Consumables Update: 3-Step Plan and First Look

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Comments

  • Eternity0Eternity0 Member Posts: 113 ★★
    So giving the feedback without knowing the whole context.

    The system of potions looks good and solid. Problem is why only unit based remodeling. Lets say for the sake of argument top 5% who uses potions in lengthy content like abyss or necropolis which comes in 2-3 years (i Don't why they would use potions anywhere else but sure) or aw master allies who uses potions would benefit from this sure. Change is great don't get wrong but for rest of the community this Doesn't help. Do people use units for potions that regularly in general?

    I hope there is a second post to help about general community. lvl5-6 potions being added to 4hour crystals would be a start for paragon players.
  • CosmicGuardianCosmicGuardian Member Posts: 408 ★★★
    While I can appreciate lowering the unit cost of potions, I don’t understand the issues switching to a percent based system would cause. For anyone who spends units on potions, then I can see this being an improvement, but for anyone else who don’t, like myself, it doesn’t really do much of anything.

    As pointed out, the main problem with the current potion system is that champion health pools are constantly growing larger and outgrowing the amounts healed by potions. While I appreciate the transparency behind this post, I feel like there should have been some clarification as to why increasing the amount healed or switching to a percent based system were ultimately ruled out. Either of those options would have benefitted more players, and would have been more beneficial, than just decreasing the unit cost.
  • MØNK3YMØNK3Y Member Posts: 16
    This is like the worst possible solution to such a big problem. Instead of being helpful with percentage potions, y’all are just lower the unit cost which still mean you have to whale out just to get your 6* kingpin back to like half health.
  • startropicsstartropics Member Posts: 905 ★★★★
    Yukzii_II said:

    Repto23 said:

    So let me see if I got this right.
    Boosts = Percentage
    Revive = Percentage
    Double Edge = Percentage
    Liquid Courage = Percentage
    Willpower = Percentage
    Health = Random amount set by team

    How does switching health potions to a percentage like everything else in the game cause problems for summoners?

    Percents are so much easier, let’s say I have 10x 5% health potions. Now I can use on any champ and get the same results no matter what. Why have small potions that only benefit 1/2* champs instead of allowing them to be used in any content?

    Less variety of potions would also mean less clutter in the game files instead of indefinitely adding higher level health potions as HP continues to rise.

    There is literally no problems that I can see arising from percent potions.
    no matter what they bring out and no matter how they market this, they will always rearrange the numbers so it takes them where they want to be.

    there's no escaping their monetization targets and "game balance". one example is they can just make percentage based potions so small that it ends up costing a lot anyway. they control the market and we are fools if we expect any different.
  • BowTieJohnBowTieJohn Member Posts: 2,379 ★★★★
    edited October 2023
    Percentage based health potions would have been a better idea and I can see them as a more long-term solution.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★
    Okay, this is a bit too much.
    People requested percentage-based. That doesn't mean that was the direction they were going. It may be disappointing, but it's not the direction.
    For that matter, its more of the same issue. Only on the opposite end. As it stands now, Champs that are lower get more from Pots. With percentage-based, the opposite would be true. Same Pots, more for higher Champs.
    I get the whole sentiment of being disappointed, but they're still looking at ways to improve them. Saying they changed nothing is extreme.
    People still spend to Heal. Not everyone saves every Unit for the big sales. In fact, it's pretty much mandatory at higher levels of game play that you Heal to full in team modes, and I'm almost positive the majority don't rely on stores alone, so it's a benefit.
    People can say whatever they like, but I have to interject and say I feel that some of the reactions are exaggerated.
  • LordSmasherLordSmasher Member Posts: 1,579 ★★★★★

    Okay, this is a bit too much.
    People requested percentage-based. That doesn't mean that was the direction they were going. It may be disappointing, but it's not the direction.
    For that matter, its more of the same issue. Only on the opposite end. As it stands now, Champs that are lower get more from Pots. With percentage-based, the opposite would be true. Same Pots, more for higher Champs.
    I get the whole sentiment of being disappointed, but they're still looking at ways to improve them. Saying they changed nothing is extreme.
    People still spend to Heal. Not everyone saves every Unit for the big sales. In fact, it's pretty much mandatory at higher levels of game play that you Heal to full in team modes, and I'm almost positive the majority don't rely on stores alone, so it's a benefit.
    People can say whatever they like, but I have to interject and say I feel that some of the reactions are exaggerated.

    What has changed?
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★

    Okay, this is a bit too much.
    People requested percentage-based. That doesn't mean that was the direction they were going. It may be disappointing, but it's not the direction.
    For that matter, its more of the same issue. Only on the opposite end. As it stands now, Champs that are lower get more from Pots. With percentage-based, the opposite would be true. Same Pots, more for higher Champs.
    I get the whole sentiment of being disappointed, but they're still looking at ways to improve them. Saying they changed nothing is extreme.
    People still spend to Heal. Not everyone saves every Unit for the big sales. In fact, it's pretty much mandatory at higher levels of game play that you Heal to full in team modes, and I'm almost positive the majority don't rely on stores alone, so it's a benefit.
    People can say whatever they like, but I have to interject and say I feel that some of the reactions are exaggerated.

    What has changed?
    They literally listed their plan. Did people even read it or did they stop at no percentage?
  • LordSmasherLordSmasher Member Posts: 1,579 ★★★★★

    Okay, this is a bit too much.
    People requested percentage-based. That doesn't mean that was the direction they were going. It may be disappointing, but it's not the direction.
    For that matter, its more of the same issue. Only on the opposite end. As it stands now, Champs that are lower get more from Pots. With percentage-based, the opposite would be true. Same Pots, more for higher Champs.
    I get the whole sentiment of being disappointed, but they're still looking at ways to improve them. Saying they changed nothing is extreme.
    People still spend to Heal. Not everyone saves every Unit for the big sales. In fact, it's pretty much mandatory at higher levels of game play that you Heal to full in team modes, and I'm almost positive the majority don't rely on stores alone, so it's a benefit.
    People can say whatever they like, but I have to interject and say I feel that some of the reactions are exaggerated.

    What has changed?
    They literally listed their plan. Did people even read it or did they stop at no percentage?
    Yes I read it. Did you? Potions haven't changed at all.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★

    Okay, this is a bit too much.
    People requested percentage-based. That doesn't mean that was the direction they were going. It may be disappointing, but it's not the direction.
    For that matter, its more of the same issue. Only on the opposite end. As it stands now, Champs that are lower get more from Pots. With percentage-based, the opposite would be true. Same Pots, more for higher Champs.
    I get the whole sentiment of being disappointed, but they're still looking at ways to improve them. Saying they changed nothing is extreme.
    People still spend to Heal. Not everyone saves every Unit for the big sales. In fact, it's pretty much mandatory at higher levels of game play that you Heal to full in team modes, and I'm almost positive the majority don't rely on stores alone, so it's a benefit.
    People can say whatever they like, but I have to interject and say I feel that some of the reactions are exaggerated.

    What has changed?
    They literally listed their plan. Did people even read it or did they stop at no percentage?
    Yes I read it. Did you? Potions haven't changed at all.
    Their availability is changing. Cheaper prices, more availability based on progression, more Loyalty to buy Pots, I mean the list goes on.
    You can argue ad nauseum that the Pots themselves don't heal more, but 2 for the price of one heals more. Not sure what the pricing will be, but that's the general idea.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★
    Djin said:

    Okay, this is a bit too much.
    People requested percentage-based. That doesn't mean that was the direction they were going. It may be disappointing, but it's not the direction.
    For that matter, its more of the same issue. Only on the opposite end. As it stands now, Champs that are lower get more from Pots. With percentage-based, the opposite would be true. Same Pots, more for higher Champs.
    I get the whole sentiment of being disappointed, but they're still looking at ways to improve them. Saying they changed nothing is extreme.
    People still spend to Heal. Not everyone saves every Unit for the big sales. In fact, it's pretty much mandatory at higher levels of game play that you Heal to full in team modes, and I'm almost positive the majority don't rely on stores alone, so it's a benefit.
    People can say whatever they like, but I have to interject and say I feel that some of the reactions are exaggerated.

    Maybe if you read the replies you would have realized that most of them are saying price drop is a step is right direction but this is just one of the issues with health potions.
    - No increase in the amount healed
    - No inventory cap increase

    Maybe if you read the post carefully you would have realized that this is a half baked information dump.
    - Most F2P player(including me) don't like to spend units on health potions. I would rather buy a full energy refill and restart the quest. It doesn't make me want to buy health potions. I still feel the same. And I can safely assume most player also feel the same.
    - They mention adding potions to the glory and loyalty store but they don't reveal the price.

    What kabam is trying to do here is by showing us the dropped prices they thought that the community will be excited and when they reveal the price of glory/loyalty store (which they mention will only be substantially lower), the community will overlook those prices because they reduced the amount of units to buy the potions.
    I read the comments. People demand transparency, and then complain that the information is "half-baked" when Kabam gives a tentative plan. The prices will be revealed when they're ready.
    The value of what people spend for is precisely the issue that makes it tricky to increase in any kind of reasonable way. Whatever you change is going to devalue the amount that X amount of Units are worth on either side.
    People don't *like* to spend on Pots and Revs, but their data clearly suggests that they do, otherwise they wouldn't be addressing it.
    There are a number of sources for free Pots and Revs in the game. You get more if you spend, and you don't even need to spend money. You can use Units which are earned. I'm sorry, but choosing not to use Units on them is a personal choice.
    Most people would say they want more for free. Game balance isn't always about want.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★
    The 500 Unit Deals alone have been a huge help. I'm sorry if people don't want to buy them, but that's entirely up to them.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★
    Djin said:

    .

    Djin said:

    Okay, this is a bit too much.
    People requested percentage-based. That doesn't mean that was the direction they were going. It may be disappointing, but it's not the direction.
    For that matter, its more of the same issue. Only on the opposite end. As it stands now, Champs that are lower get more from Pots. With percentage-based, the opposite would be true. Same Pots, more for higher Champs.
    I get the whole sentiment of being disappointed, but they're still looking at ways to improve them. Saying they changed nothing is extreme.
    People still spend to Heal. Not everyone saves every Unit for the big sales. In fact, it's pretty much mandatory at higher levels of game play that you Heal to full in team modes, and I'm almost positive the majority don't rely on stores alone, so it's a benefit.
    People can say whatever they like, but I have to interject and say I feel that some of the reactions are exaggerated.

    Maybe if you read the replies you would have realized that most of them are saying price drop is a step is right direction but this is just one of the issues with health potions.
    - No increase in the amount healed
    - No inventory cap increase

    Maybe if you read the post carefully you would have realized that this is a half baked information dump.
    - Most F2P player(including me) don't like to spend units on health potions. I would rather buy a full energy refill and restart the quest. It doesn't make me want to buy health potions. I still feel the same. And I can safely assume most player also feel the same.
    - They mention adding potions to the glory and loyalty store but they don't reveal the price.

    What kabam is trying to do here is by showing us the dropped prices they thought that the community will be excited and when they reveal the price of glory/loyalty store (which they mention will only be substantially lower), the community will overlook those prices because they reduced the amount of units to buy the potions.
    I read the comments. People demand transparency, and then complain that the information is "half-baked" when Kabam gives a tentative plan. The prices will be revealed when they're ready.
    The value of what people spend for is precisely the issue that makes it tricky to increase in any kind of reasonable way. Whatever you change is going to devalue the amount that X amount of Units are worth on either side.
    People don't *like* to spend on Pots and Revs, but their data clearly suggests that they do, otherwise they wouldn't be addressing it.
    There are a number of sources for free Pots and Revs in the game. You get more if you spend, and you don't even need to spend money. You can use Units which are earned. I'm sorry, but choosing not to use Units on them is a personal choice.
    Most people would say they want more for free. Game balance isn't always about want.
    Their data suggest that people prefer to use revives over potions because potions heal very less. They are decreasing the price to shift the meta from revive spamming to potion spamming.
    The cumulative result of these changes is intended to shift the meta away from always feeling like you have to revive to 20% or 40% health, and to provide more varied options where often it's best to heal your champions a greater amount.


    Again, potions obtained from other sources still have the same value. No real change there. Apply 10 potions just to increase the health by 2-3% of 6 Star champions
    Higher level potions cannot be obtained easily for free. Lower level potions have no real impact.
    That's like anything. Not everything is free.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★
    What you're describing only pertains to free Pots.
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,573 ★★★★★
    Djin said:

    What you're describing only pertains to free Pots.

    Maybe our definition of free is different. If they send something in the mail is free... items obtained from calendar is free.
    If I get something from completing a quest or doing the solo milestone is not free.
    When you're talking about spending versus earnable, it is.
  • DjinDjin Member Posts: 1,962 ★★★★★

    Djin said:

    What you're describing only pertains to free Pots.

    Maybe our definition of free is different. If they send something in the mail is free... items obtained from calendar is free.
    If I get something from completing a quest or doing the solo milestone is not free.
    When you're talking about spending versus earnable, it is.
    To put it according to your definition... make them significantly more earnable by slightly increasing the number of potions in different aspects of the game. That should have been the real focus of the this change not just units...
  • EaglesxsamiullaEaglesxsamiulla Member Posts: 2
    MCOC Team said:

    Hello Summoners!

    As discussed many moons ago, our team has been working hard on a Consumables Revamp. We have spent a lot of time considering how best to improve potions in the Contest. The intention of this post is to share with you our process, our findings and our short and longer-term plans.

    Before we get into it, we want to make sure that everybody is approaching this information with the knowledge that Potions and Revives are a very important part of the MCoC in-game Economy. The changes we’re sharing with you today were carefully considered and meticulously crafted to protect the future good of the game while also being a major upgrade for players. These changes will make the biggest impact for Summoners who spend their units to heal their roster and we hope you’ll see the value in these changes, making potions more affordable and accessible.

    Starting at the Beginning

    To provide the best solution, we began by identifying the core problems:

    • On a per-unit basis, potions heal far less health than revives do. This is due to the ever-growing health pools of champions, combined with the percentage-based nature of revives.
    • Because potions, especially lower-level potions, heal so little health on a per-potion basis, they’re time-consuming and fiddly to use.
    • If you have a health boost active, potions are less effective since your health pool is larger now but your potions still heal the same amount.
    • Our highest-level potions don’t heal enough health anymore relative to some champion health pools.

    A 3-Step Solution

    Below is our 3-step plan to mitigate these core concerns in a long-term, sustainable way. The solution is not switching to or adding percentage-based potions - we did consider this option carefully, but we ruled it out as we acknowledged an array of new problems for Summoners it could produce. Ultimately, we determined that the below solution would allow us to move forward effectively without introducing any new issues.

    In the interest of transparency, we wanted to give you an overview of the plan, our anticipated dates for when each of these aspects are targeted to ship and our confidence level we have in hitting these dates. If there are delays, we’ll keep you in the loop.

    STEP 1 - Potion Cost Adjustment

    Target launch date: Early November 2023

    Timeline Confidence: High

    • Unit prices for questing, Alliance War and Alliance Quest potions are dropping, and in many cases, significantly!
    • Moving forward, prices and availability for questing potions are going to be tied to progression.
      • Potions will be consistently cheaper in the rework, even for Challenger and Contender accounts. 
      • Proven-to-Uncollected accounts will gain access to level 5 potions (and level 6 potions through Unit Offers) and all potion Unit prices will drop. 
      • Cavalier+ accounts will see Unit prices for potions drop again, and will gain access to level 6 and 7 potions through unit offers. 
      • Because potion prices are now tied to milestone progress, in the future, as champion health pools continue to rise, we will lower potion prices as needed when we introduce further Progression Levels.
    • We’re adding Level 6 and 7 health potions and Level 6 and 7 team health potions to questing, Alliance War and Alliance Quest, and Level 5 health potions and Level 4 team health potions to Incursions
      • Note: these will be available in Unit Offers only.
    • We will continue to update our healing item offers to reflect the lowered base prices - this will likely not all be ready all at once, but rather than delay until all offer updates are ready, we thought it best to give you all the lowered base potion prices as early as possible. We aim to have all updated offers reflect the new base potions quickly thereafter.

    Potion Cost Update






    STEP 2 - Potions Compensate for Boosts & Glory/Loyalty Costs Update

    Target Launch Date: February 2024
    Timeline Confidence: Medium-high

    • When you have a health boost active, potions will heal that percentage more health while the boost is active
    • Prices in the Glory and Loyalty stores will be lowered, though not substantially. Instead, in Alliance War, for each fight completed you’ll gain Loyalty, giving you more access to this resource. We’ve approached the situation from this angle primarily to ensure that the choice of how to spend your Loyalty remains an interesting one.
    • We’re adding level 5 single and team potions to the Loyalty Store, and level 4 single and team potions to the Glory Store.

    STEP 3 - Quick Heal

    Target Launch Date: April 2024
    Timeline Confidence: Medium

    • Introducing Quick Heal! This will be a convenient, new option that will use the Potions and Revives from your inventory to heal your champions with one tap. This will be a new option in the pre-fight screen, and will also be usable from within the fight screen itself if you want to heal and jump right back in. If you’re out of healing items, there will be a separate Quick Heal option for you to directly convert Units to health/revival at a great exchange rate. This feature will dramatically reduce the number of taps needed to heal your champs, saving you time and effort. This feature will roll out first in questing content, but we will also introduce it to Alliance War, Alliance Quest and Incursions in future.
    • Note: the details of this feature are still under discussion

    Looking to the Future

    The cumulative result of these changes is intended to shift the meta away from always feeling like you have to revive to 20% or 40% health, and to provide more varied options where often it's best to heal your champions a greater amount. This is expected to give viability to a wider range of champions, and lower the stress of fights by giving revived champions more margin of error on the rematch.

    Now this is something very useful in the game we need.thanks for this potions update.
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  • Nameless_IWNameless_IW Member Posts: 1,048 ★★★★
    Siliyo said:

    Sorry, this may be great for the whales and people who use units but unless you’re lowering the cost of potions in the Glory, Incursion, and Loyalty store - this update isn’t that great for MOST summoners to be honest

    hold on so they are not lowering the cost of potions and revives at any of those stores ???
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