Any chance quake will become a 6* with 7*s coming

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  • BitterSteelBitterSteel Posts: 8,860 ★★★★★
    benshb said:

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I mean.... Going up against true strike, or life transfer, or like force of will nodes, I would much rather take champs like, you know....Herc, CGR, Kitty, and other extremely broken champs.

    Heck, you could even "nerf" (fix) quake against debuff immun opponents, she would still not be as much used as Hercules.
    There’s a reason Quake as a 5* champion gets banned sometimes over 6* Rank 4 champions in Tier 1-2 wars.

    There’s a reason she gets brought to war as a 5* champion instead of 6* champions.

    If you think Herc, CGR and Kitty would be banned or used as much as quake if they were only 5*s you’re kidding yourself.

    As I said to Hector, I could make a thousand points but you wouldn’t change your mind. So I’m happy to agree to disagree. Quake isn’t going to be added to the game, Kabam have literally said she’s too powerful and would need to be nerfed to be added. But hey, maybe you guys are right - and the champion who counters 99% of nodes in the game would be a good addition 🙃
  • Ackbar67Ackbar67 Posts: 253 ★★★

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I agree with all your points except that no one has ever been as strong as quake. Pre 12.0 Scarlet Witch was easily on par with, if not more powerful than modern Quake for the time. As badly as 12.0 was handled, it was extremely necessary for the long term health of the game. If Kabam understandably doesn't want to directly nerf Quake, locking her as a 5* is the next best thing
  • firemoon712firemoon712 Posts: 492 ★★★
    Wolverine makes more sense tbh since both Deadpool (Classic) and Scarlet Witch (Classic) are available as 6 stars now.
  • benshbbenshb Posts: 714 ★★★★

    benshb said:

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I mean.... Going up against true strike, or life transfer, or like force of will nodes, I would much rather take champs like, you know....Herc, CGR, Kitty, and other extremely broken champs.

    Heck, you could even "nerf" (fix) quake against debuff immun opponents, she would still not be as much used as Hercules.
    There’s a reason Quake as a 5* champion gets banned sometimes over 6* Rank 4 champions in Tier 1-2 wars.

    There’s a reason she gets brought to war as a 5* champion instead of 6* champions.

    If you think Herc, CGR and Kitty would be banned or used as much as quake if they were only 5*s you’re kidding yourself.

    As I said to Hector, I could make a thousand points but you wouldn’t change your mind. So I’m happy to agree to disagree. Quake isn’t going to be added to the game, Kabam have literally said she’s too powerful and would need to be nerfed to be added. But hey, maybe you guys are right - and the champion who counters 99% of nodes in the game would be a good addition 🙃
    There are other areas of the game than T1-2 war, and even so, the could keep banning quake, there will be no difference whatsoever. What I'm saying is there wouldn't be as high scaling in the DOT, as a regular 5*-6* upgrade, so it's not a farfetched mind-blowing idea to bring her in as a 6*.
    I understand that she would be good for the 90% of the nodes, but comeon, 5* is too.
    Act 8 figts would still take plenty of time, in BG you could ban her, in AW you can ban her, I don't know how useful would be in AQ map8(/9?).
    But if I'm wrong with the scaling of DOT a dev can hop in to clarify things, just not this way, this didn't age too well:



  • ButtehrsButtehrs Posts: 3,110 ★★★★★
    benshb said:

    benshb said:

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I mean.... Going up against true strike, or life transfer, or like force of will nodes, I would much rather take champs like, you know....Herc, CGR, Kitty, and other extremely broken champs.

    Heck, you could even "nerf" (fix) quake against debuff immun opponents, she would still not be as much used as Hercules.
    There’s a reason Quake as a 5* champion gets banned sometimes over 6* Rank 4 champions in Tier 1-2 wars.

    There’s a reason she gets brought to war as a 5* champion instead of 6* champions.

    If you think Herc, CGR and Kitty would be banned or used as much as quake if they were only 5*s you’re kidding yourself.

    As I said to Hector, I could make a thousand points but you wouldn’t change your mind. So I’m happy to agree to disagree. Quake isn’t going to be added to the game, Kabam have literally said she’s too powerful and would need to be nerfed to be added. But hey, maybe you guys are right - and the champion who counters 99% of nodes in the game would be a good addition 🙃
    There are other areas of the game than T1-2 war, and even so, the could keep banning quake, there will be no difference whatsoever. What I'm saying is there wouldn't be as high scaling in the DOT, as a regular 5*-6* upgrade, so it's not a farfetched mind-blowing idea to bring her in as a 6*.
    I understand that she would be good for the 90% of the nodes, but comeon, 5* is too.
    Act 8 figts would still take plenty of time, in BG you could ban her, in AW you can ban her, I don't know how useful would be in AQ map8(/9?).
    But if I'm wrong with the scaling of DOT a dev can hop in to clarify things, just not this way, this didn't age too well:



    This quote did age properly though. It took a full 2 years from that quote for her to be a 5*. That's not soon. And at the time of that quote content was extremely east compared to the nodes and such that we have now.
  • Wicket329Wicket329 Posts: 2,140 ★★★★★
    benshb said:

    benshb said:

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I mean.... Going up against true strike, or life transfer, or like force of will nodes, I would much rather take champs like, you know....Herc, CGR, Kitty, and other extremely broken champs.

    Heck, you could even "nerf" (fix) quake against debuff immun opponents, she would still not be as much used as Hercules.
    There’s a reason Quake as a 5* champion gets banned sometimes over 6* Rank 4 champions in Tier 1-2 wars.

    There’s a reason she gets brought to war as a 5* champion instead of 6* champions.

    If you think Herc, CGR and Kitty would be banned or used as much as quake if they were only 5*s you’re kidding yourself.

    As I said to Hector, I could make a thousand points but you wouldn’t change your mind. So I’m happy to agree to disagree. Quake isn’t going to be added to the game, Kabam have literally said she’s too powerful and would need to be nerfed to be added. But hey, maybe you guys are right - and the champion who counters 99% of nodes in the game would be a good addition 🙃
    There are other areas of the game than T1-2 war, and even so, the could keep banning quake, there will be no difference whatsoever. What I'm saying is there wouldn't be as high scaling in the DOT, as a regular 5*-6* upgrade, so it's not a farfetched mind-blowing idea to bring her in as a 6*.
    I understand that she would be good for the 90% of the nodes, but comeon, 5* is too.
    Act 8 figts would still take plenty of time, in BG you could ban her, in AW you can ban her, I don't know how useful would be in AQ map8(/9?).
    But if I'm wrong with the scaling of DOT a dev can hop in to clarify things, just not this way, this didn't age too well:



    The reason for bringing up Quake in the context of Alliance War is wasn’t to say that Quake is too strong for Alliance War. It was to say that a 5* R5 Quake can hit so far above her weight class that she is still considered a substantial enough threat to use one of the very few bans available in the mode.

    Quake would gain roughly a 50% attack bump going from a 5* r5 to a 6* r4 (numbers derived from comparing her stats to Mangog, who has identical attack value as a 5* r5 according to Aunt Mai). That would suddenly make her viable in content like EOP and Act 8 and other large healthpool areas of the game where currently she is not a favored option, plus make her an absolute menace in Battlegrounds. She would immediately become the most powerful champion in the game (yes, stronger than Hercules and CGR and the others). Not because she outdamages them, but because she can handle so many more fights than they can.

    There was a time when new content had to be made Quake-proof and it was miserable. True Strike and similar nodes everywhere. Other champions who used evade mechanics, such as Elsa Bloodstone, were severely limited by this status quo. That’s why Quake was so bad for the game. She required the devs to design fights she couldn’t walk through blindfolded, which then had knock on effects to limit other champions the player base enjoyed. Her being out of the meta is a very good thing for the health of the game.
  • benshbbenshb Posts: 714 ★★★★
    edited November 2022






    That was posted 2.5 years before her release, during which time we released 40+ new Champs, new content, new Story quests, nodes, and much more. Things change all the time in this game so old quotes can become out of date pretty quickly.

    Exactly. There are new champs, new nodes, and much more, so even SW is now available as 6*. It's a game of variety. So excluding Quake (and damn poor Magik), just because she is strong, is nonsense.
    Or so what, we just forget that she exist in game? I'd have given my swiping arm for a 5* SW or Wolverine when 5* were the meta (based on my progression). But now they are collecting dust. However newcomers can easily benefit from the of they pull them early. Now if you (might) release Quake 2 years from now, the same will happen to her

  • BitterSteelBitterSteel Posts: 8,860 ★★★★★
    Wicket329 said:

    benshb said:

    benshb said:

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I mean.... Going up against true strike, or life transfer, or like force of will nodes, I would much rather take champs like, you know....Herc, CGR, Kitty, and other extremely broken champs.

    Heck, you could even "nerf" (fix) quake against debuff immun opponents, she would still not be as much used as Hercules.
    There’s a reason Quake as a 5* champion gets banned sometimes over 6* Rank 4 champions in Tier 1-2 wars.

    There’s a reason she gets brought to war as a 5* champion instead of 6* champions.

    If you think Herc, CGR and Kitty would be banned or used as much as quake if they were only 5*s you’re kidding yourself.

    As I said to Hector, I could make a thousand points but you wouldn’t change your mind. So I’m happy to agree to disagree. Quake isn’t going to be added to the game, Kabam have literally said she’s too powerful and would need to be nerfed to be added. But hey, maybe you guys are right - and the champion who counters 99% of nodes in the game would be a good addition 🙃
    There are other areas of the game than T1-2 war, and even so, the could keep banning quake, there will be no difference whatsoever. What I'm saying is there wouldn't be as high scaling in the DOT, as a regular 5*-6* upgrade, so it's not a farfetched mind-blowing idea to bring her in as a 6*.
    I understand that she would be good for the 90% of the nodes, but comeon, 5* is too.
    Act 8 figts would still take plenty of time, in BG you could ban her, in AW you can ban her, I don't know how useful would be in AQ map8(/9?).
    But if I'm wrong with the scaling of DOT a dev can hop in to clarify things, just not this way, this didn't age too well:



    The reason for bringing up Quake in the context of Alliance War is wasn’t to say that Quake is too strong for Alliance War. It was to say that a 5* R5 Quake can hit so far above her weight class that she is still considered a substantial enough threat to use one of the very few bans available in the mode.

    Quake would gain roughly a 50% attack bump going from a 5* r5 to a 6* r4 (numbers derived from comparing her stats to Mangog, who has identical attack value as a 5* r5 according to Aunt Mai). That would suddenly make her viable in content like EOP and Act 8 and other large healthpool areas of the game where currently she is not a favored option, plus make her an absolute menace in Battlegrounds. She would immediately become the most powerful champion in the game (yes, stronger than Hercules and CGR and the others). Not because she outdamages them, but because she can handle so many more fights than they can.

    There was a time when new content had to be made Quake-proof and it was miserable. True Strike and similar nodes everywhere. Other champions who used evade mechanics, such as Elsa Bloodstone, were severely limited by this status quo. That’s why Quake was so bad for the game. She required the devs to design fights she couldn’t walk through blindfolded, which then had knock on effects to limit other champions the player base enjoyed. Her being out of the meta is a very good thing for the health of the game.
    Exactly this. If you think the reason Quake should be a 6* only because it would take “2-3 less aftershocks” then you don’t understand how powerful quake is.

    If a 5* is getting banned over 6* Rank 4s, that shows how powerful she is compared to those 6* rank 4s. Now imagine her as a 6* rank 4, everyone would only ever ban her, then when she’s whitelisted war would suck for an entire season. If you care about the game and how fun it is, if you think about it for more than 30 seconds you won’t want quake added.

    We have plenty of fun champions to use, you don’t need the most broken one in the game.
  • BitterSteelBitterSteel Posts: 8,860 ★★★★★
    Ackbar67 said:

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I agree with all your points except that no one has ever been as strong as quake. Pre 12.0 Scarlet Witch was easily on par with, if not more powerful than modern Quake for the time. As badly as 12.0 was handled, it was extremely necessary for the long term health of the game. If Kabam understandably doesn't want to directly nerf Quake, locking her as a 5* is the next best thing
    I was more talking about champions you could compare her to today, since quake would be joining the game and be compared to current champions.

    But I agree, 12.0 was necessary - and if Quake was a 6* it would be necessary again.
  • PikoluPikolu Posts: 2,028 ★★★★★
    @Wicket329 I'm glad I'm not the only one who disliked the 2+ straight years of content having true strike slapped on it to specifically counter quake. I also remember true sense slapped on boss island in AW to counter ghost until kitty came lol.
  • WorknprogressWorknprogress Posts: 7,231 ★★★★★

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    Rattling off other mistakes in champ balancing doesn't mean that the game team should double down on past mistakes or that players should want them to. There are multiple champs that shouldn't have been released as powerful as they are. Quake is just the most egregious by miles.

    All I hope for is they at least learn from past mistakes and nip champs like Herc, Ghost, Corvus, and probably even Kitty the same way by not releasing them as 7*s just like they seem to be doing with Quake. If the player base is going to throw a fit any time the word nerf gets brought up, this is about the best way of removing mistakes from the game.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Posts: 32,678 ★★★★★

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s

    Most people don't care in the slightest about game balance sadly and just want as many overpowered toys as possible. It makes them feel like they're getting one over on Kabam.
    "Balance". Lol, good one. And when exactly was the game... balanced? Nice theory but I would debate that OP champs are exactly those who bring in the cash for Kabam. Quake was not a well-planned one, that's all.
    Balance has never meant all Champs are equally powerful at everything. Balance more colloquially means keeping the status quo of the game from veering to extremes. There are some Champs that are powerful, and the game will never be without them. Unfortunately, when you have a Champ like Quake, when used properly, that can bypass a vast majority of content without ever getting hit, then you're somewhat hesitant to make a more powerful version.
  • xjdalegendxxjdalegendx Posts: 41
    Imo if they give her a 6* they’ll probably end up nerfing her and then the community will 9 times out of 10 get upset about the nerf
  • Etm34Etm34 Posts: 1,593 ★★★★★
    Honestly until this thread popped up I forgot Quake was even in the game….

    With story content being easy now and me not taking war very seriously I wouldn’t care at all if a 6* Quake were to be released. But I get why they don’t do it.
  • SirGamesBondSirGamesBond Posts: 2,657 ★★★★★

    benshb said:

    benshb said:

    @BitterSteel

    "shoulda / woulda / coulda" . We have a game in which Kabam not only deliberatly created numerous OP champions (see Doom, Apocalypse and certainly others) but the strongest of them all (Hercules), had the audacity to outright sell to the community in the Summer deals! Not NRG or anything! Just outright sell this champ, by selector in a crystal! The particular champion is so damn OP that we have people coming in the forums and creating threads asking how and exactly why they died using him in War! Imagine that! And we're still discussing about a 6* Quake...? Oh, come on...

    None of those champions, nor anybody you could possibly name is as strong as Quake.

    As I said before:

    Anyone who doesn’t think Quake would ruin the game as a 6* 1) doesn’t understand how powerful she is or 2) doesn’t remember what it was like when 5* quake dominated the game before 6* rank 3s
    I mean.... Going up against true strike, or life transfer, or like force of will nodes, I would much rather take champs like, you know....Herc, CGR, Kitty, and other extremely broken champs.

    Heck, you could even "nerf" (fix) quake against debuff immun opponents, she would still not be as much used as Hercules.
    There’s a reason Quake as a 5* champion gets banned sometimes over 6* Rank 4 champions in Tier 1-2 wars.

    There’s a reason she gets brought to war as a 5* champion instead of 6* champions.

    If you think Herc, CGR and Kitty would be banned or used as much as quake if they were only 5*s you’re kidding yourself.

    As I said to Hector, I could make a thousand points but you wouldn’t change your mind. So I’m happy to agree to disagree. Quake isn’t going to be added to the game, Kabam have literally said she’s too powerful and would need to be nerfed to be added. But hey, maybe you guys are right - and the champion who counters 99% of nodes in the game would be a good addition 🙃
    There are other areas of the game than T1-2 war, and even so, the could keep banning quake, there will be no difference whatsoever. What I'm saying is there wouldn't be as high scaling in the DOT, as a regular 5*-6* upgrade, so it's not a farfetched mind-blowing idea to bring her in as a 6*.
    I understand that she would be good for the 90% of the nodes, but comeon, 5* is too.
    Act 8 figts would still take plenty of time, in BG you could ban her, in AW you can ban her, I don't know how useful would be in AQ map8(/9?).
    But if I'm wrong with the scaling of DOT a dev can hop in to clarify things, just not this way, this didn't age too well:



    That was posted 2.5 years before her release, during which time we released 40+ new Champs, new content, new Story quests, nodes, and much more. Things change all the time in this game so old quotes can become out of date pretty quickly.
    Well Thanks Miike,
    Will see you in 2025 for that 6* quake.
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