Masochism: Bug or misleading text?

Ultra8529

It has been this way forever but it should be clarified - is masochism supposed to enable the enemy to shrug off more than 1 debuff at a time?

The node description reads: "Every 7 seconds the next Debuff triggered on this Champion is immediately removed. Each time this effect triggers, they Regenerate 5% of their Max Health". It says "the next Debuff", ie singular. If that is meant to apply to multiple debuffs being triggered on the champion at the same time, then it should be made clear.

Eb0ny-O-M4w

It is supposed to work that way. It was confirmed multiple times already that that's the intended behaviour and will not be changed

Unknown

This content has been removed.

Dexman1349

Several champs have abilities to inflict multiple debuffs at the same time (Voodoo's spirit venom, Blade's bleed with Parry, Thor & Corvus armor break with Parry, CapIW parry, etc).

Masochism has acted exactly the same for all of them.

Dexman1349

I'm not saying I'm happy about it, but at least it's consistent across the board so I learn to play around it.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

GroundedWisdom

zeezee57 said:

Dexman1349 said:

I'm not saying I'm happy about it, but at least it's consistent across the board so I learn to play around it.

That's what we've all done, doesn't make it right or consistent with the way they've handled all other situations with the same wording. My beef is far more with the lack of consistency depending on which end the issue at hand lands; benefits the player and its immediately changed to match the wording, works against the player and its working as intended. Why the blatant double standard?

No, it has nothing to do with changing only what benefits Players. That's just the misconception of people who aren't happy something was fixed.
Masochism works that way because the mechanic kicks in and consumes the Debuff applied. When you have Champs that apply multiple Debuffs in one go, that registers as all one application. It has to do with how the Champs apply the Debuffs. Not that it hinders Players.
Fury was fixed because he was never intended to Purify all Buffs, and he certainly wasn't intended to allow people to run penalty-free Suicides. A bug is a bug. That one was particularly detrimental, but it was a bug nonetheless. Regardless of whether people expected to benefit or not, a game-changing bug is a priority to fix. It has nothing to do with the fact that people benefited from it. It was the effect it had on the game.
This whole idea that they only fix issues that benefit Players is ignorant to the actual effect these bugs have on the overall system. He was never meant to do that, and just because someone on YouTube showed people and they ran out and Ranked him doesn't mean they're going to allow a game-altering bug to exist. If all it did was benefit people and didn't break the system in some way, I'm sure they would have left it.

Perceptron

Still im stuck in 5.2.4. , Guys do lemme know how to deal with Masochism . which champs better

GroundedWisdom

Perceptron said:

Still im stuck in 5.2.4. , Guys do lemme know how to deal with Masochism . which champs better

I used Champs with Damage Over Time, like Hyperion and Gwenpool. Parry to trigger the Masochism, then apply Bleed or Incinerate while the Timer is on.

GroundedWisdom

Also, if you have Sabretooth with Killmonger, he stops Masochism.

Ultra8529

zeezee57 said:

This absolutely should be fixed to match the description just like Nick Fury and Sym Supreme were, but so long as it works against the player it never will. Anyone can comment as much as they like that "they've already said this is intended" but the fact that other interactions behaving exactly the same are changed but this remains shouldn't sit well with the player base. If I parry with IW Cap against Maso I should lose the stun and keep the debuffs from his sig. Consistency on both sides shouldn't have to be constantly asked for on the forums, it should be something Kabam does on their own.

This is exactly the point. The fact that it has been stated on the forums to be "working as intended" should not be an excuse for keeping an inaccurate and misleading description in the game. Those confirmations were made possibly 1-2 years ago. A player starting out today would have no idea of that history and be substantially misled by the text.

GroundedWisdom

GroundedWisdom said:

zeezee57 said:

Dexman1349 said:

I'm not saying I'm happy about it, but at least it's consistent across the board so I learn to play around it.

That's what we've all done, doesn't make it right or consistent with the way they've handled all other situations with the same wording. My beef is far more with the lack of consistency depending on which end the issue at hand lands; benefits the player and its immediately changed to match the wording, works against the player and its working as intended. Why the blatant double standard?

No, it has nothing to do with changing only what benefits Players. That's just the misconception of people who aren't happy something was fixed.
Masochism works that way because the mechanic kicks in and consumes the Debuff applied. When you have Champs that apply multiple Debuffs in one go, that registers as all one application. It has to do with how the Champs apply the Debuffs. Not that it hinders Players.
Fury was fixed because he was never intended to Purify all Buffs, and he certainly wasn't intended to allow people to run penalty-free Suicides. A bug is a bug. That one was particularly detrimental, but it was a bug nonetheless. Regardless of whether people expected to benefit or not, a game-changing bug is a priority to fix. It has nothing to do with the fact that people benefited from it. It was the effect it had on the game.
This whole idea that they only fix issues that benefit Players is ignorant to the actual effect these bugs have on the overall system. He was never meant to do that, and just because someone on YouTube showed people and they ran out and Ranked him doesn't mean they're going to allow a game-altering bug to exist. If all it did was benefit people and didn't break the system in some way, I'm sure they would have left it.

*Purify all Debuffs

GroundedWisdom

Ultra8529 said:

zeezee57 said:

This absolutely should be fixed to match the description just like Nick Fury and Sym Supreme were, but so long as it works against the player it never will. Anyone can comment as much as they like that "they've already said this is intended" but the fact that other interactions behaving exactly the same are changed but this remains shouldn't sit well with the player base. If I parry with IW Cap against Maso I should lose the stun and keep the debuffs from his sig. Consistency on both sides shouldn't have to be constantly asked for on the forums, it should be something Kabam does on their own.

This is exactly the point. The fact that it has been stated on the forums to be "working as intended" should not be an excuse for keeping an inaccurate and misleading description in the game. Those confirmations were made possibly 1-2 years ago. A player starting out today would have no idea of that history and be substantially misled by the text.

I mean, they could update the description, yes. Although I'm pretty sure people could figure it out by trying the Node. Fair enough request though.

Ultra8529

A more accurate wording, in my opinion, would be "the next time a debuff is triggered on the Champion, all debuffs applied at the same instance are purified". That should make it beyond clear.

Ultra8529

Can we get this fixed or acknowledged?

Notcho59

This mechanic has always happened in the game when discussing the purify/nullify mechanic. When it benefited the player using the Nick Fury Synergy or Symbiote Supreme it was stated to be a bug because it was unintended. That is just a fact not an opinion or a conspiracy.

I will say this stagger (when used by Hood, Juggs, Thor JF, etc) still benefits from cancelling all buffs that would trigger on an opponent at once like King Groot or the Champion is a benefit to the player and if that gets fixed then they have to fix the buffet / masochism node to only consume one buff / debuff.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

Kabam Lyra

Please refer to the comments in this thread. Since the question has already been answered, this will be closed.