What happened to the buff program?

Age_of_Luca2000

I've been wondering this for quite some time, but what happened to the buff program? It has been several months now that no buffs have been announced for the old characters, already last month after the balance update of ant man future and cassie I had this question in mind, but I wanted to wait and see if something changed this time but nothing yet .
The buff program is one of the few things that makes all players happy but maybe I should say it "was", I understand that it takes time, ideas and passion to improve a character and that it doesn't earn as much as a new character recently released, but removing this program and replacing it with the new balance update or with bug fixis by passing them off as improvements is a ridiculous maneuver from my point of view (and I think not only).
Let's not forget that we are still waiting for the black panther cw buff, and it's been a year since it was announced or even for the venom the duck buff said during the 7* announcement live and never talked about again, we know they're coming, but I start wonder if the wait will be worth it.
I hope to receive an answer, not only for me but also on behalf of all players who probably wonder the same, it would be a real shame to lose this aspect of the game.

Comments

baskinrobbinsknows

Like a lot of good things in this game, it got killed off by Kabam.

Etm34

They silently killed it off it seems to only focus on the new champs, aka the money makers.

GroundedWisdom

It takes a great deal of work to rework older Champs. I haven't seen anything official indicating they've stopped. They've also been quite busy as of late. I'm sure we'll hear word of something eventually, but for now, it's not reasonable to assume they've given up.

SlayerOfGods

I haven't seen anything official indicating they've stopped.

Even so, we've gone from 4 buffs a month to maybe 1 every few months. The program is definitely not dead but it barely feels alive at this point.

Age_of_Luca2000

The last buff we received from an older champion it was ice man in april, but they stopped announcing them with the balance update of shuri and attuma, and that was about 6 months ago.

Rebark

I think they shouldn't end the buff program without visiting champions that are really terrible. For example: Groot, Sentry, Beast, Psycho-Man.
Yes, there are other champions that need a buff, but these four are in a situation where they are barely usable in the arena.
Groot, Sentry and Beast do not have an alternate version and are very beloved champions.
Yes, Psycho-Man has already been buffed, but let's face it: If they multiplied his damage by 3, he would still be bad. For me, in terms of damage, he is the worst champion in the game, even losing to groot. Not all champions need to be good, some are bad but are usable with synergy, but these ones are in an unfortunate situation.
The least worst of the 4 is the Sentry, which can be minimally usable and despite having serious problems in construction, it manages to achieve damage and reasonable utility.

Rebark

I think they shouldn't end the buff program without visiting champions that are really terrible. For example: Groot, Sentry, Beast, Psycho-Man.
Yes, there are other champions that need a buff, but these four are in a situation where they are barely usable in the arena.
Groot, Sentry and Beast do not have an alternate version and are very beloved champions.
Yes, Psycho-Man has already been buffed, but let's face it: If they multiplied his damage by 3, he would still be bad. For me, in terms of damage, he is the worst champion in the game, even losing to groot. Not all champions need to be good, some are bad but are usable with synergy, but these ones are in an unfortunate situation.
The least worst of the 4 is the Sentry, which can be minimally usable and despite having serious problems in construction, it manages to achieve damage and reasonable utility.

Just to complement, I would be happy if they only increased their damage, because when it comes to fighting in the arena with Groot and Psycho-man, the will is not to use them

Magrailothos

I haven't seen anything official indicating they've stopped.
Even so, we've gone from 4 buffs a month to maybe 1 every few months. The program is definitely not dead but it barely feels alive at this point.

Absolutely this.

They haven't 'stopped' as such.

However, the communications team have - in a variety of posts - made it abundantly clear that the resources previously used for buffing older champions are now prioritised for balancing new ones. And only where no balancing changes are required at all to new champions will they consider devoting any Developer time to reworking an older champion.

Age_of_Luca2000

Now I'm saying it just to have a little chat but I've been making characters concept buffs for more than a year, every time I create one I always send it to kabam (modifying where needed and showing others if they like it, or where they can be defects that I have not seen) hoping that it can be viewed by them (little hope that it happens I know, but you never know).
But the fun thing about these buffs of mine is the challenge I give myself... finish them within 2 hours of starting to create them, and so far I've always achieved that goal but most of all I have to put passion into creating them, be fun to use, useful in various contexts and more.
In short, if there is passion in what you are doing, the work itself takes a back seat, at least in drawing up the ideas on how to create a unique character in its own way, I know that the effort is in the programming side and in making it work as you have to, but hey... it's always a start.

Age_of_Luca2000

As I said, was it just to say or perhaps imply that they are losing their passion? maybe...

Searmenis

R.I.P.
.-

Axew

No old champ reworks again. Disappointing.

CosmicGuardian

Any official response will most likely provide little explanation and just state that there was never an “official buff program”, but instead that they were just doing so when they had the resources. It really disheartens me that we’ve gotten to a point where there are very few buffs being released. I understand that balancing new champs is important so they all fall above a certain level of quality, but I feel like buffing older champs to make them more effective and useful is just as important. I just wish we had some communication regarding whether or not they’re moving away from buffs, or if this is just a temporary break.

There was a time when I was just as excited for each month’s buffs as I was the new champs, not because the buffs were anything broken or OP, but because it felt good to see new life breathed into underperforming champs. Personally, I really hope we see an uptick in buff announcements before the year is out, but if the past few months have been any indication I feel like I’m gonna disappointed.

SandeepS

I think they'll do an announcement at the in person event... From now we will do one champ every three months just to make sure it's done right...

Age_of_Luca2000

At this point we just have to hope that they give a clear answer to the community, after almost 6 months without a real buff, this lack of them starts to be annoying.
Like others have said, it was nice to see who would be buffed and all the curiosity and maybe even the hype that a pg could bring.

Ercarret

Generally speaking, I don't dislike the balance between the buff program and the balancing program. I do think the balancing program is a good thing and I don't mind when tweaking a new champion takes precedence to buffing an old one. However, lately the balance between those two programs have fallen off. It's been quite a few champions that have been released that need tweaks and are therefore taking precedence over older champion getting some love. That is unfortunate. We saw Kabam alternating between the two programs well during the beginning of the year, but it has felt like there is always some kind of issue with at least one of the champs that have been released in the last three or four months (or at least those that have come up for review in those months).

It would be nice to see a dedication to two buffs/balances each month. Either two balances of new champions, two buffs to older champions, or one of each. Part of me feels that this might be an unreasonable request, but another part feels like they probably have that two-buff time scheduled already since there's always the possibility that both champs on any given month might need to be balanced.

Regardless of that, we'll hopefully see a string of champion releases where no changes need to be made, which would automatically free up some time to buff older champions.

HungaryHippo

They can’t sell us old champs.

Magrailothos

Any official response will most likely provide little explanation and just state that there was never an “official buff program”....

There absolutely was.

Behold, the (quite aspirational) announcement from July 2020's "Dev Diaries"

https://playcontestofchampions.com/news/dev-diary-champions-of-the-contest/

Magrailothos

July 2020-June 21
First twelve months of the buff program: 23 champion buffs

Magneto
Magneto HOX
Punisher-2099
Gambit
Falcon
DDHK
Kingpin
Howard the Duck
Masacre
Angela
Civil Warrior
Yellow jacket
Odin
Mr Fantastic
Vulture
Black Panther (Classic)
Crossbones
Nova
War Machine
Ultron
Bishop
Ronin
Diablo

July 21-June 22
Second twelve months of the buff program: 17 champions

The Hood
Gamora (twice)
Miles Morales
Venompool
King Groot
Karnak
Nebula
Thor (Ragnarok)
Guillotine
Joe Fixit
Hawkeye
Psycho-man
Storm
Mordo
Thor (Jane Foster)
Deadpool X-Force
Yondu

July 22 - June 23
Third twelve months of the buff program: 7 champions

Juggernaut
Ant Man
Rocket Raccoon
IMIW
Hulk (Classic)
Spiderman
Iceman

Magrailothos

I could follow that with a list of champions who haven't been reworked yet, and give you my estimate of how long it'll take to buff them all at current rates; but I think we'd all just find that depressing 🥺

Coppin

Got replacef with the nerf program

Trafalgarwar96

Luca for president

DarkestDestroyer

@Kabam Miike why does no one see a post like this and jump in to give us some information, at this point I would go as far to say that we should actually deserve something. It’s so silent it’s scary, and there’s a 3 month track event coming up which is going to cost £30.

At least communicate with us on things, even the roadmaps have gone, there used to be so many encouraging posts about being open with us and so forth and I’ve no idea what’s happened.

SandeepS

July 2020-June 21
First twelve months of the buff program: 23 champion buffs
July 21-June 22
Second twelve months of the buff program: 17 champions
July 22 - June 23
Third twelve months of the buff program: 7 champions

Don't be unfair to kabam... Some champs were done a few times like gamora so numbers should be higher lol

Magrailothos

@Kabam Miike why does no one see a post like this and jump in to give us some information, at this point I would go as far to say that we should actually deserve something. It’s so silent it’s scary, and there’s a 3 month track event coming up which is going to cost £30.

At least communicate with us on things, even the roadmaps have gone, there used to be so many encouraging posts about being open with us and so forth and I’ve no idea what’s happened.

Well, I kind of agree with the sentiment; but expecting a response here and now, in this thread is unlikely: this is a forum for us to discuss the game amongst ourselves, not a direct line to the Dev team.

I wouldn't especially expect a forum mod to comment any time soon.

It's conceivable, if a few threads like this got traction (and there are YouTube videos by people like KT1 on this subject too, recently) that the perspectives shared in it might come up at a meeting some time, and there might be some kind of update at some time, or maybe in a Livestream, or something.

I wouldn't expect anything more than that: the mods will monitor this kind of conversation, but don't expect them to get involved unless/until they've got something to say.

CosmicGuardian

Any official response will most likely provide little explanation and just state that there was never an “official buff program”....
There absolutely was.

Behold, the (quite aspirational) announcement from July 2020's "Dev Diaries"

https://playcontestofchampions.com/news/dev-diary-champions-of-the-contest/

Oh wow, I actually completely forgot about this, thanks for pointing it out. I can barely remember what I did 3 days ago, so 3 years is a big stretch for me lol. I think I may have gotten confused as I feel like I remember that the last couple of times I’ve seen dev responses to concerns regarding the old buff program, the response was that there was no “official buff program”.

Milan1405

I don't get why it's so hard to buff champions on a regular schedule. We aren't asking for them to be OP or anything, just fun and useable. Maybe I'm missing something but if Kabam were limited on time for some reason, how hard would it be to buff someone like Beast? Just give him double his regular damage and increase his bleeds by 300% potency and maybe give him some coldsnap mitigation since he has thick fur. He already has some bleed mitigation and damage reduction as well as healing so a change like this could just make him fun to play and take no time at all, and I'm sure most players would be grateful for it.

BigPoppaCBONE

I'm surprised that Kabam hasn't taken the next step in the monetization of relics by using that as the "Buff Program". For instance, the Sentry relic adds something minor to other champs, but on Sentry, it basically rewrites his abilities and gives them something to sell.

AMS94

I'm surprised that Kabam hasn't taken the next step in the monetization of relics by using that as the "Buff Program". For instance, the Sentry relic adds something minor to other champs, but on Sentry, it basically rewrites his abilities and gives them something to sell.

That might happen when 6* relics are more common

Currently people care about relic for just prestige & to extend combos.......the general feeling about relics is not positive

They get backlash for relics based nodes only so making them important enough to be considered as champion buff will attract a pretty big backlash from the community

They will do that, but after relics have been here long enough to be considered indispensable

Magrailothos

I'm surprised that Kabam hasn't taken the next step in the monetization of relics by using that as the "Buff Program". For instance, the Sentry relic adds something minor to other champs, but on Sentry, it basically rewrites his abilities and gives them something to sell.

Monetisation is definitely the problem. It costs time/money and the return is intangible (increased player satisfaction, if they get it right).

To be 100% clear: I don't wish for that to sound like a complaint or criticism: clearly the game has a very effective business model which isn't positively impacted by turning developer time to improving champions that can easily be 'put off till later' (ignored) when there are more pressing things like massive bugs to fix, cheaters to catch, etc.

And despite my fervent wish for the classic champions to be playable, the longevity of the game should be our primary concern.

I don't know how to monetize the process, so surely the answer is to reduce costs, basically centering on: reduce the developer time required (and our expectations) -

Build on existing abilities
Keep designs simple (particularly bearing early players in mind)
Use mechanics already in game (e.g. hit counters, abilities that trigger on critical hits, dodges or well-timed blocks; nothing fancy. Don't give Symbiote Spiderman a funky new webbing ability - just repurpose the one you've just used for Classic Spidey)
Avoid graphics changes (or copy/paste animations from another champ, if they're really necessary)

I've got my own thread of reworks in the Suggestions thread here, working from those principles, if anyone fancies a read: https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/comment/2252246/#Comment_2252246

So, reduce costs by reducing the developer load required, and then reduce the beta load by having potentially 4-6 of those buffs per month, and a really interesting beta trying them all out at once.