Developers Thoughts: Improving Alliance Wars Discussion Thread

Hey Summoners!

We've just posted a brand new behind the scenes look at the future of Alliance Wars, including some new changes coming to Alliance Wars Season 5! Make sure you take a read of the post over on our Blog: https://playcontestofchampions.com/developer-thoughts-improving-alliance-wars/

The Rotating Global Buffs kick off on October 17th! Prepare yourselves!

Comments

BeginthEnd

This discussion is meant to constructively gather the ideas of those affected by the new changes being implemented. This also applies to those who may be affected in the near future by these same changes- or new ones like it.

Please take a moment to consider how Kabam could address the concerns of all and make this game better. For everyone. Not just your champs, but God teir Champs, new champs (new players), and the core community.

I am part of the core community. Back when 5* where just being introduced I was SO stoked. However.. when I pulled a 5* Collosus.. ouch.. followed by 5* Ant Man.. Rhino.. BP.. just OUCH. Couldn’t do anything with those champs if I wanted to.. maybe awakened? I finally got a Sparky. After all that n then some.

Point is, when there were no 5*s, you’d be lucky to get Thor, who used to be a God. Easy to forget Doctor Strange was the BEST THERE EVER IS. Until they took away his doctorates degree, smashed his hands again and sold Dormammu his soul, now he’s worthless.

So many garbage champs now.. partly because the meta does change. New champs are almost always stronger in some way, while older ones get stagnet or flat out nerfed.

It’s not about luck or who you want to play with, it’s about when you choose to get the champ and whether or not that champ remains to be a good option. Will always be a better champ in the future though.

How to fix this? Take away entire masteries like Mystic Disperion and Deep Wounds or just weaken the entire class? Not very cool and not a fix, that’s beating a dead horse to death, knowing it won’t bleed anymore.

This is how you fix it. Allow people the opportunity to rank up any champ they have (in AW if that’s how Kabam wants it)

Issue the “bad word” rank down tickets to players that deserve them, maybe people that really used bleed champ and the masteries that come with it. Same for MD and mystic. It’s long past due. Better yet, do it just for kicks, let people have fun re-diversifying their rosters and reuseing the hard earned rank up material. Everyone will still have to grind for the gold and ISO to rank them. Kabam keeps all the gold/iso used before. It’s a win/win.

That’s just my “constructive” idea. Have a good idea or could maybe comment on how Kabam should fix known issues like account sharing, hacking, cheating, selling, etc?

Post your constructive ideas here.

BigPoppaCBONE

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

Who are your 3-5 r5 5* champs again?

How many times will you keep responding that way before you realize it's just old. If you want to have a serious discussion, try doing it on topic and without calling people out on what they have and don't have. Unless you can point out how my Roster pertains to a Global Node.

If you stop making definitive statements on end game content I'll stop asking about you experience with end game content.

Calling someone out about where they're at in the game doesn't give you more of a right to have an opinion on the subject, and it's not a very constructive way to have a debate. If you think your Roster and position in the game automatically makes you right and me wrong, prove it with points that pertain to my own. All that equates to in a discussion is an act of desperation.

Your roster and position in the game don’t make you automatically wrong, they make your definitive statements about end game/Tier 1 content only conjecture since you don’t have personal experience and claim to not get information from YouTubers. It shouldn’t come as a surprise that people don’t value guesses and assumptions as much as firsthand knowledge.

GroundedWisdom

DNA3000 wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

Who are your 3-5 r5 5* champs again?

How many times will you keep responding that way before you realize it's just old. If you want to have a serious discussion, try doing it on topic and without calling people out on what they have and don't have. Unless you can point out how my Roster pertains to a Global Node.

If you stop making definitive statements on end game content I'll stop asking about you experience with end game content.

Calling someone out about where they're at in the game doesn't give you more of a right to have an opinion on the subject, and it's not a very constructive way to have a debate. If you think your Roster and position in the game automatically makes you right and me wrong, prove it with points that pertain to my own. All that equates to in a discussion is an act of desperation.

Actually, I presume anyone actually fighting in tiers 1 through 5 have a more informed opinion about the state of tiers 1 through 5. I wouldn't make strong statements about those tiers when I don't participate in them. I have a *general* opinion of those that I feel generally informed about, having seen them and talked to players that participate in them. But I think anyone speaking authoritatively about a part of the game they don't actually experience is being presumptuous. Everyone has a right to express an opinion, but that doesn't mean every opinion is equally interesting.

That doesn't mean every person playing in those tiers is automatically right, but it does mean every person not playing in those tiers is on very shaky ground when talking about those tiers. The burden of proof is on them to demonstrate they are sufficiently well informed that their opinion is meaningful.

It's something that takes place more than is necessary. It's almost always random and has nothing to do with the discussion directly. I've had the same encounter repeatedly with the individual. It's just calling someone out. I respect your input, but I'm not going to put a spin on people trying to bully me out of a conversation. If there's any aspect of what I'm saying they would like to debate, they can have at it. "You even Tier 1 bro?" isn't a constructive response.

RagamugginGunner

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

Who are your 3-5 r5 5* champs again?

How many times will you keep responding that way before you realize it's just old. If you want to have a serious discussion, try doing it on topic and without calling people out on what they have and don't have. Unless you can point out how my Roster pertains to a Global Node.

If you stop making definitive statements on end game content I'll stop asking about you experience with end game content.

Calling someone out about where they're at in the game doesn't give you more of a right to have an opinion on the subject, and it's not a very constructive way to have a debate. If you think your Roster and position in the game automatically makes you right and me wrong, prove it with points that pertain to my own. All that equates to in a discussion is an act of desperation.

How can you not admit that by not being an endgame player you don't actually know what it's like for endgame players?\

I coach middle school football but I'm not trying to tell Bill Belichick how he should run the Patriots.

Kabam Miike

Hey All,

I want to drop in and let you all know that you've given us A LOT of feedback, and we've made sure that the team is aware of your ideas and concerns. You've given us a lot to think about when we're choosing Rotating Buffs in the future, and even on how we're going to monitor the performance of the Buffs we're implementing this time.

Like we said in our Blog Post, this is a stepping stone for us to move towards allowing Alliances the agency to choose a Global Buff that they feel best suits their Defense teams. It's both a testing ground and a preview. This isn't something that we're going to be able to implement overnight, or even by the end of the year, but it's something we're actively working on.

Something that we've seen come up a few times is regarding the availability of Rank Up materials. We've been increasing the availability of rank up materials, like Tier 2 Alphas and T4CCs in modes like Alliance Quests, and even in Seasons rewards. We're not going to stop there, and are always moving forward in increasing rewards and access to resources across The Contest.

When we said the intention of introducing Rotating Global Buffs was not to find a way to increase difficulty, we truly meant that . The goal is to ensure there is more variety in Alliance Wars, and that we can continually keep the mode fluid, and ever changing.

We understand that this concept is a little scary, and we are going to monitor this change very closely, and use the data that we collect to continue to improve upon this moving forward, helping to make Alliance Wars a more engaging and lively mode. We also want to assure you that we will provide previews of large scale changes like this moving forward.

GroundedWisdom

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

Who are your 3-5 r5 5* champs again?

How many times will you keep responding that way before you realize it's just old. If you want to have a serious discussion, try doing it on topic and without calling people out on what they have and don't have. Unless you can point out how my Roster pertains to a Global Node.

If you stop making definitive statements on end game content I'll stop asking about you experience with end game content.

Calling someone out about where they're at in the game doesn't give you more of a right to have an opinion on the subject, and it's not a very constructive way to have a debate. If you think your Roster and position in the game automatically makes you right and me wrong, prove it with points that pertain to my own. All that equates to in a discussion is an act of desperation.

How can you not admit that by not being an endgame player you don't actually know what it's like for endgame players?\

I coach middle school football but I'm not trying to tell Bill Belichick how he should run the Patriots.

Was I talking about how hard the Nodes are? Was I implying my own struggles? Did I say anything at all about my own experience in that Tier? No. I was talking about the changes to the Nodes and how there should be no logical reason why anyone at that stage shouldn't be capable of dealing with a Bleed Immunity Node. That's simple logic. I also talked about how any change will require adjusting. That's a general statement. I talked about how it would be an adjustment for some more than others. That's common sense.
Being at the End-Game level doesn't somehow make people impervious to having to make adjustments to new content. That's a statement that applies to any Player. Something new comes, you have to adjust. Your questioning of my position in the game had nothing to do with what I was talking about. It was an attempt to devalue my points using your position. If you want to make such an attempt, it's probably better to do it with valid points within the context of a discussion. Otherwise it's just personal.

RagamugginGunner

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

Who are your 3-5 r5 5* champs again?

How many times will you keep responding that way before you realize it's just old. If you want to have a serious discussion, try doing it on topic and without calling people out on what they have and don't have. Unless you can point out how my Roster pertains to a Global Node.

If you stop making definitive statements on end game content I'll stop asking about you experience with end game content.

Calling someone out about where they're at in the game doesn't give you more of a right to have an opinion on the subject, and it's not a very constructive way to have a debate. If you think your Roster and position in the game automatically makes you right and me wrong, prove it with points that pertain to my own. All that equates to in a discussion is an act of desperation.

How can you not admit that by not being an endgame player you don't actually know what it's like for endgame players?\

I coach middle school football but I'm not trying to tell Bill Belichick how he should run the Patriots.

Was I talking about how hard the Nodes are? Was I implying my own struggles? Did I say anything at all about my own experience in that Tier? No. I was talking about the changes to the Nodes and how there should be no logical reason why anyone at that stage shouldn't be capable of dealing with a Bleed Immunity Node. That's simple logic. I also talked about how any change will require adjusting. That's a general statement. I talked about how it would be an adjustment for some more than others. That's common sense.
Being at the End-Game level doesn't somehow make people impervious to having to make adjustments to new content. That's a statement that applies to any Player. Something new comes, you have to adjust. Your questioning of my position in the game had nothing to do with what I was talking about. It was an attempt to devalue my points using your position. If you want to make such an attempt, it's probably better to do it with valid points within the context of a discussion. Otherwise it's just personal.

You're making assumptions and stating it as fact. You simply don't understand what you're talking about, and refuse to admit it...again.

ShaggyM

Then why not make these changes prior to the new season?

GroundedWisdom

Kabam Miike wrote: »

Hey All,

I want to drop in and let you all know that you've given us A LOT of feedback, and we've made sure that the team is aware of your ideas and concerns. You've given us a lot to think about when we're choosing Rotating Buffs in the future, and even on how we're going to monitor the performance of the Buffs we're implementing this time.

Like we said in our Blog Post, this is a stepping stone for us to move towards allowing Alliances the agency to choose a Global Buff that they feel best suits their Defense teams. It's both a testing ground and a preview. This isn't something that we're going to be able to implement overnight, or even by the end of the year, but it's something we're actively working on.

Something that we've seen come up a few times is regarding the availability of Rank Up materials. We've been increasing the availability of rank up materials, like Tier 2 Alphas and T4CCs in modes like Alliance Quests, and even in Seasons rewards. We're not going to stop there, and are always moving forward in increasing rewards and access to resources across The Contest.

When we said the intention of introducing Rotating Global Buffs was not to find a way to increase difficulty, we truly meant that . The goal is to ensure there is more variety in Alliance Wars, and that we can continually keep the mode fluid, and ever changing.

We understand that this concept is a little scary, and we are going to monitor this change very closely, and use the data that we collect to continue to improve upon this moving forward, helping to make Alliance Wars a more engaging and lively mode. We also want to assure you that we will provide previews of large scale changes like this moving forward.

I think that's one of the biggest concerns for people, the Ranking materials. Thanks for commenting Miike.

AxeCopFire

BeginthEnd wrote: »

This discussion is meant to constructively gather the ideas of those affected by the new changes being implemented.

What changes?

RagamugginGunner

Kabam Miike wrote: »

When we said the intention of introducing Rotating Global Buffs was not to find a way to increase difficulty, we truly meant that . The goal is to ensure there is more variety in Alliance Wars, and that we can continually keep the mode fluid, and ever changing.

Can you please explain to me how, exactly, adding global nodes does not make AW more difficult? Thanks.

GroundedWisdom

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

Who are your 3-5 r5 5* champs again?

How many times will you keep responding that way before you realize it's just old. If you want to have a serious discussion, try doing it on topic and without calling people out on what they have and don't have. Unless you can point out how my Roster pertains to a Global Node.

If you stop making definitive statements on end game content I'll stop asking about you experience with end game content.

Calling someone out about where they're at in the game doesn't give you more of a right to have an opinion on the subject, and it's not a very constructive way to have a debate. If you think your Roster and position in the game automatically makes you right and me wrong, prove it with points that pertain to my own. All that equates to in a discussion is an act of desperation.

How can you not admit that by not being an endgame player you don't actually know what it's like for endgame players?\

I coach middle school football but I'm not trying to tell Bill Belichick how he should run the Patriots.

Was I talking about how hard the Nodes are? Was I implying my own struggles? Did I say anything at all about my own experience in that Tier? No. I was talking about the changes to the Nodes and how there should be no logical reason why anyone at that stage shouldn't be capable of dealing with a Bleed Immunity Node. That's simple logic. I also talked about how any change will require adjusting. That's a general statement. I talked about how it would be an adjustment for some more than others. That's common sense.
Being at the End-Game level doesn't somehow make people impervious to having to make adjustments to new content. That's a statement that applies to any Player. Something new comes, you have to adjust. Your questioning of my position in the game had nothing to do with what I was talking about. It was an attempt to devalue my points using your position. If you want to make such an attempt, it's probably better to do it with valid points within the context of a discussion. Otherwise it's just personal.

You're making assumptions and stating it as fact. You simply don't understand what you're talking about, and refuse to admit it...again.

You're trying to come for me, so it's time to move on.

GroundedWisdom

Inigo wrote: »

Then why not make these changes prior to the new season?

That could be a good idea, actually. Might feel like less pressure.

SgtSlaughter78

DNA3000 wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

Who are your 3-5 r5 5* champs again?

How many times will you keep responding that way before you realize it's just old. If you want to have a serious discussion, try doing it on topic and without calling people out on what they have and don't have. Unless you can point out how my Roster pertains to a Global Node.

If you stop making definitive statements on end game content I'll stop asking about you experience with end game content.

Calling someone out about where they're at in the game doesn't give you more of a right to have an opinion on the subject, and it's not a very constructive way to have a debate. If you think your Roster and position in the game automatically makes you right and me wrong, prove it with points that pertain to my own. All that equates to in a discussion is an act of desperation.

Actually, I presume anyone actually fighting in tiers 1 through 5 have a more informed opinion about the state of tiers 1 through 5. I wouldn't make strong statements about those tiers when I don't participate in them. I have a *general* opinion of those that I feel generally informed about, having seen them and talked to players that participate in them. But I think anyone speaking authoritatively about a part of the game they don't actually experience is being presumptuous. Everyone has a right to express an opinion, but that doesn't mean every opinion is equally interesting.

That doesn't mean every person playing in those tiers is automatically right, but it does mean every person not playing in those tiers is on very shaky ground when talking about those tiers. The burden of proof is on them to demonstrate they are sufficiently well informed that their opinion is meaningful.

And again, we move away from talking about the actual issue to catering for/dealing with one person’s ego.

Let’s get back on track here.

Demonzfyre

DNA3000 wrote: »

Demonzfyre wrote: »

Kpatrix wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

borntohula wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

Playing at that level consistently means they will have more options. That's just a fact.

Sigh. At times it seems you're not simply missing the gist of an argument, but purposefully avoiding it. Truth is, there aren't an infinite (or even a large) number of counters to specific alliance war nodes in higher tiers. Let alone to entire paths. And no, not everyone that is affected by this euphemism for 'we want you to spend more to clear your line' has a whole team of 5/5 champs on the bench.

Me, I'm in a consistently Gold 1 alliance (yes, we're affected). Out of our 30 members, only three (!) have two (!) maxed out five stars. None of us has a rank 2 six star. And roughly half (I'd have to check) of the players make do with 5/4 and/or lower ranked champs. The 15 or so members who do have one or two maxed five stars, all ranked for the most difficult and potentially most profitable game-mode, AW. None of us ranked up champs specifically for other content. Mostly, because none of us really struggle in other content.

Given that Blade and other bleeders (KM and AA, for instance) were among the best (few) AW offensive options, it stands to reason that most maxed those champs. So, to reiterate, for alliances at our level - not crazy high up there, just 'solid' Gold 1 - this little experiment doesn't hamper 'a few' of our top champs, but - in many cases - all of them. We hardly have any to begin with!

And given that the number of counters to specific (successions of) nodes/champs on specific lines, is insanely limited, the only way for most of us to (maybe) still make it through, is by spending a ton of items. Would we like to use different champs? Sure, we would! But only if those stood a chance to succeed. Also, if you could lead the way to the pot of rank up materials at the end of your argumentative rainbow, that would be a great help.

In short; you have no idea what you're talking about. And I don't think you care either.

I know exactly what I'm talking about. The issue is people don't like hearing it. I specifically said that it would pose a problem for some. That's the point of the Node. To challenge people to rely on more than just Bleed. I didn't say everyone has everything they need to R5 a Roster immediately. Especially those at the bottom end of the demographic we are discussing. I said people have options. If all people depend on is Bleed throughout, that's a problem in and of itself. Considering that's only one Debuff. That's a byproduct of a majority only Ranking the same Champs. Yes, Resources are scarce. That's a different issue. The main point I'm making is it will take adjusting. At least for a Season. There's somehow an expectation that whatever change comes should entail little to no difference in how people play, and that's just not in touch with reality. Simply put, you have to do things differently to adjust to something different. I'm not even entertaining the idea that people have absolutely no options outside of Bleed. If so, that's because they expected to Rank one Team that would remain untouched no matter what they throw at people, and that's equally as unrealistic. The bottom line is, it's a rotating Node that some will have to put more effort into adjusting to than others, and that makes it no different than any other change that comes.
I've been pretty respectful in that, considering the pointed implication that I don't know what I'm talking about. I could have just as easily said to be the best, you have to be able to adjust to anything. However, I try to operate with a tad more mindfulness than that.

I would like to invite you to my alliance so you can experience first hand what we experience. We are gold one, tier 4-5 and the nodes get ridiculous against stronger teams. Hit me up in game if you really want to know the facts.

Gold 1 isn't that difficult. I'm in Gold 1/plat 3 ally. Tier 3 wars are significantly harder war.

Gold 1 is a bracket, so it is difficult to say anything about the difficulty in that bracket. I believe everything from really great tier 8 alliances to tier 3 alliances having a really bad week could find themselves in there, and the difficulty increases start to become non-linear above tier 9. Just the jump from tier 7 to tier 6 seems to be a dramatic jump upward to me.

Sorry, tier 4 to tier 3 to clarify what I meant.

Brainimpacter

Kabam Miike wrote: »

Hey All,

I want to drop in and let you all know that you've given us A LOT of feedback, and we've made sure that the team is aware of your ideas and concerns. You've given us a lot to think about when we're choosing Rotating Buffs in the future, and even on how we're going to monitor the performance of the Buffs we're implementing this time.

Like we said in our Blog Post, this is a stepping stone for us to move towards allowing Alliances the agency to choose a Global Buff that they feel best suits their Defense teams. It's both a testing ground and a preview. This isn't something that we're going to be able to implement overnight, or even by the end of the year, but it's something we're actively working on.

Something that we've seen come up a few times is regarding the availability of Rank Up materials. We've been increasing the availability of rank up materials, like Tier 2 Alphas and T4CCs in modes like Alliance Quests, and even in Seasons rewards. We're not going to stop there, and are always moving forward in increasing rewards and access to resources across The Contest.

When we said the intention of introducing Rotating Global Buffs was not to find a way to increase difficulty, we truly meant that . The goal is to ensure there is more variety in Alliance Wars, and that we can continually keep the mode fluid, and ever changing.

We understand that this concept is a little scary, and we are going to monitor this change very closely, and use the data that we collect to continue to improve upon this moving forward, helping to make Alliance Wars a more engaging and lively mode. We also want to assure you that we will provide previews of large scale changes like this moving forward.

The people in expert tiers can deal with it easy, the people in challenger not so much, they cant just bust out a good enough high ranked 5* team every 6 weeks to deal with the latest global nodes

DNA3000

Red_barron wrote: »

So forget what’s been said and let’s look at the direction this is going, after this season coming bleed champs will be back in and maybe heavy hitters or power control champs are penalized, so we will be back to the same issue but even worse as we’ve spent remorse’s on female champs, to keep moving the goal posts at such short intervals will never give us time to rank up the champs we need so the only way will be use what we have and if your unlucky to have a nerfed champ that series then you will have to use items and pay to play.

The idea is not to move the goal posts. The idea is to eliminate the goal posts. The notion that there is a goal line is the canonical symptom of the problem.

Werewrym

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

When we said the intention of introducing Rotating Global Buffs was not to find a way to increase difficulty, we truly meant that . The goal is to ensure there is more variety in Alliance Wars, and that we can continually keep the mode fluid, and ever changing.

Can you please explain to me how, exactly, adding global nodes does not make AW more difficult? Thanks.

This... ^^^

MattMan

Kabam Miike wrote: »

Hey All,

I want to drop in and let you all know that you've given us A LOT of feedback, and we've made sure that the team is aware of your ideas and concerns. You've given us a lot to think about when we're choosing Rotating Buffs in the future, and even on how we're going to monitor the performance of the Buffs we're implementing this time.

Like we said in our Blog Post, this is a stepping stone for us to move towards allowing Alliances the agency to choose a Global Buff that they feel best suits their Defense teams. It's both a testing ground and a preview. This isn't something that we're going to be able to implement overnight, or even by the end of the year, but it's something we're actively working on.

Something that we've seen come up a few times is regarding the availability of Rank Up materials. We've been increasing the availability of rank up materials, like Tier 2 Alphas and T4CCs in modes like Alliance Quests, and even in Seasons rewards. We're not going to stop there, and are always moving forward in increasing rewards and access to resources across The Contest.

When we said the intention of introducing Rotating Global Buffs was not to find a way to increase difficulty, we truly meant that . The goal is to ensure there is more variety in Alliance Wars, and that we can continually keep the mode fluid, and ever changing.

We understand that this concept is a little scary, and we are going to monitor this change very closely, and use the data that we collect to continue to improve upon this moving forward, helping to make Alliance Wars a more engaging and lively mode. We also want to assure you that we will provide previews of large scale changes like this moving forward.

Summary:

Your opinions are being ignored. Adapt you scrubs.

Zuko_ILC

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

The response is mainly due to people having limited ranked up champs. If they ranked bleeders because those were only the good champs they've pulled they are now not that useful in the upcoming season. Unlike you some people spend a lot of money on this game. When you do and they make a change that hampers what you paid for its just bad for customers. They aren't getting what they paid for. Of course people will survive but if you spent $1000 to get blade persay and his abilities were reduced after outrage is an acceptable reaction. Free2play players can't argue about anything because they don't financially support the game. Without spenders theres no game.

Kpatrix

I would like to see more enhancements available for attack, as well as a choice of gobal nodes we could place on random paths for defense. Give us strategy on both sides of war.

Also, putting the global node in a place where it can be dropped by taking out a buffed up node or left in place with a penalty for dropping the node that is 80-160 points more than leaving it, maybe even 240 points+ the node points for dropping it.

unknown

This content has been removed.

DNA3000

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

Kabam Miike wrote: »

When we said the intention of introducing Rotating Global Buffs was not to find a way to increase difficulty, we truly meant that . The goal is to ensure there is more variety in Alliance Wars, and that we can continually keep the mode fluid, and ever changing.

Can you please explain to me how, exactly, adding global nodes does not make AW more difficult? Thanks.

Since they are both buffing defenders and buffing attackers, it is at least *theoretically* possible that the net result is roughly the same difficulty but with different champs at different strengths.

I'm skeptical that's how it will actually turn out, partially because the context of the change makes this unlikely, but also because every single time Kabam has said a non-trivial game change would be difficulty-neutral they've been spectacularly wrong. My money would be on "somewhat more difficult on some nodes, but probably not dramatically more difficult on most nodes."

GroundedWisdom

Zuko_ILC wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

RagamugginGunner wrote: »

GroundedWisdom wrote: »

People keep calling it a nerf, but that's not at all what it is. It's a rotating Node. Nothing is changing about the Champs themselves. As for buffs, they've done a few and no doubt there's room for more. However, I think the list that people consider useless/less effective is much higher than can reasonably be reworked. There's a tendency to discard anything not God Tier. Buffs have to be calculated and done carefully, and within balance of other progress. It's not a matter of just sweeping all the old Champs.

When the game only allows you to max out 3-5 total champs after playing for 3+ years then the players HAVE to discard non god tier champs. It's a self inflicted problem, that they have total control over.

Kabam, and many of their blind supporters on this forum, don't seem to understand that in a game like this any change, even a small one, has a huge impact on everyone. Of course people who are in tiers that won't change can speculate on how those changes will impact players, but they won't actually know.

Yes, the impact is you can't rely in Bleed for a Season. Given your example, if all 3-5 rely on Bleed, that's more of a tactical issue than Resources. Personally, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket, but that's how I Rank.
In any case, there are many other options besides Bleed. No doubt 6*s have been acquired as well. I doubt they're all Bleed. Nor do you need to use a Max Champ. Point is, there are choices.
The whole reaction is as if this is some type of permanent change. It's the first rotation. It's going to swap out. That's what I'm saying. The response is as if they've irreparably damaged Champs. It's a Node. One that won't stay indefinitely, and doesn't change the Champs at all. Still just as useful.
For the record, there are quite a few other Debuffs. I don't care what Tier I'm in. I wouldn't rely on one alone. There's Incinerate, Shock, Armor Break, Degen, etc. That brings me back to my original point. People will survive. They'll just have to do something different. That's the real argument in my opinion. The same tactic can't be used indefinitely if the game mode wants to be challenging.

The response is mainly due to people having limited ranked up champs. If they ranked bleeders because those were only the good champs they've pulled they are now not that useful in the upcoming season. Unlike you some people spend a lot of money on this game. When you do and they make a change that hampers what you paid for its just bad for customers. They aren't getting what they paid for. Of course people will survive but if you spent $1000 to get blade persay and his abilities were reduced after outrage is an acceptable reaction. Free2play players can't argue about anything because they don't financially support the game. Without spenders theres no game.

I'm not a F2P, but that's besides the point.
I understand the concerns about Resources, and I get why people are upset. What I'm saying is no such thing as a Rank-Up in this game that will go unchallenged. There are counters to everything. It's been that way as long as I can remember. Eventually, something comes along that stops Blade, and something will stop that, and so on. His Abilities aren't reduced. He still does what he did before. There's just a Node being used that can counter his Bleed. Once the Node shifts rotation, he will still be the same. He will be the same with it in place. That was my point about calling it a nerf.
There's no guarantee that any Champ will go unchallenged. 12.0 is often referenced, but that's one of the things that we could have taken away from that. The moment we have a Champ that trumps everything, the game is in trouble from a future standpoint.
As for all people have, I'm quite aware of the God Tier system. Some cases, people Rank the best they can. Other cases, it's all based on popular opinion. Anything suggested outside of that is seen as anarchy, which adds to the shock of what we see here. My point earlier on is I make an effort to have a range of Champs and Abilities Ranked as highly as possible. That's because there are many curveballs and challenges in the game. Bleed won't always work. Stun won't always work. Shock won't always work. Options are important to have. If I was going to settle on one Team indefinitely, I would leave myself unable to do anything outside of their use. That's very limiting in and of itself. There's really no such thing as indestructible in this game. Notwithstanding Luke Cage. Lol.
I get it. I'm not oblivious. I'm just also not cosigning the idea that there aren't options.

sbb75

@Kabam Miike Can you clarify an how a global node (Bleed Immune) is not intended increase difficulty?
Are other Nodes being lowered? Seems to me that one of the major ways to do damage is being turned off and to balance the difficulty part out is ... did I miss it?

The only thing I see with the difficulty going down is taking off suicides before placing defenders then redoing mastery again....
No need for people to start listing how Cable and kingpen will be easier to fight...

sbb75

The buff to Female attackers... SW and BE 4* only. Medusa, Domino, GP you took awake their Bleed... even for Elektra and Gamora. X23
Angela, CM, and KK she Hulk got a buff...

I honestly believe Female Attackers as a whole will be less effective in AW with their new buff

GroundedWisdom

Quake, Hela, Emma,...just off the top of my head.

Championcritic

sbb75 wrote: »

@Kabam Miike Can you clarify an how a global node (Bleed Immune) is not intended increase difficulty?
Are other Nodes being lowered? Seems to me that one of the major ways to do damage is being turned off and to balance the difficulty part out is ... did I miss it?

The only thing I see with the difficulty going down is taking off suicides before placing defenders then redoing mastery again....
No need for people to start listing how Cable and kingpen will be easier to fight...

In current alliance wars, bleed immune nodes already exist. If your alliance can deal with 1 bleed immune node easily by bringing in immunity champs like they usually would, what difference would it make that the bleed immune node becomes global

unknown

This content has been removed.

Midknight007

Kpatrix wrote: »

I totally agree, just wanted to show someone what it's like in higher tiers that will see the changes. I don't bring any bleed champs right now anyway, 1 t2a away from r4 corvus, x23, or gp. But a lot of my alliance mates have bleed champs as counters for their paths and they will be disadvantaged now affecting the rest of us.

It's just frustrating when a guy jumps in a fight he doesn't have a dog in. It's like a shrink telling you a bulging disc. Is because you're mom have you too much love as a kid.

This is my Corvus:

This is how far away I am from R5: