Kabam please do something about GC points aquisition

It's quite amusing how you gain and lose the same amount of points in GC. You might play for 3-4 hours, or even longer, only to end up with the same score.

In VT, changes were made to help players with a 50% win rate progress towards milestones. I'm not suggesting a 50% reduction for losing, but perhaps losing points could be reduced by at least 20%.

There aren't many people playing GC; mostly skilled players participate. Casual players often don't invest their time because they get overwhelmed and can't progress. For players with moderate skills (like myself), it's been quite challenging to earn enough points to achieve radiance objectives.

In VT, I progress quickly, with a win rate certainly above 50%. I probably lost 5-7 matches from Diamond 5 to GC this season. However, in GC, it's like standing still. I won a few matches right after reaching GC, but in the last few days, the pattern has been "win-lose-win-lose...". It is not about several matches. It is about ~20 matches. I faced the same issue in previous seasons as well. I believe this is the main reason for the low activity in GC. Players with a 50% win rate have little chance to progress significantly. They can only hope for a small difference of 1-2 points if they earn 16 points for a win and then lose 14 points.

Let's imagine being a 50% win rate player in VT who reaches GC. The best option might be to achieve the first radiance objective and then forget about BG. You might hope for some luck to climb higher, but with a 50% win rate, there's little reason to continue playing. So, you don't waste time on a seemingly hopeless mode.

Now, consider the impact on other players, for example those with a 75% win rate. These players could progress faster in VT and are more skilled than those with a 50% win rate. However, their 75% win rate is largely due to less skilled players participating in BG. If players with a win rate of 50% or less stop playing, it creates a new group of players with a 50% win rate—those who previously had a 75% win rate now competing against each other. This means you need to be significantly more proficient in GC to make progress.

I haven't even mentioned the bugs and inconsistencies that can ruin your match:

- System outdrafting, where you can't control the outcome, and your opponent gets all the counters to your defenders while you get nothing, or the shuffle gives you 4-5 of the same champions.
- Poor AI, either extremely passive or one that unexpectedly intercepts you with a light attack while dashing.
- Accidental long loading times, which consume 10-15 seconds of your match, and even if you perform perfectly, you've already lost some advantage.
Since we all face these issues, they can be considered a baseline.

There should be more reasons for players to play in GC. A solo anniversary event seems insufficient for motivation. It's clear that many players don't participate in GC at all, as it's unlikely that each season I lose a significant portion of my skills upon reaching GC. No, it's because there are fewer players in this mode.

Comments

Rav514

I completely agree. The system was fine when there were no objectives in the GC, it was just trying to figure out who is the best, which is OK.

However once you added objectives for people to strive for, the system should’ve changed to accommodate for that. Right now it’s a +15 and a -14 and frankly it should be changed to something like -10. That way people who participate can hit the objectives after a decent period of time.

Yes, that will bump up the total max points because losses will not be quite as painful, but it will also make people in the lower rankings participate more because they’re going to feel that progress is rewarded for their time and effort which it is not right now.

Edit = punctuation.

JediJones77

You're absolutely right. I'm a longtime Valiant with over 100 7-stars, but not a whale. I have one Rank 4 7-star of each class. For me, Battlegrounds is Victory Track and Gladiator's Circuit doesn't exist. As soon as I get there, I can't make any progress whatsoever. Last season, it paired me up with people at a more advanced position and score every time. I try to get one match won so I'm at least not at the very bottom of the ranking, and then I quit because I know the chances of me losing the next match are far greater than winning. But I don't really care if they fix it. Completing the Victory Track is probably all I care to do at this point, and all I have time for. But Gladiator's Circuit is a really useless game mode for anyone but the biggest whales.

O_Deadpool_O

Thank you for your comments! I hope more people will engage with this post so that Kabam takes notice. There have been many similar discussions in the past, but they haven't led to any changes yet. Perhaps with increased community involvement, we can eventually make a difference.

I find the win-lose dynamic in BG to be quite toxic. Winning means reducing your opponent's points, potentially pushing them further from their desired objectives. Conversely, losing means you're further from achieving your own goals.

Additionally I dislike the use of emotes, especially those that can be perceived as bullying, like Loki laughing. It really frustrates me and makes me feel bad when opponents use them repeatedly, even when I know they aren't necessarily better than me - I might have just been outdrafted for the match. This kind of behavior makes climbing in GC even more challenging, mentally.

I must admit that I sometimes resort to using bullying emotes when I'm extremely frustrated by losses, but I feel guilty afterward, knowing I might have negatively impacted someone else's experience.

I believe that bullying through emotes is another reason why people may not enjoy the mode as much. Perhaps reducing the amount of points lost could lessen the negative impact of emotes.

BringPopcorn

Yup, I wondered how long it would take for post like this to come out.... Now they people are asking to dull out GC...

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893248#Comment_2893248

It's not about dulling it down; it's about making it a bit more enjoyable. You may be one of the skilled Mysterium demons or higher. You may not see the issue now, but consider it from a broader perspective. Let me simplify it a bit.

Players with a 50% win rate have quietly left GC. With their absence, those with a 60% win rate have dropped to a 50% win rate when competing against others in their tier. Eventually, they will also leave, as the time invested won't justify the rewards. This pattern will continue with players who have a 70% win rate, and so forth.

The mode will naturally decline if there's no motivation to participate. While you may still receive some Mysterium or Celestial rewards, the points required for these tiers will be significantly lower than they are now. As a result, all tiers will become very close to one another. Losing just 16 points could drastically affect your position (e.g., from Mysterium to Arcane). Additionally, achieving Radiance objectives will become more challenging.

This is because you'll be facing opponents similar to yourself, but whereas you once competed with them at 300 points, you'll now be playing against them at 100-150 points.

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893249#Comment_2893249

It's been over 3 years, people losing interest is normal. They should have never done the 2 coin 1 coin system.

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893251#Comment_2893251

I disagree, 2 coin 1 coin system is very helpful for developing accounts and less skilled players. And it brings enough motivation to play. This is the reason why it is possible for more skilled players to complete VT faster.

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893254#Comment_2893254

And the same reason why they get into GC, find themselves roadblocked and ask for the same system....

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893255#Comment_2893255

It's not them asking for the same system; it's me. I have a win rate well above 50% in VT, yet I find myself in matches with players at my level, stuck in a win-lose-win-lose cycle. I've consistently pushed to Quantum 2-1, but I'm on the verge of giving up too.

Last season, I spent 12 hours moving from 176 points to 200 due to the same win-lose pattern. I promised myself I wouldn't do that again. I realized that 10k Radiance isn't worth 12 hours of gameplay, nor is 20k Radiance.

I've also decided not to play BG in weeks 3 and 4 because I'm not skilled at intercepting, so there's no point in participating. I'll push as hard as I can in the first two weeks, finish where I can, and enjoy some personal time. Fortunately, the game hasn't implemented a penalty system for missing BG.

I believe I'm not the only one tired of the win-lose cycle, and more people will start calculating the time cost of participating in such a challenging game mode. So, all I can say to you is good luck with your matches, and I hope I won't see a similar post from you in +- six months when every matchup is against Mysterium or Celestial level players.

NoahSansman

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893265#Comment_2893265

It's a competitive gamemode. If you're at 176 or 200 points you shouldn't be asking for handicaps. If you can't move up from there, you aren't meant to.

VanillaCoke

Baby Battlegrounds is coming soon. You’ll have what you want soon

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893265#Comment_2893265

Why would I post something similar in 6 months when I haven't done it in 3 years?...

You realized 10k radiance was not worth the 12 hours and here you are...still wanting the 10k radiance.

I found the part of win/lose being toxic extremely funny. Welcome to the world of competitions, you lose you don't get participation points. Imagine every Olympic swimmer who had to face Michael Phelps whinning about the guy getting all the gold medals and some of them getting nothing. That is so toxic....

JESUSCHRIST

If players lose less points, they will trade losses with each other, especially in Celestial where it's a small group, everyone gains points by losing to each other

I lose first -8 points, you gain 16 points

You let me win, +16 points, you lose 8 points

Everyone gains 8 points at the end

Den match fixing becomes easy and common

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893266#Comment_2893266

You're absolutely right. But. Radiance objectives were introduced to encourage participation. In the first season they were added, I reached all of them without any issues. At that time, 200 points were somewhere at high-tier Arcane or even lower.

With so many people participating, many were able to achieve these objectives. However, now that fewer people are playing this mode, it has become much more challenging without a clear objective reason.

Rayven5220

IIt's an ELO system. This is how they work.

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893269#Comment_2893269

Participating in the Olympics is not essential for your personal progress in life.
However, participating in BG is necessary to remain on par with other players.

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893272#Comment_2893272

There is fewer people cause 10k radiance is not big enough of an incentive, so you should ask for a better objective reward, not to dumb down GC.

Also your perspective could be wrong since this is an event point farming season and people are just forfeiting matches and sandbagging decks.

So many factors that could explain why there are less players, and your solution is to get pity points … hilarious.

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893275#Comment_2893275

Wise thoughts, I agree with you here.
Any solution that encourages people to participate in BG is beneficial. If many players are engaged, even the current system works well. Perhaps the objective could be based on a certain number of points or a specific number of matches played. Offering alternatives in objective acquisition might spark interest.
_________________
Haven't met people forfeiting matches since Saturday…

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893279#Comment_2893279

Well why would someone start forfeiting matches at 150+ points?.... You forfeit at 0 at 15... Over and over and then when you are done start climbing …

You really haven't put much though on all this have you? Also you ask for more ways to incentive engagement and then say that you don't play weeks 3 and 4... You don't care about the integrity of BGs as a competition, you just want easier access to the 200 point objective.

GroundedWisdom

I mean, there's a point on both sides.

The Players usually advance, but because people are farming, this Season is going to be struggle bus in the lower rungs of the GC.

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893281#Comment_2893281

I have thought about it a lot. I typically play whole season. And last season I participated till the last 2 days.
I do want easier access to 200 points objective, this is true. Just because it was very easy at the beginning and extremely hard now.

I do not think I should provide a well-thought solution for whole BG, that will ensure its integrity and competitive aspects, as I am not a game designer. This work is on Kabam's side. I do not understand why you want something like that from me, this is dumb IMO :)

I try to express the problem I see and possible solution to this.
If you see better solution - why wouldn't you just write it here? No, you seem are here just to critisize my comments.

SirGamesBond

I can hit 100 pretty easily. If I have to play more than my usual to hit 200 points. I'm skipping it. couldn't care less tbh.

I get what you are saying tho.... and I don't mind player grinding mindlessly to hit 200 points.... ehh easier for me to get higher but I actually don't care enough for measly 10k.

Get me 50k per milestone and I'll grind (probably).

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893286#Comment_2893286

You are proposing a change in scoring, if you are not responsible for making a well thought out change then you shouldn't propose a change at all, cause its a dumb proposal…

And the grind is not to 200 points. Its the anniversary event that is keeping players farming EVENT POINTS in URU....

Yeah you haven't thought this at all...

Why would I propose a solution where I don't see a problem?..

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893288#Comment_2893288

LOL, don't tell me what I can and cannot do.
All your comments, except one, are biased against me.

I do not think my solution is dumb. Again, if you have better option - can you provide it?

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893293#Comment_2893293

I don't know you, I got 0 reasons to be biased against you, your dumb proposal total different story. I got nothing against you, I opposed your dumb idea.

A better idea to solve your problem when I don't see a problem at all?....

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893294#Comment_2893294

I guess Kabam will provide the final judgement if the idea is dumb or not (if somebody from their side at least looks at such discussions). From my perspective it is not dumb. It is opposite from your opinion. OK, it is a normal situation.
If you see no problem with that you may not spend half of the evening in this discussion. I think it should be enough of just one comment that it will not work well.

BringPopcorn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893299#Comment_2893299

Well if it was well thought out, you wouldn't have to explain it over and over...

You would also know that this s

O_Deadpool_O

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893303#Comment_2893303

I did not explain it over and over. My top post covers all the aspects. All the comments I wrote to you are just a discussion. You can consider them as a background of me as a player. But they are not related to main topic, should not be. It is a question of a common relation, there may be various backgrounds to that.

Also, your comment is not finished, hope you are OK.

CheeseMaster482

Competitive modes usually work this way. The only difference is that unlike actual competitive games, you will lose no matter how good you play if you don't have a whale roster. Kabam won't change anything though since they just want money and whales will slobber over the sales for BGs.

At least when I was grinding MK11 ranked I would be losing to people hitting crazy combos on me; something that takes skill and can't be bought. In this game you can play perfectly and still lose just because your opponent is an NPC whale that has all the meta seven stars at rank 4.

HarleyQnn

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2893303#Comment_2893303

What you are doing is called nitpicking and using a straw man fallacy. This person is trying to bring up the problem of low-level BG participation. He is right that he is not a game designer to judge the best solution, but at least he proposes something.

There is no doubt that BG participation is declining, which obviously makes objectives harder. Maybe changing the points system is not the best option, but it's worth considering. Objective goals can also be adjusted according to the participation rate. It seems that setting objectives at 75/150 points is reasonable now, as the number of people playing GC has drastically decreased.

You did not provide a single good counterpoint; you only try to misrepresent another point of view. Maybe you are doing it intentionally, or maybe you are not smart enough to understand the problem.