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Who is the better defender in BGs?

PolygonPolygon Posts: 3,837 ★★★★★
edited February 3 in General Discussion
Nick has the most counters so I would lean towards one of the other 2.

Who is the better defender in BGs? 113 votes

Nick
30%
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Jessica Jones
49%
DrZolaRagnarok13Terraege999menRayven5220sxlbstverliebtPikoluLuke9523Ayden_noah1OGAvengercaptain_rogersPowerofpain1001NanosamaEwell65SSS69ItsClobberinTimeDisthene_TReignkingTWPlinkoRenaxqqMatty_Ice 56 votes
Thing
20%
MasterSmokeMagicBentonDuo_Kuliobm3eppsAleorJustcause102peixemacacoRebarkErcarretCarracho01SchnoodleUltragamerFr4s3rMightyDPhilthiesMrA23JLordVileJGlocqueRiryokuJerichoharris 23 votes

Comments

  • Options
    EdisonLawEdisonLaw Posts: 1,971 ★★★★
    Jessica Jones
    You pretty much need a counter for Jessica otherwise you can’t use special attacks against her. Either a slow or cleanse champ
  • Options
    PolygonPolygon Posts: 3,837 ★★★★★
    ItsClobberinTime said:

    EdisonLaw said:

    You pretty much need a counter for Jessica otherwise you can’t use special attacks against her. Either a slow or cleanse champ

    Not really, if you nuke her down fast enough it's possible, I've killed a few with my 7* Sunspot. It all comes down to how quickly you can kill her really but I do think she's better than Nick or Thing, I don't think they're as dangerous as Jessica.
    I thought about that as well. If a nuke champ can kill her fast enough to not even need the cleanse or slow.
  • Options
    PolygonPolygon Posts: 3,837 ★★★★★
    edited February 3
    Looks like an easy win for Jessica here.

    Would everyone agree Thing takes it over Nick if Jessica wasn’t in the poll though?
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    Luke9523Luke9523 Posts: 907 ★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Jessica hands down.

    Thing is extremely easy to counter if you know his mechanics and how to fight against him.
    Nick is just a time consuming fight, but also not difficult, especially with a champ that can counter his second-life.
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    TheSaithTheSaith Posts: 634 ★★★
    EdisonLaw said:

    You pretty much need a counter for Jessica otherwise you can’t use special attacks against her. Either a slow or cleanse champ

    i never faced any problem with CGR , ELSA, or even KINGPIN
    idk what i am missing on her
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    ItsClobberinTimeItsClobberinTime Posts: 3,357 ★★★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Polygon said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    EdisonLaw said:

    You pretty much need a counter for Jessica otherwise you can’t use special attacks against her. Either a slow or cleanse champ

    Not really, if you nuke her down fast enough it's possible, I've killed a few with my 7* Sunspot. It all comes down to how quickly you can kill her really but I do think she's better than Nick or Thing, I don't think they're as dangerous as Jessica.
    I thought about that as well. If a nuke champ can kill her fast enough to not even need the cleanse or slow.
    Yeah so basically never place her if they have someone who can kill her in a single sp2 like HM, Sunspot, Hulkling etc the usual nukes cause she will get clapped before any of her strong defensive abilities start to trigger.
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    ItsClobberinTimeItsClobberinTime Posts: 3,357 ★★★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Polygon said:

    Looks like an easy win for Jessica here.

    Would everyone agree Thing takes it over Nick if Jessica wasn’t in the poll though?

    Absolutely, a sig 200 Thing without a counter can still waste more time than a sig 200 Nick. Most people are used to fighting Nick nowadays so you don't really need a counter, Thing on the other hand can be a guaranteed timeout on certain situations.
  • Options
    PolygonPolygon Posts: 3,837 ★★★★★
    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Polygon said:

    Looks like an easy win for Jessica here.

    Would everyone agree Thing takes it over Nick if Jessica wasn’t in the poll though?

    Absolutely, a sig 200 Thing without a counter can still waste more time than a sig 200 Nick. Most people are used to fighting Nick nowadays so you don't really need a counter, Thing on the other hand can be a guaranteed timeout on certain situations.
    People still hype Nick Fury for defense and i just can’t understand why unless he has a uncooperative AI and throws sp1 or something, Thing is definitely the better staller and defender overall in my opinion
  • Options
    Luke9523Luke9523 Posts: 907 ★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Polygon said:

    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Polygon said:

    Looks like an easy win for Jessica here.

    Would everyone agree Thing takes it over Nick if Jessica wasn’t in the poll though?

    Absolutely, a sig 200 Thing without a counter can still waste more time than a sig 200 Nick. Most people are used to fighting Nick nowadays so you don't really need a counter, Thing on the other hand can be a guaranteed timeout on certain situations.
    People still hype Nick Fury for defense and i just can’t understand why unless he has a uncooperative AI and throws sp1 or something, Thing is definitely the better staller and defender overall in my opinion
    It's all opinion based and who you have counters for.
    I am always much happier to see a Thing in BGs, because I know my Masacre can take it down in under 30 seconds and still have over 95% health left (unless I massively screw up).
  • Options
    PolygonPolygon Posts: 3,837 ★★★★★
    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

  • Options
    Luke9523Luke9523 Posts: 907 ★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Polygon said:

    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

    Although a sound argument about how to counter this in the draft stage, this is irrelevant, because the exact same could be said of Nick Fury counters. If someone had: Toad, Knull, Dani Moonstar..... I likely wouldn't pick Nick Fury as a defender, faced with these options.

    I'm not saying Nick Fury is a top tier defender, I'm just saying in my opinion, I would rather have to face Thing, as I find him a lot easier to counter, quicker, and with a larger range of Champs.
  • Options
    bm3eppsbm3epps Posts: 1,148 ★★★
    Thing
    I don't even ban NF in BGs. The only one I really dread playing is maybe Thing.
  • Options
    PolygonPolygon Posts: 3,837 ★★★★★
    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

    Although a sound argument about how to counter this in the draft stage, this is irrelevant, because the exact same could be said of Nick Fury counters. If someone had: Toad, Knull, Dani Moonstar..... I likely wouldn't pick Nick Fury as a defender, faced with these options.

    I'm not saying Nick Fury is a top tier defender, I'm just saying in my opinion, I would rather have to face Thing, as I find him a lot easier to counter, quicker, and with a larger range of Champs.
    It isn’t irrelevant because more champs can take Nick down in sub 60/65s than they can take Thing.

    AA,sunspot, onslaught, Kate, massacre,herc,Tigra, stealthy,crossbones,juggy,black cat,toad,bishop, Chavez, Galan, Domino, starky, cgr,hulkling, Future Antman to name a few
  • Options
    JT_SupremeJT_Supreme Posts: 839 ★★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Jessica Jones is the best if you don’t have a nuke or a counter, but I find thing way easier to counter than nf. Probably because he loves to throw unblockable sp1s at will and his stun immune can mess up my intercepts.

    Thing you only have to watch unstoppable so no problem there most times for me anyway.
  • Options
    ItsClobberinTimeItsClobberinTime Posts: 3,357 ★★★★★
    Jessica Jones
    JT_Supreme said:

    Jessica Jones is the best if you don’t have a nuke or a counter, but I find thing way easier to counter than nf. Probably because he loves to throw unblockable sp1s at will and his stun immune can mess up my intercepts.

    Thing you only have to watch unstoppable so no problem there most times for me anyway.

    I'm pretty sure op wasn't talking about overall defensive abilities but the time wasting part (at least for Thing and Nick). A sig 200 Thing can be a guaranteed time out in certain situations, Nick can be taken out even with Deathless Guillotine, you'll rarely time out against him unless you play very bad.
  • Options
    Luke9523Luke9523 Posts: 907 ★★★
    edited February 4
    Jessica Jones
    Polygon said:

    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

    Although a sound argument about how to counter this in the draft stage, this is irrelevant, because the exact same could be said of Nick Fury counters. If someone had: Toad, Knull, Dani Moonstar..... I likely wouldn't pick Nick Fury as a defender, faced with these options.

    I'm not saying Nick Fury is a top tier defender, I'm just saying in my opinion, I would rather have to face Thing, as I find him a lot easier to counter, quicker, and with a larger range of Champs.
    It isn’t irrelevant because more champs can take Nick down in sub 60/65s than they can take Thing.

    AA,sunspot, onslaught, Kate, massacre,herc,Tigra, stealthy,crossbones,juggy,black cat,toad,bishop, Chavez, Galan, Domino, starky, cgr,hulkling, Future Antman to name a few
    It is completely irrelevant, as we aren't talking about the draft stage, rather which defender is a more time consuming and difficult fight.

    I can see this is like talking to a wall, so I'm just going to give up after this. You asked for people's opinions, and when they didn't agree with you, you didn't like it and got triggered. But people struggle and thrive against different opponents.

    You want my honest opinion? I think that Thing is so outdated as a top defender and is now extremely easy to counter, I am GLAD when I have to face him. A good player can counter him successfully with almost every single champ, so long as you understand the mechanics.
  • Options
    PolygonPolygon Posts: 3,837 ★★★★★
    edited February 4
    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

    Although a sound argument about how to counter this in the draft stage, this is irrelevant, because the exact same could be said of Nick Fury counters. If someone had: Toad, Knull, Dani Moonstar..... I likely wouldn't pick Nick Fury as a defender, faced with these options.

    I'm not saying Nick Fury is a top tier defender, I'm just saying in my opinion, I would rather have to face Thing, as I find him a lot easier to counter, quicker, and with a larger range of Champs.
    It isn’t irrelevant because more champs can take Nick down in sub 60/65s than they can take Thing.

    AA,sunspot, onslaught, Kate, massacre,herc,Tigra, stealthy,crossbones,juggy,black cat,toad,bishop, Chavez, Galan, Domino, starky, cgr,hulkling, Future Antman to name a few
    It is completely irrelevant, as we aren't talking about the draft stage, rather which defender is a more time consuming and difficult fight.

    I can see this is like talking to a wall, so I'm just going to give up after this. You asked for people's opinions, and when they didn't agree with you, you didn't like it and got triggered. But people struggle and thrive against different opponents.

    You want my honest opinion? I think that Thing is so outdated as a top defender and is now extremely easy to counter, I am GLAD when I have to face him. A good player can counter him successfully with almost every single champ, so long as you understand the mechanics.
    You did not just say “they” in plural when it’s literally just you lmao. The guy above with white tiger pfp even commented the exact opposite , that he doesnt ban Nick and the only one he dreads playing against is Thing. Since you used a fallacy to try proving a point, I’ll do you a favor and make a poll with just Thing and Fury in it and lets see if people really think Thing is outdated.
  • Options
    Matty_IceMatty_Ice Posts: 538 ★★★
    Jessica Jones
    1st place: Jessica can just suck to fight. If the fight goes wrong it’s a tough battle to get back in control.

    2nd place: Thing with the right nodes can be a problem, but for the most part is a simple fight as long as you’re able to manage his stacks. And an sig 200 thing can just be an annoying long fight if you don’t have a good counter.

    3rd place: Nick is pretty straightforward, but might take some block damage if he’s not willing to throw heavies. As long as you can keep him from throwing sp1 the fight is over, and that is even easier now with strikers.
  • Options
    Dab_westDab_west Posts: 122 ★
    Nick
    nick is still the best defender out of these 3 cause he stalls and u have the potential to be taking more block damage
  • Options
    Luke9523Luke9523 Posts: 907 ★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Polygon said:

    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

    Although a sound argument about how to counter this in the draft stage, this is irrelevant, because the exact same could be said of Nick Fury counters. If someone had: Toad, Knull, Dani Moonstar..... I likely wouldn't pick Nick Fury as a defender, faced with these options.

    I'm not saying Nick Fury is a top tier defender, I'm just saying in my opinion, I would rather have to face Thing, as I find him a lot easier to counter, quicker, and with a larger range of Champs.
    It isn’t irrelevant because more champs can take Nick down in sub 60/65s than they can take Thing.

    AA,sunspot, onslaught, Kate, massacre,herc,Tigra, stealthy,crossbones,juggy,black cat,toad,bishop, Chavez, Galan, Domino, starky, cgr,hulkling, Future Antman to name a few
    It is completely irrelevant, as we aren't talking about the draft stage, rather which defender is a more time consuming and difficult fight.

    I can see this is like talking to a wall, so I'm just going to give up after this. You asked for people's opinions, and when they didn't agree with you, you didn't like it and got triggered. But people struggle and thrive against different opponents.

    You want my honest opinion? I think that Thing is so outdated as a top defender and is now extremely easy to counter, I am GLAD when I have to face him. A good player can counter him successfully with almost every single champ, so long as you understand the mechanics.
    You did not just say “they” in plural when it’s literally just you lmao. The guy above with white tiger pfp even commented the exact opposite , that he doesnt ban Nick and the only one he dreads playing against is Thing. Since you used a fallacy to try proving a point, I’ll do you a favor and make a poll with just Thing and Fury in it and lets see if people really think Thing is outdated.
    Yes, I did say THEY, as in plural, correct. I'm not quite sure if its your grammar, your basic maths skills, or ignorance that is failing you here. But I count 3 people in the comments who disagree with you: myself, superchubbies and JT Supreme. That's not just me pal.
    Along with the 20+ people in the poll you so kindly created, yet fail to acknowledge. Evidence for you below:


    I'm pretty sure in almost all, if not all of my comments, I clarified my opinion with 'this is my own personal opinion', since this is not a factual debate, rather just people's opinions, which you asked for. You just got triggered when everyone didn't side with you.

    Everyone is entitled to their own opinion on who is the more difficult champ to face. Just because you try to shout yours the loudest, doesn't make it correct. Many more people than just me, disagree with you on this.

    And your other poll doesn't prove anything, regardless of who comes out on top, the fact that it isn't 100% either way shows, it's opinion! And you won't change mine by acting infantile because you didn't hear what you wanted on a public forum.
  • Options
    ItsClobberinTimeItsClobberinTime Posts: 3,357 ★★★★★
    Jessica Jones
    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

    Although a sound argument about how to counter this in the draft stage, this is irrelevant, because the exact same could be said of Nick Fury counters. If someone had: Toad, Knull, Dani Moonstar..... I likely wouldn't pick Nick Fury as a defender, faced with these options.

    I'm not saying Nick Fury is a top tier defender, I'm just saying in my opinion, I would rather have to face Thing, as I find him a lot easier to counter, quicker, and with a larger range of Champs.
    It isn’t irrelevant because more champs can take Nick down in sub 60/65s than they can take Thing.

    AA,sunspot, onslaught, Kate, massacre,herc,Tigra, stealthy,crossbones,juggy,black cat,toad,bishop, Chavez, Galan, Domino, starky, cgr,hulkling, Future Antman to name a few
    It is completely irrelevant, as we aren't talking about the draft stage, rather which defender is a more time consuming and difficult fight.

    I can see this is like talking to a wall, so I'm just going to give up after this. You asked for people's opinions, and when they didn't agree with you, you didn't like it and got triggered. But people struggle and thrive against different opponents.

    You want my honest opinion? I think that Thing is so outdated as a top defender and is now extremely easy to counter, I am GLAD when I have to face him. A good player can counter him successfully with almost every single champ, so long as you understand the mechanics.
    How exactly do you play around that protection at sig 200 without a counter, tell us, illuminate us. The protection instantly shuts down any big damage which forces you to have a counter. If you love facing Thing I don't think you've faced a sig 200 one without a counter yet lol.
  • Options
    Luke9523Luke9523 Posts: 907 ★★★
    Jessica Jones
    ItsClobberinTime said:

    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    Luke9523 said:

    Polygon said:

    @Luke9523 @SuperChubbies7

    The thing is, If I saw you guys draft a Black Cat, Masacre, Falcon, Valk etc then I wouldn’t draft Thing.

    Speaking from experience I would either

    1) Wait until the later rounds of the draft to sneak in Thing if I saw you didn’t draft any of those skill counters to catch you off guard

    Or

    2) Draft thing early on in hopes those skill champs don’t show up. And IF they did, then I simply would make you waste your draft on them, as I wouldn’t put Thing down on defense

    Although a sound argument about how to counter this in the draft stage, this is irrelevant, because the exact same could be said of Nick Fury counters. If someone had: Toad, Knull, Dani Moonstar..... I likely wouldn't pick Nick Fury as a defender, faced with these options.

    I'm not saying Nick Fury is a top tier defender, I'm just saying in my opinion, I would rather have to face Thing, as I find him a lot easier to counter, quicker, and with a larger range of Champs.
    It isn’t irrelevant because more champs can take Nick down in sub 60/65s than they can take Thing.

    AA,sunspot, onslaught, Kate, massacre,herc,Tigra, stealthy,crossbones,juggy,black cat,toad,bishop, Chavez, Galan, Domino, starky, cgr,hulkling, Future Antman to name a few
    It is completely irrelevant, as we aren't talking about the draft stage, rather which defender is a more time consuming and difficult fight.

    I can see this is like talking to a wall, so I'm just going to give up after this. You asked for people's opinions, and when they didn't agree with you, you didn't like it and got triggered. But people struggle and thrive against different opponents.

    You want my honest opinion? I think that Thing is so outdated as a top defender and is now extremely easy to counter, I am GLAD when I have to face him. A good player can counter him successfully with almost every single champ, so long as you understand the mechanics.
    How exactly do you play around that protection at sig 200 without a counter, tell us, illuminate us. The protection instantly shuts down any big damage which forces you to have a counter. If you love facing Thing I don't think you've faced a sig 200 one without a counter yet lol.
    In all honesty, I can't tell you how many sig 1 or sig 200 Thing's I have beaten, as I don't make a habit of going and checking the sig level of everyone I beat (or don't beat, for that matter). So I have no idea how many sig 200's I have faced in BGs.
    All I know is (as the question that was originally posted), I believe that NF is a better defender than Thing, but not as good as JJ, and I would definitely block a NF over Thing in BGs.
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