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Why not "retire" champs instead of trying to buff all the Meme Tier ones?

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Comments

  • Notsavage19Notsavage19 Posts: 2,817 ★★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    I don't think we should let players trade in bad champs for good ones. Periodt.

    Just buff all the bad ones then?
    I don't see why not.

    "Buffing" a champion isn't about making the champion a "god tier". It's about making the champion somewhat usable in today's content. Think about how far content has changed from Act 1 to Act 6. Think about all the requirements that Act 6 imposes. The point of a buff is to make an outdated champion, like Iron Man, have a kit that can fulfill some of the requirements that are set by future/present content.

    Will there always be bad champions, even when buffed? Yes. It's unavoidable.
    Makes sense that all buffed champs won't be god tier but I hate to think how the community will react when classic champs like Ironman, Cyclops, Daredevil, Deadpool, Cap America Classic, Spiderman Classic aren't given the Mags treatment. And Spiderman Classic is probably the most famous Marvel character by far. So when they do get to him, his buff will have insane expectations. To further demonstrate why my idea could work, there are several other Spiderman Characters now that do justice to his Marvel comics status.
    But why should someone be rewarded for a bad pull?
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,369 ★★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    GMAX77 said:

    So are you saying the "new" champ would take the place of the old champ in your roster?
    If I have a rank 2, 6 star Drax for an example, would the champ I pull from the new crystal be at rank 2...like the retired one?
    Then there's the issue of which champs are considered "meme" tier. Just because a champ is commonly panned, doesn't necessarily make them one a lot of summoners would like to see retired. This could be for a variety of reasons. I think the retirement idea is very creative, and maybe could be seen as these older champs simply not added to 6 star crystals (and maybe 7? stars), but I wouldn't like to trade in my champs which I enjoy playing the contest with just because there are those who consider them "useless". Colossus is one of my favorite champs in all of MCOC right now. I am very appreciative that they buffed him instead of just kicking him out.

    Then keep all your champs. As far as tiers go, there are items for that too. Not sure Kabam would be willing to do that but I as a player wouldn't hate it lol. It was an idea that is targeting those players, like me, with lots of bad champs that might not want to wait a year or so for my specific bad champs to win the buff lottery. Or worse, get buffed and still not be very good (like Sentry.)
    But there's also the question about what a "meme tier" champion is. What makes a "meme tier" a "meme tier"?

    Furthermore, I don't get how this would work. You get a "meme tier", then you trade it in for a crystal that contains better champions? How are those champions chosen?

    If the champion pool of said crystal was limited to the upper 25% of the character list, wouldn't the people who pull a champion who is good, but not great (not in the bottom 25% nor the top 25% be at a disadvantage? Should any champion pull not in the top 25% be eligible?

    There's too many flaws in the execution.
    My original idea mentioned the date the champ was created as probably the easiest and fairest way to help upgrade champs designed for what was a very different game.
    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    GMAX77 said:

    So are you saying the "new" champ would take the place of the old champ in your roster?
    If I have a rank 2, 6 star Drax for an example, would the champ I pull from the new crystal be at rank 2...like the retired one?
    Then there's the issue of which champs are considered "meme" tier. Just because a champ is commonly panned, doesn't necessarily make them one a lot of summoners would like to see retired. This could be for a variety of reasons. I think the retirement idea is very creative, and maybe could be seen as these older champs simply not added to 6 star crystals (and maybe 7? stars), but I wouldn't like to trade in my champs which I enjoy playing the contest with just because there are those who consider them "useless". Colossus is one of my favorite champs in all of MCOC right now. I am very appreciative that they buffed him instead of just kicking him out.

    Then keep all your champs. As far as tiers go, there are items for that too. Not sure Kabam would be willing to do that but I as a player wouldn't hate it lol. It was an idea that is targeting those players, like me, with lots of bad champs that might not want to wait a year or so for my specific bad champs to win the buff lottery. Or worse, get buffed and still not be very good (like Sentry.)
    But there's also the question about what a "meme tier" champion is. What makes a "meme tier" a "meme tier"?

    Furthermore, I don't get how this would work. You get a "meme tier", then you trade it in for a crystal that contains better champions? How are those champions chosen?

    If the champion pool of said crystal was limited to the upper 25% of the character list, wouldn't the people who pull a champion who is good, but not great (not in the bottom 25% nor the top 25% be at a disadvantage? Should any champion pull not in the top 25% be eligible?

    There's too many flaws in the execution.
    My original idea mentioned the date the champ was created as probably the easiest and fairest way to help upgrade champs designed for what was a very different game.
    there are super strong champs in the original champs. SW for instance is so powerful they have yet to release her as a 5*. there are too many factors.
  • Notsavage19Notsavage19 Posts: 2,817 ★★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    GMAX77 said:

    So are you saying the "new" champ would take the place of the old champ in your roster?
    If I have a rank 2, 6 star Drax for an example, would the champ I pull from the new crystal be at rank 2...like the retired one?
    Then there's the issue of which champs are considered "meme" tier. Just because a champ is commonly panned, doesn't necessarily make them one a lot of summoners would like to see retired. This could be for a variety of reasons. I think the retirement idea is very creative, and maybe could be seen as these older champs simply not added to 6 star crystals (and maybe 7? stars), but I wouldn't like to trade in my champs which I enjoy playing the contest with just because there are those who consider them "useless". Colossus is one of my favorite champs in all of MCOC right now. I am very appreciative that they buffed him instead of just kicking him out.

    Then keep all your champs. As far as tiers go, there are items for that too. Not sure Kabam would be willing to do that but I as a player wouldn't hate it lol. It was an idea that is targeting those players, like me, with lots of bad champs that might not want to wait a year or so for my specific bad champs to win the buff lottery. Or worse, get buffed and still not be very good (like Sentry.)
    But there's also the question about what a "meme tier" champion is. What makes a "meme tier" a "meme tier"?

    Furthermore, I don't get how this would work. You get a "meme tier", then you trade it in for a crystal that contains better champions? How are those champions chosen?

    If the champion pool of said crystal was limited to the upper 25% of the character list, wouldn't the people who pull a champion who is good, but not great (not in the bottom 25% nor the top 25% be at a disadvantage? Should any champion pull not in the top 25% be eligible?

    There's too many flaws in the execution.
    My original idea mentioned the date the champ was created as probably the easiest and fairest way to help upgrade champs designed for what was a very different game.
    Also, doesn't RNG already create a advantage/disadvantage element to this game we just all except? I've seen players pull a top champ with their first 6* pull like Quake or Ghost and just torch all the content they were struggling with beforehand. That seems like a disadvantage to me for everyone else that didn't do that.
    That's the point. You get champions, and their usability determines how far you'll get. Why should you be able to trade in a disadvantage for an advantage?
  • SaltE_Wenis69SaltE_Wenis69 Posts: 1,992 ★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    Yeah, I didn't say make new ones either wow. No one is getting this. The trade-in would be for a crystal with existing but much better champs in it. AND THIS WOULD BE A CHOICE!!

    That would be great and all but would defeat the purpose of the rng. like really what the heck. That's basically being greedy and wanting your roster to be like all great champs. That's not the point of the game! It's being patient+grinding and getting some trash champs and once and a while getting some good ones. It feels so good to finally pull an amazing champ when you've been pooped on with your previous crystals. I have not experienced that moment yet but it will come and It will make my day or if its in 2020 make my year. So no that's a horrible idea.
  • lowlevelplayerlowlevelplayer Posts: 4,292 ★★★★★
    will-o-wisp said:

    No champions should be straight up removed from the game

    except joe fixit
  • Notsavage19Notsavage19 Posts: 2,817 ★★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    SaltE_Wenis69 said:

    RyGoku said:

    Yeah, I didn't say make new ones either wow. No one is getting this. The trade-in would be for a crystal with existing but much better champs in it. AND THIS WOULD BE A CHOICE!!

    That would be great and all but would defeat the purpose of the rng. like really what the heck. That's basically being greedy and wanting your roster to be like all great champs. That's not the point of the game! It's being patient+grinding and getting some trash champs and once and a while getting some good ones. It feels so good to finally pull an amazing champ when you've been pooped on with your previous crystals. I have not experienced that moment yet but it will come and It will make my day or if its in 2020 make my year. So no that's a horrible idea.
    Haha, just one question if this is true for all players...why are the buffing champs at all?
    To make them somewhat viable in today's content.
  • Notsavage19Notsavage19 Posts: 2,817 ★★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    GMAX77 said:

    So are you saying the "new" champ would take the place of the old champ in your roster?
    If I have a rank 2, 6 star Drax for an example, would the champ I pull from the new crystal be at rank 2...like the retired one?
    Then there's the issue of which champs are considered "meme" tier. Just because a champ is commonly panned, doesn't necessarily make them one a lot of summoners would like to see retired. This could be for a variety of reasons. I think the retirement idea is very creative, and maybe could be seen as these older champs simply not added to 6 star crystals (and maybe 7? stars), but I wouldn't like to trade in my champs which I enjoy playing the contest with just because there are those who consider them "useless". Colossus is one of my favorite champs in all of MCOC right now. I am very appreciative that they buffed him instead of just kicking him out.

    Then keep all your champs. As far as tiers go, there are items for that too. Not sure Kabam would be willing to do that but I as a player wouldn't hate it lol. It was an idea that is targeting those players, like me, with lots of bad champs that might not want to wait a year or so for my specific bad champs to win the buff lottery. Or worse, get buffed and still not be very good (like Sentry.)
    But there's also the question about what a "meme tier" champion is. What makes a "meme tier" a "meme tier"?

    Furthermore, I don't get how this would work. You get a "meme tier", then you trade it in for a crystal that contains better champions? How are those champions chosen?

    If the champion pool of said crystal was limited to the upper 25% of the character list, wouldn't the people who pull a champion who is good, but not great (not in the bottom 25% nor the top 25% be at a disadvantage? Should any champion pull not in the top 25% be eligible?

    There's too many flaws in the execution.
    My original idea mentioned the date the champ was created as probably the easiest and fairest way to help upgrade champs designed for what was a very different game.
    Also, doesn't RNG already create a advantage/disadvantage element to this game we just all except? I've seen players pull a top champ with their first 6* pull like Quake or Ghost and just torch all the content they were struggling with beforehand. That seems like a disadvantage to me for everyone else that didn't do that.
    That's the point. You get champions, and their usability determines how far you'll get. Why should you be able to trade in a disadvantage for an advantage?
    Then why are we all happy they are buffing our disadvantages?
    Just because a character is buffed doesn't mean that it's still going to be "good". Again, it just means that they are at least somewhat viable. A decreased disadvantage is still a disadvantage.
  • SaltE_Wenis69SaltE_Wenis69 Posts: 1,992 ★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    I don't think we should let players trade in bad champs for good ones. Periodt.

    Just buff all the bad ones then?
    Bruh there not buffing all the bad ones and even if did it would be on a whole other universe or something because everyone will delete the game if they only had good champs. Also if they buffed all the bad champs it doesn't have to be a major buff it can like to promote them by 1 or 2 tiers it doesn't have to always be beyond god champs. Those champs that get a small buff can play a huge role in some lower-tier players who are still progressing that will be op for their content. Just look at seatin's FTP account, he used some trash champs at the beginning but if they get buffed a little, they can still dominate the beginner's content or if they make a champ fun it will be enjoyable play but not necessarily op.
  • Notsavage19Notsavage19 Posts: 2,817 ★★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    SaltE_Wenis69 said:

    RyGoku said:

    Yeah, I didn't say make new ones either wow. No one is getting this. The trade-in would be for a crystal with existing but much better champs in it. AND THIS WOULD BE A CHOICE!!

    That would be great and all but would defeat the purpose of the rng. like really what the heck. That's basically being greedy and wanting your roster to be like all great champs. That's not the point of the game! It's being patient+grinding and getting some trash champs and once and a while getting some good ones. It feels so good to finally pull an amazing champ when you've been pooped on with your previous crystals. I have not experienced that moment yet but it will come and It will make my day or if its in 2020 make my year. So no that's a horrible idea.
    Haha, just one question if this is true for all players...why are the buffing champs at all?
    To make them somewhat viable in today's content.
    Lol, this conversation is a circle. My idea does the same thing with champs that already exist and don't need a month plus to be buffed. I never said just God Tier, I never said remove from rosters...I see why Kabam struggles so much now to do something we all like. I said I was gonna give up on this thread awhile ago. I am now out for real. Double Good Talk.
    There's a difference between making a champion useful and completely trading said character for a better one.
  • TheVyrusTheVyrus Posts: 418 ★★★
    I suggested this years ago, but not to remove the outdated champs. They should not go away, just be retired from the crystals. That way those that you have gain a trophy value and we improve the pull odds for up to date champs. It would also provide an opportunity for newer versions of those outcast by the community.
  • LormifLormif Posts: 7,369 ★★★★★
    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    RyGoku said:

    Notsavage19 said:

    I don't think we should let players trade in bad champs for good ones. Periodt.

    Just buff all the bad ones then?
    I don't see why not.

    "Buffing" a champion isn't about making the champion a "god tier". It's about making the champion somewhat usable in today's content. Think about how far content has changed from Act 1 to Act 6. Think about all the requirements that Act 6 imposes. The point of a buff is to make an outdated champion, like Iron Man, have a kit that can fulfill some of the requirements that are set by future/present content.

    Will there always be bad champions, even when buffed? Yes. It's unavoidable.
    Makes sense that all buffed champs won't be god tier but I hate to think how the community will react when classic champs like Ironman, Cyclops, Daredevil, Deadpool, Cap America Classic, Spiderman Classic aren't given the Mags treatment. And Spiderman Classic is probably the most famous Marvel character by far. So when they do get to him, his buff will have insane expectations. To further demonstrate why my idea could work, there are several other Spiderman Characters now that do justice to his Marvel comics status.
    But why should someone be rewarded for a bad pull?
    They will be anyway when the champ is buffed in the future. I don't get how this is just a bad idea to so many lol. But I guess that is obvious by now. Alright, I give up. Good Talk.
    Its a bad idea for many reasons.

    1) you may lose an actual champ. A featured crystal may reward you another champ you already have, even another meme tier champ.
    2) You lose a champ in in way that can be useful for things like arena or special events that target that champ type, who would want to give up a hulk if they need him for content, such as variants.

    just to name two. It is better for them to rework the champion, there is no downside to that.
  • odogg9941odogg9941 Posts: 418 ★★★
    Not gonna happen ever. People spend money to get champs. You can’t just take that away no matter how bad the champ
  • PseudouberPseudouber Posts: 748 ★★★
    So "retire" and awesome champ like colossus and then make a new one? Instead uff a buff? Why? Or just have him totally gone fro the game forever? Doesn't sound too cool.
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