AW tanking

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

Comments

unknown

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hungryhungrybbq

Right, we don't do that either, because it's not our style and unsportsmanlike in my opinion. And we did experience this as well. Our first 5 matches last season were basically 50% stronger than us in alliance rating. I have posted about this myself and I'm hoping there's a way to discourage this practice via the scoring system in the future. I doubt it's a simple rework to do, but maybe there is a way. Multiplier partially effected by war rating? I'm not sure exactly how they would go about it.

Jaeguerra909

Cry me a river maybe find u guys a better alliance.

GroundedWisdom

Gmonkey wrote: »

My alliance does not tank but we no longer boost in the offseason as the rewards do not equal the cost.

That's fair. Tanking involves intentionally throwing Matches to lower Ratings and get easier Matches when Seasons start. Lots of Allies reserve themselves for Seasons. Not the same.

DL864

Who cares it’s offseason we don’t war but once a week and we are not boosting or spending resources. People are gonna try and find any edge they can get. It’s really not against any rules.

Muscleheadz

Perfect example of a platinum level alliance tanking in off season.

B_Dizzle_01

We do not tank. We play every war to win. Though in the off-season we don’t boost or use many resources. Occasionally if it close we will. But I do think tanking is a big problem. It would be smart if kabam locked in your final AW rating from the previous season and you could not move it in the off season regardless of win or loss. This would make it so you pick up right where you left off regardless of what you do in the off time. That would also give us opportunities to try different strategies and champs to test things out. This would completely eliminate tanking. Idk why this hasn’t been done already @Kabam Miike @Kabam Wolf @Kabam Lyra

Swimmer15

Id prefer not to even play war in offseason. But we play and use no pots/no boost, and many leave some best champs out for questing. It doesnt make any sense whatsoever to go hard in offseason. Rewards are trash, so all ally is achieving by going hard in off season is raising war rating. Just guarantees when season starts you can kick it off needing boost and pots right from start. I dont have a solution, maybe make the basic war rewards worth while. I think a good BC and loyalty reward increase would be a great incentive to at least play serious in offseason (we likely still wouldnt use boost but we would care to win at least). Many struggle with donations running map 5x5 weekly and even if say war win reward was 25-50,75k of each with drop rate being what they are, would not be a game changer. But incintive to play somewhat serious because many just dont have time or desire to grind arena at times.

DTMelodicMetal

It's comical how many "top" players do whatever to it takes to get the best rewards with the least amount of effort

Irohr

DTMelodicMetal wrote: »

It's comical how many "top" players do whatever to it takes to get the best rewards with the least amount of effort

The phrase work smarter not harder comes to mind lol.

DTMelodicMetal

Irohr wrote: »

The phrase work smarter not harder comes to mind lol.

Years of competitive sports experience has clouded my MMO IQ

PaytoPlay

We have fun defender themes during off season. Like a house party defender protocol where we only place different type of iron man on the map.

Still get lots of kill

Archangel442

DTMelodicMetal wrote: »

Irohr wrote: »

The phrase work smarter not harder comes to mind lol.

Years of competitive sports experience has clouded my MMO IQ

Most, if not all, competitive sports have eliminated competitive advantages like throwing or sandbagging simply by making it not beneficial... it can still happen, at the end of a season for example teams that have already secured their playoff spot may bench their starters... this game hasn’t yet managed to eliminate that advantage.

DTMelodicMetal

Archangel442 wrote: »

Most, if not all, competitive sports have eliminated competitive advantages like throwing or sandbagging simply by making it not beneficial... it can still happen, at the end of a season for example teams that have already secured their playoff spot may bench their starters... this game hasn’t yet managed to eliminate that advantage.

@Archangel442 Excellent comment. I played NCAA tennis in college, my team's preseason schedule had our most difficult matches. It was common to learn where we needed to improve when we played superior opponents. We also had ways of structuring practices to improve our weaknesses and hone our strengths. If a player was struggling with their return, they'd play matches where a teammate had 3 serves instead of 2. Can't stop double faulting? Play sets with 1 serve to figure out where your serve needed improvement. Can't volley? Coach pulled them aside and drilled them at the net until they could barely hold their racket.

I haven't seen much if any tanking by alliances who've finished top 3, especially those that weren't included in the recent AW Seasons ban waves. Sports and video games comparisons aren't always black and white, there're still better ways to lower war rating while placing defenders. Switch up assigned AW paths to give lesser skilled members AW experience with harder paths and fights, don't use items or boosts, randomize defender placement to see if you can find a new effective defender/node combination, fight AWs without using block or parry to improve intercepting skills, etc. I thought of those examples within 30 seconds, they all seem more useful long-term than tanking.

Zuko_ILC

72yendor wrote: »

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

It's not against the rules, we aren't playing for rewards so take the easy shards they give you. You will most likely end up on the same spot regardless so just say thanks for the free shards.

B_Dizzle_01

Zuko_ILC wrote: »

72yendor wrote: »

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

It's not against the rules, we aren't playing for rewards so take the easy shards they give you. You will most likely end up on the same spot regardless so just say thanks for the free shards.

Not true. Coming in to the season and having the first 5 wars be against people much stronger than you makes you lose out on the shards you could have won in a fair matchup. Then after losing your war rating for that time and then spending the next 5 getting back to where you started doesn’t leave much of the season left to climb up.

EB54

Doesn’t tanking open the door for alliances on the low end to climb the rewards tier in the “off time”? Then just sit out the season and wait for others to be tanking again. You would get better rewards that way then finishing below silver tier in season. Then everyone wins.

JamesM

Archangel442 wrote: »

DTMelodicMetal wrote: »

Irohr wrote: »

The phrase work smarter not harder comes to mind lol.

Years of competitive sports experience has clouded my MMO IQ

Most, if not all, competitive sports have eliminated competitive advantages like throwing or sandbagging simply by making it not beneficial... it can still happen, at the end of a season for example teams that have already secured their playoff spot may bench their starters... this game hasn’t yet managed to eliminate that advantage.

You are confusing season tanking with normal off season play. Name one professional sports team that cares about winning in preseason. They are doing it for practice they aren't playing to the best of their ability and that could be considered tanking.

Helicopter_dugdugdug

Third completely empty map in a row... soon we will be cross 3,000 rating even though we r just a t2 plat 2/3 aliance

GroundedWisdom

Zuko_ILC wrote: »

72yendor wrote: »

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

It's not against the rules, we aren't playing for rewards so take the easy shards they give you. You will most likely end up on the same spot regardless so just say thanks for the free shards.

It's hot fair play. That's for sure. Whether explicitly against the rules or not. It's manipulating one system to take advantage of another. It's also not "easy shards". People get a few easy Wins at the expense of being bombarded when Seasons start and losing Points towards larger Rewards.
The Matchmaking issues are one of the things being looked at currently, so whether or not it's against the rules doesn't make it a fair tactic. Many things are not specified in the rules that still equate to taking an unfair advantage of a situation.

unknown

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DTMelodicMetal

GluteusMaximus wrote: »

You mean like resting players in the regular season so they're fresh for the post-season?
You mean like pacing yourself and drafting to cut down on wind resistance in a marathon?
You mean coasting down inclines during a bike race?
You mean not busting it to first base on a ground out?
You mean taking a knee or running out of bounds instead of getting drilled by the d-line?
I could go on...

I meant continuously getting practice in novel ways to strengthen weaknesses. All of your examples involve some kind of action. Tanking is inaction. It would be more constructive to comment on the post I made after the one you quoted.

Wiredawg1

Zuko_ILC wrote: »

72yendor wrote: »

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

It's not against the rules, we aren't playing for rewards so take the easy shards they give you. You will most likely end up on the same spot regardless so just say thanks for the free shards.

Technically it is against rules. Don’t remember the 2* war from season 2 where both alliances got docked? Tanking is the exact same thing

PaytoPlay

Wiredawg1 wrote: »

Zuko_ILC wrote: »

72yendor wrote: »

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

It's not against the rules, we aren't playing for rewards so take the easy shards they give you. You will most likely end up on the same spot regardless so just say thanks for the free shards.

Technically it is against rules. Don’t remember the 2* war from season 2 where both alliances got docked? Tanking is the exact same thing

That's not true, 2* war is considered collusion. Tanking doesn't involve negotiating between two alliances and its a decision prior to attack phase.

Reference

To minimize the chance of tanking, I suggest Kabam to add the following functions (especially in off-season):
1. set a minimum number of participant per BG (e.g. over 6) or otherwise they can't create a new BG, such that leader/officer can't create an empty BG;
2. set a minimum ranking of defenders with alliance above Gold 1, such that they can't place 2* or 3* defenders;
3. penalty for exploration below 70% for alliance above Gold 1, such that they can't suicide entire team at the first fight. The best penalty is a ban for joining AW during the war season (1 times, 5, times, 10 times.....escalating bans);

@Kabam Miike what do you think?

Wiredawg1

PaytoPlay wrote: »

Wiredawg1 wrote: »

Zuko_ILC wrote: »

72yendor wrote: »

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

It's not against the rules, we aren't playing for rewards so take the easy shards they give you. You will most likely end up on the same spot regardless so just say thanks for the free shards.

Technically it is against rules. Don’t remember the 2* war from season 2 where both alliances got docked? Tanking is the exact same thing

That's not true, 2* war is considered collusion. Tanking doesn't involve negotiating between two alliances and its a decision prior to attack phase.

That’s also not true as alliances do it in off season. It’s common practice now it not hard to see. It’s done to get an unfair advantage at start of the season

PaytoPlay

Wiredawg1 wrote: »

PaytoPlay wrote: »

Wiredawg1 wrote: »

Zuko_ILC wrote: »

72yendor wrote: »

In the off season lots of teams are purposely loosing so they have the chance of winning more matches. In the last 2 seasons our alliance has fought really high ranked teams by them using this strategy is this the new way to play as our alliance likes to win matches but if lots of others are doing this well while in Rome.

It's not against the rules, we aren't playing for rewards so take the easy shards they give you. You will most likely end up on the same spot regardless so just say thanks for the free shards.

Technically it is against rules. Don’t remember the 2* war from season 2 where both alliances got docked? Tanking is the exact same thing

That's not true, 2* war is considered collusion. Tanking doesn't involve negotiating between two alliances and its a decision prior to attack phase.

That’s also not true as alliances do it in off season. It’s common practice now it not hard to see. It’s done to get an unfair advantage at start of the season

Most alliances save items during off season that's the common practice. It's strategic because you can build items back prior to season starts and at the same time lower war rating (this is somewhat a loophole, but absolutely legal which is the point I am arguing here). Some choose to place empty map to tank but there are still alliances out there who tries to win without using items as some comments above demonstrated. Some ppls tank and others try to win during off season to get to a higher multiplier. It is not against rules period.

GroundedWisdom

I think it's important to differentiate. Playing without using Items to the best of your ability and placing as normal is not Tanking. Tanking is intentionally taking dives to lower Rating and use the easier Matches to boost Seasons. It's perfectly within reason to play but not use Items.

Marzipan87

we have the second time in this offseason an empty defence ...
if this rate continue, with 2 empty defence wins from 3 war per week, we will start this season in T1...
so we think about to do the same...

but the real solution and maybe the easy one is:

Lock the war rating in offseason, only in active season the war rating should change

@Kabam Miike

Omni

It will take some digging but there was a post where Miike said people will have different defender placing strategies and that placing a full defense may not be optimal. Well in “tanking” alliances opinions it’s optimal based off their strategy not to place any defense.

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