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Champion nerfs

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    SHIELD4AGENTSHIELD4AGENT Posts: 915 ★★★★
    Illusionary said:

    Can we get some? The meta within MCOC has frankly felt incredibly stale for far too long at this point. I'm not suggesting that champions like Quake and Ghost should be nerfed to the ground, but adjust them so that they aren't so dominant at the top. I believe it was said at the beginning of the champion buff program that nerfs would take place as well, but we haven't seen any as of yet.

    Ghost and to a greater extent, Quake simply aren't healthy for the longevity of the game. Competitive games like MCOC are at their best when the meta is ever-shifting, but with those two champions remaining dominant for years now, the meta has only grown staler and staler over time. Kabam, I implore you to fix this for the sake of MCOC's health.

    Side note: Providing RDT's should a nerf like this take place is a prerequisite. People have invested in these champions and thus would have every right to be aggravated. In a case like this where nerfing these champions is fairly necessary for the heath of the game, providing RDT's are a far lesser evil comparatively.

    This is a ridiculous idea, I myself don't have Ghost or Quake or any of the OP BGT champs as 5*/6* but I don't have anything against them being dominant in the meta.
    Cause just like you said people have invested in them, nerfing them will surely backfire and the game might even die faster cause if they nerf them I don't think there will be any compensation Kabam will hand out that will be enough for the effort and resources invested by the players.

    I can sense jealousy in this post,
    Cause the game is not getting staler and staler. Admit it or not, I guess it's your account that's getting staler everytime you hope of pulling Quake/Ghost but then you get Kabamed by a roll over.
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    The_Sentry06The_Sentry06 Posts: 7,781 ★★★★★
    Haji_Saab said:

    Worknprogress said:

    Never going to happen even though it should. Kabam lost their spine in-between Act 6 and Act 7.

    Players complain about overtuned content but refuse to accept that content design got to that point in the first place bc of champs that were basically broken existing in the game.

    You can't properly tune difficulty around lesser champs still being usable while Quake, Ghost, and Magneto (Corvus in AQ) are still running rampant. Act 7 chapters can basically be done by any average player with a Ghost, a few hours, and a handful of boosts now that they've moved to the everyone gets a prize model of content design. They let players forget how to walk without a crutch and they're just never going to have the stones to take the crutches away and apparently even design content to specifically remove then as options (Guantlet).

    Been singing this song for a long time but it's being sung to a deaf audience so it's basically pointless at this point.

    Yep... Ghost makes a mockery of so many paths in 7.2. The node is like "You have to bring A type champ to inflict B debuff in order to avoid C and D from triggering" ... or you can bring Ghost and face roll in one sp2.

    Then so many well designed fights in Gauntlet, only to let Quake lose on them :neutral:
    I don't see the problem with Gauntlet here. You got to enjoy those well-designed fights no with other champs if you didn't use Quake? Using Quake required a significant time investment.
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    WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 7,233 ★★★★★
    SHIELD4AGENT said:

    Illusionary said:

    Can we get some? The meta within MCOC has frankly felt incredibly stale for far too long at this point. I'm not suggesting that champions like Quake and Ghost should be nerfed to the ground, but adjust them so that they aren't so dominant at the top. I believe it was said at the beginning of the champion buff program that nerfs would take place as well, but we haven't seen any as of yet.

    Ghost and to a greater extent, Quake simply aren't healthy for the longevity of the game. Competitive games like MCOC are at their best when the meta is ever-shifting, but with those two champions remaining dominant for years now, the meta has only grown staler and staler over time. Kabam, I implore you to fix this for the sake of MCOC's health.

    Side note: Providing RDT's should a nerf like this take place is a prerequisite. People have invested in these champions and thus would have every right to be aggravated. In a case like this where nerfing these champions is fairly necessary for the heath of the game, providing RDT's are a far lesser evil comparatively.

    This is a ridiculous idea, I myself don't have Ghost or Quake or any of the OP BGT champs as 5*/6* but I don't have anything against them being dominant in the meta.
    Cause just like you said people have invested in them, nerfing them will surely backfire and the game might even die faster cause if they nerf them I don't think there will be any compensation Kabam will hand out that will be enough for the effort and resources invested by the players.

    I can sense jealousy in this post,
    Cause the game is not getting staler and staler. Admit it or not, I guess it's your account that's getting staler everytime you hope of pulling Quake/Ghost but then you get Kabamed by a roll over.
    I assure you, my account is not lacking or stale by any means.
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    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    SHIELD4AGENT said:

    Illusionary said:

    Can we get some? The meta within MCOC has frankly felt incredibly stale for far too long at this point. I'm not suggesting that champions like Quake and Ghost should be nerfed to the ground, but adjust them so that they aren't so dominant at the top. I believe it was said at the beginning of the champion buff program that nerfs would take place as well, but we haven't seen any as of yet.

    Ghost and to a greater extent, Quake simply aren't healthy for the longevity of the game. Competitive games like MCOC are at their best when the meta is ever-shifting, but with those two champions remaining dominant for years now, the meta has only grown staler and staler over time. Kabam, I implore you to fix this for the sake of MCOC's health.

    Side note: Providing RDT's should a nerf like this take place is a prerequisite. People have invested in these champions and thus would have every right to be aggravated. In a case like this where nerfing these champions is fairly necessary for the heath of the game, providing RDT's are a far lesser evil comparatively.

    This is a ridiculous idea, I myself don't have Ghost or Quake or any of the OP BGT champs as 5*/6* but I don't have anything against them being dominant in the meta.
    Cause just like you said people have invested in them, nerfing them will surely backfire and the game might even die faster cause if they nerf them I don't think there will be any compensation Kabam will hand out that will be enough for the effort and resources invested by the players.

    I can sense jealousy in this post,
    Cause the game is not getting staler and staler. Admit it or not, I guess it's your account that's getting staler everytime you hope of pulling Quake/Ghost but then you get Kabamed by a roll over.
    Dude.... I have both of them....
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    GamerGamer Posts: 10,219 ★★★★★
    Illusionary said:

    Gamer said:

    I’m disliked nerft in general. And I’m don’t se ghost and quake need it there can just put true strikes one more node for preventing quake and put node rust for ghost. Ect. There’s is better way to limte there using

    The issue is that by doing that you also limit other champions that aren't overpowered who share evade mechanics, such as Mister Negative.
    Yes but again u doesn’t hav to be true strike ever node I’m said one a few node so u limited the use of he and I’m wil definitely be mad of a nerft because the there need to be better rebalance them ASAP and not wait 3 years that’s wrongly there need to do it monthly because if wait 5 year you already then there isn’t free 2 players base spend to getting but of course kabam stand in there tos there can do what there won’t to do
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    GreekhitGreekhit Posts: 2,819 ★★★★★
    Denzel116 said:

    My mom always told me….if I have nothing nice to say, just hit the disagree button.


    Hard disagree. Case in point: Blade. People said the same thing. And now people think he’s “outdated.”

    The game will transition. Newer champs will bring fresh perspectives. The Meta will shift. It’ll be fine.

    Meta is still Quake/Ghost.
    That hasn’t shifted a lot since last 3 years. And with the latest champion releases being mostly mediocre, it doesn’t seems to change next years too. Kabam is very conservative with newer champs. No very powerful champ releases, with very few exceptions (Apocalypse f.e.) that are still not at their level.
    Let’s at least don’t fool ourselves and acknowledge that these two champs are a tier on their own. They are superior than any other champ and that’s a fact.
    There is no need to nerf them, that would be a bad decision.
    Kabam could balance their existence in the game, by using True Hit node more often, not only on a single special event fight like SOP. It could be used on many paths of future story quests or even at some paths at AW.
    They are overpowered but the nerf route is just wrong.

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    LeStMn92LeStMn92 Posts: 119 ★
    edited July 2021
    Haven't read all the replies, but they really can't outright nerf champs, this isn't a competitive game where constant balancing is going on, this is a game where some people outright pumped money into certain units. Changing those units drastically warrants a refund in ways, I assume anyway. They can make tweaks to bugged units, but you can't outright change their kits without compensation or backlash like in previous cases.

    On a personal note I don't want to live in a world again where there is numerous threads of "RDTs when?"

    Edit: Autocorrect typo
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    LeStMn92LeStMn92 Posts: 119 ★
    Illusionary said:

    Renaxqq said:

    So I spent money and time to get and rank up these champs and now you want Kabam to nerf Ghost and Quake? I don't know what compensation would be enough for me and other players.

    P.S. they already tried something like this and it was huge fail (update v12.0).

    12.0 was by no means a fail. Anybody with the ability to consider the long-term effects of champions that dominant existing in the game realizes that 12.0 was needed for the sake of the game's longevity, just as some action needs to be taken to reduce the dominance of Ghost and Quake (Mags and Corvus as well like Work said, though likely to a lesser degree) in order to maintain the game's longevity.
    12.0 was directionally right, Shame they absolutely destroyed the units instead of making them viable but not game breaking. Hell, DS still hasn't fully recovered from his assassination.

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    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    T_O_Double27 said:

    Dude no one believes you use them then ask for a nerf… your that guy whose alliance just smashed Bc they don’t know how to quake… hmmm yea … that was us we did that to you.. smashed you good and proper

    Dude Quake and Ghost really aren't that good in AW. The reason I think they're op even though I have both of them is because I'm actually thinking about the long term health of the game instead of just being selfish.
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    ESFESF Posts: 1,944 ★★★★★
    I sincerely doubt Quake ever gets released as a 6-star. That means that the kit will fall out of the meta in the future, most likely — though it will still get used

    Ghost…man. I don’t know. It has always bugged me that such a minor character from the lore has been as effective as that kit has been in the game, but at this point, a nerf is pretty much pointless because of the sheer volume of characters in the game

    I am not scared of nerfs for characters that are ridiculously overtuned but those characters are old enough that if you were gonna do that, it probably should have been done at least two years ago
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    PulyamanPulyaman Posts: 2,365 ★★★★★
    So, if they guy asking for a nerf is jealous that he does not have the champ/cannot use the champ, can we also blankly assume that people against the nerf are afraid to actually learn how to other champs? My point - Don't assume anything about the people asking for a nerf. There is no question that quake and ghost are broken. People saying there are counters to them think as if these 2 are used as defenders. I can hardly name a champ that counters both quake and ghost when we use them as attackers.
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    TheTalentsTheTalents Posts: 2,254 ★★★★★
    quake is about to be nerfed by r4 6 stars health pools so quake is no longer an issue by 2022. Ghost is just not that OP. She needs two-three champs to use her properly and a simple armor break renders her useless. You can't just ghost your way through everything anymore, that's just not true.
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    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    Pulyaman said:

    So, if they guy asking for a nerf is jealous that he does not have the champ/cannot use the champ, can we also blankly assume that people against the nerf are afraid to actually learn how to other champs? My point - Don't assume anything about the people asking for a nerf. There is no question that quake and ghost are broken. People saying there are counters to them think as if these 2 are used as defenders. I can hardly name a champ that counters both quake and ghost when we use them as attackers.

    Thank you. Just because someone thinks a champion should be nerfed doesn't mean they're jealous or smth. Frankly, the assumption carried by so many on the forums that this is the case shows how illogical and childish they are.
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    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    Illusionary said:

    Pulyaman said:

    So, if they guy asking for a nerf is jealous that he does not have the champ/cannot use the champ, can we also blankly assume that people against the nerf are afraid to actually learn how to other champs? My point - Don't assume anything about the people asking for a nerf. There is no question that quake and ghost are broken. People saying there are counters to them think as if these 2 are used as defenders. I can hardly name a champ that counters both quake and ghost when we use them as attackers.

    Thank you. Just because someone thinks a champion should be nerfed doesn't mean they're jealous or smth. Frankly, the assumption carried by so many on the forums that this is the case shows how illogical and childish they are.
    I literally have both of them at their maximum possible rarities. I can have and utilize them while still thinking they're broken and deserve nerfs.
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    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    Faseeh said:

    Stop taking this guy seriously. He's a troll. Joined around 2 hours back and making dumb posts. Let this thread die

    Oh shush mate. Just because you don't agree doesn't give you the right to dismiss someone's post. I assure you that my account is more advanced than yours so don't base your frankly stupid response on my forums account.
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    shadow_lurker22shadow_lurker22 Posts: 3,243 ★★★★★
    Illusionary said:

    Pulyaman said:

    So, if they guy asking for a nerf is jealous that he does not have the champ/cannot use the champ, can we also blankly assume that people against the nerf are afraid to actually learn how to other champs? My point - Don't assume anything about the people asking for a nerf. There is no question that quake and ghost are broken. People saying there are counters to them think as if these 2 are used as defenders. I can hardly name a champ that counters both quake and ghost when we use them as attackers.

    Thank you. Just because someone thinks a champion should be nerfed doesn't mean they're jealous or smth. Frankly, the assumption carried by so many on the forums that this is the case shows how illogical and childish they are.
    Or maybe we just know how people are, when they get something good they want to keep it typically. When people in the forums have a way to cheese something they don't typically ask for it to be removed. When people master a broken character they don't typically ask for a nerf. However we cannot absolutely rule out the possibility that you aren't out typical forum dweller.
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    The_Sentry06The_Sentry06 Posts: 7,781 ★★★★★
    Quake and Ghost should not be outright nerfed. Nerf them through nodes or something.
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    GiuliameijGiuliameij Posts: 1,849 ★★★★
    Purely taken from the example you give. Ghost and Quake.
    Both those champs have a very unique, sometimes really counter intuitive playstyle.
    In order to make them really broken you need to absolutely master them.
    Simply Heavy/Parry will not make you a broken Quake player. Same with ghost. To fully make her OP you need to be timing everything correctly. Need to learn to 1 hit every single champion in the game and know that timing.
    There are champs that are really good, not the top 5, but in the top 15 of champs that anyone can pick up and do 90% of everything that is possible.
    Highly skilled players should have a handful of champs in which they can truly showcase their skill. Those champs are Ghost and Quake.

    And for the record. I can`t Quake for the damn, and my ghost skills are only so so. So I am not one of the people who can benefit from these champs. But this does not mean I feel others should not be able to either.
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    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    shadow_lurker22 said:

    Illusionary said:

    Pulyaman said:

    So, if they guy asking for a nerf is jealous that he does not have the champ/cannot use the champ, can we also blankly assume that people against the nerf are afraid to actually learn how to other champs? My point - Don't assume anything about the people asking for a nerf. There is no question that quake and ghost are broken. People saying there are counters to them think as if these 2 are used as defenders. I can hardly name a champ that counters both quake and ghost when we use them as attackers.

    Thank you. Just because someone thinks a champion should be nerfed doesn't mean they're jealous or smth. Frankly, the assumption carried by so many on the forums that this is the case shows how illogical and childish they are.
    Or maybe we just know how people are, when they get something good they want to keep it typically. When people in the forums have a way to cheese something they don't typically ask for it to be removed. When people master a broken character they don't typically ask for a nerf. However we cannot absolutely rule out the possibility that you aren't out typical forum dweller.
    That shortsightedness has always struck me as being so illogical. We all love and enjoy this game, why ask for broken things to remain broken if they're detrimental to the game's long-term health?
  • Options
    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    Giuliameij said:

    Purely taken from the example you give. Ghost and Quake.
    Both those champs have a very unique, sometimes really counter intuitive playstyle.
    In order to make them really broken you need to absolutely master them.
    Simply Heavy/Parry will not make you a broken Quake player. Same with ghost. To fully make her OP you need to be timing everything correctly. Need to learn to 1 hit every single champion in the game and know that timing.
    There are champs that are really good, not the top 5, but in the top 15 of champs that anyone can pick up and do 90% of everything that is possible.
    Highly skilled players should have a handful of champs in which they can truly showcase their skill. Those champs are Ghost and Quake.

    And for the record. I can`t Quake for the damn, and my ghost skills are only so so. So I am not one of the people who can benefit from these champs. But this does not mean I feel others should not be able to either.

    I don't intend to be condescending, but Ghost really isn't that hard to play. Quake I can kinda understand, but even with the thought process that both of them reward high skill play, the payoff is incredibly disproportionate to their difficulty.
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    ShadowstrikeShadowstrike Posts: 3,090 ★★★★★
    Illusionary said:

    T_O_Double27 said:

    Dude no one believes you use them then ask for a nerf… your that guy whose alliance just smashed Bc they don’t know how to quake… hmmm yea … that was us we did that to you.. smashed you good and proper

    Dude Quake and Ghost really aren't that good in AW. The reason I think they're op even though I have both of them is because I'm actually thinking about the long term health of the game instead of just being selfish.
    No, you asking for this reeks of something else.. Even if your intent was something as Noble as longevity in the game, there will always be new champs and nodes, events that will have built in counters to them. There game will evolve and things will change.
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    shadow_lurker22shadow_lurker22 Posts: 3,243 ★★★★★
    Illusionary said:

    shadow_lurker22 said:

    Illusionary said:

    Pulyaman said:

    So, if they guy asking for a nerf is jealous that he does not have the champ/cannot use the champ, can we also blankly assume that people against the nerf are afraid to actually learn how to other champs? My point - Don't assume anything about the people asking for a nerf. There is no question that quake and ghost are broken. People saying there are counters to them think as if these 2 are used as defenders. I can hardly name a champ that counters both quake and ghost when we use them as attackers.

    Thank you. Just because someone thinks a champion should be nerfed doesn't mean they're jealous or smth. Frankly, the assumption carried by so many on the forums that this is the case shows how illogical and childish they are.
    Or maybe we just know how people are, when they get something good they want to keep it typically. When people in the forums have a way to cheese something they don't typically ask for it to be removed. When people master a broken character they don't typically ask for a nerf. However we cannot absolutely rule out the possibility that you aren't out typical forum dweller.
    That shortsightedness has always struck me as being so illogical. We all love and enjoy this game, why ask for broken things to remain broken if they're detrimental to the game's long-term health?
    And how is a 5* that's getting phased out and ghost "detrimental to the games health?"
  • Options
    IllusionaryIllusionary Posts: 43 ★
    shadow_lurker22 said:

    Illusionary said:

    shadow_lurker22 said:

    Illusionary said:

    Pulyaman said:

    So, if they guy asking for a nerf is jealous that he does not have the champ/cannot use the champ, can we also blankly assume that people against the nerf are afraid to actually learn how to other champs? My point - Don't assume anything about the people asking for a nerf. There is no question that quake and ghost are broken. People saying there are counters to them think as if these 2 are used as defenders. I can hardly name a champ that counters both quake and ghost when we use them as attackers.

    Thank you. Just because someone thinks a champion should be nerfed doesn't mean they're jealous or smth. Frankly, the assumption carried by so many on the forums that this is the case shows how illogical and childish they are.
    Or maybe we just know how people are, when they get something good they want to keep it typically. When people in the forums have a way to cheese something they don't typically ask for it to be removed. When people master a broken character they don't typically ask for a nerf. However we cannot absolutely rule out the possibility that you aren't out typical forum dweller.
    That shortsightedness has always struck me as being so illogical. We all love and enjoy this game, why ask for broken things to remain broken if they're detrimental to the game's long-term health?
    And how is a 5* that's getting phased out and ghost "detrimental to the games health?"
    I wrote out my reasoning but I'm still waiting for the comment to be approved. Just a second, man.
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