**Mastery Loadouts**
Due to issues related to the release of Mastery Loadouts, the "free swap" period will be extended.
The new end date will be May 1st.
Options

Players in the game

SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
I may be the only one to “observe” this but I feel like the progression points of players is imbalance: high end players can complete whatever content is out there, new players can easily catch up with intermediate to high end players, but those who are in the middle can’t really do much... you may have done most of the content but you can’t really pull the champs you’d like in order to efficiently 100% certain content because of RNG. I wish for a better way to obtain a certain champion.
«1

Comments

  • Options
    hiddenblizzardhiddenblizzard Posts: 506 ★★
    champions are not the way for progress for high end players at least... it's just you need to rank the counters for the roadblockers you get....and for that kabam has given AQ HIGHH!!!! rewards
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    Siliyo wrote: »
    I may be the only one to “observe” this but I feel like the progression points of players is imbalance: high end players can complete whatever content is out there, new players can easily catch up with intermediate to high end players, but those who are in the middle can’t really do much... you may have done most of the content but you can’t really pull the champs you’d like in order to efficiently 100% certain content because of RNG. I wish for a better way to obtain a certain champion.

    these are 2 largely unrelated complaints. as in:
    1) new players have more opportunity to progress vs original users simply because there's more content. 2015 there wasn't even an Act 4, and alliance wars weren't even a thing. now noobs create new accounts just to work the beginners arenas for easy champs.
    2) rng gives some folks champs that clear content easier than others, and for those who don't get those champs it hurts their feelings. this presupposes those "high end players" didn't use the rng of arenas (as in, 100%) to score the champions of their choosing, and thus those without the means or time for similar efforts are left poking at basic 5s every 5 weeks, cursing the ant-men and IPs they pull.

    it's a collecting game, so that won't change. the better argument is asking for content that doesn't penalize users for rng. specialized boosts like from the sym eq or trials of alchemist being offered for every eq (for a price) would be a fix that won't change demand for certain champs but would placate a good amount of the user base, i believe.

    That's actually a good idea and some very valid points you have made!
  • Options
    Putang76Putang76 Posts: 283 ★★
    I agree ☝️
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    Well, although most people on here seem to be highly offended by this, the most important thing in this game is skill.
    Neither spending tons of money, nor only pulling so called got tier champs will really get you forward.
    Based on that I don't really get your point.
    I am by no means an end game player. I have two 4/55's, recently pulled my first 6* and haven't even fully completed 5.3 (only explored 5.1 so far) and I did all content available this month, including 100% uc event and 100% captain marvel event.
    I'm 100% free to play by the way.

    Not trying to be rude here, so I apologize in advance, but most often "git gud" is a legitimate piece of advice.

    How well did you do in Cap Marvel? How many units/resources did you use? Who was your team?
  • Options
    Putang76Putang76 Posts: 283 ★★
    Lol
    It’s not about getting good
    But of course that is your best variable
    But so many other variables in this game
    Lag and what device your playing on
    It doesn't even matter if u have the best internet, it also depends on Kabams servers
    Hope they know that 😂✌️
    But this game is coming down to counters
    Ya you can be the best, but you ain’t using no meh champs to beat any uncollected bosses.

  • Options
    RapRap Posts: 3,194 ★★★★
    I get it his point. The game has been retooled to boost low end players fast. They are fast gaining on the mid tier in mastery and prestige, mean while the top it cracking 3 duped six stars at a cracking...so the top is rising fast...the middle is not getting all these wonderful aids and gifts...we are spinning in place again...
  • Options
    RapRap Posts: 3,194 ★★★★
    And it is kinda the rng...or at least the champ openings...the lower teir is duping 4s the top is duping sixes, in the middle we need fives duped to gain ground and ya just can't dupe a five...
  • Options
    RapRap Posts: 3,194 ★★★★
    Additionally, it sucks that 5 star crystals and six star crystals take the same number of shards when there is almost zero chance (for most) to dupe a five, and right now it is apparently easily possible to open 4 crystals and get the same champ 3 times at the six star level???? Something wrong with that picture!
  • Options
    Blubfish_666Blubfish_666 Posts: 237
    I agree that intermediate players progress the least fastest, but there’s not much that can be done that doesn’t change the state of the game and potentially ruin it for the rest of players
  • Options
    Marlo_Mike33Marlo_Mike33 Posts: 193
    edited February 2019
    There are so many videos of guys doing like Seatin using maxed 3 stars to clear master mode and beating UC bosses with 2 stars that I don't think " I can't progress without these champs" is a valid arguement. I feel ya though as far as wishing there was an easier way to pull certain champs
  • Options
    RapRap Posts: 3,194 ★★★★
    Something is up gentlemen! Cryptic "whole new game" messages in our mailboxes! Two or three weeks ago i opened 6 2 star yellowjackets in six seprate openings from phc (and one from my daily to boot!) In a row. Then someone opens 4 six star crystals and pulls 3 jane thors, then they announce a change in the grand master crystals drop rates??? Now i am beginning weeks six (longest dry spell ever!) of not popping a single 4 star from a phc! It all smacks of "behind the scenes" testing or tweeking! They have altered the algorithms!
  • Options
    HaminHamin Posts: 2,444 ★★★★★
    edited February 2019
    Edit: never mind
  • Options
    NOOOOOOOOPEEEEENOOOOOOOOPEEEEE Posts: 2,803 ★★★★★
    There are so many videos of guys doing like Seatin using maxed 3 stars to clear master mode and beating UC bosses with 2 stars that I don't think " I can't progress without these champs" is a valid arguement. I feel ya though as far as wishing there was an easier way to pull certain champs

    Funnily enough they have to use specific champs for this which was the OP point.
  • Options
    Marlo_Mike33Marlo_Mike33 Posts: 193
    edited February 2019
    There are so many videos of guys doing like Seatin using maxed 3 stars to clear master mode and beating UC bosses with 2 stars that I don't think " I can't progress without these champs" is a valid arguement. I feel ya though as far as wishing there was an easier way to pull certain champs

    Funnily enough they have to use specific champs for this which was the OP point.

    I'm almost POSITIVE he didnt mean 3* versions. Anyone who's been playing this game more than 3 or 4 months I'm sure has 3* versions of more than a few "God Tier" champs, even awakened at nice Sig level.
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    edited February 2019
    All those so called high end players you talk about had to work to get where they are. Instead of complaining they worked. I'd consider myself an end game player also. What did I do to get here? Work. Complaining won't get you anywhere so less talk and more work namsayin?

    Sorry, but mindlessly going in arena is not "work" -- you simply put in time. When you put in work for something, you get rewarded for it. That is, however, not the case in this game because you can grind for 4/5* shards and still get crapped. You don't feel rewarded do you? No. If it wasn't for RNG, those high end players wouldn't be where they are, especially Brian Grant. Namsayin?
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    There are so many videos of guys doing like Seatin using maxed 3 stars to clear master mode and beating UC bosses with 2 stars that I don't think " I can't progress without these champs" is a valid arguement. I feel ya though as far as wishing there was an easier way to pull certain champs

    Funnily enough they have to use specific champs for this which was the OP point.
    There are so many videos of guys doing like Seatin using maxed 3 stars to clear master mode and beating UC bosses with 2 stars that I don't think " I can't progress without these champs" is a valid arguement. I feel ya though as far as wishing there was an easier way to pull certain champs

    Funnily enough they have to use specific champs for this which was the OP point.

    I'm almost POSITIVE he didnt mean 3* versions. Anyone who's been playing this game more than 3 or 4 months I'm sure has 3* versions of more than a few "God Tier" champs, even awakened at nice Sig level.

    Although I did not initially mean 3* versions, Seatin's 3* challenge is a good example of what I mean: needing specific champions. Seatin is only able to do that challenge because of the "God tier" champions that are available as 3*.
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    Rap wrote: »
    I get it his point. The game has been retooled to boost low end players fast. They are fast gaining on the mid tier in mastery and prestige, mean while the top it cracking 3 duped six stars at a cracking...so the top is rising fast...the middle is not getting all these wonderful aids and gifts...we are spinning in place again...
    I agree that intermediate players progress the least fastest, but there’s not much that can be done that doesn’t change the state of the game and potentially ruin it for the rest of players

    For this who misunderstood my initial post, ^ this is exactly what I am talking about
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    edited February 2019
    Siliyo wrote: »
    All those so called high end players you talk about had to work to get where they are. Instead of complaining they worked. I'd consider myself an end game player also. What did I do to get here? Work. Complaining won't get you anywhere so less talk and more work namsayin?

    Sorry, but mindlessly going in arena is not "work" -- you simply put in time. When you put in work for something, you get rewarded for it. That is, however, not the case in this game because you can grind for 4/5* shards and still get crapped. You don't feel rewarded do you? No. If it wasn't for RNG, those high end players wouldn't be where they are, especially Brian Grant. Namsayin?

    Sorry, but "mindlessly" doing anything in this game is the worst possible perspective you can have and just doing stuff to be done with it and get the rewards will nessecarily result in disappointment and frustration, when followed by "bad pulls".

    Arena is a great way to train your basic skills, such as parry, baiting and evading. It's not supposed to be a chore, non of the game modes are.

    If you simply play the game, because you like playing the game, then there's your reward. On top of that you get tons of free stuff from all the game modes, just for doing something that you like.

    Am I excited to pull a 5* colossus or iron patriot? I mean... No? But it's not like I "worked" towards that exact pull. If anything I work towards progressing further int the game I like to play, which, again, is more about playing the game well, as it is about getting that 5* corvus.

    From what I take after seeing many many posts like this, this is more an issue of too high expactations for a system that is 100% luck based.

    And who are you to say that it is the "worst possible perspective" to have about arena? Is it arena fun? No. Enjoyable? Not really. 9/10 you will find players who want to get arena over and done with because of how mind numbing it is - you do the same thing every round. Not to mention, people learn their parry, baiting, and evading skills from questing as well so they don't bother doing that in arena.

    To counter your last point, this post is not an issue of too high expectations for a system that is RNG based. In fact, because of how RNG based this system is I, as well as other players, believe that should change and there should be more of an intentional focus/purpose to playing a game mode so we can obtain what we want.
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    Siliyo wrote: »
    Siliyo wrote: »
    All those so called high end players you talk about had to work to get where they are. Instead of complaining they worked. I'd consider myself an end game player also. What did I do to get here? Work. Complaining won't get you anywhere so less talk and more work namsayin?

    Sorry, but mindlessly going in arena is not "work" -- you simply put in time. When you put in work for something, you get rewarded for it. That is, however, not the case in this game because you can grind for 4/5* shards and still get crapped. You don't feel rewarded do you? No. If it wasn't for RNG, those high end players wouldn't be where they are, especially Brian Grant. Namsayin?

    Sorry, but "mindlessly" doing anything in this game is the worst possible perspective you can have and just doing stuff to be done with it and get the rewards will nessecarily result in disappointment and frustration, when followed by "bad pulls".

    Arena is a great way to train your basic skills, such as parry, baiting and evading. It's not supposed to be a chore, non of the game modes are.

    If you simply play the game, because you like playing the game, then there's your reward. On top of that you get tons of free stuff from all the game modes, just for doing something that you like.

    Am I excited to pull a 5* colossus or iron patriot? I mean... No? But it's not like I "worked" towards that exact pull. If anything I work towards progressing further int the game I like to play, which, again, is more about playing the game well, as it is about getting that 5* corvus.

    From what I take after seeing many many posts like this, this is more an issue of too high expactations for a system that is 100% luck based.

    And who are you to say that it is the "worst possible perspective" to have about arena? Is it arena fun? No. Enjoyable? Not really. 9/10 you will find players who want to get arena over and done with because of how mind numbing it is - you do the same thing every round. Not to mention, people learn their parry, baiting, and evading skills from questing as well so they don't bother doing that in arena.

    To counter your last point, this post is not an issue of too high expectations for a system that is RNG based. In fact, because of how RNG based this system is I, as well as other players, believe that should change and there should be more of an intentional focus/purpose to playing a game mode so we can obtain what we want.

    Someone who speaks of experience. Sure, that's anecdotal, but so is your perspective.
    I personally like arena as a game mode. No one is forcing you to like it as well, but - and that's the point you seemingly didn't understand - that is your attitude towards (parts of) the game. And said attitude or perspective is the basis for your emotional response towards the outcome.

    How is arena more mind numbing than other game modes? You do the same thing everywhere. Start the fight - fight - win - repeat.
    But okay, I give you that.

    What's really puzzling me now is the following:
    How on earth, if your parry, bait and evade skills are on point, do you have issues completing certain pieces of content?

    I can see the need for specific champs to do things like lol, but if you're at that point of the game, even if your roster is mostly ****, you should be able to acquire additional 5* champs rather fast.
    Same for variant.

    Could you at least specify which content you have issues with? I gave the example of the captain marvel event, which I completed with a less than ideal team, besides there not being much room for specific counters to begin with.
    Same with the event quest this month, which is also perfectly doable by simply playing well.

    Without a bit of substance this thread is nothing but a rant about. And that last part would also need any kind of substance to be considered a counter.
    You basically say "I and several others think the rng based system is bad and it should be different."
    How would you like it to be then? Pay 30k 5* shards for a specific champ? Curious, because any time something like this is suggested here in the forum, most of the player base seems to certainly dislike this idea.

    Having mostly skil based content is the best solution I can see. And... I mean... Not trying to sound like a broken record, but that's kind of exactly what we got this month.

    You make it sound like even if you have all of the essential skills of the game, that somehow it won't backfire on you. I mean, take a look at the AI now compared to 6-9 months ago - in some cases, it responds directly to how you play. If you swipe, even a second too late, you're punished. If you miss a parry by half a second, you end up taking a lot of unnecessary block damage. Kabam's way of making things harder for us by making the AI behave in ways it shouldn't is beyond me.

    Although you can acquire additional 5* champs rather fast, it doesn't mean you will pull what you need. For example, Variant is very champion specific (which I do not appreciate myself), although I do like the idea of having to use specific classes.

    In regards to how to reduce RNG, @Kabam Miike who is a Community Manager for Transformers: Forged to Fight announced last month on their Forums "Generic Bot Chips" or in MCOC terms "Generic Champion Shards" and I love this. In that post, Miike posted:
    • "Starting on January 10th, Featured Bot Chips will be taking on a new form. Bot Chips will no longer be exclusive to just one Bot, and will now be a permanent Currency that can be spent on any Bots featured in the Store! ... In place of a new Bot released monthly, Commanders will have 3 exclusive 5-Star Bots to choose from each month. This includes previous exclusive 5-Star Bots that have not yet been added to the 5-Star pool!"

    As you can see, from doing the things that you normally do (Arena, Monthly EQ, Act completion, Special Events, etc), you are able to earn Champion Shards to purchase a specific champion without using any additional 3/4/5* shards.
  • Options
    SiliyoSiliyo Posts: 1,379 ★★★★★
    Siliyo wrote: »
    Siliyo wrote: »
    Siliyo wrote: »
    All those so called high end players you talk about had to work to get where they are. Instead of complaining they worked. I'd consider myself an end game player also. What did I do to get here? Work. Complaining won't get you anywhere so less talk and more work namsayin?

    Sorry, but mindlessly going in arena is not "work" -- you simply put in time. When you put in work for something, you get rewarded for it. That is, however, not the case in this game because you can grind for 4/5* shards and still get crapped. You don't feel rewarded do you? No. If it wasn't for RNG, those high end players wouldn't be where they are, especially Brian Grant. Namsayin?

    Sorry, but "mindlessly" doing anything in this game is the worst possible perspective you can have and just doing stuff to be done with it and get the rewards will nessecarily result in disappointment and frustration, when followed by "bad pulls".

    Arena is a great way to train your basic skills, such as parry, baiting and evading. It's not supposed to be a chore, non of the game modes are.

    If you simply play the game, because you like playing the game, then there's your reward. On top of that you get tons of free stuff from all the game modes, just for doing something that you like.

    Am I excited to pull a 5* colossus or iron patriot? I mean... No? But it's not like I "worked" towards that exact pull. If anything I work towards progressing further int the game I like to play, which, again, is more about playing the game well, as it is about getting that 5* corvus.

    From what I take after seeing many many posts like this, this is more an issue of too high expactations for a system that is 100% luck based.

    And who are you to say that it is the "worst possible perspective" to have about arena? Is it arena fun? No. Enjoyable? Not really. 9/10 you will find players who want to get arena over and done with because of how mind numbing it is - you do the same thing every round. Not to mention, people learn their parry, baiting, and evading skills from questing as well so they don't bother doing that in arena.

    To counter your last point, this post is not an issue of too high expectations for a system that is RNG based. In fact, because of how RNG based this system is I, as well as other players, believe that should change and there should be more of an intentional focus/purpose to playing a game mode so we can obtain what we want.

    Someone who speaks of experience. Sure, that's anecdotal, but so is your perspective.
    I personally like arena as a game mode. No one is forcing you to like it as well, but - and that's the point you seemingly didn't understand - that is your attitude towards (parts of) the game. And said attitude or perspective is the basis for your emotional response towards the outcome.

    How is arena more mind numbing than other game modes? You do the same thing everywhere. Start the fight - fight - win - repeat.
    But okay, I give you that.

    What's really puzzling me now is the following:
    How on earth, if your parry, bait and evade skills are on point, do you have issues completing certain pieces of content?

    I can see the need for specific champs to do things like lol, but if you're at that point of the game, even if your roster is mostly ****, you should be able to acquire additional 5* champs rather fast.
    Same for variant.

    Could you at least specify which content you have issues with? I gave the example of the captain marvel event, which I completed with a less than ideal team, besides there not being much room for specific counters to begin with.
    Same with the event quest this month, which is also perfectly doable by simply playing well.

    Without a bit of substance this thread is nothing but a rant about. And that last part would also need any kind of substance to be considered a counter.
    You basically say "I and several others think the rng based system is bad and it should be different."
    How would you like it to be then? Pay 30k 5* shards for a specific champ? Curious, because any time something like this is suggested here in the forum, most of the player base seems to certainly dislike this idea.

    Having mostly skil based content is the best solution I can see. And... I mean... Not trying to sound like a broken record, but that's kind of exactly what we got this month.

    You make it sound like even if you have all of the essential skills of the game, that somehow it won't backfire on you. I mean, take a look at the AI now compared to 6-9 months ago - in some cases, it responds directly to how you play. If you swipe, even a second too late, you're punished. If you miss a parry by half a second, you end up taking a lot of unnecessary block damage. Kabam's way of making things harder for us by making the AI behave in ways it shouldn't is beyond me.

    Although you can acquire additional 5* champs rather fast, it doesn't mean you will pull what you need. For example, Variant is very champion specific (which I do not appreciate myself), although I do like the idea of having to use specific classes.

    In regards to how to reduce RNG, @Kabam Miike who is a Community Manager for Transformers: Forged to Fight announced last month on their Forums "Generic Bot Chips" or in MCOC terms "Generic Champion Shards" and I love this. In that post, Miike posted:
    • "Starting on January 10th, Featured Bot Chips will be taking on a new form. Bot Chips will no longer be exclusive to just one Bot, and will now be a permanent Currency that can be spent on any Bots featured in the Store! ... In place of a new Bot released monthly, Commanders will have 3 exclusive 5-Star Bots to choose from each month. This includes previous exclusive 5-Star Bots that have not yet been added to the 5-Star pool!"

    As you can see, from doing the things that you normally do (Arena, Monthly EQ, Act completion, Special Events, etc), you are able to earn Champion Shards to purchase a specific champion without using any additional 3/4/5* shards.

    I mean... There are different degrees of ai difficulty. Adapting to that is also purely a skill thing. How would corvus, blade, ghost or anyone help you there? A missed parry is a missed parry. Mistiming evades is mistiming evades.
    For example: I'd definitely say that I figured out how to fight iron man iw. Does that prevent me from running into his sp1? That would just be me not playing as good as I should. Does a certain champ prevent me from running into his sp1? No, that would also be on me.

    And the last part... I mean... What should I take from this? I don't play that transformer game, I play mcoc. For all I know the discrepancy between the usefulness or power of certain champs could be far from what is the case in mcoc.

    Also, how high should the price be? Would it be 15k? 30k? This is rather important since that price would determine which tiers of players woild benefit the most from such a system.
    Too cheap? Everyone will be running around with a 5* ghost and pandamanpetes youtube revenue will go through the roof.
    "Too expensive"? Now the top players can not only acquire way more champs than the average player, they can even choose on demand.

    Again, most people on the forum do not like this suggestion whenever it is made.

    But if you want some clarity, feel free to start a poll. I'll be sure to participate and share my thoughts on that.

    https://youtu.be/TGB3UMAkzDA

    The “adapt, git gud” approach is getting old, especially with proof like the one you see above. And encounters like these doesn’t only apply to parry, it applies to AI interactions and how they behave as well (you can find a lot of these with Dave’s Iivestreams).

    In regards to your argument for the discrepancy between the 2 games: for all you know the discrepancy between the usefulness or power of certain champs could be exactly what is the case is in MCOC, so we can skip that point. Especially since the Transformers game is an MCOC version for Transformers.

    In the Transformers game, it costs 10,000 shards to obtain a 3* hero of your choice, 100,000 shards for the 4* hero. Unfortunately, I was unable to find how many shards it will take for a 5* hero (although the post did say there will be three 5* hero’s featured each month so players can obtain them). In addition, players can earn 100,000 shards within a month’s time by completing the things you would normally. However, I do not believe it should take, at most, longer than 1-1.5 months to get the champ you want if this were to be implemented in MCOC.
  • Options
    Siliyo wrote: »
    I may be the only one to “observe” this but I feel like the progression points of players is imbalance: high end players can complete whatever content is out there, new players can easily catch up with intermediate to high end players, but those who are in the middle can’t really do much... you may have done most of the content but you can’t really pull the champs you’d like in order to efficiently 100% certain content because of RNG. I wish for a better way to obtain a certain champion.

    Some days it seems everyone observes this. Where ever you are in the progression of the game, it seems like everyone else has it better. And yet, what I find interesting is that no one who says this ever says it gets better when they actually progress higher, nor do I see a lot of people rushing to restart the game from scratch to get in on all the goodness at lower levels.

Sign In or Register to comment.