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Due to issues related to the release of Mastery Loadouts, the "free swap" period will be extended.
The new end date will be May 1st.
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Carnage nerf before release....
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I sure hope so, such a fan favorite champ and he's almost useless
Just stop, Kabam said nerf. It was nerfed. You are wrong no matter what you respond with so why keep responding on the subject. Kabam even said he was nerfed to my face therefore no matter what your opinion is it is wrong as the creators themself said nerf. So not sure why you have to prove you are right. You are 1000% wrong and that won't change.
Thanks for confirming, it provides valuable insight into what has already been said.
@GroundedWisdom seems he blocked me, he never wants to answer me when I call him out on his bs. Cat.
You're missing the point of what I'm saying. There are nerfs that we refer to. BW, SW, etc. Those are changes to Champs that were in existence. Then there is the term "nerf" that is used. In this case, it refers to toning him down. What I'm saying is the changes they make to Champs before they're released are not nerfs. They make changes to Champs before they release them. I am not arguing what was said. I'm pointing out the difference because the idea of nerfing will inevitably lead to conspiracy discussions.
Really not trying to inhibit your Thread. I'm clarifying.
I'm glad you made it out to the convention.
I’d say you already watched it seeing as you posted about it right after Seatin uploaded the video talking about it.
He wants to be a kabam employee so God Damn bad lol
Because there isn't one. Semantics arguments are only made as a deliberate attempt to derail a conversation. We understand the distinction you are making, you are just wrong. Not in a "IMO" type of wrong, just wrong.
Sorry you disagree. We can move on.
I was at the event and asked the question to a developer there. I'm sure lots of people asked about carnage. I didn't even know there was a video up yet.
Stop derailing the thread, stay on topic or it will be flagged.
Credit to Seatin for actually asking the developers these questions whilst he was there and giving us the answers
I've been using the term "nerf" for as long as I've been playing MMOs, which is since 2003. At no time has the term been defined to be changes after deployment. It has generally been used in that context because players generally are unaware of changes made prior to deployment. But when the term became widespread, game developers used the term to refer to their own experiences with internal development: a nerf is a significant downward change from an established implementation. When beta testing became the standard for MMOs, the term "nerf" was always used as if applicable to a development, alpha, closed beta, or open beta environment. It refers to the spirit of the action, not the connotative effect on players.
Also, there is no such rule of accepted language that determines the pronunciation of acronyms. If the rules of language mandated that "GIF" be pronounced with a hard G just because "Graphics" is pronounced with a hard G, then "BIOS" should be pronounced "bee-oss."
Yes, Kabam has admitted that he was originally designed to be stronger but then decided to reduce those abilities. Call it whatever you want, at the end of the day the champ we got wasn't what we hoped he would be. I am encouraged that the developers have indicated they are working to improve him, but as we've seen with other "fixes" in the game, any change will likely take some time and probably cause more problems than it solves.
This happens all the time, unfortunately, because of a number of factors. Short answer: time pressure plus mathematical illiteracy, combined with the overwhelming fear not to over shoot a champion.
When the MMO City of Heroes was in pre-release beta test, one of the damage mitgation powersets was playtested to be incredibly strong relative to the others, specifically the defensive (i.e. don't get hit) Super Reflexes powerset. Literally one week before release and with no real testing the devs cut the numbers for that set in half.
For very mathy reasons that would have been obvious to mathy people, but apparently not to the devs, cutting the numbers in half actually made the set literally worthless on release. I don't mean like it went from really strong to really weak and now players didn't want it. I mean its actual effective damage mitigation capability was reduced to almost zero.
Sticking with the superhero theme, when Champions Online was in final beta many defensive abilities were playtested to be much stronger than the devs apparently intended. Again, literally just before release they globally changed all of them in different ways to "fix" the problem. In the process, they broke almost all of them.
In both cases, literally years of development time and months of testing got obliterated by a last minute panic change. And game developers are *notorious* for not being good with snap changes that are relatively untested. But why always aim so low? Because one of the MMO development commandments is: thou shalt aim low, because thou wilst not get slammed for buffing later, but woe be he that aims high, because the nerf bat brings down all who dare wield it.
People who like math do not tend to jump into careers in game development. Which is ironic because while much of game implementation is very artsy - graphics, sound design, visual effects, character modeling skeletal animations, etc - the fundamental systems design and entity and abilities design is essentially all math. When you make a building, the architects design the look of the building and the structural engineers make sure it doesn't fall down. Game design has a lot of architects being tasked to be structural engineers.
But I will cut the game developers one bit of slack. Most players that think they are way better than the game devs. Most aren't. True in every game. This looks way easier than it is. You have to actually do it, and have your work judged by thousands of other people none of whom will necessarily agree with any of your ideas, without a safety net and nowhere to hide if you screw up, before you will know if you are actually any good at it.
EDIT: Or whoever you are wanting to quote
When you talked to them, did they explain how he was OP? I mean did he have different abilities? Same abilities just more attack power? What made him OP?
More than one player seems to be relating the same story: the designer said among other things that during testing Carnage was able to defeat RoL Winter Soldier in about 80 hits. That suggested far too much offensive output.
Given how Carnage appears to be designed to stack up buffs, that's not entirely out of the realm of possibility. Stark Spidey has a similar albeit possibly more difficult scaling offense: stack up enough charges and he starts to generate huge offensive output. My guess is that not only was Carnage generating too much damage, but he was doing so too easily relative to the extremely long combo meter required for SL or the consistent evasion required from Spark.
So then it sounds like he was pretty much the same package, only the numbers were most likely tuned a lot higher.
It wouldn't take much. Suppose we increase the buff cap from five to eight, and suppose the mutation timer didn't exist and activating a special caused the current buff to become permanent on activation. Now spamming heavies and mediums along with special attacks could ramp up your damage to Stark Spidey levels very fast and you could also be doing a lot of bleed with deep wounds.
Now working backwards, it is plausible that the devs saw that and decided to lower the cap on buffs and add a cooldown timer so you could not build them up that quickly, aka the mutation timer. I'm not saying that happened exactly, but something like that is possible. Relatively small changes on the surface can have a dramatic impact on the performance of a champion. My guess is the mutation timer is the prime suspect in toning down Carnage, and the buff cap number feels like it could have been lowered also.
If carnages power was pre "nerf" from bleeds and heavy attack bleeds i really cant consider hin OP, some cased yes but using like solely heavys to get a bleed going is really qlunky mechanics imo.
But i have 4* carnage and cosmic awaken so hoping the buff to be good and happening soon
It also makes me really curious as to how strong he was before than , and really saddened because I actually just pulled him earlier today on my alt and now that I know he could have been great instead of being carbage.