Suggesting a “Pity” System for Featured Cavaliers

I recently spent a grand total of $3,400 on the Dr Doom Cavalier crystals without getting a single 5* or higher Dr Doom.

I suggest a tweak to the drop rates in this manner:

I suggest a “pity” system for Featured cavaliers. This is how it’s gonna work:

Every unsuccessful pull for either the featured 5 or 6-star champion would result in the pity meter going up by a metric of 1 point, once it reaches 200 or 300 points which equates to 200 or 300 unsuccessful pulls, then the game will increase the drop rate for the Featured from 0.5% to 1.5%.

This system would be beneficial to both Kabam and the summoner as it would empathize with the summoner by allowing him to have slightly better odds after 200 unsuccessful pulls, essentially ensuring that the summoner would be rewarded with a better drop rate thereafter. Kabam’s monetary benefit is that it can still earn more income from summoners that are incentivized to carry on pulling after 200 unsuccessful crystals, but this time they’ll have the benefit of knowing that their odds have increased by a certain degree.

I’m not expecting charitable handouts from Kabam which is running a business after all, but more like a fairer way to reward summoners that have plunked in thousands of dollars without any tangible benefit.

My loss shouldn’t be nought, the least I can do is make this suggestion so that the player base could at least benefit slightly from a fairer system.
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Comments

  • ChampioncriticChampioncritic Posts: 3,238 ★★★★
    I know another game that has a gacha like system whereby after 199 unsuccessful pulls, you will be guaranteed the featured champion on the 200th pull. Perhaps kabam can implement something similar where after 99 unsuccessful pulls, your 100th pull will have 25% chance of featured champ 1 as a 5*, 25% chance of featured champ 1 as a 6*, 25% chance of featured champ 2 as a 5* and 25% chance of featured champ 2 as a 6*.

    This benefits both kabam, the whales and the FTP players. The whales can whale out on units to get 100 crystals and they at least are guaranteed a 5 or 6* version of a featured champ, the FTP players can grind out the units required knowing that at least they will be guaranteed the featured champ at the end of 100 pulls, and kabam get more money from the whales who will invest into getting 100 pulls.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★
    E

    I know another game that has a gacha like system whereby after 199 unsuccessful pulls, you will be guaranteed the featured champion on the 200th pull. Perhaps kabam can implement something similar where after 99 unsuccessful pulls, your 100th pull will have 25% chance of featured champ 1 as a 5*, 25% chance of featured champ 1 as a 6*, 25% chance of featured champ 2 as a 5* and 25% chance of featured champ 2 as a 6*.

    This benefits both kabam, the whales and the FTP players. The whales can whale out on units to get 100 crystals and they at least are guaranteed a 5 or 6* version of a featured champ, the FTP players can grind out the units required knowing that at least they will be guaranteed the featured champ at the end of 100 pulls, and kabam get more money from the whales who will invest into getting 100 pulls.

    Exactly, you my friend understand Emmy suggestion. This would be win-win for both kabam and the player base. Unlike someone who commented earlier, I reiterate once again that I can live with spending so much and wasn’t complaining, but just using my predicament to make a useful suggestion.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★
    I wouldn’t go as far as to suggest increasing the drop rate up to 25% but any slight increment (up to 1.5% to 2% as suggested earlier) would greatly help to incentivize the effort. Take for instance those whales who go to the casino, they receive in one form or another slight perks for whaling out. I enjoy the thrill of the Gatcha system and will continue to whale out in the future for champs that I deem desirable, but all I’m suggesting is a slight bump to the drop rates after a certain number of unsuccessful pulls.

    To add on, this system of bumped up drop rates will reset for each successful pull so as to not be abused. For instance for those that are able to pull the 5* featured early on, the counter will reset back to zero.
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
    Very intriguing. This could be implemented without any huge losses on Kabam's side and also help some players. I'm on board with this
  • ChampioncriticChampioncritic Posts: 3,238 ★★★★
    Akumaccb said:

    I wouldn’t go as far as to suggest increasing the drop rate up to 25% but any slight increment (up to 1.5% to 2% as suggested earlier) would greatly help to incentivize the effort. Take for instance those whales who go to the casino, they receive in one form or another slight perks for whaling out. I enjoy the thrill of the Gatcha system and will continue to whale out in the future for champs that I deem desirable, but all I’m suggesting is a slight bump to the drop rates after a certain number of unsuccessful pulls.

    To add on, this system of bumped up drop rates will reset for each successful pull so as to not be abused. For instance for those that are able to pull the 5* featured early on, the counter will reset back to zero.

    An increase to 1.5% chance after 200 failed attempts is not worth the effort. Increasing the chance to pull the featured champ as a 5 or 6* by 1% for every failed attempt maybe.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★

    Akumaccb said:

    I wouldn’t go as far as to suggest increasing the drop rate up to 25% but any slight increment (up to 1.5% to 2% as suggested earlier) would greatly help to incentivize the effort. Take for instance those whales who go to the casino, they receive in one form or another slight perks for whaling out. I enjoy the thrill of the Gatcha system and will continue to whale out in the future for champs that I deem desirable, but all I’m suggesting is a slight bump to the drop rates after a certain number of unsuccessful pulls.

    To add on, this system of bumped up drop rates will reset for each successful pull so as to not be abused. For instance for those that are able to pull the 5* featured early on, the counter will reset back to zero.

    An increase to 1.5% chance after 200 failed attempts is not worth the effort. Increasing the chance to pull the featured champ as a 5 or 6* by 1% for every failed attempt maybe.

    Akumaccb said:

    I wouldn’t go as far as to suggest increasing the drop rate up to 25% but any slight increment (up to 1.5% to 2% as suggested earlier) would greatly help to incentivize the effort. Take for instance those whales who go to the casino, they receive in one form or another slight perks for whaling out. I enjoy the thrill of the Gatcha system and will continue to whale out in the future for champs that I deem desirable, but all I’m suggesting is a slight bump to the drop rates after a certain number of unsuccessful pulls.

    To add on, this system of bumped up drop rates will reset for each successful pull so as to not be abused. For instance for those that are able to pull the 5* featured early on, the counter will reset back to zero.

    An increase to 1.5% chance after 200 failed attempts is not worth the effort. Increasing the chance to pull the featured champ as a 5 or 6* by 1% for every failed attempt maybe.
    We’re on the same wavelength, but in terms of probability improvements we’ll leave that to the game team to debate on.
  • Topdog23Topdog23 Posts: 15
    Kabam has always been fair with the drop rates. .give them credit for that and please don't demand something which is fair to be revised
  • Topdog23Topdog23 Posts: 15

  • Topdog23Topdog23 Posts: 15
    That champ above belongs to my humble friend who always got meh champs but trusted the system kabam has successfully created. He was eventually rewarded. Guys, just don't give up and keep opening crystals, your patience will be rewarded by kabam
  • Duke_SilverDuke_Silver Posts: 2,404 ★★★★
    Gotta learn to love the casino style.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★
    edited November 2019




    Now before anyone misconstrues my intentions in suggesting a tweak to the Cavalier system, as per the above screenshots, I myself have been the beneficiary of some decent pulls from cavaliers over my time as a summoner.

    Kabam has been very forthright in establishing the drop rates for said crystals, and all I’m suggesting is that Kabam explore the benefits of a tweak to the system to further incentivize us summoners who have a never say die attitude. For those of us who prefer to spend at least we can have a bit more to look forward to in as we continue plunking more dough into Kabam’s coffers. Kabam has got to earn their keep after all, hence I wasn’t suggesting free handouts or anything of that sort.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,346 ★★★★★
    edited November 2019
    Akumaccb said:





    Now before anyone misconstrues my intentions in suggesting a tweak to the Cavalier system, as per the above screenshots, I myself have been the beneficiary of some decent pulls from cavaliers over my time as a summoner.

    Kabam has been very forthright in establishing the drop rates for said crystals, and all I’m suggesting is that Kabam explore the benefits of a tweak to the system to further incentivize us summoners who have a never say die attitude. For those of us who prefer to spend at least we can have a bit more to look forward to in as we continue plunking more dough into Kabam’s coffers. Kabam has got to earn their keep after all, hence I wasn’t suggesting free handouts or anything of that sort.

    People already run conspiracies that the rates are rigged this would further inflame them it would also only benefit the whales not the entire base
  • OdachiOdachi Posts: 617 ★★★
    A little off topic, surely you have plenty of time to play the game why risk it when you can graft it?
    1 odin gives 155 refreshes of a 6* champ at say 60,000 points as the lowest for a 6* win, thats 9.3mil, so for around $1000 you'd get 93mil which (probably) would be enough to earn the 5*
  • AmytGAmytG Posts: 36
    I like the idea of a pity system. In another popular gacha game I played, for every 5 pulls you didn't get a 5-star, the featured 5-star drop rates would go up .25% and the non-featured 5-star odds would also go up .25%. When you pulled any 5-star, featured or not, the odds went back to the original preset and the grind began again. If Kabam were to implement something like this (and a smaller but still comparable pity for the 6-stars), players would be pretty encouraged to sink just a little in, and a little more... Building up pity is a good incentive to keep investing, and the payoff would encourage players with both the vision of sparkly new champs, but also the results to back it up.
  • zeezee57zeezee57 Posts: 2,951 ★★★★★
    As a non whale, minimal spender who's opened in the range of 275 cavs and featured cavs with not even pulling a single champ I've taken to R4 and my only 6* being WS I approve of this post. I pretty much steer clear of these things for the most part now because it's been such an abysmal waste for me its sickening to even think about how many units have gone to literally nothing. Knowing there's some safeguard to keep this from continuing on forever would entice me enough to gamble on these thing here and there again, but I doubt they'll ever do it when there's people out there that'll just buy more and more until they get the target no matter the cost.
  • gp87gp87 Posts: 298 ★★★
    I agree 100% . The rng system is also broken lately for sure: the drop rates of featured champs and 6* is pathetic.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★
    edited November 2019
    Even though it’s highly unlikely that Kabam will implement this suggestion, a suggestion it is nonetheless. So @Kabam Miike we have spoken, if you could please at least help us relay our thoughts on this issue to the game team that would be greatly appreciated.

    PS the mandalorian is an awesome series!!
  • AddyosAddyos Posts: 984 ★★★★
    There's already a "Pity" system with Featured Cavalier crystals. The drop rates are PITIFUL, although in the OP's case with his awakened 6* Namor, Corvus, Cull and unawakened Guilly 2099, Nick Fury, BWCV and others, his drop rates aren't so much.

    Thanks OP. Now I feel pity for myself for not having champs like you. There's another 'Pity' system for you.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★
    I mean let’s be honest here:

    For the first 100 crystals you pop, the odds of getting a featured within the first 100 are

    1-0.995^100 = 39.4%

    For 200 crystals:

    1-0.995^200 = 63.3%

    Seeing as how it’s already gonna be highly likely, with a 63.3% chance that you’ll pull a 5* featured within the first 200 crystals, this Pity which only kicks in after 200 failed attempts to boost up the drop rate ever so slightly acts as a mechanism to provide the player with slightly raised odds if he keeps at it beyond 200 crystals.

    What I personally experienced was this:

    After 340 crystals, my odds of getting a 5* featured would be around 1-0.995^340 = 81.8%, but I still failed to get him. I chose to stop as I was beginning to lose faith in ever getting him this time out.

    With this pity system in place, it’s still not a guarantee to get him even at 340 attempts, but it would make a difference in terms of the slightly better drop rates. In my eyes, this can only be beneficial to kabam as it would actually get more players on board to try their luck, and not as some envision cut into Kabam’s earnings.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★

    I don't get how you can tell us your story and then suggest that such a pity system would be in any way beneficial to kabam lmao.

    You and many other players already throw a ton of cash at those crystals as it is. Improving the drop rates after a certain amount of crystals would not be beneficial to kabam, since many players will continue spending regardless.

    What is the thought process here? How would that benefit kabam in any way?

    And how would it actively benefit f2p players lol? 100 featured cavaliers is 30000 units. I don't think many f2p players able to acquire such an amount in a reasonable time would throw those units at cavaliers, no matter any change in drop rates.

    This thread is a complaint disguised as a suggestion, whether you like that or not.

    You’re definitely entitled to you own opinion, but like I said there are no complaints here from me. I’m happy with what I was able to get during my time as a summoner. My objective was to highlight one of the deficiencies that I detected with the current system.

    I refer you to the above comment I just made, with probability calculations, to prove to you my point on how this would have the opposite effect and boost spending in the game, this being a win-win for kabam and the players.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★
    edited November 2019

    Akumaccb said:

    I mean let’s be honest here:

    For the first 100 crystals you pop, the odds of getting a featured within the first 100 are

    1-0.995^100 = 39.4%

    For 200 crystals:

    1-0.995^200 = 63.3%

    Seeing as how it’s already gonna be highly likely, with a 63.3% chance that you’ll pull a 5* featured within the first 200 crystals, this Pity which only kicks in after 200 failed attempts to boost up the drop rate ever so slightly acts as a mechanism to provide the player with slightly raised odds if he keeps at it beyond 200 crystals.

    What I personally experienced was this:

    After 340 crystals, my odds of getting a 5* featured would be around 1-0.995^340 = 81.8%, but I still failed to get him. I chose to stop as I was beginning to lose faith in ever getting him this time out.

    With this pity system in place, it’s still not a guarantee to get him even at 340 attempts, but it would make a difference in terms of the slightly better drop rates. In my eyes, this can only be beneficial to kabam as it would actually get more players on board to try their luck, and not as some envision cut into Kabam’s earnings.

    You're still not giving any hint at why this would be beneficial to kabam. Quite the opposite actually.

    If someone is willing to spend 30000-60000 units for 100-200 crystals and doesn't get the featured champ, it's safe to assume that such a person would either still spend or stop spending at this point regardless of a pity system, which only slightly increases the odds after a certain amount of crystals.

    And if the odds get heavily increased or if there's even a guarantee for a 5*/6* champ after [X] amount of crystals, then the amount people would spend would be fixed, compared to it now being only restricted by the individuals spending behavior.

    It's just silly tbh. You're solely looking at a group of players that is currently willing and able to simply buy 100-200 cavs. That's definitely above the average player spending getting a deal sometimes, so we're technically looking at the heavy spending territory here.

    Out of the people who will currently buy that many cavs without any increase in drop rates, there should be at least some that would/will even buy 300-400 cavs.

    Let me put it this way, kabam would hurt their own revenue in regards to their heavy heavy spenders. And 100-200 cavs is not enticing to any f2p player I could imagine.

    No one besides a small group of players would benefit from this and kabam certainly wouldn't. Otherwise, please explain how this would help their overall revenue.
    Let me explain it to you in an easier to understand manner:

    1. The calculations I provided for 100, 200, 300 and even 340 crystals clearly illustrate one’s odds of getting the featured 5*.

    2. These odds also apply to all whales from orca to the largest blue whale.

    3. As such, the majority of spenders would get what they want 200 crystals in (63.3% chance)

    4. So let me reiterate once again that I’m content with what I pulled from the Doom crystals, but I was just making a suggestion that could improve rates ever so slightly for those unlucky few whalers, so that they’ll have slightly better odds at landing that Moby ****.

    So pray tell, how would this hurt Kabam’s bottom line, seeing as how most whale’s should get the featured 5* within 200 crystals?

    I’m sure you can see now how this suggestion can assist and spur those who have received the wrong end of the stick 200 crystals in to continue to stuff Kabam’s coffers, albeit with slight raised drop rates. It’s only gonna be in the best interests of both kabam and the player.

    TLDR:

    The majority of whales won’t even past to 200 failed attempts as can be seen from the math. This so called “pity” system that was suggested is just that, to offer as semblance, whether big or small, of an assured bump to the drop rate for those brave souls who wish to soldier on.

    And since the majority of whales would’ve gotten him within 200 crystals, this doesn’t hurt kabam’s Bottom line. Rather it improves it as it promotes further spending from those who would be otherwise unwilling to buy even more crystals after 200 failed attempts.

    Like it or not, it’s the whales that pay to keep this game up as it is. And it would be in Kabam’s best interests to keep those whales happy so that they keep on coming back for more. I can only see this generating more revenue for kabam.
  • SatsuiNoHadouSatsuiNoHadou Posts: 664 ★★★

    Akumaccb said:

    Akumaccb said:

    I mean let’s be honest here:

    For the first 100 crystals you pop, the odds of getting a featured within the first 100 are

    1-0.995^100 = 39.4%

    For 200 crystals:

    1-0.995^200 = 63.3%

    Seeing as how it’s already gonna be highly likely, with a 63.3% chance that you’ll pull a 5* featured within the first 200 crystals, this Pity which only kicks in after 200 failed attempts to boost up the drop rate ever so slightly acts as a mechanism to provide the player with slightly raised odds if he keeps at it beyond 200 crystals.

    What I personally experienced was this:

    After 340 crystals, my odds of getting a 5* featured would be around 1-0.995^340 = 81.8%, but I still failed to get him. I chose to stop as I was beginning to lose faith in ever getting him this time out.

    With this pity system in place, it’s still not a guarantee to get him even at 340 attempts, but it would make a difference in terms of the slightly better drop rates. In my eyes, this can only be beneficial to kabam as it would actually get more players on board to try their luck, and not as some envision cut into Kabam’s earnings.

    You're still not giving any hint at why this would be beneficial to kabam. Quite the opposite actually.

    If someone is willing to spend 30000-60000 units for 100-200 crystals and doesn't get the featured champ, it's safe to assume that such a person would either still spend or stop spending at this point regardless of a pity system, which only slightly increases the odds after a certain amount of crystals.

    And if the odds get heavily increased or if there's even a guarantee for a 5*/6* champ after [X] amount of crystals, then the amount people would spend would be fixed, compared to it now being only restricted by the individuals spending behavior.

    It's just silly tbh. You're solely looking at a group of players that is currently willing and able to simply buy 100-200 cavs. That's definitely above the average player spending getting a deal sometimes, so we're technically looking at the heavy spending territory here.

    Out of the people who will currently buy that many cavs without any increase in drop rates, there should be at least some that would/will even buy 300-400 cavs.

    Let me put it this way, kabam would hurt their own revenue in regards to their heavy heavy spenders. And 100-200 cavs is not enticing to any f2p player I could imagine.

    No one besides a small group of players would benefit from this and kabam certainly wouldn't. Otherwise, please explain how this would help their overall revenue.
    Let me explain it to you in an easier understand manner:

    1. The calculations I provided for 100, 200, 300 and even 340 crystals clearly illustrate one’s odds of getting the featured 5*.

    2. These odds also apply to all whales from orca to the largest blue whale.

    3. As such, the majority of spenders would get what they want 200 crystals in (63.3% chance)

    4. So let me reiterate once again that I’m content with what I pulled from the Doom crystals, but I was just making a suggestion that could improve rates ever so slightly for those unlucky few whalers, so that they’ll have slightly better odds at landing that Moby ****.

    So pray tell, how would this hurt Kabam’s bottom line, seeing as how most whale’s should get the featured 5* within 200 crystals?

    I’m sure you can see now how this suggestion can assist and spur those who have received the wrong end of the stick 200 crystals in to continue to stuff Kabam’s coffers, albeit with slight raised drop rates. It’s only gonna be in the best interests of both kabam and the player.
    Oof... Okay first of all, the drop rates of the game are not cumulative. That seems to be something you're missing in your calculation. The only important factor are the individual drop rates.

    Second of all, you've made the point that such a system will benefit kabam. I asked you how exactly such a system would benefit kabam, if it would possibly result in less crystals being needed to pull a certain champ, resulting in less crystals bought and therefore less revenue for kabam.

    You can't just switch the burden here, especially after I've already explained how it would hurt kabam.

    Let's say there is a clear average of pulling a featured champ out of [X] featured cavalier crystals. Now, increasing the odds in any way shape or form, be it steadily, be it by one chunk after [Y] crystals, be it however.

    Would that not result in [X] decreasing? Would that not mean that the average amount of features cavaliers "needed" to pull the featured champ would drop by some amount? Would that not mean people would buy less featured cavaliers?

    Try some logic, mate lol.
    Now you’re the one who doesn’t seem to get the math my friend:

    Whether it’s for weapon tickets in dissidia final fantasy opera omnia or crystals in mcoc, the same formula of 1-(chance of not getting the featured)^no. of attempts holds true.

    It’s only cause you were so antagonistic that I offer the same back to you. Seems like your probability logic has just flown out the window.
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