Again, this is a very ambiguous statement. Progression in what regard? What sort of effort? Let's assume you're referring to the much touted scenario of KO-ing and declining to revive because you do not think you can beat the champ. There are a number of solutions here.
    A) Get better. Practise against that champ (in story, in duels) so that next time you are capable of beating them.
    B) Rank-up champs. Maybe you suck at fighting evaders? Rank up BW/Iceman. Maybe you struggle with block damage? How about Wolverine/X-23/Blade?
    C) Ask your alliance for back up. Sometimes it helps to have an ally help you out. If war is really about working together, then this should be a legitimate option- currently, as alliances are expected to clear 100% of the map, this is actually discouraged.
    Being unable to beat a champ on a single occassion should not (in my opinion) necessitate a complete change in the system. Otherwise the would be no limiting content, and everyone would be able to complete everything in the game.
    6. OK... but as I've already covered, using resources (i.e. making purchases) does not necessarily result in penalities. And with the addition of glory, an increase in consumed resources may not result in an increase in actual monetary purchases.
    7. Diversity has already been forced (artifically) in the new system, so this isn't relevant.
    8. Your evidence for this is what? You have no knowledge of what Kabam "intended". Besides, you're essentially suggesting that wins/losses should be decided on factors other than the ability to kill opposing champs without dying (which you resentingly term "skill"- to me, that seems to be a fairly good definition).
    9. Regeneration penalises players (e.g. Maestro in Act 4) for trying unsuccesfully. Are you saying that this is also unfair? The concept of risk-reward is inherent in most games.
    10. Limiting the defender kills of the other alliance is the skilled part. If both are equally skilled, neither will get defender kills. It is about the ratio.

    Please do continue- in my view, you've completely failed to construct a convincing argument.

    That girl want to work for kabam.... So she is writing in the favor of kabam... I am sure, whatever she do..... Kabam never hire.....her..
  • CrusherCrusher Posts: 230
    Snizzbar wrote: »
    The_One wrote: »
    The biggest problem with war is that we just lost yesterday's war by 123 points to diversity.
    We got more defender kills than them 55-49, both got 3 boss kills but we got 100% and they only got 99%
    Now I know that not being fully diverse is our fault and we need to work on it but it shouldn't decide a war.

    Skill should decide a war and our opponents needing to revive and one of our bosses getting 12 kills is not skill

    To be honest, if Defender Kills count for nothing and you're paying attention to those instead of Diversity, it's a preventable Loss. It takes skill to finish a Map. The difference is no one is penalized for dying.

    WHY IS BEING PENALISED FOR DYING A BAD THING

    1. It changed the focus of Wars and became the single focus of metrics.
    2. The game is changing and will only amplify that in the future.
    3. People are spending hard-earned and purchased Resources to increase their chance of losing.
    4. War is not about dying the least. It's about working together as an Ally.
    5. It discouraged Players from making an effort and progressing.
    6. No reasonable game would penalize Players for making purchases.
    7. It created a very minimal focus on a select few number of Champs, hence Diversity.
    8. It created a separation between Players that was never really intended. "Skill" is what it's been labeled.
    9. Trying should never be a nail in the coffin.
    10. Relying on Defender Kills is not skill at all.

    Shall I continue?

    Stop enough..... When u can't understand anything don't post it... Fake mod...
  • NDK13NDK13 Posts: 620
    back in the day war needed skill.....now you can take any **** champ and still complete your route
  • Crusher wrote: »

    That girl want to work for kabam.... So she is writing in the favor of kabam... I am sure, whatever she do..... Kabam never hire.....her..

    Whilst I understand what you're saying, I'm trying to refute the actual arguments put forward rather than say anything about the personalities of those involved.
  • There's not much point refuting GWs arguments. His opinion comes from the point of view of a tiny alliance with beginners in it that only run 1 battle group in the very lowest tiers of war. Any 'evidence' he puts forward is based on the easiest iteration of Alliance War where recent changes have made it a cake walk. I'm not entirely sure why he continues to make lengthy posts giving the impression he understands the game when he hasnt even touched end game content.
  • MadMarksMadMarks Posts: 155
    This is just another brilliant strategy by the game designers (money extractors) at Kabam. They brainwashed the whole community that the AW map is easy and that you should be able to 100% it. For the first time they approached difficulty from the other end of the spectrum, very easy ramping to hard. That was brilliant. Now people have a tendency to hold on longer (i.e. spend more money) to not be the one who can't 100%. Kudus to Kabam for finding a very efficient way to separate the majority of players from their money once again. Now as I stated before, this will hold on until most alliances realize the tough defense strategy is now valid again. Once that happens the pendulum will swing back. But this time, when that pendulum swings back Kabam will make even more money. Tip of the cap to you Kabam, ruthless, but effective. Even better strategy for Kabam is put out the 100% map prize similar to AQ, that will even incentivize some who have already won the war to keep pressing on. Dangle the t2a shards possibly . . .
  • KpatrixKpatrix Posts: 911
    xNig wrote: »
    KyrieRed wrote: »
    I’d love for people to stop complaining about war and how BS is turning out to be. I bet they are the same ones who said that war was too easy. I give kudos to Kabam for showing a lesson to people who think that know better than the own creators of the game. I’d love for Kabam to increase the rewards however because it is really clear that we need to use items at times to win. Because if you think about it when Kabam introduced the new revamped war map and scoring everyone and their mom complained,a few updates later now, they still are (I’m using “they” because I never complained I just rolled with the punches and accepted the fact that war was different). Kabam will still increase the difficulty of war by making the nodes more “interactive” if you will. However we will be doing triple the work compared to what we did the very first time war changed yet receiving the same rewards. It is ironically unbelievable how those that complained just made it harder on themselves while receiving the same payout. Good job everyone

    You don’t have to 100% you know?

    That was the point of the increased Nodes.

    So they took away defender kills because they thought that was discouraging people from trying, then introduced nodes to prevent people from progressing ? That makes no sense, it's a contradiction in itself and further proof that they wanted to increase revenue.

    What exactly are the objectives ? They don't want people to not try fighting a node and giving away defender kills and now at the same time we are not supposed to finish maps and give away exploration and attacker kills ? Someone explain that to me.
  • Snizzbar wrote: »
    The_One wrote: »
    The biggest problem with war is that we just lost yesterday's war by 123 points to diversity.
    We got more defender kills than them 55-49, both got 3 boss kills but we got 100% and they only got 99%
    Now I know that not being fully diverse is our fault and we need to work on it but it shouldn't decide a war.

    Skill should decide a war and our opponents needing to revive and one of our bosses getting 12 kills is not skill

    To be honest, if Defender Kills count for nothing and you're paying attention to those instead of Diversity, it's a preventable Loss. It takes skill to finish a Map. The difference is no one is penalized for dying.

    WHY IS BEING PENALISED FOR DYING A BAD THING

    1. It changed the focus of Wars and became the single focus of metrics.
    2. The game is changing and will only amplify that in the future.
    3. People are spending hard-earned and purchased Resources to increase their chance of losing.
    4. War is not about dying the least. It's about working together as an Ally.
    5. It discouraged Players from making an effort and progressing.
    6. No reasonable game would penalize Players for making purchases.
    7. It created a very minimal focus on a select few number of Champs, hence Diversity.
    8. It created a separation between Players that was never really intended. "Skill" is what it's been labeled.
    9. Trying should never be a nail in the coffin.
    10. Relying on Defender Kills is not skill at all.

    Shall I continue?

    Wrong
  • dolann__dolann__ Posts: 98
    edited November 2017
    .
  • AW is still not that hard in Tier1/2. If it wasn't for the recently added game lag issues very few would need potions.

    Our alliance wars still almost always end with 100%/100%. Max diversity on both sides. Defender rating deciding the outcome by a few hundred points or less. Us with 100+ defender kills and our opponent with 70 - 80 defender kills.

    Need points for defender kills to make skill matter - not harder nodes.
  • Deadbyrd9Deadbyrd9 Posts: 3,424
    Top 100 alliances have gone back to mystic wars. Our last 3 wars haven’t had either side go for diversity
  • MadMarks wrote: »
    This is just another brilliant strategy by the game designers (money extractors) at Kabam. They brainwashed the whole community that the AW map is easy and that you should be able to 100% it. For the first time they approached difficulty from the other end of the spectrum, very easy ramping to hard. That was brilliant. Now people have a tendency to hold on longer (i.e. spend more money) to not be the one who can't 100%. Kudus to Kabam for finding a very efficient way to separate the majority of players from their money once again. Now as I stated before, this will hold on until most alliances realize the tough defense strategy is now valid again. Once that happens the pendulum will swing back. But this time, when that pendulum swings back Kabam will make even more money. Tip of the cap to you Kabam, ruthless, but effective. Even better strategy for Kabam is put out the 100% map prize similar to AQ, that will even incentivize some who have already won the war to keep pressing on. Dangle the t2a shards possibly . . .

    I agree with you, except that we tried the tough defense strategy a couple wars ago and it didn't work. The outcome was both alliances had 100% complete, we had 186 defender kills and they had 71 defender kills. we lost because of diversity even with a max diffcilut defense because all you have to do is spend to overcome it.
  • ZerovZerov Posts: 26
    edited November 2017
    NDK13 wrote: »
    back in the day war needed skill.....now you can take any **** champ and still complete your route

    Depends what tier you're in, which paths you're taking, and which champs ur facing on certain nodes. There are now some paths in Tier 1 that people routinely get stuck on and require backup. We won the most recent AW with all 3 of their BGs not being able to clear a certain key node.
  • CobsCobs Posts: 74
    Tier1 has become harder and is mainly back to top tier defenders from what ive seen but tier2 and down War is still easy. The biggest problem is war is over before it even starts. Someone joins the wrong bg or a new player places the wrong champs and Messes up on diversity? Your war is over before you even start fighting. Without defender kills you have next to no shot at winning because everyone still 100%s the map. We either win on defender rating or because the other side made a mistake on diversity. War is Just terrible, it may be close to where kabam wants it but for me its missing one key thing, fun.
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