Degeneration

VedisukeVedisuke Member Posts: 166 ★★
in General Discussion
Good Morning.

Cable is not able to make Robot-like characters suffer Degeneration as described in their listing, but why do Robot characters suffer Degeneration in challenges posed by Kabam?

Is not it time to officially leave Robot-type immune to Degeneration?

Thank you

Comments

  • Eb0ny-O-M4wEb0ny-O-M4w Member Posts: 14,032 ★★★★★
    Cable degen works differently, just that. His degen isn't supposed to affect robot character's.

    Make robot champions immune to all type of degeneration would unbalance the game, and create a scenario where some nodes like no retreat, life transfer, starburst, degenration and etc would become useless.
  • Eb0ny-O-M4wEb0ny-O-M4w Member Posts: 14,032 ★★★★★
    AndiYTDE said:

    will-o-wisp said:

    Cable degen works differently, just that. His degen isn't supposed to affect robot character's.

    Make robot champions immune to all type of degeneration would unbalance the game, and create a scenario where some nodes like no retreat, life transfer, starburst, degenration and etc would become useless.

    That´s not really a reason. Following your statement there should be no bleed immune champions as well.
    Degeneration is the only damage dealing debuff no champion is immune against. There should be some champions that can deal with that...
    In the case of a debuff, any champion that can shrug it off or interact with debuffs on him would work.
    In the case it is a passive degeneration (or the other type that is neither a debuff or a passive), then it is meant for no champion to be immune to it.
    It requires the player to play differently in order to avoid a disadvantage and sometimes get some advantage on the fight. That's the intention of it
  • Thanos_CarThanos_Car Member Posts: 298 ★
    AndiYTDE said:

    will-o-wisp said:

    Cable degen works differently, just that. His degen isn't supposed to affect robot character's.

    Make robot champions immune to all type of degeneration would unbalance the game, and create a scenario where some nodes like no retreat, life transfer, starburst, degenration and etc would become useless.

    That´s not really a reason. Following your statement there should be no bleed immune champions as well.
    Degeneration is the only damage dealing debuff no champion is immune against. There should be some champions that can deal with that...
    Heard of gulk?

  • loader187loader187 Member Posts: 222 ★★
    AndiYTDE said:

    will-o-wisp said:

    Cable degen works differently, just that. His degen isn't supposed to affect robot character's.

    Make robot champions immune to all type of degeneration would unbalance the game, and create a scenario where some nodes like no retreat, life transfer, starburst, degenration and etc would become useless.

    That´s not really a reason. Following your statement there should be no bleed immune champions as well.
    Degeneration is the only damage dealing debuff no champion is immune against. There should be some champions that can deal with that...
    What about critical failure? What about Quake? When its on you can't do anything about it.
  • CassyCassy Member Posts: 1,078 ★★★
    Thanos_Car said:

    AndiYTDE said:

    will-o-wisp said:

    Cable degen works differently, just that. His degen isn't supposed to affect robot character's.

    Make robot champions immune to all type of degeneration would unbalance the game, and create a scenario where some nodes like no retreat, life transfer, starburst, degenration and etc would become useless.

    That´s not really a reason. Following your statement there should be no bleed immune champions as well.
    Degeneration is the only damage dealing debuff no champion is immune against. There should be some champions that can deal with that...
    Heard of gulk?

    Does not work with Degeneration passive nodes. And not for degen debuffs as Well...
  • Colonaut123Colonaut123 Member Posts: 3,091 ★★★★★
    Cable cannot degen robots because robots don't bleed, so they can't be affected by the virus. This is also for other bleed immune champs like Iceman.

    Regarding the question if there should be such thing as degen immunity, my answer is simple: yes. Any damaging debuff should have an immunity and degen is no exception. This wouldn't be any more gamebreaking than bleed or poison immunity.

    But then the question is: who would be degen immune? I wondered the same thing, but I've difficulty understanding how to translate the mechanic of degeneration into reality.

    In case of Cable, degen can be explained by some kind of disease. Then robots, lacking any organic tissue that can be affected by viruses, should be degen immune. However, Cable's degen is techno-organic (so its virus is both an organic virus and a computer virus) so it would affect both organic and artificial sentient beings, but not non-physical beings like Dormammu.

    In case of Dormammu and Mordo, degen would be some kind of magic spell. Any master of the mystical arts would be either immune or can cast a counterspell to purify it. Certain beings of pure magical energy, like Dormammu, Mephisto, Ghost Rider or Morningstar, would be immune as well.

    A third case can be made, degen could be simply be rapid ageing. Any being who is immortal like Thanos, Dormammu, Mephisto, Ghost Rider or Morningstar could be degen immune. However, robots would to as robots are inorganic and do not age.

    Metal wouldn't technically degen, as @Sungj stated, as most metals form passivating oxides that prevent further degradation. Iron is an exception, but it can easily be made oxidation resistant through either coating with a passivating metal (galvanisation, chroming) or adding oxidation-resistant metals to the steel alloy (stainless steel). Robots are definitely made out of durable materials. In the case of Vision and Ultron, it is even vibranium, the most durable metal in the Marvel universe.

    I think the only reason why Kabam never made clear what degen exactly is, is to make sure no one is immune to it so no one can avoid its damage. It is a cheap trick to milk players.
  • Eb0ny-O-M4wEb0ny-O-M4w Member Posts: 14,032 ★★★★★
    There should be no champuon completely immune to degeneration.

    Having said that, I don't mind seing a champion be immune to degeneration debuffs. Meaning it will be immune to the degeneration applied by Mordo, Cable, and nodes such as Chaos. But it wouldn't be immune to passive degeneration, like Dormammu's and all these nodes on act 5 and act 6.
  • SlyCat42SlyCat42 Member Posts: 504 ★★
    Well, this has kind of been explained, but for once it's not game play balance related.

    Cable has a techno organic virus that turns things into machines which is why he has a metal arm and robo eye. He keeps it under control with his psionic powers. He's actually the son of Jean Grey and Cyclops and there are alternate versions of him such as Nate Grey (who I hope they will some day add to the game) from age of apocalypse.

    Anywho, it doesn't effect robots because they are already technological. The virus turns things into machines, and they are already machines. Wouldn't make much sense if they turned even MORE robotic like.

    I don't remember how it worked in the comics. Pretty sure the virus came from the Phalanx which were a group of hive mind robotic beings from space, or there was also a different virus created by Mr. Sinister and then given to Apocalypse.

    So, there's your answer.
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