Stealth Spidey Poor Ability Design?

Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
in General Discussion
Anyone else think the fact that you have to get 5 consecutive hits (and land specifically the fourth light), or get to your sp2 (and hope they don't evade it) to apply the slow debuff kind of defeats the purpose? When fighting high evade champs, it's tough and risky to apply it, and reapply it for that matter. For such a glass cannon, it's almost too risky to even try.. Wish they would have made it more practical to apply, and sustain.

Comments

  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • MagrailothosMagrailothos Member Posts: 6,042 ★★★★★
    Jake303AoS said:

    Anyone else think the fact that you have to get 5 consecutive hits (and land specifically the fourth light), or get to your sp2 (and hope they don't evade it) to apply the slow debuff kind of defeats the purpose? When fighting high evade champs, it's tough and risky to apply it, and reapply it for that matter. For such a glass cannon, it's almost too risky to even try.. Wish they would have made it more practical to apply, and sustain.

    Surely it shouldn't be too easy? So that he doesn't make all evaders useless?

    Would you prefer to have to land a Heavy, like She-Hulk?
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    Magrailothos said:


    Surely it shouldn't be too easy? So that he doesn't make all evaders useless?

    Would you prefer to have to land a Heavy, like She-Hulk?

    Yea, like Spider Gwen as well, I like that method much better. It just makes more sense..
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    Sadly, the only way to do that is to get lucky and hope that your opponent doesn't evade your 5-hit combo, once you land it though, it's an absolute field day.

    It has an element of RNG, but it's in no way unmanageable.
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    FreeToPlay_21 said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    Sadly, the only way to do that is to get lucky and hope that your opponent doesn't evade your 5-hit combo, once you land it though, it's an absolute field day.

    It has an element of RNG, but it's in no way unmanageable.
    Sure it's doable, but there's a very high chance your going to get evaded and attacked, and he's such a glass cannon he's going to get wrecked if that happens. And if you're fighting a long fight, you may have to take that chance multiple times.. There are much better options for evade champs that it seems pointless to even consider him if you have any of those other champs. I would rather bring my Killmonger (with WS synergy), or Heimdall, She Hulk, Spider Gwen, Venom (for spiders) to name a few.. It's a little better if you're using it to negate unstoppable, but again, there are still much better options for that than him. So it just seems like a waste of an ability, imo..
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    You can’t apply it to NC due to class disadvantage. For spiders it would go something like this. Build to s2 stun and hit them with it. When your first hit of a special lands they cannot evade the others.

    All I had was duel so I couldn’t select my ability but did apply the debuff.
    https://youtu.be/K5WQ0Y64qTs
  • Colonaut123Colonaut123 Member Posts: 3,091 ★★★★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    You can’t apply it to NC due to class disadvantage. For spiders it would go something like this. Build to s2 stun and hit them with it. When your first hit of a special lands they cannot evade the others.

    All I had was duel so I couldn’t select my ability but did apply the debuff.
    https://youtu.be/K5WQ0Y64qTs
    You still died though, proving the point of the OP.

    PS did you use pacify mastery?
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    You can’t apply it to NC due to class disadvantage. For spiders it would go something like this. Build to s2 stun and hit them with it. When your first hit of a special lands they cannot evade the others.

    All I had was duel so I couldn’t select my ability but did apply the debuff.
    https://youtu.be/K5WQ0Y64qTs
    I know that it's possible to apply it, it's just difficult and risky. Spider Gwen has a low evade chance, but try it against a high evade champ (when you would actually need it), and, imo, it's too risky. There are much better options to negate evade, which makes that ability seem like a waste on him.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    edited October 2019
    If that was the slow debuff I wouldn’t have died, it’s a duel and you cannot select your pre-fight ability in duels. The video shows how to apply his debuff, if the debuff had been slow the evade that killed me would not have happened. Given that I satisfied the criteria of applying the debuff, had I had the option to make it the slow debuff keeping it up is easily managed by ending your combos with lights to reapply it and making sure you can recharge his web cartridges with s3 at some point.

    All I have in proficiencies is the basics (parry, dex, stupify) with max limber.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Member Posts: 7,233 ★★★★★
    edited October 2019
    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    He cant stop nightcrawler evading regardless. Slow doesnt work with class disadvantage
  • Colinwhitworth69Colinwhitworth69 Member Posts: 7,470 ★★★★★
    Every champ needs counters. Same is true for Stealth Spidey.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    Jake303AoS said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    You can’t apply it to NC due to class disadvantage. For spiders it would go something like this. Build to s2 stun and hit them with it. When your first hit of a special lands they cannot evade the others.

    All I had was duel so I couldn’t select my ability but did apply the debuff.
    *snip*
    I know that it's possible to apply it, it's just difficult and risky. Spider Gwen has a low evade chance, but try it against a high evade champ (when you would actually need it), and, imo, it's too risky. There are much better options to negate evade, which makes that ability seem like a waste on him.
    If you know why are you specifically asking for gameplay? I’m shooting at a moving target here. I agree slow’s primary use is unstoppable, the anti-evasion is secondary.

    Here’s a fight She-Hulk and Spidergwen would be useless for, No Retreat, Can’t Touch This Moonknight under a New Moon with 163k HP; 50% chance and 5% chance to evade, high enough? Yeah yeah he was hurting at the end but most of that damage is from blocking due to No Retreat.

    https://youtu.be/lbNhDm7rsac



  • Lvernon15Lvernon15 Member Posts: 11,598 ★★★★★
    That’s just a downside of him, the bad design I see is the enervate, it’s too difficult to get the fury from it, especially with the double medium increasing the time it takes to launch his combo
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    You can’t apply it to NC due to class disadvantage. For spiders it would go something like this. Build to s2 stun and hit them with it. When your first hit of a special lands they cannot evade the others.

    All I had was duel so I couldn’t select my ability but did apply the debuff.
    *snip*
    I know that it's possible to apply it, it's just difficult and risky. Spider Gwen has a low evade chance, but try it against a high evade champ (when you would actually need it), and, imo, it's too risky. There are much better options to negate evade, which makes that ability seem like a waste on him.
    If you know why are you specifically asking for gameplay? I’m shooting at a moving target here. I agree slow’s primary use is unstoppable, the anti-evasion is secondary.

    Here’s a fight She-Hulk and Spidergwen would be useless for, No Retreat, Can’t Touch This Moonknight under a New Moon with 163k HP; 50% chance and 5% chance to evade, high enough? Yeah yeah he was hurting at the end but most of that damage is from blocking due to No Retreat.

    https://youtu.be/lbNhDm7rsac



    Not bad, and lucky that he didn't get instantly attacked into after some of those evades (which is what makes it risky, because he can't really take a hit). But the other point I was making is that there are much better options. I destroyed that Moon Knight with my Killmonger. Just wish they would have given the new champ a more distinct use. Sure it's cool that he has the ability, but I can't really justify ranking him up since there are several other better options for negating evade and even unblockable.. I also get that not everyone has those other champs, but I still think the abilities champs have should be reliable for that specific counter, especially with the insane number of champs that keeps climbing, and the increasingly ridiculous nodes they keep coming out with lol.

    But just my opinion, and thanks for the vid!
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    Lvernon15 said:

    That’s just a downside of him, the bad design I see is the enervate, it’s too difficult to get the fury from it, especially with the double medium increasing the time it takes to launch his combo

    I also agree with that, the enervate is basically useless.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    Jake303AoS said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    You can’t apply it to NC due to class disadvantage. For spiders it would go something like this. Build to s2 stun and hit them with it. When your first hit of a special lands they cannot evade the others.

    All I had was duel so I couldn’t select my ability but did apply the debuff.
    *snip*
    I know that it's possible to apply it, it's just difficult and risky. Spider Gwen has a low evade chance, but try it against a high evade champ (when you would actually need it), and, imo, it's too risky. There are much better options to negate evade, which makes that ability seem like a waste on him.
    If you know why are you specifically asking for gameplay? I’m shooting at a moving target here. I agree slow’s primary use is unstoppable, the anti-evasion is secondary.

    Here’s a fight She-Hulk and Spidergwen would be useless for, No Retreat, Can’t Touch This Moonknight under a New Moon with 163k HP; 50% chance and 5% chance to evade, high enough? Yeah yeah he was hurting at the end but most of that damage is from blocking due to No Retreat.

    https://youtu.be/lbNhDm7rsac



    Not bad, and lucky that he didn't get instantly attacked into after some of those evades (which is what makes it risky, because he can't really take a hit). But the other point I was making is that there are much better options. I destroyed that Moon Knight with my Killmonger. Just wish they would have given the new champ a more distinct use. Sure it's cool that he has the ability, but I can't really justify ranking him up since there are several other better options for negating evade and even unblockable.. I also get that not everyone has those other champs, but I still think the abilities champs have should be reliable for that specific counter, especially with the insane number of champs that keeps climbing, and the increasingly ridiculous nodes they keep coming out with lol.

    But just my opinion, and thanks for the vid!
    KM is **** compared to CG/Ghost But what to do if you don’t have them or they are poor path options...Little too much Goldilocks syndrome here.

    P.S. He can take more than a hit if his 70% evade does not save him first but yeah if it wasn't for no retreat he would’ve had a much easier time.

    P.P.S. He’s not meant to be the master of one but jack of all, even with suicides ROL doesn’t stop him until SW and the fights end in around 100 hits.

    P.P.P.S KM sux, where’s his video (empty words without)! Peeper Parker rules! But CG/ghost **** on all.
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    CoatHang3r said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    You can’t apply it to NC due to class disadvantage. For spiders it would go something like this. Build to s2 stun and hit them with it. When your first hit of a special lands they cannot evade the others.

    All I had was duel so I couldn’t select my ability but did apply the debuff.
    *snip*
    I know that it's possible to apply it, it's just difficult and risky. Spider Gwen has a low evade chance, but try it against a high evade champ (when you would actually need it), and, imo, it's too risky. There are much better options to negate evade, which makes that ability seem like a waste on him.
    If you know why are you specifically asking for gameplay? I’m shooting at a moving target here. I agree slow’s primary use is unstoppable, the anti-evasion is secondary.

    Here’s a fight She-Hulk and Spidergwen would be useless for, No Retreat, Can’t Touch This Moonknight under a New Moon with 163k HP; 50% chance and 5% chance to evade, high enough? Yeah yeah he was hurting at the end but most of that damage is from blocking due to No Retreat.

    https://youtu.be/lbNhDm7rsac



    Not bad, and lucky that he didn't get instantly attacked into after some of those evades (which is what makes it risky, because he can't really take a hit). But the other point I was making is that there are much better options. I destroyed that Moon Knight with my Killmonger. Just wish they would have given the new champ a more distinct use. Sure it's cool that he has the ability, but I can't really justify ranking him up since there are several other better options for negating evade and even unblockable.. I also get that not everyone has those other champs, but I still think the abilities champs have should be reliable for that specific counter, especially with the insane number of champs that keeps climbing, and the increasingly ridiculous nodes they keep coming out with lol.

    But just my opinion, and thanks for the vid!
    KM is **** compared to CG/Ghost But what to do if you don’t have them or they are poor path options...Little too much Goldilocks syndrome here.

    P.S. He can take more than a hit if his 70% evade does not save him first but yeah if it wasn't for no retreat he would’ve had a much easier time.

    P.P.S. He’s not meant to be the master of one but jack of all, even with suicides ROL doesn’t stop him until SW and the fights end in around 100 hits.

    P.P.P.S KM sux, where’s his video (empty words without)! Peeper Parker rules! But CG/ghost **** on all.
    Lol, sounds like a Spidey fan boy to me. They're all glass cannons, but I'd take Spider Gwen over stealthy any day.. And KM crushes content. I'll be glad to make a vid when I have time. But saying KM sucks, dismisses all your credibility 😂😂
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    Worknprogress said:

    Jake303AoS said:

    RazorDevil said:

    No, I find it to be very maintainable.

    I'd love to see some gameplay of how you apply it to a beefed up Spiderman classic or Nightcrawler, and sustain it through the fight.
    He cant stop nightcrawler evading regardless. Slow doesnt work with class disadvantage
    True, I was just using his evade/quick attack as an example.
  • BelaPichBelaPich Member Posts: 89 ★
    Kabam should rework him as well
  • RoninManRoninMan Member Posts: 747 ★★★★
    Stealthy isn’t as bad as you make him out to be. I’ve seen a lot of comments about how hard it is to land 5 hits but you don’t have to. 4 lights in a row works. For most content you can get 3 hits off after a parry before they recover from stun. That means that really you only have to land one hit which really isn’t that hard. Once you get that rolling you make it to an L2 which extends the duration of his web cartridges. You make it sound so difficult when in reality you’re over complicating it.

    Also while it may be easier to parry and heavy with Shulk and SG, they do need to be able to parry stun. That can be difficult against certain champs or nodes like masochism and (stun) immunity. Also I don’t know if you realize it or not, but if you use the web foam cartridge and affect them with slow, stealthy can’t miss. This gives him more added utility against Maw, Guilly 2099, DH, and there’s even a node that can make you miss.
  • Jake303AoSJake303AoS Member Posts: 321 ★★
    RoninMan said:

    Stealthy isn’t as bad as you make him out to be. I’ve seen a lot of comments about how hard it is to land 5 hits but you don’t have to. 4 lights in a row works. For most content you can get 3 hits off after a parry before they recover from stun. That means that really you only have to land one hit which really isn’t that hard. Once you get that rolling you make it to an L2 which extends the duration of his web cartridges. You make it sound so difficult when in reality you’re over complicating it.

    Also while it may be easier to parry and heavy with Shulk and SG, they do need to be able to parry stun. That can be difficult against certain champs or nodes like masochism and (stun) immunity. Also I don’t know if you realize it or not, but if you use the web foam cartridge and affect them with slow, stealthy can’t miss. This gives him more added utility against Maw, Guilly 2099, DH, and there’s even a node that can make you miss.

    I don't think he's bad at all, I just wish his abilities were a bit more appealing. I think new champs should have new/useful abilities. And I'm not even saying he doesn't, as much as they're just not that significant. In other words, I wish I could justify ranking him up, but I have a better champ for pretty much all his abilities. But he's of course still a good champ..

    Also, you're right, it may be a bit more difficult to land a heavy on stun immune champs/nodes, but it's still very doable, and really not that tough.
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