Poison reduces healing effectiveness by 30%

Naim54321Naim54321 Member Posts: 124 ★
in General Discussion
Is it true that poison reduces the healing effectiveness by 30%? Or is it 25%? Or has someone told me a complete lie?

Comments

  • TheBestinTuakauTheBestinTuakau Member Posts: 955 ★★★
    It's 30% not 25%
  • AlphA101AlphA101 Member Posts: 285 ★★★
    Lol , 30%
  • Naim54321Naim54321 Member Posts: 124 ★
    For all poisons? Even like Abomination’s poison?
  • TheBestinTuakauTheBestinTuakau Member Posts: 955 ★★★
    Naim54321 said:

    For all poisons? Even like Abomination’s poison?

    Yes, all poison effects reduce regeneration by any means, by 30%
  • Naim54321Naim54321 Member Posts: 124 ★
    Awh mannnn, I was going to get suicides because I thought that Willpower would just like overpower it, but if my calculations are correct it doesn’t.
    0.7 (Willpower) x1.15(Recovery)x 0.7(Reduced by 30%)=0.5635% which will be beaten by poison’s 0.6% damage. Damn.
  • TheBestinTuakauTheBestinTuakau Member Posts: 955 ★★★
    You can over power it with some lower level champions
  • TheBestinTuakauTheBestinTuakau Member Posts: 955 ★★★
    @Giuliameij ghe damaging debuff ticks first (since it was applied first). Therefore you would die about 20-30 seconds earlier. But great calculations!!!
  • GiuliameijGiuliameij Member Posts: 1,849 ★★★★
    @TheBestinTuakau Ah thnx. I indeed did not consider those extra factors. Just the basic numbers. Got tricked by the old, if somethings moves 3 places forward and 2 steps back how long will it take for it to move to the other side question.
  • Naim54321Naim54321 Member Posts: 124 ★
    Giuliameij said:

    Naim54321 said:

    Awh mannnn, I was going to get suicides because I thought that Willpower would just like overpower it, but if my calculations are correct it doesn’t.
    0.7 (Willpower) x1.15(Recovery)x 0.7(Reduced by 30%)=0.5635% which will be beaten by poison’s 0.6% damage. Damn.

    @Naim54321 If all your values are correct, that would me the following for a 30k health champ.
    Damage: 30k*0.006 = 180 damage per second
    Heal: 30K*0.005635 = 169.05 heal per second
    180-169.05=10.95 damage per second.
    If all other incomming damage is ignored that would mean the fight will take:
    30k/10.95=2739.726 seconds or 45.66 minutes before your champs dies from the poison damage.
    I don`t know about you, but I have never done a 45 minute fight in this game. You won`t notice it.

    the trouble with suicides comes from the 5% with using specials. Which, if you use the right champs, will never hinder you because you end the fights in every gamemode except act 6 and variant once you get to your sp2 from all the extra damage you do.
    I’m going into Act 6 so would you say suicides would be a good idea, I mean, I’ll turn them on after 6.1.2 because you kinda need to throw specials there.
  • Frivolousz21Frivolousz21 Member Posts: 438 ★★★
    Kabam like doesn't post the poison curtailing healing like anywhere.

    When I got suicides a year ago I went through the same disappointment with will power not healing back up like I thought it would.

    Either way since then I use suicides 99 percent of the time


    1. Can't do arena without them. My God it makes things move along so much slower.

    2. I feel like the 60 percent boost in basic attack is a huge plus versus using the masteries for other things.

    It's not like you get a 60 percent health boost when you turn them off.

    3. They are perfect for sentinel, corvus, Omega, aegon, domino, dorm, iceman, warlock...

    Any champ that's bleed or poison immune. Expecially poison since will power gains a lot of healing without the permenant poison.

    4. I do miss not being able to use champs that bleed and poison.

    Even worse if they require sp1 use. You will lose to much health.

    You can mitigate this if you only need them for one or two fights on the path tho.


    All in all I will never play without suicides unless they have new masteries that are compelling.

    So if I were you I'd get them anyways.
  • Naim54321Naim54321 Member Posts: 124 ★
    Frivolousz21 said:

    Kabam like doesn't post the poison curtailing healing like anywhere.

    When I got suicides a year ago I went through the same disappointment with will power not healing back up like I thought it would.

    Either way since then I use suicides 99 percent of the time


    1. Can't do arena without them. My God it makes things move along so much slower.

    2. I feel like the 60 percent boost in basic attack is a huge plus versus using the masteries for other things.

    It's not like you get a 60 percent health boost when you turn them off.

    3. They are perfect for sentinel, corvus, Omega, aegon, domino, dorm, iceman, warlock...

    Any champ that's bleed or poison immune. Expecially poison since will power gains a lot of healing without the permenant poison.

    4. I do miss not being able to use champs that bleed and poison.

    Even worse if they require sp1 use. You will lose to much health.

    You can mitigate this if you only need them for one or two fights on the path tho.


    All in all I will never play without suicides unless they have new masteries that are compelling.

    So if I were you I'd get them anyways.

    Are you being sarcastic? You’ve just given me like a milllion reasons not to get suicides and then you immediately turn to saying how I should get it anyway
  • Frivolousz21Frivolousz21 Member Posts: 438 ★★★
    Naim54321 said:

    Frivolousz21 said:

    Kabam like doesn't post the poison curtailing healing like anywhere.

    When I got suicides a year ago I went through the same disappointment with will power not healing back up like I thought it would.

    Either way since then I use suicides 99 percent of the time


    1. Can't do arena without them. My God it makes things move along so much slower.

    2. I feel like the 60 percent boost in basic attack is a huge plus versus using the masteries for other things.

    It's not like you get a 60 percent health boost when you turn them off.

    3. They are perfect for sentinel, corvus, Omega, aegon, domino, dorm, iceman, warlock...

    Any champ that's bleed or poison immune. Expecially poison since will power gains a lot of healing without the permenant poison.

    4. I do miss not being able to use champs that bleed and poison.

    Even worse if they require sp1 use. You will lose to much health.

    You can mitigate this if you only need them for one or two fights on the path tho.


    All in all I will never play without suicides unless they have new masteries that are compelling.

    So if I were you I'd get them anyways.

    Are you being sarcastic? You’ve just given me like a milllion reasons not to get suicides and then you immediately turn to saying how I should get it anyway
    Because in the end the power you gain from suicides makes the game dramatically easier.

    It makes arena like 30-40 percent faster.

    In one hour of arena with full suicides you will get in 30-40 percent more fights.

    In all content you will finish fights so much faster making things less prone to slip ups.

    Those drawbacks are real but they don't outweigh the fun suicides brings to many who have used them.

  • Naim54321Naim54321 Member Posts: 124 ★
    Frivolousz21 said:

    Naim54321 said:

    Frivolousz21 said:

    Kabam like doesn't post the poison curtailing healing like anywhere.

    When I got suicides a year ago I went through the same disappointment with will power not healing back up like I thought it would.

    Either way since then I use suicides 99 percent of the time


    1. Can't do arena without them. My God it makes things move along so much slower.

    2. I feel like the 60 percent boost in basic attack is a huge plus versus using the masteries for other things.

    It's not like you get a 60 percent health boost when you turn them off.

    3. They are perfect for sentinel, corvus, Omega, aegon, domino, dorm, iceman, warlock...

    Any champ that's bleed or poison immune. Expecially poison since will power gains a lot of healing without the permenant poison.

    4. I do miss not being able to use champs that bleed and poison.

    Even worse if they require sp1 use. You will lose to much health.

    You can mitigate this if you only need them for one or two fights on the path tho.


    All in all I will never play without suicides unless they have new masteries that are compelling.

    So if I were you I'd get them anyways.

    Are you being sarcastic? You’ve just given me like a milllion reasons not to get suicides and then you immediately turn to saying how I should get it anyway
    Because in the end the power you gain from suicides makes the game dramatically easier.

    It makes arena like 30-40 percent faster.

    In one hour of arena with full suicides you will get in 30-40 percent more fights.

    In all content you will finish fights so much faster making things less prone to slip ups.

    Those drawbacks are real but they don't outweigh the fun suicides brings to many who have used them.

    Oh, I read your comment wrong, whoops
  • UnknownUnknown
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  • Lvernon15Lvernon15 Member Posts: 11,598 ★★★★★
    Running suicides depends on your roster, if you have suicide friendly champs then they’re a good investment, or if you run a lot of arena
  • UltimatheoryUltimatheory Member Posts: 520 ★★★
    A couple other factors you need to take into consideration. Healing from Willpower is impacted by base health only. Suicides deal damage based on modified health. That's why it's recommended to max out glass cannon if you want to take less damage from suicides. Quick calculation for a champ with 30k base health:

    Modified health after masteries: (30000(Base Health)+24(Vitality))*(100%-7.2%(Glass Cannon)+1.6%(Greater Vitality)) = 28342 HP

    Suicides Damage: 28342*0.006 = 170.05 damage per second
    Willpower healing: 30000*0.005635 = 169.05 heal per second

    This results in only 1 point of damage per second. If you invest into the salve mastery as well you will actually come out ahead in health. This is of course largely dependent on the base health of your champion.
  • UltimatheoryUltimatheory Member Posts: 520 ★★★
    To take this one step further the actual damage from suicides comes from Double Edge's bleed damage. Even with max Coagulate you still take a chunk of damage:

    Coagulate damage: (28342*(20%(Double Edge)*0.7(Coagulate))/16 = 247.99 damage per second
    Willpower healing: 30000*0.005635 = 169.05 heal per second

    This results in 78.94 damage per second (before salve is applied). Over 16 seconds this is 1263 damage total. That is 1263/28342 = 4.4% of your health lost every fight. Suture could mitigate this a bit but I don't know too many people who have invested into this mastery.

    There are also other factors like if you apply boosts or have health inflated through synergies. Since health boosts increase your modified health you will actually take more damage overall. Also, if you're fighting arena or AW you have to take into account if the opponents run Despair. This will also lower your overall healing from Willpower significantly.
  • Naim54321Naim54321 Member Posts: 124 ★
    Ultimatheory said:

    To take this one step further the actual damage from suicides comes from Double Edge's bleed damage. Even with max Coagulate you still take a chunk of damage:

    Coagulate damage: (28342*(20%(Double Edge)*0.7(Coagulate))/16 = 247.99 damage per second
    Willpower healing: 30000*0.005635 = 169.05 heal per second

    This results in 78.94 damage per second (before salve is applied). Over 16 seconds this is 1263 damage total. That is 1263/28342 = 4.4% of your health lost every fight. Suture could mitigate this a bit but I don't know too many people who have invested into this mastery.

    There are also other factors like if you apply boosts or have health inflated through synergies. Since health boosts increase your modified health you will actually take more damage overall. Also, if you're fighting arena or AW you have to take into account if the opponents run Despair. This will also lower your overall healing from Willpower significantly.

    So masteries that give me more health will actually make the Suicides on me stronger? I put 3 points in Greater vitality because I wanted more HP but if it just makes me suicide even more should I take the 3 points off?
  • Mirage_TurtleMirage_Turtle Member Posts: 1,868 ★★★★
    Naim54321 said:

    Ultimatheory said:

    To take this one step further the actual damage from suicides comes from Double Edge's bleed damage. Even with max Coagulate you still take a chunk of damage:

    Coagulate damage: (28342*(20%(Double Edge)*0.7(Coagulate))/16 = 247.99 damage per second
    Willpower healing: 30000*0.005635 = 169.05 heal per second

    This results in 78.94 damage per second (before salve is applied). Over 16 seconds this is 1263 damage total. That is 1263/28342 = 4.4% of your health lost every fight. Suture could mitigate this a bit but I don't know too many people who have invested into this mastery.

    There are also other factors like if you apply boosts or have health inflated through synergies. Since health boosts increase your modified health you will actually take more damage overall. Also, if you're fighting arena or AW you have to take into account if the opponents run Despair. This will also lower your overall healing from Willpower significantly.

    So masteries that give me more health will actually make the Suicides on me stronger? I put 3 points in Greater vitality because I wanted more HP but if it just makes me suicide even more should I take the 3 points off?
    Yes.

    On that same note, beware of using boosts with Suicides. If you use health-boosting boosts, your damage from suicides will increase.
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