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Thoughts on Daredevil (Hell's Kitchen) Buff after trying him out?

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Comments

  • Silver_GooseSilver_Goose Posts: 480 ★★★
    He is good. But this poll needs a “great” option - which he isn’t.
  • Silver_SagaSilver_Saga Posts: 359 ★★★
    That's the problem, he's just... meh.
    He's better, undeniably, his animations are more fitting to the character than previously, but... meh.
    But it's OK, not every champion need to be best ever, as long as he has some utility it's fine, I'll keep him at rank 3 for now cause there's a Stealthy waiting to go to rank 5 but maybe one day he'll join the rank 4 gang.
  • HolrosHolros Posts: 322 ★★★
    Sadane said:

    Danyal_39 said:

    Ghost12 said:

    I've given him a few good tries and I still haven't seeing him done nothing to impressive but if anyone has figured out a good rotation plz let me know

    @Ghost12 First use MLLLM combo until 20 hits to get rage then throw heavy to get cruelty anr to convert rage to fury, repeat it till SP3 to get righteous wrath, after that again do MLLLM combo till 20 hits and heavy until you SP2 then throw SP2 and repeat the entire cycle.

    i was able to get 3-4 cruelties and furies stacks consistently using this rotation, and my 3 star DDHK was hitting 3-4.5K mediums crits and 2-3K light crits consistently.
    You can’t convert rages into fury. Your "rotation" is impossible. The only place you can get furies is the sp2. I don’t know where your 3 star was getting 5k mediums from, so I’m pretty confident in calling **** on this.
    Actually you can convert rage to fury, what are you on about? by switching to Murdock mode your rage purifies into a fury, rage from sig can't be converted though
  • Unio77Unio77 Posts: 2,092 ★★★★★
    I really wanted him to have more spice. Not ghost level or something but an admin that makes the payoff possible.

    Also he should have evade. For someone with enhanced senses to not have evade just doesn't make sense
  • Pancake_FacePancake_Face Posts: 1,390 ★★★★
    Where do u think he is on the tier list?
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 1,426 ★★★★
    All they have to do is fix the regen rate. I’m fine with the rest.
  • Lvernon15Lvernon15 Posts: 11,520 ★★★★★
    For suicides users (me included) he’s in worthless tier, for non suicides he’s ok but still meh
  • Raichu626Raichu626 Posts: 731 ★★★★
    First of all, this isn't about how good or bad the new DD is. I haven't played him, and so far, I don't think I will all that much. Got other champs to rank first.

    I actually want to talk about something I've barely seen anyone talk about: his synergies (and those of other champions with the same issue). I've seen some complaints about the fact that a lot of things are locked away in his synergies, like the longer cruelty, stun on specials or heavy miss mechanic. I have a bigger problem with his synergies: There are too many. Literally, even the most effective build, leaving the least useful synergies out, requires at least 5 other champions (SG, Shulk, Elektra, GR, Moleman and then maybe Monkey or Masacre). In the immortal words of Haiku bouncer guy:

    "Eh, that's one too many champions there, bub"

    Even if he was broken good, 4 team members would already be too many. For perspective, Blade has been largely left behind by the community because he ideally needs 2 other champions for maximum output.

    This isn't just a Daredevil problem either, our favourite dimensional being Dormammu has reliably received one or two unique synergies every single year since he came out (Yes. Seriously. No hyperbole here), clocking in at a whopping 8 (including the new Sigil Witch, according to Auntm.ai). Even in a hypothetical 9 champion team scenario, I don't think Dormammu would be that insane, not to mention having to drag around such greats as Mephisto, IHulk and Diablo. And sure, if you were to build a synergy team around, say, Mephisto, he's actually pretty good.
    Newsflash: You already used 4 too many slots for Dormammu, sorry Mephs, you ain't getting any synergies here.

    Speaking of Mephisto, these extradimensional ruler types really love having loads of people on their team, don't they? Why else would he have 11! (E.L.E.V.E.N.) unique synergies. Just why? Even leaving out the least useful synergies I get to 5 other champions. Leaving out Sigil Witch as well, that's 4 champs. Barely fits on a team, and mephisto still isn't blowing me away. And you'd have to drag around Morningstar and the Champion. Sure, MS isn't bad, but both her and Mephisto need some ramp-up, and ramping up two champions in one quest is rather inconvenient to say the least. And that team would be made up of 3 mystics, deadweight McChampion and Omega Red. Who uses suicides. Which make MS hardly usable. And if the SW leak (or whatever it is) is correct, you can yeet OR right out of there and run a 4 mystic 1 deadweight team instead. Balance!

    Potentially unpopular opinion based on this: Please stop buffing lackluster old champions with unique synergies on new champions. And if you absolutely have to, do it like Apocalypse, who was actually successful. Just stop spamming synergies onto Dormammu, Mephisto, Green Goblin and so so many others. The saying is third time's a charm, not twelfth time's

    Maybe some people are gonna disagree, I'd certainly like to see this being talked about more, it's been bugging me for a while now. So, I hope to spark at least some discussion on this.
    Have a nice day, don't let the negativity in this post drag you down too much :)
  • BerjibsBerjibs Posts: 1,394 ★★★★
    Ghost12 said:

    R5 unawakened DD Vs. Winter Soldier after buffed (4-5min fight):


    R5 unawakened DD vs. Winter Soldier before buffed (7-8min fight):


    Conclusion: his damage output is significantly improved after buffed, but it’s still underwhelming....

    I don't think he even got a buff it feels like a nerf XD like taking the armor break hmm don't know why, it just feeks like with old man Logan we got over hyped and men did he turn out to be somewhat a dissapointing


    OML’s a beast now, he’s way better, what you mean?? 🤷🏽‍♂️
  • BigBlueOxBigBlueOx Posts: 266 ★★★

    Hey everybody,

    Lots of differing feedback here. I am not going to offer any info to sway anyone in a different direction, but I want to remind everybody that not every Champion will be the best choice for everything. Nor will every overhaul slingshot every Champion to the top of the list. The Magnetos are an expectation, and probably outside what you should expect for these kinds of updates. We wanted to bring them in line with their comic book/film counterparts.

    Daredevil (Hell's Kitchen) is a unique Champion. He won't work with every mastery setup (the same way that not every mastery is beneficial to every Champion), but he has his place in certain situations now. I am taking your feedback to the team, especial regarding the regen rate change, but I want to make sure that everybody is aware that you should not be ranking up Champions before you know what the update is going to be, and that our goal is not to make every Champion the Top Damage dealer in the game.

    @Kabam Miike I appreciate you taking the Regen concerns back to the team. I think if that was addressed we’d have a really great addition to the rosters as he would have great utility in long fights. I’ve. Nitpicked on this as the character spotlight called this out as what he was supposed to great at, and plainly thats just not true with this Regen reduction.

  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 1,426 ★★★★

    TheMask said:

    TheMask said:

    The fury doesnt stack i think....which is a big disappointment
    Atleast give a max stack 2 kabam !!

    sp2 fury stacks. But the fury from his sig ability does not, which is extremely disappointing. It wouldn't be game breaking if it stacked
    Yeah truee, which is very veryy disappointing lol...now i want to know what is the use of his first part of signature ability lol...
    GIVES Rage debuff with no effect xD
    The Rage Debuff his signature ability gives him for exiting his Murdock Boy mode won't convert into a Fury, but it will still activate the Attack Rating boost he gets for each Non-Damaging Debuff while in Stick's Apprentice mode, as well as to letting him easily activate the healing from Willpower. This can let him have that increased Attack Rating and some healing going for long portions of the fight.
    I’m okay with this IF the regen rate was normalized. A regular DOT debuff - and I’m talking just 1 - makes him die off super fast.

    Either adjust the regen rate or make him shrug off all debuffs in his kit.
  • BigBlueOxBigBlueOx Posts: 266 ★★★

    It is not a buff, it is nerf... Kabam made daredevil unplayable with decreased heal, especially against void or with suicide mastery.


    Void would destroy him as his rage would count towards voids debuff melt ability. This guy gets it
  • Colonaut123Colonaut123 Posts: 2,887 ★★★★★
    You forgot Darkhawk and Night Thrasher 😉.

    I agree. Conservatively, you can only use one or two synergy champions, and only if those champions are not bad and the synergies really make a difference. Let's call it the Blade rule.

    Most of the synergies should be on the basic kit of these champions.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 1,426 ★★★★

    Hey everybody,

    Lots of differing feedback here. I am not going to offer any info to sway anyone in a different direction, but I want to remind everybody that not every Champion will be the best choice for everything. Nor will every overhaul slingshot every Champion to the top of the list. The Magnetos are an expectation, and probably outside what you should expect for these kinds of updates. We wanted to bring them in line with their comic book/film counterparts.

    Daredevil (Hell's Kitchen) is a unique Champion. He won't work with every mastery setup (the same way that not every mastery is beneficial to every Champion), but he has his place in certain situations now. I am taking your feedback to the team, especial regarding the regen rate change, but I want to make sure that everybody is aware that you should not be ranking up Champions before you know what the update is going to be, and that our goal is not to make every Champion the Top Damage dealer in the game.

    Thanks, Miike.

    I think I can speak for most of us that we aren’t looking for a mega damage dealer every time, but usable for sure.

    The regen rate is the sticking point here IMO. I’ve already found many uses for him but it’s like he has no willpower because it’s so low. Any DOT debuffs melts him instantly because of the regen rate.

    Nobody is going to Max willpower for him, and honestly that won’t fix it either. The regen rate idea wasn’t a good fit for his play style.

    We look forward to the update to the regen issue.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 1,426 ★★★★
    zeezee57 said:

    TheMask said:

    Hey everybody,

    Lots of differing feedback here. I am not going to offer any info to sway anyone in a different direction, but I want to remind everybody that not every Champion will be the best choice for everything. Nor will every overhaul slingshot every Champion to the top of the list. The Magnetos are an expectation, and probably outside what you should expect for these kinds of updates. We wanted to bring them in line with their comic book/film counterparts.

    Daredevil (Hell's Kitchen) is a unique Champion. He won't work with every mastery setup (the same way that not every mastery is beneficial to every Champion), but he has his place in certain situations now. I am taking your feedback to the team, especial regarding the regen rate change, but I want to make sure that everybody is aware that you should not be ranking up Champions before you know what the update is going to be, and that our goal is not to make every Champion the Top Damage dealer in the game.

    Thanks Mike for your Feedback, appreciate it
    But you guys keep telling he has his place in situations, which situations lol?
    If someone has falcon, they ll just use him.
    We are glad kabam did an overhaul, and i dont think people wanted a magneto level buff, they wanted a decent champ which didnt have to be a lame copy of falcon.

    People have expectations, that to with a fan favourite champ like Daredevil. And this just disappointed, nothing to do with magento or anything like that.
    I'm sorry to hear you're disappointed. Every Champion in-game is somebody's favourite though, and that doesn't mean that we'll be able to make them all the very best at everything.

    If somebody has Falcon, they can use Falcon, but if they don't, but have Daredevil, then they can use Daredevil. Not everybody has access to every Champion, so giving Summoners more tools to handle certain situations is a good thing.
    The unfortunate thing is this new DD doesn't really stand out anywhere to make him the right choice. Sure if you don't have another option besides karnak or kingpin then he's a great option, for everyone else he isn't. I know the team put a good amount of effort into this, you don't redo his entire animation set with the intent of him never being used, it just seems like the concept wasn't tested throughly to see that the idea panned out. When the buff info first leaked out everyone could see the potential, but the values, durations and the regen rate just fall way short of what they should be.

    The gimped regen rate is something we all hope will just be removed, from the gameplay ive done he's not carrying debuffs enough to give him some OP regen even at the normal rate, and willpower is mostly used in conjunction with suicides and with the weak regen he's completely unplayable. And sadly he needs the extra damage they provide, his output even with suicides is subpar. The concept is there, with a few tweaks he could be a solid champ and give everyone a fun and effective DD we've all wanted to see for a long time now, hopefully the door isn't closed to making those tweaks and he just falls in with the forgotten.
    If they remove the 40% and set it to normal, I’ll R5 mine. I’ve found many uses for him.
  • ChobblyChobbly Posts: 211 ★★
    It’s clear that a significant amount of effort has gone into this change, from animations to the character build. It feels like there’s a really decent character in here, trying desperately to get out, but got trimmed back a little too heavily just before release.

    Having tried a 5*r3 in a mix of content, he doesn’t seem to excel enough in any particular area - or rather enough areas, to make him 5* rank 4 or 5 worthy, especially when compared to many other Skill champs.

    As mentioned earlier, maybe giving him True Strike might help, for balance just when in Stick’s Apprentice mode?
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 1,426 ★★★★
    He is a brawler, like they made him in the Netflix show. My only issue with him is the regen rate.

    I legitimately will R5 my 5* if the regen rate is adjusted.

    One DOT melts him. That’s pretty significant. He’s a brawling machine, a bleed debuff shouldn’t stop him. I’m fine with doing nothing but fixing the regen rate so willpower can do it’s thing.

    He’s also a skill based champion. People who can’t manage his combo meter will not see the damage output.

    Additionally if I want to AAR something, I hit an sp1 to get past 15 faster. Then he bypasses a ton of stuff. It’s a great mechanic.

    Regen rate for me. Anything else is bonus.
  • FluffyPigMonsterFluffyPigMonster Posts: 1,426 ★★★★

    Literally just put his regen back to 100% and he will be fine. Then people can actually use him with Suicides to get the damage they want out of him.

    This is pretty much how I feel
  • Denslo500Denslo500 Posts: 560 ★★★
    just watched the MCOCAlbundy video previously mentioned.
    It fully illustrates the buff's potential.

    DDHK has a more complex mechanic than I can manage in an Act 6 fight.
    For the difficulty required to play him right, he should have a bigger payoff.

    Un-nerf the healing, so we can use suicides on him or boost his damage.
    Otherwise, he is going to be Hela (great but unusable by most summoners).
  • HolrosHolros Posts: 322 ★★★
    BigBlueOx said:

    It is not a buff, it is nerf... Kabam made daredevil unplayable with decreased heal, especially against void or with suicide mastery.


    Void would destroy him as his rage would count towards voids debuff melt ability. This guy gets it
    Actually he is a nice counter to void, what are you on about, just do sp2 when below 30 hit to immediately to cancel rage to fury
  • ChobblyChobbly Posts: 211 ★★

    Can I just point out there was a complete missed opportunity to use the ‘true sense’ buff that’s on red goblin here

    I mean seriously, if daredevil doesn’t have true sense then who does? And it would have given him some seriously good utility

    I think that could have worked really well, good call.
  • HolrosHolros Posts: 322 ★★★
    Ace_03 said:

    A lot of his abilities and kit are being ignored, also his rotation will take time to master, but he is very strong and resilient. Obscene burst damage is not everything, Corvus and Blade both are not good in ROL, but shine in other places.

    His potential has yet to be unlocked.

    This is the same community that thought Corvus, Warlock and Claire Voyant we're ok, also Apocalypse. This champion has resilience, packs a good punch, good utility and helpful synergies.

    The only thing I would change is regeneration rate, if they do that he will be a great champ.

    Someone who gets it, he has solid utility and his damage is not bad at all
  • Davepool87Davepool87 Posts: 21
    Not rank up tier
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