What was Kabams’s intended game plan for facing Bullseye?

Heruzu369 · May 12

As we all know, the amount of people at Kabam who actually play the game can be counted on one hand. With that being said, I’m genuinely curious if can Kabam can convey to us, whether through a video, or explanation here on the forums, of a how a regular match up against bullseyes is supposed to be played🤔 how exactly is every champ in the game besides Sinister and Negasonic intended to handle him?🤔

I don’t think there’s a been a more clearer prime example of a champ who sickeningly overtuned on defense and remotely nonexistent on offense… especially when the champ been requested for YEARSSS. To leave him in the state he’s in now would be undignified with how big of an obvious issue he is in the game.
Also, why create a champ who gets countered by the person they’re supposed to counter? Lmaooo what type of game designing logic is this? I’ve literally never heard of such a thing.
“He’s a photon counter

”
Except his minimal damage is halved because the champ he “counters” turns off his bleed effects, or in other words, turns off at least half his damage 😐😐

I’m genuinely confused as to what the thought process behind this champ was outside of “his toxicity gonna bring in a lot of money”
Cause that’s honestly what it feels like with his introduction to the contest.
“They wanted him for years? We’ll make sure everyone hates his existence 😈” is the current vibe

Heruzu369 · May 12

Also, if you bring a bleed immune, guess what? CRITS🥳🥳🥳
Face him on a war boss mode? Super damage through block🥳
He got a bar of power but don’t wanna throw specials? You’re forced into wall since you can’t attack him🥳
You bring an evade counter, guess what? You didn’t cover his bleeds and crits through block🥳🥳

Like literally wtf is 98% of the roster supposed to do against him?
The only 3 counters are sinister, Negasonic(who is a p2p champ as of rn for like 3-5 months until they come out regularly), and Warlock.
That’s 3 out of what? 250? Anddd it’s not just that, IF YOU DONT HAVE THEM CHAMPS, the match is screwed. That’s it.

Pure35 · May 12

Use warlock against him. He is bleed immune plus opponent's specials cannot crit while warlock has an armor up.
Well nevermind my comment just reread the above comment

Heruzu369 · May 12

Pure35 said:
Use warlock against him. He is bleed immune plus opponent's specials cannot crit while warlock has an armor up

I mentioned that already but that’s not the problem I’m addressing here. Out of the whole game, literally only 3 champs are viable against him and only 2/3 are accessible. And that’s still not mentioning how he’s disastrous on defense but a noodle on offense. The whole champ is flawed
Also warlock can’t be used as a tactic attacker WHICH IS ANOTHER THING I FORGOT TO MENTION🤦🏾‍♂️🤦🏾‍♂️

FeydRautha · May 12

Yes Bullseye feels annoying on defense and requires a bleed immune champion who also deals with his evade to counter him. But I think his evade can be dealt with and the only requirement is bleed immunity and there are lots of bleed immunes in the game. Now compare this to when characters like Electro, Domino and Korg were added in the game. They had fun and interactive damage with no proper counter even after a long time they were released. I personally find Onslaught a lot more annoying to deal with compared to Bullseye but overtime we will have handful of great counters for them as well.

Heruzu369 · May 12

FeydRautha said:
Yes Bullseye feels annoying on defense and requires a bleed immune champion who also deals with his evade to counter him. But I think his evade can be dealt with and the only requirement is bleed immunity and there are lots of bleed immunes in the game. Now compare this to when characters like Electro, Domino and Korg were added in the game. They had fun and interactive damage with no proper counter even after a long time they were released. I personally find Onslaught a lot more annoying to deal with compared to Bullseye but overtime we will have handful of great counters for them as well.

Including myself, I’ve seen numerous people learn how to dex onslaught sp1. As of rn, MSD is the only person I seen accomplish that feat for Bullesye. Also you mentioned bleed immune, when crits are a problem too depending where you’re fighting him. Which is a great chance of him being a war boss with tactic defender so warlock is out of the question and his crits(even without the bleeds) are very damaging cause of the stat boost

Nemesis_17 · May 12

I don’t like his design either, but to say there’s only 3 counters isn’t true. Aside from those you mentioned there’s also AA, kitty, Cgr, high sig guardian, Onslaught, Iceman, Weapon X, Nick, Emma, Bishop, Kate, and Storm. (though the last 2 take more block damage.) If you have a bleed immune the block damage is very reasonable. Like I said I still hate his design because of how unfair he is without a counter, but there’s still a lot of them out there.

Ayden_noah1 · May 12

Actually any champ with true sense or true strike will work. Nick after 5 charges, Moleman right out of the box, Emma in her telephathic mode, Professor x after 25 charges, Elsa with her cold snap, Iceman cold snap, Storm Pyramid X once she applies cold snap, or any champ that applies slow. So there are plenty of champs that will melt him. When he first came out I would ban him all the time in BG but now that I know he has lots of counter, I look forward to facing him. Again without a counter most defenders are hard to deal with but there is plenty of counters to Bulleyes.

captain_rogers · May 12

Iceman, prowler, and emma frost also shuts him down completely.

His sp2 is easy to dex, so you can also use bishop, both storms to push him to2 bars of power via stun lock.

Also you can counter him in non traditional approaches, like gorr who can cheese him by getting a lot of regen effects.

Also you can play around his evade by bringin a bleed immune, or nuke him down before getting much damage by bringin a evade counter.

He is definitely annoying, but trust me if onslaught don't get a rework, bullseye definitely won't.

Also none of them are as annoying as domino in her release. She was released in 2018, and the first proper counter we had was mysterio in 2019. Until that, almost every champ in game took crit failure damage. Atleast bullseye has few counters

Heruzu369 · May 12

Once again ya mention a “counter” but ksot named only works for one part of his kit.
“Just bring true sense and true strike” counters evade but not the unnecessary damage so I already mentioned that.

If you bring counters to the bleed or block damage, you still got the evade, which paired with the horrible AI, can lead you in situations where you’re just pinned against the wall or forced to trigger the evade.

I’m not saying Bullseye is this unbeatable god, I’m saying he’s easily by far the most overtuned defender with the least ACTUAL COUNTERS. Cause yes you can counter 1 part of his kit, but it’s designed that there’s at least 2 other things that can throw everything off at anytime Besides the 3 counters I mentioned.
Ya brought up champs that I already touched on in my second message on this post noting how you can counter one major part of his kit, just to be kicked in the balls by other major parts of his kit.
So yes I feel hes massively overtuned, especially when you throw boss nodes and A war tactic defender in the mix😐

And ONCE AGAIN, im talking about his WHOLE kit, not just defensively. This guy SUCKS on offense, bad. Expeditiously. He needs to fixed. He literally needs to be nerfed defensively and buffed offensively imo

Heruzu369 · May 12

captain_rogers said:
Iceman, prowler, and emma frost also shuts him down completely.

His sp2 is easy to dex, so you can also use bishop, both storms to push him to2 bars of power via stun lock.

Also you can counter him in non traditional approaches, like gorr who can cheese him by getting a lot of regen effects.

Also you can play around his evade by bringin a bleed immune, or nuke him down before getting much damage by bringin a evade counter.

He is definitely annoying, but trust me if onslaught don't get a rework, bullseye definitely won't.

Also none of them are as annoying as domino in her release. She was released in 2018, and the first proper counter we had was mysterio in 2019. Until that, almost every champ in game took crit failure damage. Atleast bullseye has few counters

I get domino was a menace when she came out but that’s another point to be made, why has the defenders felt like regressed back to that. This whole year that’s all that’s been going on. Almost every defender has fun and interactive damage and I don’t think the justification of “it’s always been like this” is a good one when the game should be evolving. A lot of these match ups nowadays are less on skill and more on hoping you have the specific right champ and that’s not a good balance for any game. Obviously having the right champ should always be better, but not having that very specific champ shouldn’t be an automatic loss in BGs cause you can’t escape the fun and interactive damage

Heruzu369 · May 12

I mean are we literally saying bullseye doesn’t deserve to have his defense prowess nerfed while having his offense buffed? Like is that what the community is telling me rn? Cause if that’s case then it’s not even Just Kabam, it’s us. Cause if Bullseye don’t deserve a nerf in that regard, then I struggle to see how any defender does. He has less counters with more defensive mechanics than most champs while also having more fun and interactive damage than them.
Bringing up a champ from yearsss ago to justify that this is okay is honestly sad on the community part and if that’s the case we might as throw away the rebalancing program since NO DEFENDER is too strong to be nerfed it seems.

And it’s so sad that’s he been relegated to this cause no one even cares about him being anything on offense. It’s truly disappointing how we treat champs that we begged years for

Heruzu369 · May 12

And once again, everyone has failed to mention him + his tactic limiting the options even more but hey cool I guess. Every defender is perfectly designed and Kabam could never do any mistakes on overturning or anything like that. It literally just has to be skill issue and always the player fault for the fun and interactive damage.

I mean who wouldn’t the LOVEE the business model of making a ridiculous defender just so to create a perfect counter half a year later.
I mean it’s not like Kabam are literally creating problems so they can sell their solutions but hey whatever ya win🥳😇

Heruzu369 · May 12

Cause if bullseye was as fair as ya say, nega sonic wouldn’t have been made SPECIFICALLY for him now would she?😇 okay

Nemesis_17 · May 12

Not a single person has said he shouldn’t be nerfed, so I don’t know what you’re trying to say. One person said he probably won’t be nerfed, but not that he doesn’t think he should be. There’s a giant poll in a different thread on whether or not he deserves a tune down, and the results are basically 50-50. I personally would love a tune down on defense for a tune up on offense. Still, some of the claims you’re making just aren’t true.

captain_rogers · May 12

@Heruzu369 I'm not saying he shouldn't be nerfed. I will be the happiest person if he gets nerfed, but he won't. If onslut and photon wasn't nerfed then bullseye wasn't.

Also I disagree with him getting a tune up on offense. Not every champ have to busted on offense. He is decent in offense and that's it. I want to have a slight tune down in defense but that ain't happenin

Demonzfyre · May 12

Heruzu369 said:
Cause if bullseye was as fair as ya say, nega sonic wouldn’t have been made SPECIFICALLY for him now would she?😇 okay

That's how this game has worked for the past 10 years. Something gets released and counters come later. Many people have given you plenty of viable options but you're brushing past all of them because you think your opinion is the only one that matters.

mbgibson · May 12

Gorr and Kushala are also very good options in addition to the others people have named.

Heruzu369 · May 12

Agree to disagree then cause they are in my eyes and many others so. My opinions aren’t new, plenty have said what I said since the beginning of year when he was released.
If you like him as is or feel he’s a more fair than I give him credit for, kudos to you

Ayden_noah1 · May 12

Now that people have fought him on a regular basis, summoers are getting used to his mechanic. He's not as bad as when he first came out. Yes his mechanics are annoying as everyone said but he does have counter. If you can get him to a sp2, he's pretty easy to take down and his health pool isn't the biggest so he will go down very fast with a sp2 from most attackers. If you have true strike or true sense, getting him to sp2 is easier. Once he looses his annoying counter strike he's not that hard to take down. When Majik came out she might have been the most annoying defender in War since she had no counter back in the old days, Blade came along and save for Blade became a huge thing. When Peni first came out, she was a pain to fight then came Hulkling and Galan to counter her. Mephisto was once a must have in your BG deck until the science class got stronger. This has been going on since the game started so why do you expected anything different.

Asher1_1 · May 12

Good defender - great early access sale
Good for AW , Battlegrounds - as saga
U want counters ??
Onslaught, Bishop , Kushala , CGR ,warlock , Redskull, werewolf,NF(2nd life trick) , AA , kitty pryde & ofc -- Negasonic

ItsClobberinTime · May 12

Bro said three counters lmao I guess AA, CGR, Guardian, Gorr, Weapon X, Sunspot, Bishop, Adam, Kushala, Red Skull, Iceman, Storms don't exist anymore.

Wicket329 · May 12

Nobody’s mentioned the White Mags prefight that gives a huge portion of the champs in the game a passive stun. Bullseye can’t shrug that. Use it with any bleed immune champ and you’re good to go. White Mags himself is bleed immune 🤷🏻‍♂️

captain_rogers · May 12

Wicket329 said:
Nobody’s mentioned the White Mags prefight that gives a huge portion of the champs in the game a passive stun. Bullseye can’t shrug that. Use it with any bleed immune champ and you’re good to go. White Mags himself is bleed immune 🤷🏻‍♂️

Yeah it is pretty decent in wars in nodes where you can stun the defender but need to manage other annoying stuff, like hazard shift bullseye

WOLF_LINK · May 12

Storm/Storm X are very effective, too.

ItsClobberinTime · May 12

ItsClobberinTime said:
Bro said three counters lmao I guess AA, CGR, Guardian, Gorr, Weapon X, Sunspot, Bishop, Adam, Kushala, Red Skull, Iceman, Storms don't exist anymore.

Forgot about Sersi, Prowler and Odin 💀

Buttehrs · May 12

Funny I dont hear people cry when a champ is op offensively. Only when it's defensively or when they lack offense. No one complained about Hercules. Not every champ in the game needs to be an offensive powerhouse. They made that VERY clear.

LordSmasher · May 12

If he doesn't get nerfed then the balance program is a sham.

Madman_marvin · May 12

Unfortunately, kabam has done this multiple times. They introduce a hard defender. Then, the release the counter later down the line so people will whale out to get said counter.

ItsClobberinTime · May 13

LordSmasher said:
If he doesn't get nerfed then the balance program is a sham.

Why would they nerf him? We literally just got Sinister and Negasonic... This is like if Peni got nerfed after Galan and Hulkling were added, makes no sense.

LordSmasher · May 13

ItsClobberinTime said:

LordSmasher said:
If he doesn't get nerfed then the balance program is a sham.
Why would they nerf him? We literally just got Sinister and Negasonic... This is like if Peni got nerfed after Galan and Hulkling were added, makes no sense.

You can beat Penni with anyone once you understand her mechanics -> remove shield, go to town.

Bullseye has a bag of "fun". Bleed when you dex, crits into your blocks, counter attack rubbish that persists for a time even after he threw an SP1.
You shouldn't have to hard counter a defender, a large chunk of attackers should be able to work around the defence mechanisms with clever play.

He's just the peak of a rapidly escalating difficult defender design since Maestro that has been sucking the fun out of AW.

What was Kabams’s intended game plan for facing Bullseye?

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