Easy question - Is Willpower worth it? [mod edit for clarity]

So many conflicting advice out there! Simply, is Willpower worth maxing out, or even having anymore since the updates? Or would the extra points on D be better spent elsewhere?

Comments

phillgreen

WP is only good against weaker/similar PI opponents and for non damage debuffs (armour break/fatigue etc) but bleeds etc, it's a waste of time.

I took points away after the nerf (I was still in act 3) and they have never gone back (completed ACT 4 and complete master every month without it)

I'd rather go attack heavy and end fights quicker which is a bunch more useful on stupid nodes (degen etc) and WP is too expensive for newer players who would get more benefit from other masteries.

Suicides are a different matter (never tried them) but for the regular guy, no way would I waste the cores and points.

Dave_the_destroyer

Thanks for all the advice people (apart from the idiot who thinks advice is being offensive) really appreciate it all. Still confused to be honest, but that is just me!

TBH im not that good a player yet in my opinion. I still get hit a lot and only on 72% of act 4, so think 2 points in WP will help. If I ever get better (!!) I can see that all those points would be great elsewhere!

Speedbump

Just do one, not 2. one is helpful 2 is a waste.

Dave_the_destroyer

Speedbump wrote: »

Just do one, not 2. one is helpful 2 is a waste.

Thanks man, will do

Extra point in ??? told you I was confused!

Speedbump

Just put one in WP, maybe post masteries and I can help better of where to put the other

RagamugginGunner

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

If you're a good player WP is garbage. Just don't get hit.

I used it WP, Coagulate and Suture when I was new and now I wish I just saved my units and got better sooner. They're a crutch keeping people from getting better.

Any Health you can recover makes all the difference when you need it. I don't care how skilled you are. No one avoids all Damage 100% of the time. For people who haven't completed Act 4, it helps. Saying it's a crutch is a bit ignorant.

If you need WP you aren't good enough at the game. Spend more time playing and less on the forums.

Wow. Your methods of helping newer Players are abounding. "Git gud". I didn't say I relied on it. I said it was worth the investment. That was the question. That's the fundamental problem with arrogance. Some forget that there are different levels of Players. I can assure you. I do just fine. Perhaps not as good as some who never get hit. Guess we all need something to aspire to. Thanks for being an example. I'm not a noob. WP helps. Any Health that can be recovered helps. If you can't see the logic in that, that's just a foolish way of thinking.

My comments are actually very helpful for new and bad players. If you aren't that good yet, WP is great. Get better at the game and drop WP for much better masteries.

I also stand by my comment that WP is a crutch. By allowing a bad player like you to clear content using poor methods it will just make the harder content that much harder. The sooner you drop WP and learn how to bait and intercept the sooner you will be to becoming good at the game.

You can either choose to heed my advice and get good at the game or choose to be pissy on the message boards and always be mediocre.

Badrose

Tmasters1984 wrote: »

It's a bit of a dickish thing to say.

It's just about playstyle and champs, as with all masteries. Willpower can be super helpful when facing, say, Cable for example. It's a good counter to degen.

I'll sometimes take an armour break on top of farltigue or weakness or and use it to heal; it helps provide some safety against abom, mordo, iceman. It's not stupid to say willpower is useful in certain situations. I'd rather have points there then glass cannon, to be honest.

Of course Willpower can be super helpful in some situations. The point is: better use few FREE potions/revives (if needed) in those situations, or unlock and spend a lot of units to unlock WP?

Tmasters1984

It never bothered me. You come across a lot of units in the game so I've unlocked a lot of masteries over 2 plus years, and I'm level 60 with the extra points from Act 4.

I still regularly keep 2 points in willpower (despite people here saying it is a waste) - the only content worth changing it for, for me, is Act 5 and LoL/RoL. - which requires a rethink of the entire set. Considering changing your whole mastery set costs less then 100 units now I don't view it as a crutch, but a utility, and I'm not going to be dissing players for using it.

The gains are minimal, but you can be strategic, and, over the course of a match you've probably gained back all the health you've lost from blocking. Not so bad.

GroundedWisdom

phillgreen wrote: »

WP is only good against weaker/similar PI opponents and for non damage debuffs (armour break/fatigue etc) but bleeds etc, it's a waste of time.

I took points away after the nerf (I was still in act 3) and they have never gone back (completed ACT 4 and complete master every month without it)

I'd rather go attack heavy and end fights quicker which is a bunch more useful on stupid nodes (degen etc) and WP is too expensive for newer players who would get more benefit from other masteries.

Suicides are a different matter (never tried them) but for the regular guy, no way would I waste the cores and points.

I think that's the number one mistake people made. The full benefit is best when it's Maxed, along with Recovery Maxed.

GroundedWisdom

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

If you're a good player WP is garbage. Just don't get hit.

I used it WP, Coagulate and Suture when I was new and now I wish I just saved my units and got better sooner. They're a crutch keeping people from getting better.

Any Health you can recover makes all the difference when you need it. I don't care how skilled you are. No one avoids all Damage 100% of the time. For people who haven't completed Act 4, it helps. Saying it's a crutch is a bit ignorant.

If you need WP you aren't good enough at the game. Spend more time playing and less on the forums.

Wow. Your methods of helping newer Players are abounding. "Git gud". I didn't say I relied on it. I said it was worth the investment. That was the question. That's the fundamental problem with arrogance. Some forget that there are different levels of Players. I can assure you. I do just fine. Perhaps not as good as some who never get hit. Guess we all need something to aspire to. Thanks for being an example. I'm not a noob. WP helps. Any Health that can be recovered helps. If you can't see the logic in that, that's just a foolish way of thinking.

My comments are actually very helpful for new and bad players. If you aren't that good yet, WP is great. Get better at the game and drop WP for much better masteries.

I also stand by my comment that WP is a crutch. By allowing a bad player like you to clear content using poor methods it will just make the harder content that much harder. The sooner you drop WP and learn how to bait and intercept the sooner you will be to becoming good at the game.

You can either choose to heed my advice and get good at the game or choose to be pissy on the message boards and always be mediocre.

You continue to make this personal, implying it's about me, and that I'm a bad Player. This needs to stop. It is not appropriate for this Forum. We are having a discussion about whether WP is worth the investment. My view is that it is. Being ignorant is not an acceptable form of debate. You can have any view you choose. DO NOT turn it into a reason to come for me because your arrogance has no effect on me. Frankly I don't care. All you're doing is turning a healthy discussion into a negative one. Commenting on someone's view is fine. Calling them a bad Player is not. You don't know how I play. You're acting like a bully in the conversation, and quite frankly that doesn't work on me.

Tmasters1984

For an average champ with 12k health, rank 1 willpower will gain you 60 health per second, rank 2 is 72 and rank 3 is 84. The higher with recovery.

For most fights you do in the game on Master level, block damage can be anywhere from 50-300 health. Most champs have debuffs but wp is particularly useful against armour break (because the break doesn't negate the armour gain you get from the mastery), weakness, fatigue, enfeeble and those debuffs that might land from an enemy parry.

It's less effective against bleed,poison, degen, shock wtc, but, against some enemies it'll take enough bite out of them to work in your favour.

In short, the days of turning all champs into wolverine are over - but it's a defensive mastery and all defensive masteries have a purpose of limiting enemy damage and maximizing attack chance.

I understand the players that hate the defensive skill set, because they never get hit, but few players are like that and most won't get to that stage. The mastery has a purpose - you just need to know your playstyle to decide whether it will be useful.

Blackbeard

Willpower will always help you no matter you place in boss or minibuses nodes or you use suicidal. What changed now is placing in boss or miniboss nodes will not increase the regen. And willpower is still required maxed for counter suicidal, just you can't place in boss or miniboss nodes again and health boosted nodes will hurt more if suicidal is on. But maxing willpower and recovery itself not gonna hurt you anyway.
But I prefer put one point in willpower and concentrate on deepwound unless you want suicidal setup. Recent change on willpower basing Base health only preventing placing in high health boosted nodes. Otherwise it's still the same useful mastery everyone should have.

Blackbeard

And again if you have enough poison immune(as I have 6) or bleed immune champs(as I have 3) it's really no change atall. I can use suicidal and willpower is serving the same way it does before.

Primmer79

I think the point of boss/miniboss discussion was about using suicides, dont place as boss

Solrac_2

Unless running suicides, WP shouldn't be maxed. It was a god-tier mastery but it has been nerfed multiple times. Recovery, if you use regen champs like most, should be maxed.

One point is all you need for WP. Those two other points are better spent elsewhere. I've run WP at 3 until the multiple nerfs. I had it at 1 for a couple of months but just recently switched to a no WP mastery setup. WP requires a lot of mastery points to unlock, more than many are willing to put in now. I know multiple players that play in very high prestige alliances and a no WP setup is the new craze.

Dave_the_destroyer

Great advice, thank you all!! Makes a lot more sense now

Idontinkso

WP is good counter-balance glass cannon if you want to run just that and not the other suicides for a max attack setup.

Also lets you take advantage of armor break and fatigue for free regeneration when you do mess up. Not tons but enough to help with block /parry damage when you run 3 in WP.

Even if you find WP useless based on your skill or play style, it is good for your PI. Proportionally hitting harder and taking less damage for all heros across the board sounds pretty useful no matter where you are at in the game.

Dave_the_destroyer

Idontinkso wrote: »

WP is good counter-balance glass cannon if you want to run just that and not the other suicides for a max attack setup.

Also lets you take advantage of armor break and fatigue for free regeneration when you do mess up. Not tons but enough to help with block /parry damage when you run 3 in WP.

Even if you find WP useless based on your skill or play style, it is good for your PI. Proportionally hitting harder and taking less damage for all heros across the board sounds pretty useful no matter where you are at in the game.

Good advice mate, thanks

How does WP make you hit harder?

vucachon

i got rid of WP a while back. i don't miss it at all. Like the others have mentioned, that's a lot of mastery pts just to reach even 1 pt in WP. But in the end, it all depends on how you play. Maybe take it off, throw the points into something else, and test to see if you notice a difference or not. If you see that your survivability takes a big hit, put it back on. Ultimately, after all the advice, you need to test it out with your current skills and roster.

Tmasters1984

Dave_the_destroyer wrote: »

Idontinkso wrote: »

WP is good counter-balance glass cannon if you want to run just that and not the other suicides for a max attack setup.

Also lets you take advantage of armor break and fatigue for free regeneration when you do mess up. Not tons but enough to help with block /parry damage when you run 3 in WP.

Even if you find WP useless based on your skill or play style, it is good for your PI. Proportionally hitting harder and taking less damage for all heros across the board sounds pretty useful no matter where you are at in the game.

Good advice mate, thanks

How does WP make you hit harder?

He's talking about pairing it with Glass Cannon, which isn't a bad idea really.

WP adds armor and regen on debuffs.
GC ups your attack but reduces your overall health.

Blackbeard

I still vote for 1 point in willpower. Actually not for itself, but to get to coagulate. Instead maxing willpower, i will go for max coagulate. Its a great safeguard. Reducing any bleed effect by 30%.

Sai_7

WillPower is good.. in fact essential.. max will power with max recovery has helped in various stages of the game (story Act 4, AQ & AW)
I would try switching to 1/3 willpower and spend those points on Deep wounds to max it and check how that works out for me.

As for the question have atleast 1 point in there I wouldn't be against get it to max as well. atleast for no1!