I don't see why they're dragging their feet in making him a 7*. What is the justification now? It can't be because he's "too op". They made Serpent, Bullseye, Onslaught (and maybe SIM and Enchantress?) OP and available as 7*'s. Serpent also comes with a 9 second immortality buff..basically the same as Herc. So what would be the excuse now?
It is in fact possible the devs disagree with your assessment.
Also, while developers have their own intuitions and judgments, their balancing decisions tend to be grounded in data. You might think Serpent or Bullseye or Onslaught are just as bad as Hercules, but I’m pretty sure the data disagrees with you. Same with Quake, same with Magik. They don’t just guess randomly which champs look problematic. They actually look for actual problems in the actual game play data. They see what everyone is doing with every champ. They don’t have to guess.
Especially since they have 100% played the actual game with a 7 star Hercules to make direct comparisons and wouldn't have to extrapolate data.
I don't see why they're dragging their feet in making him a 7*. What is the justification now? It can't be because he's "too op". They made Serpent, Bullseye, Onslaught (and maybe SIM and Enchantress?) OP and available as 7*'s. Serpent also comes with a 9 second immortality buff..basically the same as Herc. So what would be the excuse now?
It is in fact possible the devs disagree with your assessment.
Also, while developers have their own intuitions and judgments, their balancing decisions tend to be grounded in data. You might think Serpent or Bullseye or Onslaught are just as bad as Hercules, but I’m pretty sure the data disagrees with you. Same with Quake, same with Magik. They don’t just guess randomly which champs look problematic. They actually look for actual problems in the actual game play data. They see what everyone is doing with every champ. They don’t have to guess.
Especially since they have 100% played the actual game with a 7 star Hercules to make direct comparisons and wouldn't have to extrapolate data.
That's a ludicrous statement. The question of whether to release Hercules as a 7* is going to be based on his prior performance as a 6* and lower, not based on his performance as a 7* champ. Or are you saying what they should do is release him as a 7* champ, collect data on him, and then use that data to decide if they should release him as a 7* champ?
But this also misunderstands the real problem with Hercules, and the real solution to that problem. The fact that Hercules is problematic today is an unfixable problem. He always will be, because he's always going to be Hercules and the content he is problematic in will always exist. Those problems are locked in, But he's also an ongoing problem, because knowing how he performs in prior content, the devs have to always be cognizant of him when designing future content. He's a land mine there will always be a risk of stepping on. He didn't cease to be a problem because he hasn't been released as a 7* champ yet. He's *still* a problem now for the devs as they continue to design content. Holding him back from being released as a 7* champ is a long term solution to the problems he causes, as the higher progression content moves into a future where his relevance decays over time as the rest of the champion roster grows above him. Saying we don't know how he will behave as a 7* champ completely misses the actual problem Hercules creates and why the devs are reluctant to release him at higher rarities. Whether you release him as a 7* or not will not change much today. It is about the long term problems he won't eventually be able to cause.
Which the devs learned because of his datamined performance at all other levels of the game.
I don't see why they're dragging their feet in making him a 7*. What is the justification now? It can't be because he's "too op". They made Serpent, Bullseye, Onslaught (and maybe SIM and Enchantress?) OP and available as 7*'s. Serpent also comes with a 9 second immortality buff..basically the same as Herc. So what would be the excuse now?
It is in fact possible the devs disagree with your assessment.
Also, while developers have their own intuitions and judgments, their balancing decisions tend to be grounded in data. You might think Serpent or Bullseye or Onslaught are just as bad as Hercules, but I’m pretty sure the data disagrees with you. Same with Quake, same with Magik. They don’t just guess randomly which champs look problematic. They actually look for actual problems in the actual game play data. They see what everyone is doing with every champ. They don’t have to guess.
Especially since they have 100% played the actual game with a 7 star Hercules to make direct comparisons and wouldn't have to extrapolate data.
That's a ludicrous statement. The question of whether to release Hercules as a 7* is going to be based on his prior performance as a 6* and lower, not based on his performance as a 7* champ. Or are you saying what they should do is release him as a 7* champ, collect data on him, and then use that data to decide if they should release him as a 7* champ?
But this also misunderstands the real problem with Hercules, and the real solution to that problem. The fact that Hercules is problematic today is an unfixable problem. He always will be, because he's always going to be Hercules and the content he is problematic in will always exist. Those problems are locked in, But he's also an ongoing problem, because knowing how he performs in prior content, the devs have to always be cognizant of him when designing future content. He's a land mine there will always be a risk of stepping on. He didn't cease to be a problem because he hasn't been released as a 7* champ yet. He's *still* a problem now for the devs as they continue to design content. Holding him back from being released as a 7* champ is a long term solution to the problems he causes, as the higher progression content moves into a future where his relevance decays over time as the rest of the champion roster grows above him. Saying we don't know how he will behave as a 7* champ completely misses the actual problem Hercules creates and why the devs are reluctant to release him at higher rarities. Whether you release him as a 7* or not will not change much today. It is about the long term problems he won't eventually be able to cause.
Which the devs learned because of his datamined performance at all other levels of the game.
Ok so I'm going to ask a few additional questions because I'm genuinely trying to understand this 7* Herc resistance.
Kabam created a monster for a reason, and now want to keep that monster locked in a lower star level because he's too OP? Didn't the devs test him in all areas of the game and release him in his OP form? So exactly what were their expectations of his peformance and of the community?
I don't see why they're dragging their feet in making him a 7*. What is the justification now? It can't be because he's "too op". They made Serpent, Bullseye, Onslaught (and maybe SIM and Enchantress?) OP and available as 7*'s. Serpent also comes with a 9 second immortality buff..basically the same as Herc. So what would be the excuse now?
It is in fact possible the devs disagree with your assessment.
Also, while developers have their own intuitions and judgments, their balancing decisions tend to be grounded in data. You might think Serpent or Bullseye or Onslaught are just as bad as Hercules, but I’m pretty sure the data disagrees with you. Same with Quake, same with Magik. They don’t just guess randomly which champs look problematic. They actually look for actual problems in the actual game play data. They see what everyone is doing with every champ. They don’t have to guess.
Especially since they have 100% played the actual game with a 7 star Hercules to make direct comparisons and wouldn't have to extrapolate data.
That's a ludicrous statement. The question of whether to release Hercules as a 7* is going to be based on his prior performance as a 6* and lower, not based on his performance as a 7* champ. Or are you saying what they should do is release him as a 7* champ, collect data on him, and then use that data to decide if they should release him as a 7* champ?
But this also misunderstands the real problem with Hercules, and the real solution to that problem. The fact that Hercules is problematic today is an unfixable problem. He always will be, because he's always going to be Hercules and the content he is problematic in will always exist. Those problems are locked in, But he's also an ongoing problem, because knowing how he performs in prior content, the devs have to always be cognizant of him when designing future content. He's a land mine there will always be a risk of stepping on. He didn't cease to be a problem because he hasn't been released as a 7* champ yet. He's *still* a problem now for the devs as they continue to design content. Holding him back from being released as a 7* champ is a long term solution to the problems he causes, as the higher progression content moves into a future where his relevance decays over time as the rest of the champion roster grows above him. Saying we don't know how he will behave as a 7* champ completely misses the actual problem Hercules creates and why the devs are reluctant to release him at higher rarities. Whether you release him as a 7* or not will not change much today. It is about the long term problems he won't eventually be able to cause.
Which the devs learned because of his datamined performance at all other levels of the game.
Ok so I'm going to ask a few additional questions because I'm genuinely trying to understand this 7* Herc resistance.
Kabam created a monster for a reason, and now want to keep that monster locked in a lower star level because he's too OP? Didn't the devs test him in all areas of the game and release him in his OP form? So exactly what were their expectations of his peformance and of the community?
Same questions for Quake and Magik.
What happened with Quake was they didn't expect players to play her the way they do. They thought she would be used more traditionally using full combos and what not, not just heavy eavde heavy for eternity. But once they learned that was how she was used the majority of the time it created a problem. Believe it or not but kabam doesn't really want to straight up nerf champs in a major way like changing those 3 champs kits and they'll cause MAJOR backlash. On par with 12.0. So instead they decide to leave them as is but restrict them to the star levels they are currently at.
7* Herc won't be good - u want to do story or incursion 6* is enough. He is not getting used in BGs He is not getting used in war He doesn't have much utility
I don't see why they're dragging their feet in making him a 7*. What is the justification now? It can't be because he's "too op". They made Serpent, Bullseye, Onslaught (and maybe SIM and Enchantress?) OP and available as 7*'s. Serpent also comes with a 9 second immortality buff..basically the same as Herc. So what would be the excuse now?
It is in fact possible the devs disagree with your assessment.
Also, while developers have their own intuitions and judgments, their balancing decisions tend to be grounded in data. You might think Serpent or Bullseye or Onslaught are just as bad as Hercules, but I’m pretty sure the data disagrees with you. Same with Quake, same with Magik. They don’t just guess randomly which champs look problematic. They actually look for actual problems in the actual game play data. They see what everyone is doing with every champ. They don’t have to guess.
Especially since they have 100% played the actual game with a 7 star Hercules to make direct comparisons and wouldn't have to extrapolate data.
That's a ludicrous statement. The question of whether to release Hercules as a 7* is going to be based on his prior performance as a 6* and lower, not based on his performance as a 7* champ. Or are you saying what they should do is release him as a 7* champ, collect data on him, and then use that data to decide if they should release him as a 7* champ?
But this also misunderstands the real problem with Hercules, and the real solution to that problem. The fact that Hercules is problematic today is an unfixable problem. He always will be, because he's always going to be Hercules and the content he is problematic in will always exist. Those problems are locked in, But he's also an ongoing problem, because knowing how he performs in prior content, the devs have to always be cognizant of him when designing future content. He's a land mine there will always be a risk of stepping on. He didn't cease to be a problem because he hasn't been released as a 7* champ yet. He's *still* a problem now for the devs as they continue to design content. Holding him back from being released as a 7* champ is a long term solution to the problems he causes, as the higher progression content moves into a future where his relevance decays over time as the rest of the champion roster grows above him. Saying we don't know how he will behave as a 7* champ completely misses the actual problem Hercules creates and why the devs are reluctant to release him at higher rarities. Whether you release him as a 7* or not will not change much today. It is about the long term problems he won't eventually be able to cause.
Which the devs learned because of his datamined performance at all other levels of the game.
You misunderstood. I was agreeing with you. I'm saying that they don't need to guess at what 7 star Hercules can do because they know exactly what he can do.
I don't see why they're dragging their feet in making him a 7*. What is the justification now? It can't be because he's "too op". They made Serpent, Bullseye, Onslaught (and maybe SIM and Enchantress?) OP and available as 7*'s. Serpent also comes with a 9 second immortality buff..basically the same as Herc. So what would be the excuse now?
It is in fact possible the devs disagree with your assessment.
Also, while developers have their own intuitions and judgments, their balancing decisions tend to be grounded in data. You might think Serpent or Bullseye or Onslaught are just as bad as Hercules, but I’m pretty sure the data disagrees with you. Same with Quake, same with Magik. They don’t just guess randomly which champs look problematic. They actually look for actual problems in the actual game play data. They see what everyone is doing with every champ. They don’t have to guess.
Especially since they have 100% played the actual game with a 7 star Hercules to make direct comparisons and wouldn't have to extrapolate data.
That's a ludicrous statement. The question of whether to release Hercules as a 7* is going to be based on his prior performance as a 6* and lower, not based on his performance as a 7* champ. Or are you saying what they should do is release him as a 7* champ, collect data on him, and then use that data to decide if they should release him as a 7* champ?
But this also misunderstands the real problem with Hercules, and the real solution to that problem. The fact that Hercules is problematic today is an unfixable problem. He always will be, because he's always going to be Hercules and the content he is problematic in will always exist. Those problems are locked in, But he's also an ongoing problem, because knowing how he performs in prior content, the devs have to always be cognizant of him when designing future content. He's a land mine there will always be a risk of stepping on. He didn't cease to be a problem because he hasn't been released as a 7* champ yet. He's *still* a problem now for the devs as they continue to design content. Holding him back from being released as a 7* champ is a long term solution to the problems he causes, as the higher progression content moves into a future where his relevance decays over time as the rest of the champion roster grows above him. Saying we don't know how he will behave as a 7* champ completely misses the actual problem Hercules creates and why the devs are reluctant to release him at higher rarities. Whether you release him as a 7* or not will not change much today. It is about the long term problems he won't eventually be able to cause.
Which the devs learned because of his datamined performance at all other levels of the game.
Ok so I'm going to ask a few additional questions because I'm genuinely trying to understand this 7* Herc resistance.
Kabam created a monster for a reason, and now want to keep that monster locked in a lower star level because he's too OP? Didn't the devs test him in all areas of the game and release him in his OP form? So exactly what were their expectations of his peformance and of the community?
Same questions for Quake and Magik.
What happened with Quake was they didn't expect players to play her the way they do. They thought she would be used more traditionally using full combos and what not, not just heavy eavde heavy for eternity. But once they learned that was how she was used the majority of the time it created a problem. Believe it or not but kabam doesn't really want to straight up nerf champs in a major way like changing those 3 champs kits and they'll cause MAJOR backlash. On par with 12.0. So instead they decide to leave them as is but restrict them to the star levels they are currently at.
Ok understood about Quake. What about Herc? Was there another way he could be played other than intended?
I don't see why they're dragging their feet in making him a 7*. What is the justification now? It can't be because he's "too op". They made Serpent, Bullseye, Onslaught (and maybe SIM and Enchantress?) OP and available as 7*'s. Serpent also comes with a 9 second immortality buff..basically the same as Herc. So what would be the excuse now?
It is in fact possible the devs disagree with your assessment.
Also, while developers have their own intuitions and judgments, their balancing decisions tend to be grounded in data. You might think Serpent or Bullseye or Onslaught are just as bad as Hercules, but I’m pretty sure the data disagrees with you. Same with Quake, same with Magik. They don’t just guess randomly which champs look problematic. They actually look for actual problems in the actual game play data. They see what everyone is doing with every champ. They don’t have to guess.
Especially since they have 100% played the actual game with a 7 star Hercules to make direct comparisons and wouldn't have to extrapolate data.
That's a ludicrous statement. The question of whether to release Hercules as a 7* is going to be based on his prior performance as a 6* and lower, not based on his performance as a 7* champ. Or are you saying what they should do is release him as a 7* champ, collect data on him, and then use that data to decide if they should release him as a 7* champ?
But this also misunderstands the real problem with Hercules, and the real solution to that problem. The fact that Hercules is problematic today is an unfixable problem. He always will be, because he's always going to be Hercules and the content he is problematic in will always exist. Those problems are locked in, But he's also an ongoing problem, because knowing how he performs in prior content, the devs have to always be cognizant of him when designing future content. He's a land mine there will always be a risk of stepping on. He didn't cease to be a problem because he hasn't been released as a 7* champ yet. He's *still* a problem now for the devs as they continue to design content. Holding him back from being released as a 7* champ is a long term solution to the problems he causes, as the higher progression content moves into a future where his relevance decays over time as the rest of the champion roster grows above him. Saying we don't know how he will behave as a 7* champ completely misses the actual problem Hercules creates and why the devs are reluctant to release him at higher rarities. Whether you release him as a 7* or not will not change much today. It is about the long term problems he won't eventually be able to cause.
Which the devs learned because of his datamined performance at all other levels of the game.
Ok so I'm going to ask a few additional questions because I'm genuinely trying to understand this 7* Herc resistance.
Kabam created a monster for a reason, and now want to keep that monster locked in a lower star level because he's too OP? Didn't the devs test him in all areas of the game and release him in his OP form? So exactly what were their expectations of his peformance and of the community?
Same questions for Quake and Magik.
What happened with Quake was they didn't expect players to play her the way they do. They thought she would be used more traditionally using full combos and what not, not just heavy eavde heavy for eternity. But once they learned that was how she was used the majority of the time it created a problem. Believe it or not but kabam doesn't really want to straight up nerf champs in a major way like changing those 3 champs kits and they'll cause MAJOR backlash. On par with 12.0. So instead they decide to leave them as is but restrict them to the star levels they are currently at.
Ok understood about Quake. What about Herc? Was there another way he could be played other than intended?
Nope. And kabam did go on record saying if the balance program existed when herc was released he would absolutely have been tuned down somehow. They are very much aware they made him completely OP.
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But this also misunderstands the real problem with Hercules, and the real solution to that problem. The fact that Hercules is problematic today is an unfixable problem. He always will be, because he's always going to be Hercules and the content he is problematic in will always exist. Those problems are locked in, But he's also an ongoing problem, because knowing how he performs in prior content, the devs have to always be cognizant of him when designing future content. He's a land mine there will always be a risk of stepping on. He didn't cease to be a problem because he hasn't been released as a 7* champ yet. He's *still* a problem now for the devs as they continue to design content. Holding him back from being released as a 7* champ is a long term solution to the problems he causes, as the higher progression content moves into a future where his relevance decays over time as the rest of the champion roster grows above him. Saying we don't know how he will behave as a 7* champ completely misses the actual problem Hercules creates and why the devs are reluctant to release him at higher rarities. Whether you release him as a 7* or not will not change much today. It is about the long term problems he won't eventually be able to cause.
Which the devs learned because of his datamined performance at all other levels of the game.
Kabam created a monster for a reason, and now want to keep that monster locked in a lower star level because he's too OP? Didn't the devs test him in all areas of the game and release him in his OP form? So exactly what were their expectations of his peformance and of the community?
Same questions for Quake and Magik.
He is not getting used in BGs
He is not getting used in war
He doesn't have much utility