Angela with Odin not immune to debuffs in EOP???

StrategicStrategic Member Posts: 632 ★★★
in General Discussion
So Just tried Angela R4 6* sig 200 with Odin prefights all 3 of them against EOP XB and she took the buffs like she didn't have any buffs on her and just melted! WTF kabam???

Comments

  • StrategicStrategic Member Posts: 632 ★★★
    Eb0ny-O-M4w said:

    Increased debuffs duration

    Debuff duration doesn't matter cause she decreases debuff duration by percentage. So if it's 15s instead of 5 then if it's reduced by 100%+ it should still be 0s duration. Simple math.
  • TyEdgeTyEdge Member Posts: 3,115 ★★★★★
    Strategic said:

    Eb0ny-O-M4w said:

    Increased debuffs duration

    Debuff duration doesn't matter cause she decreases debuff duration by percentage. So if it's 15s instead of 5 then if it's reduced by 100%+ it should still be 0s duration. Simple math.
    This isn’t how it works. You’re treating this as if you multiply by zero. If a node is plus 40% duration and Angela reduces length by 100%, you wind up at 40%. Start with 100, and add or subtract based on nodes and abilities.
  • CorkscrewCorkscrew Member Posts: 540 ★★★
    edited June 2022
    Strategic said:


    Debuff duration doesn't matter cause she decreases debuff duration by percentage. So if it's 15s instead of 5 then if it's reduced by 100%+ it should still be 0s duration. Simple math.

    While not stated explicitly every time you see modifiers, it's implied that's how it works since they have stated it elsewhere.

    It makes sense for them to handle percentages through addition and subtraction of a base stat rather than multiplication since it gives a consistent result regardless of the order of processing them. This is particularly important because they mix both absolute and percentage-based modifiers.

    If X and Y are percentage multipliers and C is an absolute the following will always give the same result regardless of processing order.

    B + (X x B ) + (Y x B ) - C
    will be the same as

    B + (X x B ) - C + (Y x B )

    Compare to multiplying:

    (B x X x Y) - C is likely not equal to
    ((B x X) - C) x Y
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  • UnknownUnknown
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  • Badass84Badass84 Member Posts: 317 ★★★
    Same reason why Omega was killed in seconds by bleed...
  • nOuxnOux Member Posts: 522 ★★★
    edited June 2022
    Strategic said:

    Eb0ny-O-M4w said:

    Increased debuffs duration

    Debuff duration doesn't matter cause she decreases debuff duration by percentage. So if it's 15s instead of 5 then if it's reduced by 100%+ it should still be 0s duration. Simple math.
    If the node would increase certain amount of seconds instead of percentages then yes, your math would be correct.
    But its increasing percentage, so 200% - 100% is not equal to 0 seconds. It counts only as 50% reduction to debuff duration.
    Simple example:
    (200%=10s) - (100%=5s) = 5 seconds.
  • AverageDesiAverageDesi Member Posts: 5,260 ★★★★★
    GarrettN said:

    Lucifire said:

    Strategic said:

    Eb0ny-O-M4w said:

    Increased debuffs duration

    Debuff duration doesn't matter cause she decreases debuff duration by percentage. So if it's 15s instead of 5 then if it's reduced by 100%+ it should still be 0s duration. Simple math.
    That's not how it works. Use angela against hazard shift - bleed and shock. If your opponent is running deep wounds, you'll notice that while Angela is completely immune to shock, she isn't to bleed. The bleed lasts for about a second or two on her and then goes away
    Hey look someone else who likes Angela for the hazard shift lane! I thought I was alone.
    It's all fun and games till the opponent runs deep wounds
  • ZeiramMRZeiramMR Member Posts: 101 ★
    AverageDesi said:


    It's all fun and games till the opponent runs deep wounds

    So just to confirm how I am interpreting these posts, anything that extends the debuff duration like the Extend node or Deep Wounds is not going to touched by Angela's sig ability regardless of how many buffs she has, and only the "original" portion of the duration is subject to her signature ability? (I get how the additive/subtractive math works, this is not a question about that.)

  • JadedJaded Member Posts: 5,477 ★★★★★
    coagulate?
  • NastyPhishNastyPhish Member Posts: 583 ★★★
    ZeiramMR said:

    AverageDesi said:


    It's all fun and games till the opponent runs deep wounds

    So just to confirm how I am interpreting these posts, anything that extends the debuff duration like the Extend node or Deep Wounds is not going to touched by Angela's sig ability regardless of how many buffs she has, and only the "original" portion of the duration is subject to her signature ability? (I get how the additive/subtractive math works, this is not a question about that.)

    Yes. It’s also works this way with 100% resistances and 150% potency. You still take 50%
  • AverageDesiAverageDesi Member Posts: 5,260 ★★★★★
    ZeiramMR said:

    AverageDesi said:


    It's all fun and games till the opponent runs deep wounds

    So just to confirm how I am interpreting these posts, anything that extends the debuff duration like the Extend node or Deep Wounds is not going to touched by Angela's sig ability regardless of how many buffs she has, and only the "original" portion of the duration is subject to her signature ability? (I get how the additive/subtractive math works, this is not a question about that.)

    Timed increases cannot/are not reduced by percentage reductions. They're added after the total calculation. That's why domino massacre synergy 'bypasses 'limber. And mags against metal champs
  • UnknownUnknown
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  • Graves_3Graves_3 Member Posts: 1,521 ★★★★★
    BitterSteel said:

    Strategic said:

    Eb0ny-O-M4w said:

    Increased debuffs duration

    Debuff duration doesn't matter cause she decreases debuff duration by percentage. So if it's 15s instead of 5 then if it's reduced by 100%+ it should still be 0s duration. Simple math.
    Yeah I get why you think that, and kabam should really make it clearer in the game, but that’s not how it works.

    Take a debuff of 5s duration. Angela can reduce that by 100% of the original duration. So that’s 5 seconds.

    Now there’s a node that increases duration by 100%, so 5 seconds plus 5 seconds = 10 seconds.

    Angela’s ability can still only reduce duration by 100% of the original duration, hers doesn’t apply to the new duration, only the old one. So as your debuff duration, you get

    100% of 5 + 5 = 10 as your new debuff duration. Then for the reduction you have:

    10 - 100% of 5 = 5 seconds of debuff ticking

    The 100% of the original duration is still only 5 seconds reduction.

    Again, it’s not clearly explained in game how it works out this way, but it has been confirmed that this is the way it works.
    Actually Angela reduces duration by 35% per buff. If you have 3 of odins prefights and 3 of her own buffs, the duration reduction should be 200% as far as I understand. Any idea if it really works that way?
  • BitterSteelBitterSteel Member Posts: 9,264 ★★★★★
    Graves_3 said:

    BitterSteel said:

    Strategic said:

    Eb0ny-O-M4w said:

    Increased debuffs duration

    Debuff duration doesn't matter cause she decreases debuff duration by percentage. So if it's 15s instead of 5 then if it's reduced by 100%+ it should still be 0s duration. Simple math.
    Yeah I get why you think that, and kabam should really make it clearer in the game, but that’s not how it works.

    Take a debuff of 5s duration. Angela can reduce that by 100% of the original duration. So that’s 5 seconds.

    Now there’s a node that increases duration by 100%, so 5 seconds plus 5 seconds = 10 seconds.

    Angela’s ability can still only reduce duration by 100% of the original duration, hers doesn’t apply to the new duration, only the old one. So as your debuff duration, you get

    100% of 5 + 5 = 10 as your new debuff duration. Then for the reduction you have:

    10 - 100% of 5 = 5 seconds of debuff ticking

    The 100% of the original duration is still only 5 seconds reduction.

    Again, it’s not clearly explained in game how it works out this way, but it has been confirmed that this is the way it works.
    Actually Angela reduces duration by 35% per buff. If you have 3 of odins prefights and 3 of her own buffs, the duration reduction should be 200% as far as I understand. Any idea if it really works that way?
    Yes you’re right, I was keeping it simple to make the point clear.

    In theory it should work that way, so your sum would be:

    Base duration of 5 seconds with 100% increase = 10 seconds of debuff

    Reduction of 200% of 5 = 10 seconds reduction.

    Total debuff time = 10 - 10 = 0 seconds

    I don’t have a high sig Angela to test, but if anyone does that would be great.
  • UnknownUnknown
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  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    Angela’s sig ability goes above 100%, if you have the appropriate % to counter a % increase she can shut down the dot.
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