Live Events have been a part of this game's history for a long time. I respect that you may feel that way, but I wholeheartedly disagree. People enjoy it. It's an amazing thing to be able to go see, participate, and socialize in person.
Live Events have been a part of this game's history for a long time. I respect that you may feel that way, but I wholeheartedly disagree. People enjoy it. It's an amazing thing to be able to go see, participate, and socialize in person.
See, but how can you say that? Have you attended any of these live events in person to arrive at such a conclusion? Cause from my recollection these "Live Events" have always been super miniscule in scale apart from the brawl. I don't disagree with the idea of live events, they should just be miles better to constitute their investment
I should also mention that I couldn’t care less about the Battlerealm Brawl. Again, that’s something that only will cater to 16 at most players? I rather all the time and money it takes to get that going be put into the game instead. There are so many gameplay issues that I feel deserve more attention than that event. While I’m sure it’s fun for the whales at the top and helps their personal channels grow, it doesn’t do anything for the actual game.
There is no way a new player will watch that and be able to participate in that event the next year. You have to have a monster roster and spend a lot to qualify for that event. That’s the fatal flaw with Battlegrounds. To be at the top, you have to spend. Plus you have to have RNG luck to get all the meta attackers and defenders to drop.
And rereading Crashed's post, I'm actually more optimistic than I was earlier. The post is obviously 100% professional, but when he says things like: "It’s not surprising to me that Lagacy, Andrew, Trap and others at their level are extra salty with us about the current state of the game mode they dominate."
Or things like: "only three Celestial players quit in eight months.”
That signals to me that Kabam is a little tired of these people and their antics and neediness too.
That signals to me that Kabam's response might be: "We get it, you're the most invested and the loudest, but you're also the least likely to leave and are not representative of the actual player base at all."
Hopefully that means more things like R4 access to regular players and less things like exclusive status rewards for the megaspenders and status-hungry content creators. That is my hope at least.
Live Events have been a part of this game's history for a long time. I respect that you may feel that way, but I wholeheartedly disagree. People enjoy it. It's an amazing thing to be able to go see, participate, and socialize in person.
See, but how can you say that? Have you attended any of these live events in person to arrive at such a conclusion? Cause from my recollection these "Live Events" have always been super miniscule in scale apart from the brawl. I don't disagree with the idea of live events, they should just be miles better to constitute their investment
Have I? No. I've watched from home. It's still enjoyable to see people have fun, and I have yet to see someone complain about their experience that has gone. It's also not out of the realm of possibility for me. I'm Canadian. I can hop on a plane if I choose to attend the Brawl, which is what we're discussing. In any case, the Brawl was a success, and they said they would definitely be open to doing it again. Mind you that was Miike and Jax, but who knows? Whether they do or not isn't the point. We don't have to hate on something that was enjoyable altogether.
I should also mention that I couldn’t care less about the Battlerealm Brawl. Again, that’s something that only will cater to 16 at most players? I rather all the time and money it takes to get that going be put into the game instead. There are so many gameplay issues that I feel deserve more attention than that event. While I’m sure it’s fun for the whales at the top and helps their personal channels grow, it doesn’t do anything for the actual game.
There is no way a new player will watch that and be able to participate in that event the next year. You have to have a monster roster and spend a lot to qualify for that event. That’s the fatal flaw with Battlegrounds. To be at the top, you have to spend. Plus you have to have RNG luck to get all the meta attackers and defenders to drop.
And rereading Crashed's post, I'm actually more optimistic than I was earlier. The post is obviously 100% professional, but when he says things like: "It’s not surprising to me that Lagacy, Andrew, Trap and others at their level are extra salty with us about the current state of the game mode they dominate."
Or things like: "only three Celestial players quit in eight months.”
That signals to me that Kabam is a little tired of these people and their antics and neediness too.
That signals to me that Kabam's response might be: "We get it, you're the most invested and the loudest, but you're also the least likely to leave and are not representative of the actual player base at all."
Hopefully that means more things like R4 access to regular players and less things like exclusive status rewards for the megaspenders and status-hungry content creators. That is my hope at least.
Wouldn't it be more meaningful what percentage of players compete in track versus gladiator circuit and normalise those values to top 30 champ strenght, considering this is the pool size. This way we understand who benefits from the buff and who is not playing battlegrounds
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
I think a good thing to do with battlegrounds would be to equalize both attacking champions to the same level, so the gamemode isnt so terribly imbalanced. I am not Valiant yet, still need that last r3 7*, and i have like 20 7* champions, yet i get matched regularly with people who bring 4* in the match. So why not just make it so that star levels are the same for both players, and the power level is also equal, so the matches are more about skill and understanding the nodes, rather than being just about the roster. You can even make the nodes more complicated, but make sure both players are on equal footing.
I think a good thing to do with battlegrounds would be to equalize both attacking champions to the same level, so the gamemode isnt so terribly imbalanced. I am not Valiant yet, still need that last r3 7*, and i have like 20 7* champions, yet i get matched regularly with people who bring 4* in the match. So why not just make it so that star levels are the same for both players, and the power level is also equal, so the matches are more about skill and understanding the nodes, rather than being just about the roster. You can even make the nodes more complicated, but make sure both players are on equal footing.
Why stop there? Let’s go ahead and give everyone the same deck of 30 champs with same bans and mirror matches. That way everything is well balanced. Let’s see who is more skilled.
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
This is the biggest win for me out of all of this. It's so annoying when BG players derail discussions about how good a champion is and just say "can't finish fight in 30s. trash."
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
The best way to attract more players to BG is to get rid of or disincentivize the megaspender sharks who've made BG their entire identity and self-worth.
You have regular or casual players entering their first BG match thinking this is just a fun game and they're immediately greeted with this:
Like Kabam said, there's literally nothing they can do to make these people go away, despite these people constantly claiming how upset and unhappy they are with Kabam. They're like that dude who comes to your party uninvited and refuses to have a good time but also refuses to leave.
I think a good thing to do with battlegrounds would be to equalize both attacking champions to the same level, so the gamemode isnt so terribly imbalanced. I am not Valiant yet, still need that last r3 7*, and i have like 20 7* champions, yet i get matched regularly with people who bring 4* in the match. So why not just make it so that star levels are the same for both players, and the power level is also equal, so the matches are more about skill and understanding the nodes, rather than being just about the roster. You can even make the nodes more complicated, but make sure both players are on equal footing.
And then who’s going to rank up champion and for what??? How the hell Kabam can sell rank up items as well! The whales are the one keep breeding this game and they need to have advantage
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
Is that historically accurate across the history of the mode or is that currently true due to the high level of neglect causing most casual players to disengage with the mode? The complaint videos are about poor stewardship ending with less engagement so in a way this statistic could also make their point as well.
Also worth mentioning is that BGd lacks the same level of forced participation that AQ has grossly inflating the numbers of a mode that has far more detractors.
Either way when you are the only one with the stats, it’s easier to share the ones that help your argument while ignoring the ones that don’t.
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
Only thing worth mentioning here, is that historically accurate across the history of the mode or is that currently true due to the high level of neglect causing most casual players to disengage with the mode?
Despite its importance in the public domain of our game, Battlegrounds is a niche game mode. The vast majority of our players do not, nor have they ever, played Battlegrounds seriously, even when the rewards were top of the game shortly after it launched.
I think a good thing to do with battlegrounds would be to equalize both attacking champions to the same level, so the gamemode isnt so terribly imbalanced. I am not Valiant yet, still need that last r3 7*, and i have like 20 7* champions, yet i get matched regularly with people who bring 4* in the match. So why not just make it so that star levels are the same for both players, and the power level is also equal, so the matches are more about skill and understanding the nodes, rather than being just about the roster. You can even make the nodes more complicated, but make sure both players are on equal footing.
Why stop there? Let’s go ahead and give everyone the same deck of 30 champs with same bans and mirror matches. That way everything is well balanced. Let’s see who is more skilled.
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
Only thing worth mentioning here, is that historically accurate across the history of the mode or is that currently true due to the high level of neglect causing most casual players to disengage with the mode?
Despite its importance in the public domain of our game, Battlegrounds is a niche game mode. The vast majority of our players do not, nor have they ever, played Battlegrounds seriously, even when the rewards were top of the game shortly after it launched.
Still, it would be informative to understand what the peak of engagement was vs now. I also think it’s more multifaceted than just engagement too. Like how much more to people that play BGs engage on the contest vs other players? Because that might imply that more BGs players means more time in the contest too.
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
Only thing worth mentioning here, is that historically accurate across the history of the mode or is that currently true due to the high level of neglect causing most casual players to disengage with the mode?
Despite its importance in the public domain of our game, Battlegrounds is a niche game mode. The vast majority of our players do not, nor have they ever, played Battlegrounds seriously, even when the rewards were top of the game shortly after it launched.
Still, it would be informative to understand what the peak of engagement was vs now. I also think it’s more multifaceted than just engagement too. Like how much more to people that play BGs engage on the contest vs other players? Because that might imply that more BGs players means more time in the contest too.
Money spent isn’t engagement, but immediately following the part of Kabam Crashed’s post I quoted (I don’t feel like quoting and deleting that whole thread again) Crashed notes that bg players are not, as also commonly believed, the driving force of Kabam’s income either; he states the vast majority of revenue comes from players who have never seriously touched bgs in their life. I think it’s still reasonable to roughly correlate the two, since spenders presumably spend because they enjoy and play the game regularly enough to feel there’s value in buying things and/or supporting the game.
Either way when you are the only one with the stats, it’s easier to share the ones that help your argument while ignoring the ones that don’t.
And since I feel like touching on this point in particular, I don’t know what showing the data would help. You’re implicitly suggesting here that Crashed is lying by omission, that he’s only discussing the data that helps his point. If you think he’s doing that, I’m not sure why you wouldn’t also believe that he’d just make up the data wholesale. It’s not like you or anyone else here can verify it, he could just conjure a line graph from his own mind and there’d be no way to tell the difference unless he fudged the numbers to an absurd degree.
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
This is the biggest win for me out of all of this. It's so annoying when BG players derail discussions about how good a champion is and just say "can't finish fight in 30s. trash."
Exactly. But I know those guys will still say that Kabam Crash is worng lol
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
Is that historically accurate across the history of the mode or is that currently true due to the high level of neglect causing most casual players to disengage with the mode? The complaint videos are about poor stewardship ending with less engagement so in a way this statistic could also make their point as well.
Also worth mentioning is that BGd lacks the same level of forced participation that AQ has grossly inflating the numbers of a mode that has far more detractors.
Either way when you are the only one with the stats, it’s easier to share the ones that help your argument while ignoring the ones that don’t.
You should read Kabam Crash's post first then might be able to understand what is actual problem
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
Is that historically accurate across the history of the mode or is that currently true due to the high level of neglect causing most casual players to disengage with the mode? The complaint videos are about poor stewardship ending with less engagement so in a way this statistic could also make their point as well.
Also worth mentioning is that BGd lacks the same level of forced participation that AQ has grossly inflating the numbers of a mode that has far more detractors.
Either way when you are the only one with the stats, it’s easier to share the ones that help your argument while ignoring the ones that don’t.
I am split on the engagement. Matter of fact I am split on their research on any data on BGs wether its positive or negative. Why? I do believe BGs data or participation numbers were constantly padded by secondary events. How many times have you heard the phrase "Its a special BG season because of X reason". If BGs had been solely BGs and have nothing else attached to them, the numbers would be completely different and a lot of people would have stopped playing for the subpar rewards.
Kabam Crash: BG's not played by most player and niche BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
Is that historically accurate across the history of the mode or is that currently true due to the high level of neglect causing most casual players to disengage with the mode? The complaint videos are about poor stewardship ending with less engagement so in a way this statistic could also make their point as well.
Also worth mentioning is that BGd lacks the same level of forced participation that AQ has grossly inflating the numbers of a mode that has far more detractors.
Either way when you are the only one with the stats, it’s easier to share the ones that help your argument while ignoring the ones that don’t.
I am split on the engagement. Matter of fact I am split on their research on any data on BGs wether its positive or negative. Why? I do believe BGs data or participation numbers were constantly padded by secondary events. How many times have you heard the phrase "Its a special BG season because of X reason". If BGs had been solely BGs and have nothing else attached to them, the numbers would be completely different and a lot of people would have stopped playing for the subpar rewards.
I'm not sure to what extent, but I'd say this is a valid point, just based off of listening to feedback. People were getting bored with the game mode, and one of the things that made them more engaged was the tie-ins. I don't know what kind of a boost, but I think there's some truth to that.
Either way when you are the only one with the stats, it’s easier to share the ones that help your argument while ignoring the ones that don’t.
From Squid, “And since I feel like touching on this point in particular, I don’t know what showing the data would help. You’re implicitly suggesting here that Crashed is lying by omission, that he’s only discussing the data that helps his point. If you think he’s doing that, I’m not sure why you wouldn’t also believe that he’d just make up the data wholesale. It’s not like you or anyone else here can verify it, he could just conjure a line graph from his own mind and there’d be no way to tell the difference unless he fudged the numbers to an absurd degree.”
Sloppy wording on my part, my apologies as that was not my intent. More so it’s easy to confirm your own biases if you are pulling numbers to support a narrative but perhaps not pausing to challenge what the number means… which I felt was the case reading Crash’s essay.
I think this is especially true of a multifaceted metric like “engagement”. More goes into this number than “does a player want to play this mode?” Incentives, reliability, enjoyment and peer pressure all contribute. And what I poorly failed at articulating before is that while their are some Bags alliances and requirements at top of the game most alliances are still constructed around AW… and probably even more are constructed around completing AQ.
I don’t think looking at AQ engagement is a constructive way to assess that mode outside of “does peer pressure work” as an engagement tactic as, that’s answer is undeniably yes. That doesn’t mean it’s a good mode in a healthy state as engagement is outsourced to the alliances themselves.
So then, I question how valuable is that metric is in general, especially when the stewardship for BGs never really evolved it past the introduction of Elder’s Marks, the source of so many of the current issues in BGs today. (And I guess a scoring change, and reducing metas… but I don’t really count meta management reduction).
I get that there are people who say that BGs is for a small percentage of people, however this game needs a new game mode to keep the current player base “happy” as well as attract new players. I am not the first to suggest this, but I think a great idea would be to have two BG areas.
The first would be the current one that is highly competitive with high end rewards. The other would be a casual/fun focused one that had themes that make it accessible to more players. You could gate it to 3*, 4*, or 5* only champs or have Avengers only or Avengers vs X-Men only (still gated by either 3*, 4*, or 5*). Something more light and fun with themed rewards, maybe a unique champ not available currently. Mitigate adding a new part of the game by killing off one that is boring and stale like Incursions and only bring it back for themed special events.
I just hope that Kabam is allowed to bring on a few more people to help bring some new life into the game. We need another event like the Deathless chase, these Eidols so far are not really cutting it, for me anyway.
Comments
The post is obviously 100% professional, but when he says things like: "It’s not surprising to me that Lagacy, Andrew, Trap and others at their level are extra salty with us about the current state of the game mode they dominate."
Or things like: "only three Celestial players quit in eight months.”
That signals to me that Kabam is a little tired of these people and their antics and neediness too.
That signals to me that Kabam's response might be: "We get it, you're the most invested and the loudest, but you're also the least likely to leave and are not representative of the actual player base at all."
Hopefully that means more things like R4 access to regular players and less things like exclusive status rewards for the megaspenders and status-hungry content creators.
That is my hope at least.
It's also not out of the realm of possibility for me. I'm Canadian. I can hop on a plane if I choose to attend the Brawl, which is what we're discussing.
In any case, the Brawl was a success, and they said they would definitely be open to doing it again. Mind you that was Miike and Jax, but who knows? Whether they do or not isn't the point. We don't have to hate on something that was enjoyable altogether.
You have been critically hit by giant wall of text. Incur bleed damage and heal block.
This way we understand who benefits from the buff and who is not playing battlegrounds
BG Glazers entire persona got destroyed who thought and argued that BGs was most important and most played mode lol
But glad, Kabam is doing something about the mode so it can attract more players
You have regular or casual players entering their first BG match thinking this is just a fun game and they're immediately greeted with this:
Like Kabam said, there's literally nothing they can do to make these people go away, despite these people constantly claiming how upset and unhappy they are with Kabam.
They're like that dude who comes to your party uninvited and refuses to have a good time but also refuses to leave.
Also worth mentioning is that BGd lacks the same level of forced participation that AQ has grossly inflating the numbers of a mode that has far more detractors.
Either way when you are the only one with the stats, it’s easier to share the ones that help your argument while ignoring the ones that don’t.
Sloppy wording on my part, my apologies as that was not my intent. More so it’s easy to confirm your own biases if you are pulling numbers to support a narrative but perhaps not pausing to challenge what the number means… which I felt was the case reading Crash’s essay.
I think this is especially true of a multifaceted metric like “engagement”. More goes into this number than “does a player want to play this mode?” Incentives, reliability, enjoyment and peer pressure all contribute. And what I poorly failed at articulating before is that while their are some Bags alliances and requirements at top of the game most alliances are still constructed around AW… and probably even more are constructed around completing AQ.
I don’t think looking at AQ engagement is a constructive way to assess that mode outside of “does peer pressure work” as an engagement tactic as, that’s answer is undeniably yes. That doesn’t mean it’s a good mode in a healthy state as engagement is outsourced to the alliances themselves.
So then, I question how valuable is that metric is in general, especially when the stewardship for BGs never really evolved it past the introduction of Elder’s Marks, the source of so many of the current issues in BGs today. (And I guess a scoring change, and reducing metas… but I don’t really count meta management reduction).
The first would be the current one that is highly competitive with high end rewards. The other would be a casual/fun focused one that had themes that make it accessible to more players. You could gate it to 3*, 4*, or 5* only champs or have Avengers only or Avengers vs X-Men only (still gated by either 3*, 4*, or 5*). Something more light and fun with themed rewards, maybe a unique champ not available currently. Mitigate adding a new part of the game by killing off one that is boring and stale like Incursions and only bring it back for themed special events.
I just hope that Kabam is allowed to bring on a few more people to help bring some new life into the game. We need another event like the Deathless chase, these Eidols so far are not really cutting it, for me anyway.