If you brought a car for the sole purpose that it can go 100mph and that was the selling point it was sold to you on. But then got it home an the speed was capped at 50 you think thats ok for a company to do?
Or you buy a dvr recorder because it has 200 hours record space bit get it home to find it only has 100 you wouldnt complain and expect a refund or some sort of compensation?
MD isn't getting nerfed that much dude.... Don't manipulate situations. What you're doing is making it look like they nerfed MD horribly. Check exactly what they did.
In the grand scheme, if the game is going to evolve and change in general, why is it so bad to have a yearly rank down ticket to allow people to rank down a champ they no longer find valuable for one they do? Purely as a goodwill gesture, something helpful, yada yada yada. This wouldn't be in response to one thing they change, nerf or what not, but just a general evolution of the game and something that allows people to change at least one champ to help compensate for it without having to deplete their more valuable resources.
So kabam is not releasing rank down tickets because it wasn’t a bug. So was it a bug when kabam nerfed Thor back in the day and we all got rank down tickets because we spent time and money for the best thor??
I took Magik to 4/55 specifically sure to MD. T2a is very hard for me to get. Magik isn't as good as she was.
That goes for so many other players. I do believe asking for a RTD for mystics isn't an unreasonable demand. Knowing kabam, they don't care about players. The game is really bad for last few months. They made so many changes and we all saw how they compensated. So, don't waste time expecting anything from them.
I like the changes to MD and DEX. I think it is the correct adjustment. I like the way that Kabam is reimbursing the players and letting them decide if they want MD after the change. If Kabam wanted to be the most fair to its player, I agree with Ish,the original post, that they should give rank down to mystics. The difference between a changing meta and changing champions is subtle, however valid. I believe that Kabam owes those players the same choice as they are doing with the mastery. I felt the same about Archangel too.
I say give out RDTs but only give half the rescources back.
I mean when you drive a car for 2 years and go to trade it in you only get current value. And people are crying saying current value of mystic defenders is trash/nothing so guess what you don’t get full value back.
Unless you are willing to admit you only want RDTs so you can rank up your new god tier you got.
In the grand scheme, if the game is going to evolve and change in general, why is it so bad to have a yearly rank down ticket to allow people to rank down a champ they no longer find valuable for one they do? Purely as a goodwill gesture, something helpful, yada yada yada. This wouldn't be in response to one thing they change, nerf or what not, but just a general evolution of the game and something that allows people to change at least one champ to help compensate for it without having to deplete their more valuable resources.
Probably because even if given out annually the community will still want more. It’s no secret that rdt’s were used on every regretted rank up but who it was intended for in 12.0 even if the tickets were generic. Even if mystic tickets were given out nobody will rank down Dorm. Champ specific rdt’s should’ve been given out from the start.
If you are against RDTs or any other form of compensation for what is CLEARLY A NERF, you are legitimizing Kabam to do whatever they want in the future.
If you are against RDTs or any other form of compensation for what is CLEARLY A NERF, you are legitimizing Kabam to do whatever they want in the future.
Thanks guys, but don't worry, you are next.
It's not a nerf it's a bug fix and frankly it was stupid dodging an unblockable 3 hit soecial and giving them another bar of power! All they did was make it fairer to players! Rank down tickets unbalance the game... the problem is everyone asks for them over silly things so they don't take actual issues seriously and that's the main issue... at least from what it seems.
If you are against RDTs or any other form of compensation for what is CLEARLY A NERF, you are legitimizing Kabam to do whatever they want in the future.
Thanks guys, but don't worry, you are next.
It's not a nerf it's a bug fix and frankly it was stupid dodging an unblockable 3 hit soecial and giving them another bar of power! All they did was make it fairer to players! Rank down tickets unbalance the game... the problem is everyone asks for them over silly things so they don't take actual issues seriously and that's the main issue... at least from what it seems.
It's a nerf, period, and it was NEVER OFFICIALLY reported as bug and NO ONE ever said "Don't rank mystic champions in order to exploit MD", simply because there was nothing to exploit. No exploit, no bug, NERF.
We are not discussing if MD was too powerful (it was), the point is the negative effect on SOME mystic champions after the change (specifically Dormammu and Juggy) that results in a huge nerf for those champions.
Rank down tickets doesn't unbalance the game, nerfed champs does. I feel cheated (again).
MD is a Utility mastery, an add on, not an actual champion ability. The mastery was available to add on by buying it. The compensation will be the resources used to purchase this mastery will be returned. The champions themselves have not been changed. No more than they would have been if a player had never bought the MD mastery. Also, if people out there are using rare resources to rank Just for AW defense then that's a bad decision in the first place. And that bring us to RDT. People always asking for them just to fix their bad decision making. Rank smart and think ahead, problem solved.....
My r4 5* Rulk destroys All mystics in war and has since they reworked him. Mystic wars have been dead for awhile now. Since the addition of Blade and the rework of Rulk as examples. Anyone who's ranked Mystic champs specifically for AW defense, especially since the above mentioned, wasn't paying much attention to the game obviously.
I say give out RDTs but only give half the rescources back.
Unless you are willing to admit you only want RDTs so you can rank up your new god tier you got.
This.... As new champs enter the game or people aquire some of the better champs in the game they want RDT to rank up those champs, although they won't admit it.
I took Magik to 4/55 specifically sure to MD. T2a is very hard for me to get. Magik isn't as good as she was.
That goes for so many other players. I do believe asking for a RTD for mystics isn't an unreasonable demand. Knowing kabam, they don't care about players. The game is really bad for last few months. They made so many changes and we all saw how they compensated. So, don't waste time expecting anything from them.
Magik will be unaffected on offense due to the MD change as far as I understand? I can't imagine your ranked her up for defense....?
MD is a Utility mastery, an add on, not an actual champion ability. The mastery was available to add on by buying it. The compensation will be the resources used to purchase this mastery will be returned. The champions themselves have not been changed. No more than they would have been if a player had never bought the MD mastery. Also, if people out there are using rare resources to rank Just for AW defense then that's a bad decision in the first place. And that bring us to RDT. People always asking for them just to fix their bad decision making. Rank smart and think ahead, problem solved.....
MD is a Utility mastery for MYSTICS. If you change the mastery, you NERF the champs! Is that so complicated to undertand? What you say is just hiding something behind words, an expedient to indirectly nerf champs. But it's still a nerf.
But let me make a VERY STUPID example... Let's say one day Kabam will say: "We are changing CRUELTY. If you use cruelty with Blade, he will be insantly killed in any fight".
What will you say? Not a nerf because cruelty is a GENERAL mastery? (As as said it's a very stupid example, but it's explain the expedient that you are allowing.)
As for "using rare resources to rank Just for AW defense then that's a bad decision in the first place", that's your opinion. Fact is Dormammu was one of the biggest badass in AW. Then they released Blade, Hulk R. and now changing MD (which was not really necessary at this time). We are screwed 3 times and you don't want us to get a specific RDT because... You don't have Dormammu? Selfishness? As I said, today is against me, tomorrow you could be next.
Last but not least, I'll take a specific RDT which can only be used on a future MYSTIC champion only. What I don't want is my resources lost on a useless character because of some changes.
I'm legit laughing that people here are saying that ranking champs for defense is a dumb move and then talk about in-game strategy. Yall just place r1s all over the map?
I'm legit laughing that people here are saying that ranking champs for defense is a dumb move and then talk about in-game strategy. Yall just place r1s all over the map?
Lot of players in this thread don’t understand AW defenders placement. AW Seasons made ranking up strong defenders crucial for winning T5BC and T2AC shards. Funny how many players either don’t get that or ignore that because that fact contradicts their opinions. Not sure which one since plenty of master AW alliances who’ve never finished top 3 have multiple members who’ve only taken AW attackers to 5/65.
I'm legit laughing that people here are saying that ranking champs for defense is a dumb move and then talk about in-game strategy. Yall just place r1s all over the map?
Lot of players in this thread don’t understand AW defenders placement. AW Seasons made ranking up strong defenders crucial for winning T5BC and T2AC shards. Funny how many players either don’t get that or ignore that because that fact contradicts their opinions. Not sure which one since plenty of master AW alliances who’ve never finished top 3 have multiple members who’ve only taken AW attackers to 5/65.
If anyone took a champ to 5/65 just bc of MD that is insane their is SO MANY better defenders that aren't mystic. Wasp. Thor Rag. Medusa. KillMonger. KingPin. Green Goblin. Blade. Stark Spidey. Iron Man IW. Domino. Sentinel. IceMan. Quake. Hulk Rag. Korg. Night Crawler. Cable. Red Hulk. Hyperion. Venom and Carnage (when they get buffed) Modok. Rogue. SaberTooth. Bishop. Cap IW. Sentry. Red Skull. There's probably many more that I missed... Everyone I named are worth 4/55 if not 5/65.... Nobody was forced to rank up Mystics for defense... They chose to.
I'm legit laughing that people here are saying that ranking champs for defense is a dumb move and then talk about in-game strategy. Yall just place r1s all over the map?
Lot of players in this thread don’t understand AW defenders placement. AW Seasons made ranking up strong defenders crucial for winning T5BC and T2AC shards. Funny how many players either don’t get that or ignore that because that fact contradicts their opinions. Not sure which one since plenty of master AW alliances who’ve never finished top 3 have multiple members who’ve only taken AW attackers to 5/65.
If anyone took a champ to 5/65 just bc of MD that is insane their is SO MANY better defenders that aren't mystic. Wasp. Thor Rag. Medusa. KillMonger. KingPin. Green Goblin. Blade. Stark Spidey. Iron Man IW. Domino. Sentinel. IceMan. Quake. Hulk Rag. Korg. Night Crawler. Cable. Red Hulk. Hyperion. Venom and Carnage (when they get buffed) Modok. Rogue. SaberTooth. Bishop. Cap IW. Sentry. Red Skull. There's probably many more that I missed... Everyone I named are worth 4/55 if not 5/65.... Nobody was forced to rank up Mystics for defense... They chose to.
If they chose to, they did so because they had md at 4 or 5 and that fact gives mystics an extra utility. Defenders die. Every champ you named gets solo'd on the best node you could place them on. Every one of them. (I won't spend time on the fact that some of those names above suck really, really, REALLY bad on defense). But when a champ had some sort of extra utility (esp when it can interact with a node), it forces the attacker to be closer to perfect in order to survive.
And in the end, idky I'm spending time explaining this. It's a waste of time. The champs were devalued because their class specific mastery... The best class specific mastery in the game... Was nerfed for defense. They were at x value, now that value is greatly dropped. Literally every argument in this thread saying otherwise is simply sidetracking with straw men.
If anyone took a champ to 5/65 just bc of MD that is insane their is SO MANY better defenders that aren't mystic. Wasp. Thor Rag. Medusa. KillMonger. KingPin. Green Goblin. Blade. Stark Spidey. Iron Man IW. Domino. Sentinel. IceMan. Quake. Hulk Rag. Korg. Night Crawler. Cable. Red Hulk. Hyperion. Venom and Carnage (when they get buffed) Modok. Rogue. SaberTooth. Bishop. Cap IW. Sentry. Red Skull. There's probably many more that I missed... Everyone I named are worth 4/55 if not 5/65.... Nobody was forced to rank up Mystics for defense... They chose to.
I didn’t say anyone took a mystic champion to 5/65 for MD. Your list of defenders has a few holes:
Killmonger/Kingpin/Green Goblin/Venom/Carnage/MODOK - All soloed by Blade when he has his synergy with GR
Thor Ragnarok/Cable - Tough defenders on less than a handful of nodes against players who know how to fight him
Quake/Nightcrawler/Red Hulk/Cap IW/Sentry/Red Skull/Rogue - Tough defenders on 0 nodes against players who know how to fight them
Wasp/Hyperion/Sentinel/Bishop/Hulk Ragnarok/Iceman/Blade - Tough defenders on more nodes than Thor Ragnarok/Cable
Medusa/Stark Spidey/Iron Man IW/Domino/Korg - Tough defenders period
Going back to how mystic defenders benefited from the old MD/dexterity interaction as AW defenders:
5/65 Dormammu w/max MD and high signature ability - Best main AW boss period. Could be soloed by Magik/Gladiator Hulk. Never saw video footage of 5/65 Dormammu being soloed by Blade in tiers 1-3.
4/55+ Juggernaut/Unstoppable Colossus w/max MD - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW on nodes like 18, 48, 50, and 55.
4/55+ Morningstar w/max MD - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW on nodes like 44 and 53. Decent main boss but could be soloed by Blade and Dr. Voodoo.
4/55+ Magik w/max MD and high signature ability - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW anywhere as a hidden defender who didn’t show up in players profiles.
4/55+ Mephisto w/max MD - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW on nodes like 29 and 30.
I run max MD for Dr. Voodoo and was 100% for the MD/dexterity changes. It’s been great not getting screwed by mystic champions on arena death squads.
The MCOC meta evolving is one thing. The MCOC meta being changed in an instant on the part of developers instead of players meets Kabam Miike’s previously detailed criteria for some kind of compensation being warranted.
Wasp- terrible defender. Has a timer to help you not die
Thor rag- eh decent... But only because his power gain, which HMMMM is similar enough to the effects of md. Wow. A defender gaining power makes them a better defender. I am mind blown.
Medusa- her time on defense has passed... Long, long passed
Kp- can be annoying. Can def be annoying. But can also be very accommodating w his L1 lol
Goblin- meh nbd
Blade- pretty good but if we're arguing better defenders or attackers... The argument would stalemate most likely.
Km- great at everything. Oh man I love km
Spark- Meh. Def better on offense.
Iwim- ppl figured him out in week 1. It's a dumb fight.
Domino- amazing champ, still gets solo'd. Still also pretty rare
Sentinel- might as well be king groot
Ice, quake, gulk--can be annoying, still get solo'd
Nc, cable, rulk, modok, Sabre, capiw, Sentry, skull--terrible defenders
Rogue--people really have issues with limber?
Hype- he rocked in old wars I guess? Maybe?
Venom and Carnage? You're just grasping at straws here.
So, yeah. I guess we've seen that the definition of a good defender can be somewhat subjective and is definitely dependent on skill on attack and war tier. A lot of it is based on pulls as well. People rank the champs that they have that do the job best, while still fitting into their progression plans. We've also seen trying to "blame" people for making smart moves for their particular progress place in the game is a little short sighted.
I don't have any R4 mystic defenders. They didn't fit into my plans or progression. So this isn't a personal thing for me. It's much more about the simple fact that plenty of others have invested rare and valuable resources into something that was devalued. The straw men arguments don't do anything to change that.
MD isn't getting nerfed that much dude.... Don't manipulate situations. What you're doing is making it look like they nerfed MD horribly. Check exactly what they did. [/quote]
Im not manipulating and i know exactly what the changes are. This has drastically nerfed md on defence as the multiple evades to bait specials was by far the trickiest part and what made it powerful. For attack the changes are minimal but on def they are huge.
This thread is not being moved up when new comments are added. Why is that?
Usually it's because the thread has x number of flags or the mods have turned off bumping. I haven't checked the # of flags, but both those things above happen frequently... Tho you'd have to guess at the reasons for them.
I took Magik to 4/55 specifically sure to MD. T2a is very hard for me to get. Magik isn't as good as she was.
That goes for so many other players. I do believe asking for a RTD for mystics isn't an unreasonable demand. Knowing kabam, they don't care about players. The game is really bad for last few months. They made so many changes and we all saw how they compensated. So, don't waste time expecting anything from them.
Magik will be unaffected on offense due to the MD change as far as I understand? I can't imagine your ranked her up for defense....?
I ranked her up for defense when she was still a viable defense option. And I didn't have any good defenders. She used to give me decent kills before blade was introduced. There are many options now.
Comments
MD isn't getting nerfed that much dude.... Don't manipulate situations. What you're doing is making it look like they nerfed MD horribly. Check exactly what they did.
That goes for so many other players. I do believe asking for a RTD for mystics isn't an unreasonable demand. Knowing kabam, they don't care about players. The game is really bad for last few months. They made so many changes and we all saw how they compensated. So, don't waste time expecting anything from them.
I mean when you drive a car for 2 years and go to trade it in you only get current value. And people are crying saying current value of mystic defenders is trash/nothing so guess what you don’t get full value back.
Unless you are willing to admit you only want RDTs so you can rank up your new god tier you got.
Probably because even if given out annually the community will still want more. It’s no secret that rdt’s were used on every regretted rank up but who it was intended for in 12.0 even if the tickets were generic. Even if mystic tickets were given out nobody will rank down Dorm. Champ specific rdt’s should’ve been given out from the start.
Thanks guys, but don't worry, you are next.
It's not a nerf it's a bug fix and frankly it was stupid dodging an unblockable 3 hit soecial and giving them another bar of power! All they did was make it fairer to players! Rank down tickets unbalance the game... the problem is everyone asks for them over silly things so they don't take actual issues seriously and that's the main issue... at least from what it seems.
It's a nerf, period, and it was NEVER OFFICIALLY reported as bug and NO ONE ever said "Don't rank mystic champions in order to exploit MD", simply because there was nothing to exploit. No exploit, no bug, NERF.
We are not discussing if MD was too powerful (it was), the point is the negative effect on SOME mystic champions after the change (specifically Dormammu and Juggy) that results in a huge nerf for those champions.
Rank down tickets doesn't unbalance the game, nerfed champs does. I feel cheated (again).
This.... As new champs enter the game or people aquire some of the better champs in the game they want RDT to rank up those champs, although they won't admit it.
Magik will be unaffected on offense due to the MD change as far as I understand? I can't imagine your ranked her up for defense....?
MD is a Utility mastery for MYSTICS. If you change the mastery, you NERF the champs! Is that so complicated to undertand? What you say is just hiding something behind words, an expedient to indirectly nerf champs. But it's still a nerf.
But let me make a VERY STUPID example... Let's say one day Kabam will say: "We are changing CRUELTY. If you use cruelty with Blade, he will be insantly killed in any fight".
What will you say? Not a nerf because cruelty is a GENERAL mastery? (As as said it's a very stupid example, but it's explain the expedient that you are allowing.)
As for "using rare resources to rank Just for AW defense then that's a bad decision in the first place", that's your opinion. Fact is Dormammu was one of the biggest badass in AW. Then they released Blade, Hulk R. and now changing MD (which was not really necessary at this time). We are screwed 3 times and you don't want us to get a specific RDT because... You don't have Dormammu? Selfishness? As I said, today is against me, tomorrow you could be next.
Last but not least, I'll take a specific RDT which can only be used on a future MYSTIC champion only. What I don't want is my resources lost on a useless character because of some changes.
Is that fine for everyone?
Lot of players in this thread don’t understand AW defenders placement. AW Seasons made ranking up strong defenders crucial for winning T5BC and T2AC shards. Funny how many players either don’t get that or ignore that because that fact contradicts their opinions. Not sure which one since plenty of master AW alliances who’ve never finished top 3 have multiple members who’ve only taken AW attackers to 5/65.
If anyone took a champ to 5/65 just bc of MD that is insane their is SO MANY better defenders that aren't mystic. Wasp. Thor Rag. Medusa. KillMonger. KingPin. Green Goblin. Blade. Stark Spidey. Iron Man IW. Domino. Sentinel. IceMan. Quake. Hulk Rag. Korg. Night Crawler. Cable. Red Hulk. Hyperion. Venom and Carnage (when they get buffed) Modok. Rogue. SaberTooth. Bishop. Cap IW. Sentry. Red Skull. There's probably many more that I missed... Everyone I named are worth 4/55 if not 5/65.... Nobody was forced to rank up Mystics for defense... They chose to.
If they chose to, they did so because they had md at 4 or 5 and that fact gives mystics an extra utility. Defenders die. Every champ you named gets solo'd on the best node you could place them on. Every one of them. (I won't spend time on the fact that some of those names above suck really, really, REALLY bad on defense). But when a champ had some sort of extra utility (esp when it can interact with a node), it forces the attacker to be closer to perfect in order to survive.
And in the end, idky I'm spending time explaining this. It's a waste of time. The champs were devalued because their class specific mastery... The best class specific mastery in the game... Was nerfed for defense. They were at x value, now that value is greatly dropped. Literally every argument in this thread saying otherwise is simply sidetracking with straw men.
I didn’t say anyone took a mystic champion to 5/65 for MD. Your list of defenders has a few holes:
Killmonger/Kingpin/Green Goblin/Venom/Carnage/MODOK - All soloed by Blade when he has his synergy with GR
Thor Ragnarok/Cable - Tough defenders on less than a handful of nodes against players who know how to fight him
Quake/Nightcrawler/Red Hulk/Cap IW/Sentry/Red Skull/Rogue - Tough defenders on 0 nodes against players who know how to fight them
Wasp/Hyperion/Sentinel/Bishop/Hulk Ragnarok/Iceman/Blade - Tough defenders on more nodes than Thor Ragnarok/Cable
Medusa/Stark Spidey/Iron Man IW/Domino/Korg - Tough defenders period
Going back to how mystic defenders benefited from the old MD/dexterity interaction as AW defenders:
5/65 Dormammu w/max MD and high signature ability - Best main AW boss period. Could be soloed by Magik/Gladiator Hulk. Never saw video footage of 5/65 Dormammu being soloed by Blade in tiers 1-3.
4/55+ Juggernaut/Unstoppable Colossus w/max MD - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW on nodes like 18, 48, 50, and 55.
4/55+ Morningstar w/max MD - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW on nodes like 44 and 53. Decent main boss but could be soloed by Blade and Dr. Voodoo.
4/55+ Magik w/max MD and high signature ability - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW anywhere as a hidden defender who didn’t show up in players profiles.
4/55+ Mephisto w/max MD - Tough defender in tier 1-3 AW on nodes like 29 and 30.
I run max MD for Dr. Voodoo and was 100% for the MD/dexterity changes. It’s been great not getting screwed by mystic champions on arena death squads.
The MCOC meta evolving is one thing. The MCOC meta being changed in an instant on the part of developers instead of players meets Kabam Miike’s previously detailed criteria for some kind of compensation being warranted.
Wasp- terrible defender. Has a timer to help you not die
Thor rag- eh decent... But only because his power gain, which HMMMM is similar enough to the effects of md. Wow. A defender gaining power makes them a better defender. I am mind blown.
Medusa- her time on defense has passed... Long, long passed
Kp- can be annoying. Can def be annoying. But can also be very accommodating w his L1 lol
Goblin- meh nbd
Blade- pretty good but if we're arguing better defenders or attackers... The argument would stalemate most likely.
Km- great at everything. Oh man I love km
Spark- Meh. Def better on offense.
Iwim- ppl figured him out in week 1. It's a dumb fight.
Domino- amazing champ, still gets solo'd. Still also pretty rare
Sentinel- might as well be king groot
Ice, quake, gulk--can be annoying, still get solo'd
Nc, cable, rulk, modok, Sabre, capiw, Sentry, skull--terrible defenders
Rogue--people really have issues with limber?
Hype- he rocked in old wars I guess? Maybe?
Venom and Carnage? You're just grasping at straws here.
So, yeah. I guess we've seen that the definition of a good defender can be somewhat subjective and is definitely dependent on skill on attack and war tier. A lot of it is based on pulls as well. People rank the champs that they have that do the job best, while still fitting into their progression plans. We've also seen trying to "blame" people for making smart moves for their particular progress place in the game is a little short sighted.
I don't have any R4 mystic defenders. They didn't fit into my plans or progression. So this isn't a personal thing for me. It's much more about the simple fact that plenty of others have invested rare and valuable resources into something that was devalued. The straw men arguments don't do anything to change that.
MD isn't getting nerfed that much dude.... Don't manipulate situations. What you're doing is making it look like they nerfed MD horribly. Check exactly what they did. [/quote]
Im not manipulating and i know exactly what the changes are. This has drastically nerfed md on defence as the multiple evades to bait specials was by far the trickiest part and what made it powerful. For attack the changes are minimal but on def they are huge.
Usually it's because the thread has x number of flags or the mods have turned off bumping. I haven't checked the # of flags, but both those things above happen frequently... Tho you'd have to guess at the reasons for them.
I ranked her up for defense when she was still a viable defense option. And I didn't have any good defenders. She used to give me decent kills before blade was introduced. There are many options now.
The question with relation to rank down tickets has been answered a few times already and this thread is no longer constructive so it will be closed.