Why don't people use champs like ghost, guilly 2099 and stark Spidey for abyss?

Kill_Grey

Okay fine, I know it's only tech champs I mentioned there, but I'm talking generally about high damage dealers like them, other than the 4 horsemen, That is...

Lvernon15

Guilly isn’t great because of the hit cap, some people have used ghost but she doesn’t hit as hard as other options and is relatively synergy reliant, sparky also doesn’t hit as hard and is potion intensive since you want to be above 50% all the time for the extra crit

Kill_Grey

Lvernon15 said:

Guilly isn’t great because of the hit cap, some people have used ghost but she doesn’t hit as hard as other options and is relatively synergy reliant, sparky also doesn’t hit as hard and is potion intensive since you want to be above 50% all the time for the extra crit

Hit cap?

Kill_Grey

Lvernon15 said:

Guilly isn’t great because of the hit cap, some people have used ghost but she doesn’t hit as hard as other options and is relatively synergy reliant, sparky also doesn’t hit as hard and is potion intensive since you want to be above 50% all the time for the extra crit

Okay, I understand the synergy reliance aspect of ghost, but doesn't hit that hard?! Are you talking in terms of DoT and/or constant basic combo critting or what?

Lvernon15

Kill_Grey4112 said:

Lvernon15 said:

Guilly isn’t great because of the hit cap, some people have used ghost but she doesn’t hit as hard as other options and is relatively synergy reliant, sparky also doesn’t hit as hard and is potion intensive since you want to be above 50% all the time for the extra crit

Okay, I understand the synergy reliance aspect of ghost, but doesn't hit that hard?! Are you talking in terms of DoT and/or constant basic combo critting or what?

Compare her damage to aegon when ramped, she doesn’t hit anywhere near as hard, corvus can also do more damage per hit than she can because you can slow play until charges return

Lvernon15

Kill_Grey4112 said:

Lvernon15 said:

Guilly isn’t great because of the hit cap, some people have used ghost but she doesn’t hit as hard as other options and is relatively synergy reliant, sparky also doesn’t hit as hard and is potion intensive since you want to be above 50% all the time for the extra crit

Hit cap?

Yes, you have a set amount of charges, every hit you land or every hit into block removes 1, and unless the opponent is slowed you’re basically dead when they run out since they go unstoppable and unblockable

Mauled

There’s a 240 hit cap in AoL (for R5 champs), as G2099 is pretty meh for that first 100 hits you only really see her potential in ½ the fight. As The only way to start already boosted up is to kill opponent with Sp3 the previous she’s a bit too tedious to use. If you’re packing a 6* R5 G2099 the extended hit cap probably would be enough to go the distance and it’d be an entirely different kettle of fish but at present they don’t exist.

People have used sparky. I used Cap and NF as my main damage dealers, the reliance on Aegon is the unstoppable heavy/fury for the Collector. I went in without Aegon and spent 3k units in the Collector himself.

Re ghost - the most efficient way to play her would be single hit combos and 240 single hits is likely to get you backed against the wall pretty quickly. In terms of her damage output/hit ratio she’s not spectacular. She’s a very fast champion to play but it’s that hit cap that’s the real kicker. Remove that and she’s a good shout.

Polygon

Lvernon15 said:

Kill_Grey4112 said:

Lvernon15 said:

Guilly isn’t great because of the hit cap, some people have used ghost but she doesn’t hit as hard as other options and is relatively synergy reliant, sparky also doesn’t hit as hard and is potion intensive since you want to be above 50% all the time for the extra crit

Okay, I understand the synergy reliance aspect of ghost, but doesn't hit that hard?! Are you talking in terms of DoT and/or constant basic combo critting or what?

Compare her damage to aegon when ramped, she doesn’t hit anywhere near as hard, corvus can also do more damage per hit than she can because you can slow play until charges return

@Lvernon15
I agree, i dont get why everyones hyping her up, at the end of the day id take damage over having a nice utility Kit that she is , i dont know if ill even r5 my guilly

Mirage_Turtle

Kill_Grey4112 said:

Okay fine, I know it's only tech champs I mentioned there, but I'm talking generally about high damage dealers like them, other than the 4 horsemen, That is...

To add to what people are saying here, there's also the utility side of things to deal with. There are Abyssal nodes that must be considered when fighting these champs. For cosmic champs like Hyperion, Medusa, or Champion, you'll need to nullify a buff on them periodically or they'll gain an unstoppable, which has the chance to wreck you. In this case, you'll need nullification abilities, which the champs you mentioned don't have.

For fights like Quake and Invisible Woman, they're basically designed to favor bleed champs...you'll want to inflict bleeds in order to do well. You can probably skip bleed damage on Quake if you have a high crit rate, but you'll likely struggle with Invisible Woman. Against her (and Modok), if you don't have a debuff on them when your inevitable power sting expires, you'll get stunned and probably die. Ghost doesn't deal much in debuffs, so that leaves the other 2 you mentioned. And as others said, Guilly 2099 isn't well suited for Abyss. As a rank 5 5* champ, she's well-designed to close out Labyrinth fights pretty quickly, but the health pools are too big for her to be very viable in Abyss...she has a hard time carrying over a combo from fight to fight.

Can Ghost, Stark Spidey, and Guilly 2099 be used for fights in Abyss? Of course! The problem is trying to fit them on teams where they will be viable while still being able to complete the path you're on. Just for the easy path, you'll really need a champ who can inflict some form of bleed, you'll need a champ who can nullify buffs regularly, you'll need a champ who can deal with Mephisto's Aura damage, and you'll really want a heavy damage dealer for the Collector.

In a vacuum, there are a lot of champs who could be good in certain matchups. The problem is creating a team that can handle everything you'll come across in your path.