Annihilus released vs datamined abilities

He would have been way more desireable and useful with the datamined abilities.

As of now he seems mediocre with few uses

Question:

Why not release original version?
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Comments

  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 196

    This is why it's best not to build expectations based on data mined (stolen) info. The final product can differ, because it's not finished, and the last word rests with Kabam.

    Sure, but I asked a question. I can have expectations since I’m the customer.

  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★
    Maybe so, but the customer was not supposed to see the unreleased product, so....about those expectations.....
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 196

    Maybe so, but the customer was not supposed to see the unreleased product, so....about those expectations.....

    I didn’t know Kabam had so many attorneys

    Kabam, you don’t have to answer of course, but it’s my two cents on the matter.

    Thanks for the champ, he’ll be used in quite many situations!
  • Dexman1349Dexman1349 Posts: 3,060 ★★★★★
    This is no different than the spy-shots of new model cars during their real-world testing prior to release.

    People manipulate as many different photos that they can to get an idea of what the final product will be, and in the process develop a certain level of expectations. It's hard not to inflate these expectations, especially if it's a model you're interested in. Then the car is finalized behind closed doors and is ultimately released. Because you spent the time inflating your expectations in your head, you will almost never be satisfied.

    "That's not what the spy-shots showed, that new design looks horrible." Well, sorry. The testing and finalization changed it a bit. This is the final product, take it or leave it.
  • JRock808JRock808 Posts: 1,149 ★★★★
    Data mined is not stolen...

    It's on your device, you can access it. It's just some json.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 196
    edited April 7
    I actually am obliterating champs like IMIW and Medusa with him

    He good

    I just wanted to know why

    Thanks everyone
  • JRock808JRock808 Posts: 1,149 ★★★★
    edited April 7
    Data mining games on your device is not illegal in any way.

    Congrats on your champ, op. He's decent and a good counter to certain champs for sure, even if he isn't as OP as before release.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 196
    JRock808 said:

    Data mining games on your device is not illegal in any way.

    Laws made for data mining focus on PII to protect people from stealing social security #s etc

    Info on a game not so much

    Again, sorry people can’t focus on the champion and more on other things that can only negatively impact us.

    Thanks, JRock, you’re right.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★
    JRock808 said:

    Data mining games on your device is not illegal in any way.

    Congrats on your champ, op. He's decent and a good counter to certain champs for sure, even if he isn't as OP as before release.

    We do not have the rights to that data. We do not own it. It is not ours to do with as we wish. We use their product under the TOS Agreement, and releasing that information before the company decides to is most definitely illegal. You seem to be under the misconception that because it's on our device, it's ours to do with as we want. You would be wrong.
  • JRock808JRock808 Posts: 1,149 ★★★★
    Never said you can do anything you want with it. Obviously you cannot use it in any way that profits you or infringes on copyright in some way, but accessing it is completely legal. That's all I am going to feed you. You can go google the facts for yourself, but I don't think you care to learn, just argue.

    Apologies to the OP for the completely pointless and baseless derail.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 196
    JRock808 said:

    Never said you can do anything you want with it. Obviously you cannot use it in any way that profits you or infringes on copyright in some way, but accessing it is completely legal. That's all I am going to feed you. You can go google the facts for yourself, but I don't think you care to learn, just argue.

    Apologies to the OP for the completely pointless and baseless derail.

    You’re good bro. I regret starting the thread the way I did. I just wanted to see what reasoning they use.

    He’s a good champ. I like him. So many uses
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★
    It's not a baseless argument. It absolutely pertains to the subject.
    If people are stealing the information and releasing it before it's set to be put out there, it's not ready. Which means the final product will differ because the final say is at Kabam's discretion. It's arguing that the final release isn't the same as the unfinished process. Only people weren't supposed to see the unfinished product because it wasn't ready.
    If you would like to argue whether it's right or not, that's up to you. There was a point to what I was saying, and I'm afraid you were the one that branched off.
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 6,437 ★★★★★
    edited April 7

    This is why it's best not to build expectations based on data mined (stolen) info. The final product can differ, because it's not finished, and the last word rests with Kabam.

    Sure, but I asked a question. I can have expectations since I’m the customer.

    You may be a "customer" but datamined info isn't fact. Imagine if I told you I heard Apple was giving away free iphones and you were guaranteed to get one if you show up. You show up and Apple says nope, that isnt happening.

    That is what data mined info is, relying on a supposed truth. Its not concrete until the actual info is released. The dataminer doesnt work for Kabam in anyway so why would you expect Kabam to even answer in the first place?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★

    This is why it's best not to build expectations based on data mined (stolen) info. The final product can differ, because it's not finished, and the last word rests with Kabam.

    Sure, but I asked a question. I can have expectations since I’m the customer.

    You may be a "customer" but datamined info isn't fact. Imagine if I told you I heard Apple was giving away free iphones and you were guaranteed to get one if you show up. You show up and Apple says nope, that isnt happening.

    That is what data mined info is, relying on a supposed truth. Its not concrete until the actual info is released.
    It's like someone breaking into my Bakery and arguing that the Batter looks different from the Cookies I baked. Lol.
  • DiablosUltimateDiablosUltimate Posts: 1,021 ★★★
    Stealing, breaking into bakery, I'm just waiting till you compare it to genocide
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★

    Stealing, breaking into bakery, I'm just waiting till you compare it to genocide

    Stealing is accurate. Breaking in is accurate as well. There's a reason it's not visible by normal means. Genocide, that's a bit extreme.
  • JRock808JRock808 Posts: 1,149 ★★★★
    Hey guys, I'm stealing right now! I opened a browser and accessed the file that stores my bookmarks and came to the forum! I totally didn't know it was against the law to view information on my device!

    I also ran a malware scan and it looked in every file I have. Should I contact all the companies who made the software I use and tell them the scanner stole their info?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★
    Not at all the same thing. You can feel free to justify it however you want, but data mining is not that vanilla.
  • DiablosUltimateDiablosUltimate Posts: 1,021 ★★★
    They put that that in not encrypted file on public client release, if we go by wild metaphores I would rather compare it to placing letter in someones pocket and then crying that someone took it out and read it, then told others what it was saying, even though we didn't want him to. It's also not mentioned in TOS and no law forbids it, thus it's not illegal
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★
    It is illegal to release protected information, sorry.
    As for that letter analogy, that's a little too bipartisan to be accurate. They did not give people permission to access that. It would be more like picking a lock.
  • TheSpicyKnightTheSpicyKnight Posts: 1,063 ★★★
    I had no idea that we had so many lawyers in these forums
  • JRock808JRock808 Posts: 1,149 ★★★★

    I had no idea that we had so many lawyers in these forums

    We have none, and it shows.
  • DiablosUltimateDiablosUltimate Posts: 1,021 ★★★
    edited April 7
    Calling json file protected information is like calling cyclops effective, simply false. I even doubt Kabam really didn't want this information leaked or do they care about it like you imply, considering zero security meassures applied to that data
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 20,516 ★★★★★
    The information belongs to the company, and is intended to be released in the form they release it. Feel free to give it whatever spin you want, but that form doesn't include people combing it to see things they aren't meant to see, much less put it out there on a scale that has people depending on that as some Official source.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 196
    edited April 7
    It’s also my right to ask whatever question I want

    If Kabam doesn’t want to answer it, it’s their right

    Telling me something, especially without having qualifications, direct authority from Kabam and/or citing specific internet privacy laws just sparks useless debate of which neither side will agree or concede.

    Can we talk about the champion and his abilities? Is that too much to ask, or am I breaking another internet law?
  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 6,437 ★★★★★
    Im not arguing legality. I'm arguing that OP's expectations for Kabam to respond to datamined info is extreme. Datamined info hasn't ever been perfect since hes been doing it. Hes been spot on with champs but not really accurate on abilities to be able to call the information safe.

    If it really was illegal, i think Otruix would've been stopped by real lawyers and what not.
  • Fred_JoeityFred_Joeity Posts: 900 ★★★
    According to Google, data mining is legal in the US as long as it isn’t for commercial purposes. It’s a bit sketchier in Canada I believe. Copyright laws are always iffy, but considering Kabam hasn’t pressed charges, they’re probably fine with it.

    Anyways to the OP Kabam may have just changed their plan. Maybe the original version was too gamebrwaking or something and they went too heavy on the nerf. I’m honestly fine with not every new champ being the new best champion.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 196

    Im not arguing legality. I'm arguing that OP's expectations for Kabam to respond to datamined info is extreme. Datamined info hasn't ever been perfect since hes been doing it. Hes been spot on with champs but not really accurate on abilities to be able to call the information safe.

    If it really was illegal, i think Otruix would've been stopped by real lawyers and what not.

    I asked. I think if you are a paying customer, of which people have spent varying amounts, and there is information out there then I can ask anything I want within reason.

    Being that the information is posted everywhere on the internet, me asking a question based on established information is not unreasonable.

    If anything, subsequent posts citing legality of the information is ridiculous.

    Furthermore, I expect that this thread will, and should be closed for failure of us, the people who are supposedly keeping that company in business, to talk about the companies products and instead focus on trying to morally educate each other on what we can and can’t ask on an Internet forum page.
This discussion has been closed.