Why is Apoc considered a great champ? (Excluding synergy)
Justin2524
Member Posts: 1,626 ★★★★
I just don’t get it.
All his debuffs are more or less useless debuffs.
He cant power control.
He needs ramping up.
Can hardly counter evades.
All his debuffs are more or less useless debuffs.
He cant power control.
He needs ramping up.
Can hardly counter evades.
Post edited by Kabam Porthos on
6
Comments
It’s tough to know what’s not working for you without more info. I’d bet there are plenty including myself who are happy to offer suggestions, but the list you’ve made isn’t that useful.
What’s the issue you’re having?
Dr. Zola
- the damage is solid with the debuffs on
- That ability of his to turn any mutant into a horseman, which makes them better
- Bleed and Incinerate immunity (plus disorient)
- The concussion debuff is pretty decent, especially when retriggered
- generally tanky
- and the synergies you asked to exclude by I’m including anyway are also very very good
His evade counter ramps up to 100. Meaning he fully counters evade.
I think you just don’t know how to use Apoc so you think he’s bad.
Also you can't simply disregard his synergies. It's an amazing benefit.
Give it a shot.
Dr. Zola
But his way of evade countering is overhyped.
He doesn’t have huge damage like cgr.
He doesn’t have power control like Doom.
He doesn’t shut down robot like Magneto.
He doesn’t nullify.
What is he Great at exactly?
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/288908/aspects-of-apocs-kit-and-how-to-use#latest
He's been amazing for me. Useful in almost every game mode and the #1 option for a lot of tricky fights.
Probably his best attribute: Great against champs and nodes that cause opponents to shrug debuffs. No more shrugging stun.
Great for quest w evade nodes, like the one where opponent auto evades if attacked w same move. You purposely attack w 2 light attacks, knowing he'll evade the second so you're ready. Once you get to 10 evades, you're immune to evade (not the greatest counter for single evade champs though)
Specials hit stupid hard, which only take an sp1 and 2 if hes ramped or you have Cable on your team. (He gets plus 2 charges against mutants so if you fight a mutant first he'll have 2 charges already, plus a 3rd once you win the fight).
Great for nodes where you need to hit your opponent w debuffs. Also hits for 2 bleeds on heavies
Quickly becomes mmune to bleed, incinerate, and disorient.
Heavies retrigger his debuffs.
Honestly, tho, ignoring debuff shrug, the ability to stun thru block, access to three different DOT effects, easy refresh on them, etc.
And that’s not even mentioning his awesome Final Fight style flying kick on that SP2.
1.You his debuffs are "more or less useless". All of them have a use
Weakness: reduce enemy attack by up to 25% I believe, don't quote me on that. Very helpful against dealing with block damage.
Poison: no need to explain this, reduces healing and does damages over time which are both great.
Degen: damage over time that no champion is immune to.
Concussion: ability accuracy reduction is always fun.
2. Can't power control. Yea neither can 90% of characters in this game, even the 'god tier ones'. Hercules can't, Corvus can't, Fury can't, Aegon can't. You don't need power control to make a champion good.
3. Arguably one of the quickest ramp ups for a ramp up champ. Either bring in the synergy champ, or win 3 fights (1 when against a mutant).
4. Yea sure it isn't reliable evade counter for the first like 6 or 7 evades in a quest. But after that you're chilling
EDIT: Paragraph spacing to make it easier to understand
My r3 apoc can do ws, quickly, in average 64 hits with my normal mutant quest team (apoc, white mags, profx, cable) and suicides. With good rng on the sp2, it's 60. And well under a minute fight time; sp1, sp2, couple of heavies to refresh between and final sp2 for overkill, sp1 if his health is under 22%
My r3 CGR can do it faster, but not by much. Apoc's SP2 slaps hard with cable for charges and normal mutant special boost team.
Nullify and power control are typically exclusive to Mystic/Tech. Can’t use the lack of that ability as an argument against a champion that isn’t in those classes. If you’re going against a buff heavy matchup, you’re not typically going to bring a non-mystic.
But specifically to your points: He does do huge special damage like CGR. Definitely not as huge, but at 4 Prowess his SP2 takes off huge chunks of health.
He doesn’t have nullify, but with Concussion and an SP3, those buffs aren’t appearing anyways. And this ability accuracy reduction isn’t limited to metal.
He doesn’t have power control, but he can minimize hits and let the DoT debuffs + occasional specials do the job. Might mean a longish fight, but he can anyone else have 100% uptime on degen/poison debuff?
He has Best in Class ability to prevent debuff shrug off (unlike OR, its not dependent on keeping spores on). He can get Permanent prowesses, which help on Nodes that require prowesses. No one else has an immunity to Disorient. He’s handled many Mix-master/evade paths for me easily.
A sign of a great champion is one who doesn’t specifically have the abilities that a path calls for, but is able to do it anyway. And Apocalypse can handle very well paths that call for Damage, Power control, Nullify.
No suicides, and with Cable only occasionally as the only mutant teammate, he conquers many things for me based only on his kit.
He needs to ramp up, he can't power control, and his debuffs are "useless"!
*Chuckles*
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/220918/apocalypse-is-a-dud
He doesn't have a flame on prefight ability like HT
He doesn't degen mutants like ultron
He doesn't have a sword like ronin
He doesn't shoot arrows like hawkeye
He doesn't have claws like volverine or weapon x
He doesn't go unblockable after sp like Dman
and most importantly, he doesn't fly like Dman
You made your point
One could argue that Doom can’t phase damage like Kitty or Ghost, or that Magneto struggles against non-metal champs (as well as what we can assume will be increasingly more common champs like Nimrod that counter Mags)….therefore making both Doom and Mags “not that good.”
When you consider that many of his main synergy partners are also very good champs in their own rights (AA, Cable, Prof X, etc.) it’s hard to see how Apoc doesn’t rank at top of class and near the top of all champs.
I’d also ask OP to share what rarity and level of Apoc he/she is using and how/where they are using Apoc. Might be easier to diagnose what OP is doing wrong than argue about abstracts.
Dr. Zola