Early Look: New Alliance Wars Maps - Discussion Thread

Hey Everybody!

We've got another Early Look for you all! This time, we're introducing brand new Maps for all Tiers of Alliance Wars!

We recently ran a Beta for Alliance Wars that featured a number of different Updates to the Mode, and our Beta Players offered us a wealth of feedback. We’ve parsed the data and feedback that we collected, and want to give you all a glimpse into our plans moving forward.

In our Beta, we updated the map and also introduced a new feature called “Defense Tactics”. The Map update introduced a new layout and new Buffs, while Defense Tactics allowed Alliance Leadership to choose a Global Buff to apply to the Map, which allows for Defenses to be more customizable and setup in a more meaningful way.

The feedback we received was that these two major changes together were quite jarring, and that it was too much all at once. We agree with this sentiment so we have decided to stagger the release of the Map update and the release of Defense Tactics (currently scheduled for Season 11).

Read all about the upcoming map changes in the Early Look here!

Comments

SiriusBreak

Ha... learn something new everyday. Yeah, I get it, and I don't at the same time. I understand that people will bend anything to gain an edge. I do. I just will never understand why people can't keep up the spirit of straightforward competition. Sad really. Unfortunately, it likely will continue.

Actually, now that you mentioned it, I can see how this can be done on the current map too. Ridiculous. I get that things are frustrating in AW, but it is this type of nonsense that ends up screwing the honest players that give it their all. Too often people are so concerned with their own selfish desires, never once thinking of the blowback. Eh, such is life.

BuddyGuyFriend

I haven't posted anything to the forums in over a year. I've tried to be pretty forgiving to a lot of the things over this last year that I've disagreed with - decisions from Kabam, changes in game, all of it. I almost quit due to circumstances last year around this same time period in the game, but the infinity war tie in event gave me a second wind and I joined a more competitive alliance. I've played this game since March of 2015. I'm in the top 20k players globally. My alliance is over 23 million rated, a few spots from top 200 AQ, and last season we placed in the top 60 for Platinum 3.

If these new war changes are going to be kept for next season in their current form, I think you're going to see a LOT of people leaving the game. I've tried to follow the back and forth on here and read everyone's points, but I haven't seen a lot of similar alliance members share their current experiences during the off season while testing this new set up. Here's ours:

At the end of last season we won 8 wars in a row in a streak leading up to the end rewards. We are not a group who requires anyone to spend or max out items, we pride ourselves on being a good mix of laid back enough and wanting to keep the fun aspect of winning in perspective. Here's a breakdown of our wins and losses, currently, as they show in the game history for the war mode:

Losing current war.
1 Day ago: Loss
3 days ago: Loss
6 days ago: Loss
8 days ago: Loss
10 days ago: Loss
13 days ago: Win
15 days ago: Win
17 days ago: Win
20 days ago: Win
22 days ago: Win

I don't have to point out to anyone the pattern here. I know in the past the game team has relayed the desire to not have people finish these maps in war. This would seem to be the ultimate goal that was accomplished with this new set up. As a player of this game for years now, it's so disheartening to have seen the movements over the years to make this mode better and improve it, and yet have this be the end result. No one plays a game because they are guaranteed to lose by design. That defeats the entire purpose. I may not be the best player in the world but I have my moments, but I will argue some others in my alliance are AMAZING and super skilled and we wouldn't have made it to platinum level for multiple seasons otherwise. Once the change happened in the maps, we went from a few kills to wiped out across the board in the first sections. Our opponents had similar experiences. I could click on defense and check the kill count for most wars and see maybe 4-5 total on the map before they had made it to the mini bosses. Now its double digits.

This was designed for maximum punishment and I would hope we are past the point where anyone could argue the difficulty wasn't increased - it absolutely was increased. Or else the logical next explanation is that 30 platinum level players with stacked profiles and skills suddenly all got really bad at the game overnight and started suiciding on the first few fights.

I hope that Kabam reads the feedback here and takes my comment in with them as well. Some may have found some good counters to the new nodes, and that's great. But this was a necessary game mode to get rewards and those of us who have been begging for years now for a logical, fun and FAIR update did not ask for this. And if this is the new norm, it may be time for me to hang it up - and I know i'm not alone in my group. We're not spending any items or dollars if this stays in its current form and most likely will concentrate on AQ and drop down to gold one again. Would really hate to see that all happen, but the next steps really depend on Kabam.

TomBrady12

AW right now is just way too hard to be worth even trying to get through. All this off season has been was to a way to find impassible node/champ combos. We now have a bunch of node 29/Killmongers instead of just 1.

Thecurler

I play in a challenger tier ally and we’ve done a couple of wars on the new map now.

One of the good things about the previous map was the relative lack of node interdependencies. The new map feels too long and with too many links.

Some of the nodes need scaling back too. The ramp up in difficulty feels way too much.
We’ve gone from nearly always taking all 3 bosses (without necessarily clearing 100%) to wondering how many players will make it to the final section.

I appreciate there is an adjustment period but the new map feels like it’s a step too far.

If there was some intention to increase item use on the new map, I think it might have the opposite affect. Our ally will still do war but likely only use limited or no items at all because the cost vs rewards ratio seems way out of sync.

Gregdagr8

Is wars going to be delayed? Or are we going to really go into this season with all these bugs and impossible node combinations?

DocJC

Really hope you are planning to delay this season.

Stellar

Is wars going to be delayed? Or are we going to really go into this season with all these bugs and impossible node combinations?

As far as we know the season will not be delayed. While the new nodes increased the difficulty in AW, having 2 weeks to acclimate made them a little bit easier.
As for me, i tried several champions during these two weeks and ranked up some just to be able to do some new lines without too much problems.

SiriusBreak

So far I haven't seen much that spells any changes are coming. This is unfortunate. Yes, some bug fixes have been announced, which is nice... but that doesn't address the increase in difficulty and the absolute NEED for 9 players to advance in AW. The Season is supposed to kick off in less than 14 hours by the clock in game. 18 hours til matchmaking starts. With the MANY Alliances that have made it clear they won't be giving it their all, this creates a different problem.

Matches for those that are going to attempt to go at it, will very likely be messy. The many that would've been there either will be reducing BGs, or not joining at all. This likely will lead to odd matches. If this is heavily unbalanced, it will cause an even bigger uproar. Those that constantly get an unfair match they couldn't possibly finish, let alone win are gonna go postal.

Imagine giving this the benefit of the doubt, knowing full well it's gonna be tough, and then getting something next to impossible. This will only add fuel to the already spreading fire. Personally, I want to play AW and have fun. My Alliance mates and I are getting ready to try and do this. We MAY end up doing well as a result of being that unfair match for some. Which, yes, nice for points but at the same time, I like a fair match. Being that would be goliath isn't fun. It's a slaughter. That's not a war.

Situations like the aforementioned may end up being commonplace this season as a result in the reduction of Alliances participating. I can't see that being a good thing for anyone. So, unless we get a message last minute in the afternoon prior to the Season kick off... I guess this will be what we have to work with. I can only hope this situation is taken into consideration. It's very likely to be a common outcome. Then again, maybe not. We shall see soon enough I guess.

Loco24x7

So far I haven't seen much that spells any changes are coming. This is unfortunate. Yes, some bug fixes have been announced, which is nice... but that doesn't address the increase in difficulty and the absolute NEED for 9 players to advance in AW. The Season is supposed to kick off in less than 14 hours by the clock in game. 18 hours til matchmaking starts. With the MANY Alliances that have made it clear they won't be giving it their all, this creates a different problem.

Matches for those that are going to attempt to go at it, will very likely be messy. The many that would've been there either will be reducing BGs, or not joining at all. This likely will lead to odd matches. If this is heavily unbalanced, it will cause an even bigger uproar. Those that constantly get an unfair match they couldn't possibly finish, let alone win are gonna go postal.

Imagine giving this the benefit of the doubt, knowing full well it's gonna be tough, and then getting something next to impossible. This will only add fuel to the already spreading fire. Personally, I want to play AW and have fun. My Alliance mates and I are getting ready to try and do this. We MAY end up doing well as a result of being that unfair match for some. Which, yes, nice for points but at the same time, I like a fair match. Being that would be goliath isn't fun. It's a slaughter. That's not a war.

Situations like the aforementioned may end up being commonplace this season as a result in the reduction of Alliances participating. I can't see that being a good thing for anyone. So, unless we get a message last minute in the afternoon prior to the Season kick off... I guess this will be what we have to work with. I can only hope this situation is taken into consideration. It's very likely to be a common outcome. Then again, maybe not. We shall see soon enough I guess.

Agree....just add a few things these forums are put here to express as feedback to Kabam since the AW is going as is and no response it’s unfortunate that all the feedback is going on deaf ears. Also the alliances with Multiple time zones will be a thing of the past our alliance have a few international players and unfortunately a few will be leaving today bc of these changes it’s unfortunate when you have players that you built Camaraderie with over the course of years and or season and gotta let them go bc of timing.

Kabam Miike

Summoners!

We will be pushing the following changes to Alliance Wars Maps today. These will be in effect when Season 10 commences during Defence Phase.

Link Node Adjustments

We are removing the Linked Nodes to the first Minibosses to alleviate bottlenecks in the first section of the map due to one Member being unavailable.

Intermediate, Hard, Challenger & Expert - Remove Links to Nodes 22 and 23 from Nodes 15, 18, and 20.

Easy & Normal - Remove Link to Node 22 from Nodes 15, 18, and 20.

Local Node Adjustments

Based on our Data and your Feedback, before the start of Season 10, we wanted to address the difficulty of the following Nodes, and implement these changes:

Expert:
Node 2
- Remove Confusion
- Add Aegis Heavy 3

Node 13
- Remove Aegis Heavy

Node 16
- Changing Heal Block from Permanent to a duration that activates after the Opponent uses a Special Attack

Node 18
- Remove Confusion
- Add Aegis Heavy 3

Node 32
- Remove Greater Confusion
- Add Confusion

Node 37
- Remove No Retreat
- Add Limited Immunity

Node 42
- Remove Lazarus
- Add Buffet

Node 43
- Remove Lazarus
- Remove Biohazard
- Remove Backup Recovery
- Add Buffet
- Add Best Defense
- Add Empowered Immunity

Node 45
- Remove Prove Yourself
- Add Greater Confusion

Challenger
Node 2
- Remove Confusion
- Add Aegis Heavy 2

Node 13
- Remove Aegis Intercept 2

Node 18
- Add Aegis Heavy 2
- Remove Confusion

Node 37
- Remove No Retreat
- Add Limited Immunity

Node 43
- Remove Shank
- Remove Backup Recovery
- Add Empowered Immunity
- Add Best Defence

Node 45
- Remove Resistor
- Add Confusion

Hard
Node 2
- Remove Confusion
- Add Aegis Heavy 1

Node 43
- Remove Shank
- Remove Backup Recovery
- Add Buffet
- Add Empowered Immunity

Node 45
- Remove Resistor
- Add Confusion

Intermediate
Node 43
- Remove Backup Recovery
- Add Empowered Immunity
Node 45
- Remove Resistor
- Add Confusion

Good Luck to all Alliances in this Season! Season 10 kicks off later today!

SiriusBreak

I love being wrong, lol. This should help many Alliances be competitive this Season. Thanks Kabam. Was getting nervous with all the posts of Alliances dialing back but, HOPEFULLY this will be enough to have more be competitive. Also will in turn make Defense Tactics more manageable once it drops next Season.

DocJC

And did you fix matchmaking @Kabam Miike ?

Or will we see another season of 2 low prestige teams win top 3 because they didn’t fight anyone else at the top.

Str

Thanks for the changes @Kabam Miike they are appreciated.

This will mean that alliances will be going into the new season with new nodes and 0 practice and having to change tactics with very short notice. For future changes could a one week delay be considered? Just so alliances can adjust. Thanks.

Vincentblack

So we change everything ahead of time to give everyone some time to get to know the layout just to have you change it again the day the season is supposed to start? Only in kabam land does that make sense.

unknown

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LilMaddogHT

The new map, the new nodes definitely takes learning curve that I feel we have adjusted 'slightly' to over the past 2 weeks... Now we need to adjust the day Season 10 starts? Fingers crossed we don't have any bugs/issues with these changes...

sest22

how badly the changes and adjustments are implemented. at the last moment before starting the season .. very sad as they do things

unknown

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rafius_kantun

Easy way to fix things... Just do away with seasons (that only bring out the worst in people) and buff individual war rewards. Much less overall stress for everyone.

QuikPik

And we still have the prestige based match making system that guarantees a certain number of alliances at different prestiges spots within in each tier without ever playing the tougher alliances in that same tier.

DarkChyld14

Thanks for the timely update Kabam, just like with the changes in map 7 I am sure these will be in the favor of player base and reduce our item use. Also like always I feel there wont be any bugs that might make some fights a "little" hard.

Munrolm02

This does help somewhat because you can't really practice a dual on inverted controls so you kind of got to learn as you go on. I didn't mind the two bosses in the middle linked because everyone wants the other team to have one player that screwed up where they might have to fight through a link just to get to the boss section. Even though it seems toned down defense tactics is going to be what makes these nodes that are linked next to impossible so it does make sense. With the defense tactics there should always be just one minor offensive tactics such as the attacker starts with 15% extra health or gaines x amount of armor or special attack deals more damage so it doesn't look like the cards are always stacked against us

GroundedWisdom

I'm glad they were able to find a workable solution with the feedback in time.

Chen

Easy way to fix things... Just do away with seasons (that only bring out the worst in people) and buff individual war rewards. Much less overall stress for everyone.

Agree with everyone here about map change right before season starts. But this is the best, seasons creates a ton of stress for alliances and not worth it for a lot of ppl.

Planc2007

We were not having any trouble with the war maps during the off season. I can see removing the links to the middle, but changing the other nodes? Why? We 100% every day with minimal item use.

Planc2007

This does help somewhat because you can't really practice a dual on inverted controls so you kind of got to learn as you go on. I didn't mind the two bosses in the middle linked because everyone wants the other team to have one player that screwed up where they might have to fight through a link just to get to the boss section.

There should be some linked nodes to the mini bosses like in the last map configuration.
Like node 46 linked to 53, 41 linked to 51, and 47 linked to 55. This way if 1 section messes up they still need to fight thru a linked node as in the previous war map.

Cat_Murdock

Thank you for removing the nodes to 22 and 23.

Willie_Arwontie

And did you fix matchmaking @Kabam Miike ?

Or will we see another season of 2 low prestige teams win top 3 because they didn’t fight anyone else at the top.

Sooooo... you're saying that in a points system, low prestige people dont belong on top to get big rewards and catch up to the big guys faster?

Could have sworn it was the place system, where there are elimination, semi final and final rounds, that allowed for that, not points.

QuikPik

The problem is similar prestige alliances only play one another. Let's say if master 4 prestige is 8500 they will never play master 5 alliance because their prestige is 10000. Even though war rating are very similar.

DarkChyld14

And did you fix matchmaking @Kabam Miike ?

Or will we see another season of 2 low prestige teams win top 3 because they didn’t fight anyone else at the top.
Sooooo... you're saying that in a points system, low prestige people dont belong on top to get big rewards and catch up to the big guys faster?

Could have sworn it was the place system, where there are elimination, semi final and final rounds, that allowed for that, not points.

You are not getting the point.... A war between two 10K prestige alliances at 2400 rating is much harder than a war between two 8K prestige alliances at 2400 rating, but still they get the same points... so the winner of the second matchup can be ahead of the loser of the fist matchup.... although the weaker one in the first match is significantly stronger than the stronger one of second matchup.
Here is what happens
A1 - 10k prestige, 25m rating, 2500 AW rating
A2 - 10k prestige, 25m rating, 2500 AW rating
A3 - 8k prestige, 20m rating, 2500 AW rating
A4 - 8k prestige, 20m rating, 2500 AW rating

A1 vs A2 - A1 wins 200k points, A2 loses and gets 150k points
A3 vs A4 - A4 wins 200k points, A3 loses and gets 150k points

in reality A2 would win over A4 any day, but using this system, the weaker alliance can get ahead of the stronger one with out actually facing a strong matchup... at the end, the top 100 will be a mix of various alliances good in their prestige range.... not a true ranking of alliance strength.