I love the people here, those that defend kabam and those that call it out. You have some that swear up and down he hasn't changed and others going by whats writen. I think the reality is people are now out there calling BS on Kabam and testing all these mechanics. Addressing things that were supposed to work one way but never did by just changing the text to match how it works now, because more and more people are trying to keep them dare I say honest. So far in the last 6 months, we've seen text updates to a number of champs, masteries and items that the gates have been open. Whenever someone finds fault or something not working we can now be assured the company won't actually have to work on fixing it, much easier just to edit the facts. If there was no change to any actually game mechanics then why not just leave it go?
I love the people here, those that defend kabam and those that call it out. You have some that swear up and down he hasn't changed and others going by whats writen. I think the reality is people are now out there calling BS on Kabam and testing all these mechanics. Addressing things that were supposed to work one way but never did by just changing the text to match how it works now, because more and more people are trying to keep them dare I say honest. So far in the last 6 months, we've seen text updates to a number of champs, masteries and items that the gates have been open. Whenever someone finds fault or something not working we can now be assured the company won't actually have to work on fixing it, much easier just to edit the facts. If there was no change to any actually game mechanics then why not just leave it go?
except this isn't always the case. A prime example is quake. She was hot garbage before they fixed her to actually do what her description said, twice. Now she is one of the best champs in the game. Another less important one is KG. They added the fury damage to his poison like it should have been.
I don't always defend kabam. I am critical when they deserve it (pure skill anyone?), I just choose to believe they have relatively good intentions when it comes to their player base. It would make zero logical sense to constantly silent nerf champs just for the hell of it. All that would do is anger the player base and make people quit. Therefore I don't jump to that conclusion like some people do. I would rather see evidence before making baseless accusations.
I just R5’d my 5* GR 2 weeks ago. This isn’t what I want to hear right now. He’s very valuable on AQ because of his regeneration (life steal), taking a second away from that is actually a really big deal.
I just R5’d my 5* GR 2 weeks ago. This isn’t what I want to hear right now. He’s very valuable on AQ because of his regeneration (life steal), taking a second away from that is actually a really big deal.
Did you read the comments? He’s not being changed.
We always try our best to ensure that the information that we share with you is as accurate as humanly possible. But, we are human, and humans make mistakes. There is so much new content coming out constantly that it's not always possible for us to go back and catch mistakes in older content.
Ghost Rider was released just about 2.5 years ago, and in that time, this was never brought up, and wasn't noticed in any tests. We try to avoid these situations, but they happen. Right now, we're doing some pretty big sweeps on descriptions, so we've been catching some of them again.
Ghost Rider hasn't changed, and although I understand the frustration, when we discover a mistake, we have to fix it. Ideally, we would make it work as described, but for the sake of game balance, we cannot always do that.
@Kabam Zibiit Thank you for the clarification, that does make perfect sense. But you must understand this from a summoners perspective also, I completely understand that mistakes can be made, but 4 mistakes on the same champion, that haven't been rectified for 2 and a half years, is pretty big, especially for such a well used champion such as Ghost Rider. Those are some pretty big changes to the description of his abilities, not that I think it would put anyone off ranking him, but that is the ONLY information that us as summoners have to go off when we're making our rank up decisions. I honestly can't be bothered to work out the duration differences between the other text changes, but a difference of 4.5 seconds worth of regen is pretty significant, I'm sure you'll agree, that's roughly a 16.5% difference in duration.
I'm not one to cry for compensation (although I'm sure some will lol), I'm more than happy to work for my rewards, but can I make a suggestion? Well, I'm going to make it anyways so tough 😂
If you're going to be overhauling the text on multiple champions, especially for such significant changes, that you inform the community, not by the forum (which the vast majority of summoners never look at), but instead put out some in game mail notifying everybody of the changes, apologise for the mistakes, and do them all at once, or as much as humanly possible. I'm no expert in coding, but I'm assuming if youre not changing the mechanics of the champion and only changing the text it wouldn't be that difficult to rectify the description of multiple champions at the same time.
And it wouldn't hurt to offer a little something by way of apology for the mistakes, but again, I'm not personally bothered about compensation, especially if his actual mechanics haven't changed. I just think it'd be a nice gesture on behalf of Kabam to the community, considering they have been working on false information for the past 2 and a half years (apologies about the 4 years comment I've played for close to 3 years and he was one of my first champs so assumed he had been around forever lol).
But thanks for clarifying the situation.
I’m not sure about the compensation part but I agree with this. An in game mail should be sent out and an apology should be made. As long as the actual mechanics aren’t changing I don’t think compensation is needed but an explanation of a mass text changing to reflect accurate abilities would be a good gesture. If this isn’t communicated I can already see people clamoring about nerfs everywhere. It’s more of a pre damage control for Kabam to contain the issue so nerf posts don’t pile up in seconds.
Exactly, as I stated, I'm not personally bothered about compensation, it's more about the damage control.
Stop people crying before they start, it would be easy to just be like "sorry guys, we're holding our hands up, a number of issues within the text descriptions have come to light, we're going to be rectifying all the text over the next month so don't be alarmed, champion mechanics won't change but the text descriptions will. In light of our mistakes, we apologise and here's some free t4b frags"
I'm not saying they should give compensation, I'm just saying a small token of appreciation to the community for putting up with their mistakes would go a long way to appeasing the majority of the community that cry for rank down tickets as soon as the slightest thing goes wrong.
I run a business repairing electronics, and at times in the past I've had to give away free repairs even though I know they've damaged the part, just to keep the peace. It's just what you have to do in business sometimes.
@Shrimkins the other side of this though is that summoners have been given false information on 4 or 6 of Ghost Riders abilities for the past 2 and a half years, as summoners that's all we have to go on when we make our rank up decisions, and I'm not saying in this case that it would of changed anyones decisions to rank him, but it could of, and if there are other instances of this with other champions, it could of made people choose different rank up choices, but obviously we can't know that until other description issues come to light. But we need accurate information, and I don't think a quick mention that most would overlook in the patch notes is good enough. Most don't even look on the forum.
as summoners that's all we have to go on when we make our rank up decisions
You're playing a game. You can try things out and upgrade based on which champ feels better while fighting. The description is only really good for telling you how a champ works and what you should do while fighting to make the champ as effective as possible
@Shrimkins the other side of this though is that summoners have been given false information on 4 or 6 of Ghost Riders abilities for the past 2 and a half years, as summoners that's all we have to go on when we make our rank up decisions,
Except that's not all you have to go on. People typically use champs before ranking them up. They read reviews, ask friends, watch videos, practice with them in RoL, ect. The actual effectiveness of that champ along with the rest of the peer information out there is all information we use to rank up champs.
I'm not saying in this case that it would of changed anyones decisions to rank him, but it could of, and if there are other instances of this with other champions, it could of made people choose different rank up choices, but obviously we can't know that until other description issues come to light. But we need accurate information, and I don't think a quick mention that most would overlook in the patch notes is good enough. Most don't even look on the forum.
I agree we need as accurate information as possible. I wish mistakes were never made and the world was perfect. The bottom line is, GR did not change. No silent nerf, no loud nerf. no nerf. There was little need to make a big deal about a small text update when the actual function of the champ did not change.
We always try our best to ensure that the information that we share with you is as accurate as humanly possible. But, we are human, and humans make mistakes. There is so much new content coming out constantly that it's not always possible for us to go back and catch mistakes in older content.
Ghost Rider was released just about 2.5 years ago, and in that time, this was never brought up, and wasn't noticed in any tests. We try to avoid these situations, but they happen. Right now, we're doing some pretty big sweeps on descriptions, so we've been catching some of them again.
Ghost Rider hasn't changed, and although I understand the frustration, when we discover a mistake, we have to fix it. Ideally, we would make it work as described, but for the sake of game balance, we cannot always do that.
@Kabam Zibiit Thank you for the clarification, that does make perfect sense. But you must understand this from a summoners perspective also, I completely understand that mistakes can be made, but 4 mistakes on the same champion, that haven't been rectified for 2 and a half years, is pretty big, especially for such a well used champion such as Ghost Rider. Those are some pretty big changes to the description of his abilities, not that I think it would put anyone off ranking him, but that is the ONLY information that us as summoners have to go off when we're making our rank up decisions. I honestly can't be bothered to work out the duration differences between the other text changes, but a difference of 4.5 seconds worth of regen is pretty significant, I'm sure you'll agree, that's roughly a 16.5% difference in duration.
I'm not one to cry for compensation (although I'm sure some will lol), I'm more than happy to work for my rewards, but can I make a suggestion? Well, I'm going to make it anyways so tough 😂
If you're going to be overhauling the text on multiple champions, especially for such significant changes, that you inform the community, not by the forum (which the vast majority of summoners never look at), but instead put out some in game mail notifying everybody of the changes, apologise for the mistakes, and do them all at once, or as much as humanly possible. I'm no expert in coding, but I'm assuming if youre not changing the mechanics of the champion and only changing the text it wouldn't be that difficult to rectify the description of multiple champions at the same time.
And it wouldn't hurt to offer a little something by way of apology for the mistakes, but again, I'm not personally bothered about compensation, especially if his actual mechanics haven't changed. I just think it'd be a nice gesture on behalf of Kabam to the community, considering they have been working on false information for the past 2 and a half years (apologies about the 4 years comment I've played for close to 3 years and he was one of my first champs so assumed he had been around forever lol).
But thanks for clarifying the situation.
I’m not sure about the compensation part but I agree with this. An in game mail should be sent out and an apology should be made. As long as the actual mechanics aren’t changing I don’t think compensation is needed but an explanation of a mass text changing to reflect accurate abilities would be a good gesture. If this isn’t communicated I can already see people clamoring about nerfs everywhere. It’s more of a pre damage control for Kabam to contain the issue so nerf posts don’t pile up in seconds.
Exactly, as I stated, I'm not personally bothered about compensation, it's more about the damage control.
Stop people crying before they start, it would be easy to just be like "sorry guys, we're holding our hands up, a number of issues within the text descriptions have come to light, we're going to be rectifying all the text over the next month so don't be alarmed, champion mechanics won't change but the text descriptions will. In light of our mistakes, we apologise and here's some free t4b frags"
I'm not saying they should give compensation, I'm just saying a small token of appreciation to the community for putting up with their mistakes would go a long way to appeasing the majority of the community that cry for rank down tickets as soon as the slightest thing goes wrong.
I run a business repairing electronics, and at times in the past I've had to give away free repairs even though I know they've damaged the part, just to keep the peace. It's just what you have to do in business sometimes.
What you’re describing is accountability and customer service. Not usually found here. Kabam usually take a “here’s what we’re doing, too bad” stance on everything. There doesn’t seem to be any sense of what customer service is.
Kabam needs to really hire a community relations manager to address this stuff. Someone who can not only communicate with the community effectively (current forum mods are all we have and are not sufficient) as well as someone who can go back to the “team” and DIRECT them on what is not acceptable and actually affect change.
That's right, the GR was nerfed, arguably. He was my first 4 * champion that was for R5 and is still the one that evolves the most so far, every day that passes I feel more willing to abandon this game, they do it so that the new champions have this gap against the older ones, Disappointing.
Come on guys, you're not seriously suggesting the the Champion Spotlight is irrelevant...
When a champion is first released they are extremely hard to get, either you have to spend money or hard earned units on RNG reliant Crystals to get them, or you have to grind arena. Now obviously for those who have picked up the game in the last 2 years, yes there's plenty of footage out there of ghost rider for them to see. But when it's a new champion, if that description in the Champion Spotlight isn't correct, people are either grinding arena like crazy, or spending cold hard cash under false pretences.
As I said earlier, I could accept a mistake on one, or maybe even 2 of his abilities, but mistakes on 4 of 6? Thats 66% of his abilities with false information, that's not nothing, that's a serious issue. How do we know that these issues aren't happening to the champions being released in the present? How do we do we know if the info on Havok's, or Mr Sinisters abilities is correct? We could grind out 30-40-50 million points in arena to get one of them, and then find out that his description doesn't quite match his abilities, and then rather than see his abilities matched to the information we were given in the first place, they can just change the text to make him less good and then just be like "oops, our bad, but now you have to deal with it"
Maybe they should just omit specifics going forward. GR using a combo ending in a medium increases attack by some amount. Ending a combo with a light attack applies a bleed for some odd damage. L1 places a fate seal on the opponent for some amount of time.
And for those of you insinuating, I'm not just trying to stir the pot, I'm trying to highlight the bigger issue here.
As someone else said earlier, and I completely agree, I think this is a dangerous, slippery slope they've started down with changing the text to match performance rather than matching the performance to what we were promised.
Now, I understand that some things could be game breaking, like the Domino text change, if they'd of buffed her to match the description she would of been way too OP. But that just goes to show that whether it be 2 and a half years ago, a year ago, or a few months ago, these mistakes are still happening and people are spending their time, effort and money trying to get these champions under false pretences.
Especially for the statisticians who will sit and look at the abilities and do the math to figure out exactly how good they are before going for them in arena or in Crystals. And this has never been more relevant and important than it is today with the current complexity of the game. The wording has to be as close to perfect as humanly possible.
Slightly off topic but some of you may of heard of a TCG called Magic: The Gathering, for those who know it, you will know exactly the importance of the wording of abilities, one word mis-read/wrong can completely change the outcome of the ability, for example, the difference between 'while' and 'when', something as simple as that can give you a complete false interpretation of the ability. Obviously they are completely different games with different rules, but the concept is still the same.
Maybe they should just omit specifics going forward. GR using a combo ending in a medium increases attack by some amount. Ending a combo with a light attack applies a bleed for some odd damage. L1 places a fate seal on the opponent for some amount of time.
That's essentially what you get from data mined abilities, and is way too basic for the complexity of the game.
Like I say, there are plenty of statisticians out there that will sit and crunch the numbers. And I would assume, that's how these things get flagged.
Come on guys, you're not seriously suggesting the the Champion Spotlight is irrelevant...
When a champion is first released they are extremely hard to get, either you have to spend money or hard earned units on RNG reliant Crystals to get them, or you have to grind arena. Now obviously for those who have picked up the game in the last 2 years, yes there's plenty of footage out there of ghost rider for them to see. But when it's a new champion, if that description in the Champion Spotlight isn't correct, people are either grinding arena like crazy, or spending cold hard cash under false pretences.
As I said earlier, I could accept a mistake on one, or maybe even 2 of his abilities, but mistakes on 4 of 6? Thats 66% of his abilities with false information, that's not nothing, that's a serious issue. How do we know that these issues aren't happening to the champions being released in the present? How do we do we know if the info on Havok's, or Mr Sinisters abilities is correct? We could grind out 30-40-50 million points in arena to get one of them, and then find out that his description doesn't quite match his abilities, and then rather than see his abilities matched to the information we were given in the first place, they can just change the text to make him less good and then just be like "oops, our bad, but now you have to deal with it"
This seems to be their MO lately.
Personally I've stopped spending on featured crystals for new champs because I no longer trust that descriptions of be champs are accurate and I also know, firsthand, that when there is an error on their part, they just apologize while refusing to issue refunds. Given this scenario, I see zero reason to spend money pursuing new champs. I also find it ethically unacceptable for a company to behave in this manner.
Hey there everyone, apologies for the confusion here, but this was an intended change to the description of his Lifesteal that was meant to go out with the updates to the description of his Damnation, Fate Seal, and Bleed that also went out in this update. The duration of all of these abilities are still the same as they have been, but their descriptions now accurately display the base length of time these abilities last before they've had their duration increased for previous Judgements that have been placed. We will update the patch notes to note this change in description.
Again, we apologize for the confusion, and for leaving this out of the patch notes. There has been no change to the in game length of Ghost Rider's Lifesteal ability.
That's fair enough, but can I ask how its taken you 4 years to pick up on it? I'm quite willing to accept that his stats/timings haven't actually changed other than in the text as I haven't done the research to know either way yet (I'll still be doing some testing to confirm what you say is correct, no offence lol). But you have to admit, it seems a bit strange that after 4 years of nobody noticing that the text is wrong, and not just on one ability, but 4 of his 5 main abilities, and now all of a sudden you've decided to correct it? I'm not saying either way because I really don't know at the minute, but you have to admit it sounds fishy...
First off, he hasn't been around for 4 years. Secondly, if all they had to do was search for description errors, I'm sure it would have been much more expedient. However, since I'm sure they have quite a full schedule, I assume they fight fires as they come.
this can happen to any champ be warned, they can nerf his stats without changing text, then a year later nerf his text to reflect how he has been working the past year and nobody will ever know that an actual nerf went down
We appreciate everyone's feedback about this and will keep it in mind for the future. Since the question has already been answered and this discussion is no longer constructive, this will be closed.
Comments
except this isn't always the case. A prime example is quake. She was hot garbage before they fixed her to actually do what her description said, twice. Now she is one of the best champs in the game. Another less important one is KG. They added the fury damage to his poison like it should have been.
I don't always defend kabam. I am critical when they deserve it (pure skill anyone?), I just choose to believe they have relatively good intentions when it comes to their player base. It would make zero logical sense to constantly silent nerf champs just for the hell of it. All that would do is anger the player base and make people quit. Therefore I don't jump to that conclusion like some people do. I would rather see evidence before making baseless accusations.
Did you read the comments? He’s not being changed.
Exactly, as I stated, I'm not personally bothered about compensation, it's more about the damage control.
Stop people crying before they start, it would be easy to just be like "sorry guys, we're holding our hands up, a number of issues within the text descriptions have come to light, we're going to be rectifying all the text over the next month so don't be alarmed, champion mechanics won't change but the text descriptions will. In light of our mistakes, we apologise and here's some free t4b frags"
I'm not saying they should give compensation, I'm just saying a small token of appreciation to the community for putting up with their mistakes would go a long way to appeasing the majority of the community that cry for rank down tickets as soon as the slightest thing goes wrong.
I run a business repairing electronics, and at times in the past I've had to give away free repairs even though I know they've damaged the part, just to keep the peace. It's just what you have to do in business sometimes.
You're playing a game. You can try things out and upgrade based on which champ feels better while fighting. The description is only really good for telling you how a champ works and what you should do while fighting to make the champ as effective as possible
I agree we need as accurate information as possible. I wish mistakes were never made and the world was perfect. The bottom line is, GR did not change. No silent nerf, no loud nerf. no nerf. There was little need to make a big deal about a small text update when the actual function of the champ did not change.
What you’re describing is accountability and customer service. Not usually found here. Kabam usually take a “here’s what we’re doing, too bad” stance on everything. There doesn’t seem to be any sense of what customer service is.
Kabam needs to really hire a community relations manager to address this stuff. Someone who can not only communicate with the community effectively (current forum mods are all we have and are not sufficient) as well as someone who can go back to the “team” and DIRECT them on what is not acceptable and actually affect change.
When a champion is first released they are extremely hard to get, either you have to spend money or hard earned units on RNG reliant Crystals to get them, or you have to grind arena. Now obviously for those who have picked up the game in the last 2 years, yes there's plenty of footage out there of ghost rider for them to see. But when it's a new champion, if that description in the Champion Spotlight isn't correct, people are either grinding arena like crazy, or spending cold hard cash under false pretences.
As I said earlier, I could accept a mistake on one, or maybe even 2 of his abilities, but mistakes on 4 of 6? Thats 66% of his abilities with false information, that's not nothing, that's a serious issue. How do we know that these issues aren't happening to the champions being released in the present? How do we do we know if the info on Havok's, or Mr Sinisters abilities is correct? We could grind out 30-40-50 million points in arena to get one of them, and then find out that his description doesn't quite match his abilities, and then rather than see his abilities matched to the information we were given in the first place, they can just change the text to make him less good and then just be like "oops, our bad, but now you have to deal with it"
As someone else said earlier, and I completely agree, I think this is a dangerous, slippery slope they've started down with changing the text to match performance rather than matching the performance to what we were promised.
Now, I understand that some things could be game breaking, like the Domino text change, if they'd of buffed her to match the description she would of been way too OP. But that just goes to show that whether it be 2 and a half years ago, a year ago, or a few months ago, these mistakes are still happening and people are spending their time, effort and money trying to get these champions under false pretences.
Especially for the statisticians who will sit and look at the abilities and do the math to figure out exactly how good they are before going for them in arena or in Crystals. And this has never been more relevant and important than it is today with the current complexity of the game. The wording has to be as close to perfect as humanly possible.
Slightly off topic but some of you may of heard of a TCG called Magic: The Gathering, for those who know it, you will know exactly the importance of the wording of abilities, one word mis-read/wrong can completely change the outcome of the ability, for example, the difference between 'while' and 'when', something as simple as that can give you a complete false interpretation of the ability. Obviously they are completely different games with different rules, but the concept is still the same.
That's essentially what you get from data mined abilities, and is way too basic for the complexity of the game.
Like I say, there are plenty of statisticians out there that will sit and crunch the numbers. And I would assume, that's how these things get flagged.
This seems to be their MO lately.
Personally I've stopped spending on featured crystals for new champs because I no longer trust that descriptions of be champs are accurate and I also know, firsthand, that when there is an error on their part, they just apologize while refusing to issue refunds. Given this scenario, I see zero reason to spend money pursuing new champs. I also find it ethically unacceptable for a company to behave in this manner.
First off, he hasn't been around for 4 years. Secondly, if all they had to do was search for description errors, I'm sure it would have been much more expedient. However, since I'm sure they have quite a full schedule, I assume they fight fires as they come.