Courage and Assassin Masteries ( Possibly Attack Masteries in General ) Are Bugged

The video says it all!

Comments

So does this effect dominos bleeds? Since it effects KM bleeds, which are a set DOT, it won’t effect dominos if it’s done by attack?

Do both masteries 100% work for attack though..

That’s what I’m concerned about just like with the class boosts . I play my teams and set up specific masteries to do what the game says they do. I don’t have the time or units to go through and test all of your in game content to see that it is working right. I don’t think compensation needs to come out, but do you think that mastery changes will be free for a couple days just Incase anyone’s main champs are quake/KM/iceman etc and would like to keep mastery but lessen the points..

Having to reset an entire tree just to remove a point and add it elsewhere it exhausting and costly.

I hope that with the class boost showing not working and now this, someone runs through and retests every mastery that is capable of being tested.

Ebbtide

Kabam Miike wrote: »

MattMan wrote: »

So instead of updating the masteries to apply to all forms of “attack” to properly correct the issue, youre adding disclaimers to allow for some attacks to be excluded, seems like the easy way out.

Updating the Mastery is not out of the question, and something we might consider in the future. Because of just far reaching their effects are, updating the effectiveness of a Mastery can be pretty scary! It will take time for us to be able to assess the updated effect, and we have to do that before we can look at actually updating them.

Like Pure Skill and the never arrived update to that?

BomberMan

Kabam Miike wrote: »

It's Champions that place DOTs (Damage over Time) without attacking. Dormammu's attacks still make Contact, but Champions like Iceman, who can place his Cold Snap right from the beginning of a Fight will not have the strength of the DOT increased.

Mike,

I struggle with the validity of what you are saying here. You are saying Cold Snap is effected but Dave’s video clearly indicates Cold Snap is scaling properly but Frostbite is effected.

You also indicate that it’s because at the time of these masteries you didn’t have abilities that caused damage without a hit. That does not explain KM bleed being effected. Bleed has been around since the start of the game, and the bleed damage is caused after hit from SP3.

Can you clear up these inconsistencies?

xingao

Please apply fixes and compensation as I am currently stuck in labyrinth of legend...those damage matters a lot ...

BigPoppaCBONE

Does this also apply for DOT passives? Also, will(can) attack boosts that aren’t attached to a hit be changed to be consistent with these masteries? This would solve a lot of the complaints in the game lately like Iceman, Dormammu slaughtering without even landing a hit.

unknown

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phillgreen

no, money down.

It's a typo.

BigPoppaCBONE

Kabam Miike wrote: »

Hey everybody,

Thank you Dave for taking the time to make this video! We’ve spoken to our team to find out what is going on, and can confirm that this isn’t a bug, but the result of the age of these masteries. These Masteries have been the same since they were first introduced.

Courage and Assassin do not raise your attack stat on their own, but boost your attack on every hit. They have never affected Damage Over Time Debuffs that proc’d off of something that does not hit the opponent.

This is because when these Masteries were created, we had no way to apply a bonus to any stat based on your real time health as it moved up and down. We had to check your current health each and every time we wanted to trigger that bonus. At the time, we also didn’t have any abilities like this that dealt damage without a hit.

We’re going to rewrite the description text to avoid any further confusion.

Does this also apply for DOT passives? Also, will attack boosts that aren’t attached to a hit be changed to be consistent with these masteries? This would solve a lot of the complaints in the game lately like Iceman, Dormammu passives slaughtering without even landing a hit.

Kabam Miike

GhostRooster wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

Hey everybody,

Thank you Dave for taking the time to make this video! We’ve spoken to our team to find out what is going on, and can confirm that this isn’t a bug, but the result of the age of these masteries. These Masteries have been the same since they were first introduced.

Courage and Assassin do not raise your attack stat on their own, but boost your attack on every hit. They have never affected Damage Over Time Debuffs that proc’d off of something that does not hit the opponent.

This is because when these Masteries were created, we had no way to apply a bonus to any stat based on your real time health as it moved up and down. We had to check your current health each and every time we wanted to trigger that bonus. At the time, we also didn’t have any abilities like this that dealt damage without a hit.

We’re going to rewrite the description text to avoid any further confusion.

Sorry but you’re wrong. i’ve used a 4/55 hawkeye a lot over the last year, and let me tell you, once they hit 18%, and i threw an sp1, there was extra damage. This isn’t something you can just sweep up and say “theyre old” “they weren’t intended to ...” but guess what! They ARE intended to work with debuffs otherwise YOU would have reworked them a long time ago.

I think there's a little confusion here. This is how it should work, and how we said that it does. Hawkeye places DOTs by attacking, and so there is increased Damage, as it should be.

This is also only for these Masteries because they have to actively check for your current health/the health of your opponents. They are not for all boosted attack ratings.

caligarelinquo

I have a question. If DOT debuffs scale based on the champion's attack or even buffs like fury, then why doesn't the mastery Courage also make the DOT scale? It would seem like the interaction between Courage and DOT do not work well together. Then the same question can be applied to Assassin mastery, with the opponent's health dropping below 18%, we are supposed to receive an increase to attack which should, in theory, scale up our DOT debuffs. So it seems a little inconsistent, unless I just read all of this wrong, which could be the case. Any light that can be shared on this would be greatly appreciated.

Jcobra25

MattMan wrote: »

So instead of updating the masteries to apply to all forms of “attack” to properly correct the issue, youre adding disclaimers to allow for some attacks to be excluded, seems like the easy way out.

Exactly,
- step 1, create a new and exciting mastery
- step 2, change the meta
- step 3, get tons of money from summoners all over the world.
- tell your customer base that said mastery isnt doing what we thought we had paid for. But not to worry "we will update the description"
SOUND FAMILIAR?

they have done this to us, over, and over, and over. We are all a bunch of fools for remaining their loyal paying customers.

Primetime_769

Kabam you need to give us all of our resources back. You didn’t describe it well enough I wonder what apple will think of this. So I would like all of the units it takes to max out those masteries that I put into it. Please take care of your customers.

Anon1

I think Dave also pointed out that KillMonger’s SP3 bleeds do not increase with courage and assassin. But presumably his SP3 hits the opponent.

Mr_Platypus

Kabam Miike wrote: »

GhostRooster wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

Hey everybody,

Thank you Dave for taking the time to make this video! We’ve spoken to our team to find out what is going on, and can confirm that this isn’t a bug, but the result of the age of these masteries. These Masteries have been the same since they were first introduced.

Courage and Assassin do not raise your attack stat on their own, but boost your attack on every hit. They have never affected Damage Over Time Debuffs that proc’d off of something that does not hit the opponent.

This is because when these Masteries were created, we had no way to apply a bonus to any stat based on your real time health as it moved up and down. We had to check your current health each and every time we wanted to trigger that bonus. At the time, we also didn’t have any abilities like this that dealt damage without a hit.

We’re going to rewrite the description text to avoid any further confusion.

Sorry but you’re wrong. i’ve used a 4/55 hawkeye a lot over the last year, and let me tell you, once they hit 18%, and i threw an sp1, there was extra damage. This isn’t something you can just sweep up and say “theyre old” “they weren’t intended to ...” but guess what! They ARE intended to work with debuffs otherwise YOU would have reworked them a long time ago.

I think there's a little confusion here. This is how it should work, and how we said that it does. Hawkeye places DOTs by attacking, and so there is increased Damage, as it should be.

This is also only for these Masteries because they have to actively check for your current health/the health of your opponents. They are not for all boosted attack ratings.

I think the team needs to go through and thoroughly check all the descriptions of everything and make sure it works as intended AND list every change made in patch notes for whenever this occurs.
Just sitting on the information that something doesn’t work as described is idiotic, someone in the community will find out and then you’ll face even more backlash.

Chris_This

The fact that no one really knows for sure how things are actually "calculated" is alarming. Why does everything in this game have to be so complex? Its almost like we aren't supposed to figure this stuff out.

shady af.

Fyrintenimar

Just my two cents worth: When parry was changed, we were refunded our resources, given a free trial period, and given the option to invest in parry again or spend it elsewhere.
I’d say, if you change these masteries, even if it’s only the description, you should take the same approach (refund resources, give free trial, then let players decide if it’s worth putting the resources back in or not).

Fyrintenimar

Chris_This wrote: »

The fact that no one really knows for sure how things are actually "calculated" is alarming. Why does everything in this game have to be so complex? Its almost like we aren't supposed to figure this stuff out.

shady af.

To be fair to Kabam, whenever you update a program, there is a chance of unintended outcomes. As they add new mechanics, they don’t always react with existing masteries in the expected way.
I’ve seen similar issues pop up in other games as well. Whether it’s shady or not comes down to how they handle it now that the issue is revealed.

Tasty_Yum_Yums

Funny how this only negatively impacts the player base since we are the ones with masteries and feeling the impact of missing damage....

Tman0971

Kabam Miike wrote: »

MattMan wrote: »

So instead of updating the masteries to apply to all forms of “attack” to properly correct the issue, youre adding disclaimers to allow for some attacks to be excluded, seems like the easy way out.

Updating the Mastery is not out of the question, and something we might consider in the future. Because of just far reaching their effects are, updating the effectiveness of a Mastery can be pretty scary! It will take time for us to be able to assess the updated effect, and we have to do that before we can look at actually updating them.

@Kabam Miike
Developers have obviously figured out how to make SYNERGIES that grant attack boost of x% scale up for passive DoT (for example, quake with antman, YJ synergy, etc.) so why not update Courage, Assassin, and I assume Suicides, Glass Cannon and Lesser/Greater Strength do it as well instead of just changing the description?
The code is obviously there now, right?
Let's do the right thing here and get the masteries FIXED to reflect current game status vs. just sweeping it away with a wording change.

unknown

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DorkLessons

DemitriM wrote: »

you say diablo is in assassin' range when he has 23% hp
thats not assassin's range,its 18%

your attack starts at 23%hp and goes on, it doesnt end... you knock him down with your heavy but there are still 3 aftershock charges remaining(which you put on him while he wasnt in assassin's range) from your previous attack that started at 23% remaining hp...

basically imagine someone is at 20% hp, you gonna hit him with a medium attack that will drop your opponents hp to lets say 15%...that medium attack wont be effected by the assassin mastery right? but the one after that will be effected by the assassin mastery

could you try giving aftershock damage when the opponent is below 18% health with no aftershock stacks? same story goes for courage mastery as well in quake's case
cheers

I ripple deleted a clip in my editing.. So it moved the video up on my voiceover, he was soon in 18% and still was not affected at that point.. but also a whole new series of Aftershock was started well into it.

ZMode45

Really, this sounds to me like something you knew was not working properly. Rather than being proactive Kabam continues to let the mastery stay the same, hoping that we don't catch it.

Dave found it and what you are doing is not ethical. Hence why so many people are leaving this game. I know so many 3+ year players that have said forget it due to Kabam being such a poor company.

Zuko_ILC

I just don't understand the response, AW defense nodes scale with DOT so why can't courage and assassins? Fix the code not the description. This is the 2nd we'll just change the description in 2 weeks and it's not an acceptable business practice.

Wayntos

DoT is increased with courage in bleed, poison or incinerate or whatever if applied by contact such as stab, shot or whatever, but not increased if no contact is made such as poisoned by abomination where he was hit or cold snap or aftershock with quake. is that correct if so i can get behind that!

Tman0971

Tman0971 wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

MattMan wrote: »

So instead of updating the masteries to apply to all forms of “attack” to properly correct the issue, youre adding disclaimers to allow for some attacks to be excluded, seems like the easy way out.

Updating the Mastery is not out of the question, and something we might consider in the future. Because of just far reaching their effects are, updating the effectiveness of a Mastery can be pretty scary! It will take time for us to be able to assess the updated effect, and we have to do that before we can look at actually updating them.

@Kabam Miike
Developers have obviously figured out how to make SYNERGIES that grant attack boost of x% scale up for passive DoT (for example, quake with antman, YJ synergy, etc.) so why not update Courage, Assassin, and I assume Suicides, Glass Cannon and Lesser/Greater Strength do it as well instead of just changing the description?
The code is obviously there now, right?
Let's do the right thing here and get the masteries FIXED to reflect current game status vs. just sweeping it away with a wording change.

@Kabam Miike I retract this statement. I was missing the part about how Courage and Assassin are tied to your or your opponents health which requires constant calculation vs other masteries, synergies, or boosts that are flat value increase regardless of health.

That said... it's been many years since Courage and Assassin have been out - I would hope that the current code framework would have advanced enough by now to allow correct interaction between these two synergies and their subsequent attack boost.

XxLoganTDCxX

So should I continue to save up units for these masteries or should I just use them on something else?

IsItthough

While coldsnap is applied at the start of the fight, doesn't Iceman apply all other coldsnap or frostbite on contact? Since you guys are setting the standard, I went ahead and edited the text in my apple store to say Item not working as intended, can you guys update that on your end. Seems like the thing to do.

Snail_McGavin

Knowing the description for this mastery is being changed, wouldn’t that at least qualify for an opportunity to reset masteries at no costs?

TH3_STONE

I'm a 100% sure there is something wrong with the couage and assassins masteries and it has nothing to do with it being old ... sounds more to me like a whole bunch of excuses ..like a new way to create the shades to try to pull over everyones eyes and try and make us feel like we don't know when we do.
I can assure you I'm not alone or the only one with these feelings. Many of us that had been playing for a long time and pay attention to masteries and mastery setups and mastery rearranging....and we are furious.... do the right thing and fix it dont lie

MattMan

We need to hear from someone who can actually affect some sort of proper resolution. Forum mods obviously aren’t the right people to address this.

“I’ll take it to the team” means nothing anymore.

Get the “team” in here and take some responsibility for the continued fraudulant decisions being made.

I’ll ask again, when are the refunds being sent out?