Even a 6r2 SWitch Relic won’t help Doctor Strange

ESF

Hi, folks! I guess this is Relic Day/Week, something like that? I have read the posts but don’t understand how the process is going to work exactly, but it seems as though we’re going to see this concept in action really soon.

I twill try to keep this post as simple as possible: Everyone pretty much knows that Doctor Strange is in pretty bad shape. That’s not a secret and this post isn’t meant to talk about years gone by and nerfs.

It’s more a post of how if a max relic designed to help characters with Doctor Strange’s attributes still leaves the kit as one of the worst three Mystics in the game — and I would argue that it does — I am hopeful an honest discussion about what has to happen for Doctor Strange’s kit to get some form of help can take place.

Because folks, it’s really bad. I am going to attach a few photos as proof:





The first photo is the typical Winter Soldier fight, and it shows performance that is…wow.

The second photo is the Synergy team I used. With Kings of the World, Beach Bods and Masterminds giving 12 percent Special Attack bonus, Beach Bods giving 8 percent Attack Bonus and Masterminds giving another 15 percent Attack Bonus after 15 hits, and as you can tell from the fight photo, I didn’t get hit and therefore didn’t lose the attack bonus.

Folks, that was done with an R3/45 SIX-STAR Doctor Strange. Yes, you read that correctly.

Wow.

I have tested a lot of kits basically since I got my first 3-star, way back when.

I can honestly say this, without hyperbole: The only kit I ever tested that felt worse to play were the OG Iron Man/Superior Iron Man kits.

So why did I title the thread the way I did?

With Relics coming, and the Scarlet Witch Battlecast pretty much designed for kits like Doctor Strange, I was actually excited to maybe try to get one and hopefully make Doctor Strange usable.

If you look at the Scarlet Witch Battlecast page, that ain’t gonna happen.

It’s Max boost percentage, fully ranked, is less than 5 percent per those attributes listed — again, look at the performance Strange had with three Synergies giving the kit multiple damage boosts.

Again, I am not making this post to criticize anyone or anything from the past. Not at all.

But if a maxed-out Relic designed for Doctor Strange’s kit profile is clearly not going to be enough to make this kit usable…it’s beyond an emergency situation for this kit, now.

Some of us just want to play a good Doctor Strange before the game ends.

This kit truly needs so much help, it’s hard to describe.

Thanks for the time, everyone!

pseudosane

They did Doctor Strange so dirty it feels so bad.

Squirrelguy

I will add, that while I won't argue his terrible performance overall, not every champ shines in one single fight. While Dr Strange does not shine in almost any fight, his abilities can be particularly helpful in certain matchups, and so certain specific boosts that are not just attack bosts might increase his usability there. (eg. fights where you cannot gain power from hitting or being hit, or where power gain abilities are increased, or where nullify is needed) He still may not be the best for these, but his abilities aren't necessarily ideal for how basic a WS fight is, and with the passive power gain, you probably could have done it with less hits just relying on sp attacks if hit counter is something that you guage a character by.

DrZola

I struggle to think of a fight where I would reach for my Dr. Strange.

Dr. Zola

ESF

Squirrelguy said:

I will add, that while I won't argue his terrible performance overall, not every champ shines in one single fight. While Dr Strange does not shine in almost any fight, his abilities can be particularly helpful in certain matchups, and so certain specific boosts that are not just attack bosts might increase his usability there. (eg. fights where you cannot gain power from hitting or being hit, or where power gain abilities are increased, or where nullify is needed) He still may not be the best for these, but his abilities aren't necessarily ideal for how basic a WS fight is, and with the passive power gain, you probably could have done it with less hits just relying on sp attacks if hit counter is something that you guage a character by.

See, where I would disagree is if the bandwidth is so narrow for a use case, it’s really not useful enough to call it a feature.

For example, let’s take Blade’s Danger Sense, with or without the Ghost Rider synergy. That’s an example of an ability that is actually useful, with or without the Synergy. Because Blade still does enough things, especially duped, to where you can still the kit in multiple places besides the narrow use case of Danger Sense, because the kit’s DPS is still pretty functional. It’s not good or bad.

Doctor Strange’s Awakened ability requires a ton of Sigs to be considered reliable, and that’s only in a use case with Active Buffs. The WS fight is actually an example of how Strange struggles in basically ANY scenario that fits into a use case that isn’t particularly helpful for the overall game itself, because there’s nothing for him to actually do unless Strange gets hit and you want/need to heal.

That’s what I care about: No kit has to be great everywhere. Conversely, it’s rough for a kit to be bad basically everywhere except som really narrow use cases.

Wicket329

Squirrelguy said:

I will add, that while I won't argue his terrible performance overall, not every champ shines in one single fight. While Dr Strange does not shine in almost any fight, his abilities can be particularly helpful in certain matchups, and so certain specific boosts that are not just attack bosts might increase his usability there. (eg. fights where you cannot gain power from hitting or being hit, or where power gain abilities are increased, or where nullify is needed) He still may not be the best for these, but his abilities aren't necessarily ideal for how basic a WS fight is, and with the passive power gain, you probably could have done it with less hits just relying on sp attacks if hit counter is something that you guage a character by.

Less hits, sure, but even more time. And time is a far more important indicator than number of hits. It was already a four and a half minute fight.

There are absolutely times where that passive power gain is useful. I frequently use Sorcerer Supreme for matchups like Polka Dot Power because she gains power despite not having any DoT effects. But that’s the point, that I reach for somebody other than DS. I’d reach for *anybody* other than DS. I’d rather use a 4* Sorcerer Supreme or Symbiote Supreme or Wong or Hyperion or any number of other champions with access to non-combat power gain than a 6* DS. That’s how badly he scales.

ESF

Wicket329 said:

Squirrelguy said:

I will add, that while I won't argue his terrible performance overall, not every champ shines in one single fight. While Dr Strange does not shine in almost any fight, his abilities can be particularly helpful in certain matchups, and so certain specific boosts that are not just attack bosts might increase his usability there. (eg. fights where you cannot gain power from hitting or being hit, or where power gain abilities are increased, or where nullify is needed) He still may not be the best for these, but his abilities aren't necessarily ideal for how basic a WS fight is, and with the passive power gain, you probably could have done it with less hits just relying on sp attacks if hit counter is something that you guage a character by.

Less hits, sure, but even more time. And time is a far more important indicator than number of hits. It was already a four and a half minute fight.

There are absolutely times where that passive power gain is useful. I frequently use Sorcerer Supreme for matchups like Polka Dot Power because she gains power despite not having any DoT effects. But that’s the point, that I reach for somebody other than DS. I’d reach for *anybody* other than DS. I’d rather use a 4* Sorcerer Supreme or Symbiote Supreme or Wong or Hyperion or any number of other champions with access to non-combat power gain than a 6* DS. That’s how badly he scales.

That’s really the main point I am trying to get at: Sorcerer Supreme is already a really good character, and that’s not a bad thing. And if someone gets a SWitch Battlecast and wants to pair it with SS, hey, awesome. I have a SS myself, so I totally get it.

Also: I know it’s early days for Relics. It’s entirely possible something might come along that is amazing for Doctor Strange.

That’s where I am really confused about how to approach this.

The SWitch Battlecast is basically designed for SS/DS. Mordo might benefit, and I literally haven’t tested Rintrah or Wong not even once. So I don’t know if they benefit, so on and so forth.

So my question/concern is that if a Relic is basically designed for a kit, and that kit is still going to be in a bad place…yes, we could use it elsewhere. But wouldn’t it be better for players and the Relic system and the game itself if a kit wasn’t in such a bad place?

I wouldn’t care if Doctor Strange was just struggling, or if the Relic could bring the kit to even slightly below average.

But the problem is just that Strange’s kit needs a lot of help. More than a Relic can probably provide..

That’s just the truth

Wicket329

Wholeheartedly agree with you, ESF. DS himself needs an overhaul, the problems with his kit can’t be fixed by an external buff like a synergy or relic. And it’s a real bummer for a relic that is targeted at him to still not be sufficient to make him feel useful.

Kerneas

Doc Strange is in the second lowest champ tier for me. The lowest are champs without any interesting synergy - there are only two: SupIM and Groot.

Second lowest is champs with synergies, that don't make them viable (Doc Strange)

In other words I agree with every word of yours, just saying it the longer way