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How is this possible?

BajjsbwuqjwBajjsbwuqjw Posts: 876 ★★★
edited November 2018 in General Discussion
[Photo removed by moderator]


1.These 11.x point alliances did never meet each othet during this season
2.They won all matches
3. Possibility to not match each other during 8 wars when it is 5 teams is 1 out of 200


For me it is pretty obvious that they avoid each other and for me thats unfair against competition

I am nowhere in that league but it stinks
Post edited by Kabam Zibiit on

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  • Options
    KerneasKerneas Posts: 3,745 ★★★★★
    I am sorry, but how do you know this ? I am willing to believe, but I need proof
  • Options
    DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 21,060 ★★★★★
    edited November 2018
    [Photo removed by moderator]


    1.These 11.x point alliances did never meet each othet during this season
    2.They won all matches
    3. Possibility to not match each other during 8 wars when it is 5 teams is 1 out of 200


    For me it is pretty obvious that they avoid each other and for me thats unfair against competition

    I am nowhere in that league but it stinks

    Whats your point then if you aren't anywhere near their level? Whats it going to matter to you what happens? Won't effect your outcome any more or less.
    Post edited by Kabam Zibiit on
  • Options
    RagamugginGunnerRagamugginGunner Posts: 2,210 ★★★★★
    Competitive Integrity.
  • Options
    DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 21,060 ★★★★★
    chunkyb wrote: »
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    y856herc3z2m.jpg


    1.These 11.x point alliances did never meet each othet during this season
    2.They won all matches
    3. Possibility to not match each other during 8 wars when it is 5 teams is 1 out of 200


    For me it is pretty obvious that they avoid each other and for me thats unfair against competition

    I am nowhere in that league but it stinks

    Whats your point then if you aren't anywhere near their level? Whats it going to matter to you what happens? Won't effect your outcome any more or less.

    No offense meant, but this is a very common, short-sighted, and inherently incorrect view. The fact is that when alliances manipulate the system to stay on top, they are able to broaden the gap between them and everyone else. This is the case whether we're talking war, aq, or quests.

    This entire game, from top to bottom, is built on progress and growth.

    In a war season, there's a lot more than just war happening. Alliances at and near the top are uniquely able to do some things that lower alliances can't... Simply bc of #s. Avoiding other master (and even plat 1) alliances happens more often than many realize. So does coordinating search times between different allis. Some VERY top end alliances have faced multiple p2 alliances this season. That could mean defenders remaining points and spread the gap more.

    To simplify, winning a season isn't about beating everyone and being the best anymore. I'm not questioning the skill levels of those alliances, by the way. They're really good haha. But now, it's about playing the game within the game to get beneficial matchups and reap the rewards... Some of this is enabled by matchmaking chats, tho that concept is a little old at this point... Some is enabled simply by collusion to avoid... Some is by players having multiple accounts in different alliances and helping to coordinate avoidance... Which all enables you to rank more... Which opens the possibility of more defenders remaining next season. Which equals more ranks. Which equals higher pi... Which links to..
    .
    .
    Top level aq ranking. Which gives more rank up material lol. On top of that, I've seen forum users and kabam minimize the effects of the 2015 rank up gem bug and that bothers me. Being able to rank a 2015 champ would most likely mean that a player's prestige wouldn't change. Whereas ranking any champ could most definitely equal a prestige change. Prestige is more important now than it has been in the recent past. Aq rewards are better, and will theoretically get even better with the intro of map 7. When all top alliances play map 6 all week, the highest prestige gets the best rewards. There's no question of not finishing a map. That doesn't exist. I won't go into details about how they pay for that much map 6 EVERY aq cycle, but if you do the math on loyalty... You will very clearly know what's possible and what's not possible.

    Those rank ups can also mean a new meta defender being ranked and miraculously holding his/her ground on war defense vs a much lower alliance. Which is more season points, which just perpetuates the cycle.

    The bottom line is that player almost certainly CANNOT be at their level now or in the future. Not because of his/her skill, dedication, or hard work... But because of a manipulated system that continues down the wrong path.

    Would proper fixes across the board greatly change the landscape? No. Not immediately. But it would have an effect that would grow over time and give a more balanced playing field. Will it effect the majority of players? Nope. Does that mean it shouldn't be fixed? Hell no.

    @chunkyb I don't disagree with what you said but in reality if the top 10 alliances in AW flipped positions with one another but stayed in top 10, there still isn't a trickle down effect. The top 15ish alliances are pretty much set and because of their war rating (this is where the system is broken) they can schedule the wars they want because they know who they are going up against. Until a better, more fair matchmaking system is implemented, there isn't much that can be done about the top.

    But I get back to OP's point, he/she is making accusations without 100% proof. We can all speculate but he/she has levied some heavy accusations and hasn't answered to how they know.
  • Options
    ShrimkinsShrimkins Posts: 1,479 ★★★★
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    But I get back to OP's point, he/she is making accusations without 100% proof. We can all speculate but he/she has levied some heavy accusations and hasn't answered to how they know.

    Except he does have 100% proof. If all of those alliances have won all their matches then clearly they didn't face each other.
  • Options
    DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 21,060 ★★★★★
    Shrimkins wrote: »
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    But I get back to OP's point, he/she is making accusations without 100% proof. We can all speculate but he/she has levied some heavy accusations and hasn't answered to how they know.

    Except he does have 100% proof. If all of those alliances have won all their matches then clearly they didn't face each other.

    I don't see how you can tell they haven't faced each other or know they haven't?
  • Options
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    chunkyb wrote: »
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    y856herc3z2m.jpg


    1.These 11.x point alliances did never meet each othet during this season
    2.They won all matches
    3. Possibility to not match each other during 8 wars when it is 5 teams is 1 out of 200


    For me it is pretty obvious that they avoid each other and for me thats unfair against competition

    I am nowhere in that league but it stinks

    Whats your point then if you aren't anywhere near their level? Whats it going to matter to you what happens? Won't effect your outcome any more or less.

    No offense meant, but this is a very common, short-sighted, and inherently incorrect view. The fact is that when alliances manipulate the system to stay on top, they are able to broaden the gap between them and everyone else. This is the case whether we're talking war, aq, or quests.

    This entire game, from top to bottom, is built on progress and growth.

    In a war season, there's a lot more than just war happening. Alliances at and near the top are uniquely able to do some things that lower alliances can't... Simply bc of #s. Avoiding other master (and even plat 1) alliances happens more often than many realize. So does coordinating search times between different allis. Some VERY top end alliances have faced multiple p2 alliances this season. That could mean defenders remaining points and spread the gap more.

    To simplify, winning a season isn't about beating everyone and being the best anymore. I'm not questioning the skill levels of those alliances, by the way. They're really good haha. But now, it's about playing the game within the game to get beneficial matchups and reap the rewards... Some of this is enabled by matchmaking chats, tho that concept is a little old at this point... Some is enabled simply by collusion to avoid... Some is by players having multiple accounts in different alliances and helping to coordinate avoidance... Which all enables you to rank more... Which opens the possibility of more defenders remaining next season. Which equals more ranks. Which equals higher pi... Which links to..
    .
    .
    Top level aq ranking. Which gives more rank up material lol. On top of that, I've seen forum users and kabam minimize the effects of the 2015 rank up gem bug and that bothers me. Being able to rank a 2015 champ would most likely mean that a player's prestige wouldn't change. Whereas ranking any champ could most definitely equal a prestige change. Prestige is more important now than it has been in the recent past. Aq rewards are better, and will theoretically get even better with the intro of map 7. When all top alliances play map 6 all week, the highest prestige gets the best rewards. There's no question of not finishing a map. That doesn't exist. I won't go into details about how they pay for that much map 6 EVERY aq cycle, but if you do the math on loyalty... You will very clearly know what's possible and what's not possible.

    Those rank ups can also mean a new meta defender being ranked and miraculously holding his/her ground on war defense vs a much lower alliance. Which is more season points, which just perpetuates the cycle.

    The bottom line is that player almost certainly CANNOT be at their level now or in the future. Not because of his/her skill, dedication, or hard work... But because of a manipulated system that continues down the wrong path.

    Would proper fixes across the board greatly change the landscape? No. Not immediately. But it would have an effect that would grow over time and give a more balanced playing field. Will it effect the majority of players? Nope. Does that mean it shouldn't be fixed? Hell no.

    @chunkyb I don't disagree with what you said but in reality if the top 10 alliances in AW flipped positions with one another but stayed in top 10, there still isn't a trickle down effect. The top 15ish alliances are pretty much set and because of their war rating (this is where the system is broken) they can schedule the wars they want because they know who they are going up against. Until a better, more fair matchmaking system is implemented, there isn't much that can be done about the top.

    But I get back to OP's point, he/she is making accusations without 100% proof. We can all speculate but he/she has levied some heavy accusations and hasn't answered to how they know.

    I've seen a lot of matchup screens from this season, if it helps at all lol

    But to the point you raise about the top not changing...

    My argument to that would simply be that they don't face the "extra" issues that others face. Others match randomly and deal w what they get. Then they spend loyalty or other resources and boost. They don't have an assured win bc of a huge mismatch. Obv, a top alliance doesn't always have the benefit of not having to boost or fight hard for a win.. But in a season format, even a single "free" win makes a lot of difference for the season... Both in points and in resources saved. And this season, we're talking about a lot of "free" wins.

    Beyond that, the greatest migration away from this game that I've seen to date is when kabam finally did something about piloting. Cheaters tried to continue cheating, but ended up walking away. I know kabam wants to "rehabilitate" the bad guys, but that's silly imo. Better for people that are dead set on cheating to just go away.

    Most alliances have to deal with turnover, recruiting unreliable players, and any number of issues that aren't just winning a fight. The things I said before help top alliances to avoid those pitfalls as well. Some feel the "drain" of the season, but not many... Usually, it's only the few honest allis at the top that do.

    Couple that with the lack of need to grind, because of the ways in which they go outside the game to get resources, and it's an easier road to maintaining their level. Give them the day to day headaches others face, take away the shortcuts, and see what happens. It'd be very similar to the piloting results of the past.

    No aspect of this game happens in a vacuum. It's all related to the rest. Alliances at any rank have an affect on others. It's not always a huge, direct effect... But it still exists.

    Personally, I think it's the saddest, weakest thing ever to spend so much time and money cheating for digital rewards lol. But unfortunately, there's some pavlovian **** at work lmao
  • Options
    chunkyb wrote: »
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    y856herc3z2m.jpg


    1.These 11.x point alliances did never meet each othet during this season
    2.They won all matches
    3. Possibility to not match each other during 8 wars when it is 5 teams is 1 out of 200


    For me it is pretty obvious that they avoid each other and for me thats unfair against competition

    I am nowhere in that league but it stinks

    Whats your point then if you aren't anywhere near their level? Whats it going to matter to you what happens? Won't effect your outcome any more or less.

    No offense meant, but this is a very common, short-sighted, and inherently incorrect view. The fact is that when alliances manipulate the system to stay on top, they are able to broaden the gap between them and everyone else. This is the case whether we're talking war, aq, or quests.

    This entire game, from top to bottom, is built on progress and growth.

    In a war season, there's a lot more than just war happening. Alliances at and near the top are uniquely able to do some things that lower alliances can't... Simply bc of #s. Avoiding other master (and even plat 1) alliances happens more often than many realize. So does coordinating search times between different allis. Some VERY top end alliances have faced multiple p2 alliances this season. That could mean defenders remaining points and spread the gap more.

    To simplify, winning a season isn't about beating everyone and being the best anymore. I'm not questioning the skill levels of those alliances, by the way. They're really good haha. But now, it's about playing the game within the game to get beneficial matchups and reap the rewards... Some of this is enabled by matchmaking chats, tho that concept is a little old at this point... Some is enabled simply by collusion to avoid... Some is by players having multiple accounts in different alliances and helping to coordinate avoidance... Which all enables you to rank more... Which opens the possibility of more defenders remaining next season. Which equals more ranks. Which equals higher pi... Which links to..
    .
    .
    Top level aq ranking. Which gives more rank up material lol. On top of that, I've seen forum users and kabam minimize the effects of the 2015 rank up gem bug and that bothers me. Being able to rank a 2015 champ would most likely mean that a player's prestige wouldn't change. Whereas ranking any champ could most definitely equal a prestige change. Prestige is more important now than it has been in the recent past. Aq rewards are better, and will theoretically get even better with the intro of map 7. When all top alliances play map 6 all week, the highest prestige gets the best rewards. There's no question of not finishing a map. That doesn't exist. I won't go into details about how they pay for that much map 6 EVERY aq cycle, but if you do the math on loyalty... You will very clearly know what's possible and what's not possible.

    Those rank ups can also mean a new meta defender being ranked and miraculously holding his/her ground on war defense vs a much lower alliance. Which is more season points, which just perpetuates the cycle.

    The bottom line is that player almost certainly CANNOT be at their level now or in the future. Not because of his/her skill, dedication, or hard work... But because of a manipulated system that continues down the wrong path.

    Would proper fixes across the board greatly change the landscape? No. Not immediately. But it would have an effect that would grow over time and give a more balanced playing field. Will it effect the majority of players? Nope. Does that mean it shouldn't be fixed? Hell no.

    Holy---

    Yeah. Sorry. Lmao. Been some stuff bugging me lately.
  • Options
    DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Posts: 21,060 ★★★★★
    edited November 2018
    chunkyb wrote: »
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    chunkyb wrote: »
    Demonzfyre wrote: »
    y856herc3z2m.jpg


    1.These 11.x point alliances did never meet each othet during this season
    2.They won all matches
    3. Possibility to not match each other during 8 wars when it is 5 teams is 1 out of 200


    For me it is pretty obvious that they avoid each other and for me thats unfair against competition

    I am nowhere in that league but it stinks

    Whats your point then if you aren't anywhere near their level? Whats it going to matter to you what happens? Won't effect your outcome any more or less.

    No offense meant, but this is a very common, short-sighted, and inherently incorrect view. The fact is that when alliances manipulate the system to stay on top, they are able to broaden the gap between them and everyone else. This is the case whether we're talking war, aq, or quests.

    This entire game, from top to bottom, is built on progress and growth.

    In a war season, there's a lot more than just war happening. Alliances at and near the top are uniquely able to do some things that lower alliances can't... Simply bc of #s. Avoiding other master (and even plat 1) alliances happens more often than many realize. So does coordinating search times between different allis. Some VERY top end alliances have faced multiple p2 alliances this season. That could mean defenders remaining points and spread the gap more.

    To simplify, winning a season isn't about beating everyone and being the best anymore. I'm not questioning the skill levels of those alliances, by the way. They're really good haha. But now, it's about playing the game within the game to get beneficial matchups and reap the rewards... Some of this is enabled by matchmaking chats, tho that concept is a little old at this point... Some is enabled simply by collusion to avoid... Some is by players having multiple accounts in different alliances and helping to coordinate avoidance... Which all enables you to rank more... Which opens the possibility of more defenders remaining next season. Which equals more ranks. Which equals higher pi... Which links to..
    .
    .
    Top level aq ranking. Which gives more rank up material lol. On top of that, I've seen forum users and kabam minimize the effects of the 2015 rank up gem bug and that bothers me. Being able to rank a 2015 champ would most likely mean that a player's prestige wouldn't change. Whereas ranking any champ could most definitely equal a prestige change. Prestige is more important now than it has been in the recent past. Aq rewards are better, and will theoretically get even better with the intro of map 7. When all top alliances play map 6 all week, the highest prestige gets the best rewards. There's no question of not finishing a map. That doesn't exist. I won't go into details about how they pay for that much map 6 EVERY aq cycle, but if you do the math on loyalty... You will very clearly know what's possible and what's not possible.

    Those rank ups can also mean a new meta defender being ranked and miraculously holding his/her ground on war defense vs a much lower alliance. Which is more season points, which just perpetuates the cycle.

    The bottom line is that player almost certainly CANNOT be at their level now or in the future. Not because of his/her skill, dedication, or hard work... But because of a manipulated system that continues down the wrong path.

    Would proper fixes across the board greatly change the landscape? No. Not immediately. But it would have an effect that would grow over time and give a more balanced playing field. Will it effect the majority of players? Nope. Does that mean it shouldn't be fixed? Hell no.

    @chunkyb I don't disagree with what you said but in reality if the top 10 alliances in AW flipped positions with one another but stayed in top 10, there still isn't a trickle down effect. The top 15ish alliances are pretty much set and because of their war rating (this is where the system is broken) they can schedule the wars they want because they know who they are going up against. Until a better, more fair matchmaking system is implemented, there isn't much that can be done about the top.

    But I get back to OP's point, he/she is making accusations without 100% proof. We can all speculate but he/she has levied some heavy accusations and hasn't answered to how they know.

    I've seen a lot of matchup screens from this season, if it helps at all lol

    But to the point you raise about the top not changing...

    My argument to that would simply be that they don't face the "extra" issues that others face. Others match randomly and deal w what they get. Then they spend loyalty or other resources and boost. They don't have an assured win bc of a huge mismatch. Obv, a top alliance doesn't always have the benefit of not having to boost or fight hard for a win.. But in a season format, even a single "free" win makes a lot of difference for the season... Both in points and in resources saved. And this season, we're talking about a lot of "free" wins.

    Beyond that, the greatest migration away from this game that I've seen to date is when kabam finally did something about piloting. Cheaters tried to continue cheating, but ended up walking away. I know kabam wants to "rehabilitate" the bad guys, but that's silly imo. Better for people that are dead set on cheating to just go away.

    Most alliances have to deal with turnover, recruiting unreliable players, and any number of issues that aren't just winning a fight. The things I said before help top alliances to avoid those pitfalls as well. Some feel the "drain" of the season, but not many... Usually, it's only the few honest allis at the top that do.

    Couple that with the lack of need to grind, because of the ways in which they go outside the game to get resources, and it's an easier road to maintaining their level. Give them the day to day headaches others face, take away the shortcuts, and see what happens. It'd be very similar to the piloting results of the past.

    No aspect of this game happens in a vacuum. It's all related to the rest. Alliances at any rank have an affect on others. It's not always a huge, direct effect... But it still exists.

    Personally, I think it's the saddest, weakest thing ever to spend so much time and money cheating for digital rewards lol. But unfortunately, there's some pavlovian **** at work lmao

    No argument from me that the TOP will always be the TOP. There isn't a way to catch up to them roster/resource wise unless you win the lottery or some how have infinite funds to spend as you please. But even then you still have to have some skill to compete at the top (if piloting actually is done with). The gap right now is just to big to overcome for the moderate to low spenders.

    There isn't anything I can do to effect the top by any means so let them play on their mountain. I'll continue to dream of having a 2nd R5 in the next 6-8 months possibly lol
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