Hawkeye Power Control: Buff or Nerf?

With the current spotlight there has been some controversy with how good Hawkeyes new power control mechanic will be. Personally, it seems like a buff with how aggressively I’d use it if I ranked him. Of course, paper stats don’t tell us everything but while we are waiting for the buff to go live let us know your thoughts.

Comments

TheBair123

stop. not even close to a nerf

Hoitado

It sounds pretty good for me

Terra

Can't say until the buff goes live.

It's definetly a buff, especially with him getting more damage.
I wonder if the Tigra synergy will remain unchanged, with Crit Poisons maybe 🧐

GrandOldKai

So it's, under absolute optimal circumstances...

old: 40% of the entire power bar (120% of a bar)

new: 75% of a bar (25% of the entire bar), and 50% for eight to twelve seconds?

Say you landed exactly ten hits in those seconds of Suppression, and those ten hits generate an entire bar of power.

Assuming that a power bar is, say, 3000 units:

old: takes 1200 units, gives 1000 units in those ten hits. Overall -200.

New: Takes 750, gives 500. Overall -250.

Maybe my use of maths is totally wrong here, but in this case it is actually better.

I don't know how many hits you can actually land in the seconds of Suppression, or how reliable it is to get max duration Suppression, but the Suppression is a flat 50% power rate decrease regardless of length, so uh...

There's also the chance you won't manage to land enough hits for the Suppression to affect much, but they're gaining less power from you hitting their block IIRC

Maybe someone else can make better sense of this?

Mobile_P0tat0

His power control is slightly worse, his damage and utility is greatly increased. His kit looks solid and I'm excited to try him out.

FluffyPigMonster

Seems to me any time we don’t just get major damage and power control by smashing the attack button we automatically call the champ a failure.

Spidey 2099 was a noodle - until…..

Tedders

his sp1 is worse and the sp2 and sp3 are better, his bleed damage not awakened is much worse, awakened we will see how powerful those critical bleeds are.....if he can critical poison with the tigra synergy then i might rank him up

Colonaut123

Purely the power control, it is a clear nerf to me. Overall, it is still a buff.

Shadowstrike

So it's, under absolute optimal circumstances...

old: 40% of the entire power bar (120% of a bar)

new: 75% of a bar (25% of the entire bar), and 50% for eight to twelve seconds?

Say you landed exactly ten hits in those seconds of Suppression, and those ten hits generate an entire bar of power.

Assuming that a power bar is, say, 3000 units:

old: takes 1200 units, gives 1000 units in those ten hits. Overall -200.

New: Takes 750, gives 500. Overall -250.

Maybe my use of maths is totally wrong here, but in this case it is actually better.

I don't know how many hits you can actually land in the seconds of Suppression, or how reliable it is to get max duration Suppression, but the Suppression is a flat 50% power rate decrease regardless of length, so uh...

There's also the chance you won't manage to land enough hits for the Suppression to affect much, but they're gaining less power from you hitting their block IIRC

Maybe someone else can make better sense of this?

They're angry because they actually have to try to keep the power down rather than just spamming sp1

unknown

This content has been removed.

Lovejoy72

So it's, under absolute optimal circumstances...

old: 40% of the entire power bar (120% of a bar)

new: 75% of a bar (25% of the entire bar), and 50% for eight to twelve seconds?

Say you landed exactly ten hits in those seconds of Suppression, and those ten hits generate an entire bar of power.

Assuming that a power bar is, say, 3000 units:

old: takes 1200 units, gives 1000 units in those ten hits. Overall -200.

New: Takes 750, gives 500. Overall -250.

Maybe my use of maths is totally wrong here, but in this case it is actually better.

I don't know how many hits you can actually land in the seconds of Suppression, or how reliable it is to get max duration Suppression, but the Suppression is a flat 50% power rate decrease regardless of length, so uh...

There's also the chance you won't manage to land enough hits for the Suppression to affect much, but they're gaining less power from you hitting their block IIRC

Maybe someone else can make better sense of this?
They're angry because they actually have to try to keep the power down rather than just spamming sp1
Ur the type of person to defend kabam if they removed magiks power control

To be clear, most of what we love about Magik came from a buff. She used to be the worst champ in game.

Pdogg614

This is nonsense, it’s absolutely a buff. With the added suppression it is going to balance if you stay aggressive which is clearly how his kit is going to want you to play with pausing the bleeds.

Not sure why everyone cry’s nerf… I know he was once decent but who really uses him? These ppl who cry nerf are guaranteed weren’t touching him on their roster. If u need power control would u use him over magik/doom… not a chance. His power control is going to be good but more to keep ppl off as many specials not to deal with power gain, I’m thinking more like a hybrid punisher 2099 and actual power control champ.

Last I checked crit bleeds are amazing and being able to guarantee em when u master him and also keep em paused. He’s gonna be amazing and ppl will absolutely use him now. That’s the point of these buffs to give him a new life right?

Really tho I had no desire to rank mine before and now I’ve already started ranking him as he looks fun as hell and will be decent too. Is he gonna be top tier skill maybe not but time will tell how good he ends up being. Will he be marginal like now I don’t think so at all.

Ercarret

It will depend on a couple of things, but I think two things are worth pointing out:

1) We don't know if those suppression debuffs stack. If they do, you can probably lock down opponents much easier than you can currently. -50% defensive combat power gain x2 sounds very much like they won't get any power whatsoever from your strikes, which would be insane.

2) He now has power control through both power drain and a debuff, meaning he can be useful in more scenarios. If an opponent is immune to power drain or a node prevents their power from being drained, he can still shut them down fairly effectively through his suppression debuff. Even more so if they stack.

It might turn out to be a bad swap but I'm currently leaning towards it being a really intriguing change.

Colonaut123

It will depend on a couple of things, but I think two things are worth pointing out:

1) We don't know if those suppression debuffs stack. If they do, you can probably lock down opponents much easier than you can currently. -50% defensive combat power gain x2 sounds very much like they won't get any power whatsoever from your strikes, which would be insane.

2) He now has power control through both power drain and a debuff, meaning he can be useful in more scenarios. If an opponent is immune to power drain or a node prevents their power from being drained, he can still shut them down fairly effectively through his suppression debuff. Even more so if they stack.

It might turn out to be a bad swap but I'm currently leaning towards it being a really intriguing change.

1) I doubt you can stack the Suppression Debuff, exactly for that reason.

2) Pre-buff Hawkeye has two points of failure: failure to trigger the power drain because of AAR, and failure to power drain due to power drain immunity. Post-buff Hawkeye has seven points of failure: all the failures of pre-buff Hawkeye, failure to Perfect Release and subsequently loss of Dialed In Passives, failure to trigger the Suppression Debuff because of AAR, failure to apply the Suppression Debuff because of Suppression Debuff or regular Debuff immunity, removal of Suppression Debuff by nodes (Masochism) or purify ability (reduced debuff duration, tenacity, Kingpin or DDHK,...) and failure to take full advantage of the duration of the Suppression Debuff due to imperfect gameplay.

Terra

Seems to me any time we don’t just get major damage and power control by smashing the attack button we automatically call the champ a failure.

Spidey 2099 was a noodle - until…..

This. Oh god this.
People will warm up eventually, it's always like this with champs receiving buffs. The community always reacts the same.

Shadowstrike

Seems to me any time we don’t just get major damage and power control by smashing the attack button we automatically call the champ a failure.

Spidey 2099 was a noodle - until…..
This. Oh god this.
People will warm up eventually, it's always like this with champs receiving buffs. The community always reacts the same.

It's literally becoming the trend every month we go through this. At this point I wouldn't even put any faith in the threads complaining about how somebody looks on paper because with the notable exception of guillotine, even if you weren't getting ridiculous amounts of damage, you still found a use for them and I understand people hate Niche utility but sometimes that's how it's got to be because you can't just use the same five champions for everything. Especially if they're tied up in Alliance War or Alliance Quest.

KyriosRais

the poll result shows how toxic this community has gone regarding the buff program. Cause of kabam betray them with guillotine "buff", now the poison is contagious just because one bad heart breaking buff.

CoMinow

90% buff and should be way easier to spam and keep your opponent from gaming an sp1

BinkPlayz

option 3 really should've been waiting until live testing is done, since the flat power drain looks worse yet the new suppression add on could make it stronger, again, waiting for live testing

CoMinow

option 3 really should've been waiting until live testing is done, since the flat power drain looks worse yet the new suppression add on could make it stronger, again, waiting for live testing

The flat power drain isn’t worse. It’s situationally worse… it’s actually almost twice what it was at one bar of power (look again)

FluffyPigMonster

the poll result shows how toxic this community has gone regarding the buff program. Cause of kabam betray them with guillotine "buff", now the poison is contagious just because one bad heart breaking buff.

I took Guilly to war vs a mixmaster Terrax. When she had the pain link on she melted him.

Point is we have no patience if the champ doesn’t do 97 million damage on paper

BigPoppaCBONE

the poll result shows how toxic this community has gone regarding the buff program. Cause of kabam betray them with guillotine "buff", now the poison is contagious just because one bad heart breaking buff.
I took Guilly to war vs a mixmaster Terrax. When she had the pain link on she melted him.

Point is we have no patience if the champ doesn’t do 97 million damage on paper

I'm sure that's the case for a handful of people, but I'm also not calling a champ a rousing success because through trial and error we found a handful of situations where they're as good as the alternatives. Will Spidey 2099 still be a beastly non-noodle once Kabam quits spamming Unstoppable and True Strike... Nevermind, they'll never stop spamming those.

I voted nerf because the pd is straight up worse and people are tacking on the suppression numbers like they're a done deal and not of variable usefulness and that's only if you can get it. Is it likely to be easier to hit than a parry or the mini-game that people still have problems with?

AMS94

In terms of power control only it is a definite nerf....in other areas he has been improved
Still not the type of rework I wanted fr Hawkeye, but not close to the worst ones we've had
I still feel Kabam should always try to build over & above what the champ already has & not try to "balance" things

KyriosRais

the poll result shows how toxic this community has gone regarding the buff program. Cause of kabam betray them with guillotine "buff", now the poison is contagious just because one bad heart breaking buff.
I took Guilly to war vs a mixmaster Terrax. When she had the pain link on she melted him.

Point is we have no patience if the champ doesn’t do 97 million damage on paper

do you have a video ?? please share

rockykoston

the poll result shows how toxic this community has gone regarding the buff program. Cause of kabam betray them with guillotine "buff", now the poison is contagious just because one bad heart breaking buff.

The thing is as long as they're going to keep altering the base kit of a champ, the one thing that ppl love about them, the community is not going to be pleased.

There was absolutely no need to change his power drain, none, nada. It's not like he was breaking the game, heck, no one used him except for arena, one thing to like was his power drain.

Oh yes, let's change the power drain, make it a debuff, so debuff immune/shrug off champs cannot be power controlled.