Black Widow "compensation"

Now before you hate… I'm talking about compensating her abilities for her harsh treatment in v13!

Thor never had much competition on Armor break (aside from IF who is frail)
SW was OP and currently everyone is pleased with her
DS (I actually have throughts on how to make him better on another discussion)

However BW wasn't just reduced to a more balanced ability… she was dragged into the mix with Cross Bones who has ALL the damage and his ability reduction and GP who has ALL the bleeds
And even voodoo who can act as an ability reduction champ

However that's the problem! GP and Voodoo just need a single sig, CB is always ready, and BW… she needs a high dupe… Quake synergy helps her a little bit however the other all she is WAY more effectively

Black widow has some damage on her crits however it's not a lot especially when compared to the other big 3

I was thinking what if she had an L1 like Punisher but with her wrist weapon from Civil War! A punch followed by 2 electric blasts that each deal… 60%? Shock damage

Her L2 could be altered a bit to give her bleed damage like say WS L1

I know a good amount are probably going to hate this idea but currently she is FAR more work to get same results but less damage and it makes it hard for her to stand out

Comments

Illuminant

This sounds good actually I don't honk kabam will change her now but I like this!

Thawnim

Mr_Otter wrote: »

Now before you hate… I'm talking about compensating her abilities for her harsh treatment in v13!

Thor never had much competition on Armor break (aside from IF who is frail)
SW was OP and currently everyone is pleased with her
DS (I actually have throughts on how to make him better on another discussion)

However BW wasn't just reduced to a more balanced ability… she was dragged into the mix with Cross Bones who has ALL the damage and his ability reduction and GP who has ALL the bleeds
And even voodoo who can act as an ability reduction champ

However that's the problem! GP and Voodoo just need a single sig, CB is always ready, and BW… she needs a high dupe… Quake synergy helps her a little bit however the other all she is WAY more effectively

Black widow has some damage on her crits however it's not a lot especially when compared to the other big 3

I was thinking what if she had an L1 like Punisher but with her wrist weapon from Civil War! A punch followed by 2 electric blasts that each deal… 60%? Shock damage

Her L2 could be altered a bit to give her bleed damage like say WS L1

I know a good amount are probably going to hate this idea but currently she is FAR more work to get same results but less damage and it makes it hard for her to stand out

Just make her s2 as effective as it used to be. Aside from her signature ability it was her s2 that made her so dangerous. It used to be one where if you were facing her and missed blocking it or evading it you might be ko'd.

Thawnim

That said I wouldn't mind seeing the changes you suggest to her. Something is better than nothing.

LocoMotives

Elektra better too. But BW not "useless" and many people already maxed her before she got nerfed, so I don't think she will get revisited. There's no profit in buffing a champ many have already maxed out.

Mr_Otter

LocoMotives wrote: »

Elektra better too. But BW not "useless" and many people already maxed her before she got nerfed, so I don't think she will get revisited. There's no profit in buffing a champ many have already maxed out.

THANK YOU! I forgot Elektra also pushes BW into a corner quite a bit as well

DNA3000

If I had to rate the AAR debuffing skill champs, I think that Elektra and CB are better than Black Widow, but I think general ratings aren't the best way to look at the champs. The way I tend to look at them is to ask whether they serve some specific role or do some specific job effectively. In other words, do I actually use them for something in at least one situation. And for me Black Widow does serve a purpose: I use her in the enhanced poison lane in Map 5 where you see four science champs in a row and Electro and Abomination back to back with Abom having enhanced poison. That lane seems tailor made for Black Widow. CB, Elektra, and GB will take more damage than BW because their AAR doesn't start off at full strength. BW benefits from having her maximum AAR right at the start of the fight.

Right up to day five BW can take out that path for me and remain at reasonably high health unless I get horrible luck, which means she does a job well and its not a marginal job. I wouldn't argue with a buff, but she's not anywhere near the top of my list of champions that need a buff, because she is still useful in a non-trivial way.

Mr_Otter

@DNA3000 I see your point however she is lacking a decent amount of damage which is mostly where I'm at. Without her 100% anymore I feel like adding some DoT would help her transition feel more like a balance and not a nerf

X_Scott

Yeah I got her lvl 99 r5 and i was too dumb to rank her down when i had the chance. I cried for a few weeks, but I'm getting through it!

DaMunk

I'm with Thawnim, boost her specials and she'd be R5 worthy again. Her and Dr. Strange are missed.

xNig

She's still the best choice in war for left bodyguard.

Crossbones get wrecked by mirror image.

Elektra can't get bleeds / armour break off.

Gwenpool can't bleed the opponent.

AA can't poison / bleed.

Yes BW does serve her purpose.

Mr_Otter

xNig wrote: »

She's still the best choice in war for left bodyguard.

Crossbones get wrecked by mirror image.

Elektra can't get bleeds / armour break off.

Gwenpool can't bleed the opponent.

AA can't poison / bleed.

Yes BW does serve her purpose.

GP doesn't need bleeds for her special

Elektra is shut only by Immunity nodes and tenacity-like champs (AV, KG, Karnak, Rogue Groot) a very small gap

AA yes is harder to use than Elektra but he has that DAMAGE I was talking about

CB… is lethal! He has plenty of damage PLUS a decently reliable ability drop

BW doesn't have a scenario that beats the rest... well… GP has slow build up and CB has crit reliance but it's really not worth the huge damage drop for SUUUUUUUUUCH a niche pick

If it was for Vision getting past Immunity DeadPool than yes it'd be worth it!

However Safeguard is easily wrecked by *see the above* plus DoT damage champs which is basically anyone with a Bleed or Voodoo/Hyperion (Hype L1 that is)

Also with common mastery builds both Elektra and CB are just insane! Elektra with deep wound master makes hers last a lot longer and CB woth crit masteries and extended fury is just a recipe to destroy!

BW I for when like Electro and Abomination team up on Immunity nodes to stop Elektra but you still have the heavy hitting CB unless there is a crit ban which isn't really a thing unless you have MAD AMOUNTS of fatigue in which case:
LOL YOURE GETTING BEAT UP BY ANT-FIXIT