Masochism making me question my life

FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
in Strategy and Tips
As the title suggests. I'm stuck in the 'Lines in the sand' chapter. All my champions are getting knocked out every second fight. I've blown over 250 units on this quest and I'm only halfway through it. Should I quit or keep blowing units until I get done with it?

Any tips for this quest would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!
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  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
    Midnite93 said:

    Masochism in act5? Sabretooth and proxima midnight helps with that node.

    I have neither of them. I have a fixed team sadly and I can't get any new champions into this quest as of now. Thanks anyways.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • Austin555555Austin555555 Member Posts: 3,048 ★★★★★
    Post your roster so we can help better
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★



    Here it is. The top 5 champions are the ones I've taken in.
  • Oliverb1980Oliverb1980 Member Posts: 99 ★
    I remember I used a combo of void and x23 on that quest. Void you have ti time when you release his sp1.what I did was if the void debuff timer is almost up I'd trigger a parry to start masochism so that void's debuff would apply then launch an sp1. For x23 just fight as normal. Her bleed will outdamage the heal. Helpful if you have despair and deep wounds
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    FreeToPlay_21 said:

    As the title suggests. I'm stuck in the 'Lines in the sand' chapter. All my champions are getting knocked out every second fight. I've blown over 250 units on this quest and I'm only halfway through it. Should I quit or keep blowing units until I get done with it?

    Any tips for this quest would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

    Energy is cheaper than potions. If you're dying early on in any map, I always recommend just pushing as far as you can without units to get as much exposure as possible, then backing out and trying again. Maybe push at the end if you think you just need a little more, but don't push from the very start: that's just too expensive unless you have no problem spending past content.

    Lines in the Sand appears to be 5.2.4, which has Masochism. Masochism has a couple of strategies for dealing with it. First of all, you can try to not trigger it. Masochism heals the defender when you land a debuff, but it can only trigger every seven seconds. So if you just don't land any debuffs at all it never triggers. This isn't easy, but there are ways to at least reduce the number of triggers. You can try to intercept instead of parrying for example, and you can use champs that don't debuff. I consider this to be the hardest option to pull off.

    Next, you can use ability accuracy reduction. Masochism has ability accuracy, so anything that reduces defensive ability accuracy will lower the chance to trigger Masochism. As @Midnite93 says above, Sabretooth is an option because he has a synergy where every time he lands a debuff he reduces DAA by 100%, essentially stopping any defensive ability from triggering. So you can use Parry with Sabretooth because Masochism won't trigger (parry lands the stun debuff, and the synergy then stops masochism).

    Another option is heal block or heal reversal. Champs like Void, CapIW (with high sig and the right team) can reverse healing, so you can use Masochism itself to kill the defender. Champs like Vision who can heal block can simply stop the heal. But this is tricky: heal block is a debuff, so if the defender has "recharged" his Masochism and you land heal block, the heal block will be removed and Masochism will trigger. You need to play smart and heal block while Masochism is recharging for this to work.

    And then there's the last option which is to overwhelm Masochism. Many players make the mistake of being too scared of Masochism so they try to use slow tactics to avoid triggering it, but then this allows Masochism to recharge and then heal, while you aren't dealing any damage in return. Some players just dive right into the fight with something that just oozes debuffs, like X-23 or Blade and just go ham: yes you'll trigger Masochism, but you can only trigger it once every seven seconds. If you can deal more damage in seven seconds than Masochism heals back for, you can simply pretend you're fighting Angela or something and just try to damage through the intermittent healing.

    One champ that does multiple things simultaneously is Archangel. If you heavy combo with Archangel you need to remember your first parry won't work because it will trigger Masochism, but the next one will. Then you start stacking up those neurotoxins. You'll be landing so many debuffs that you'll swamp Masochism, plus you'll be reducing the strength of the healing with poison stacks, plus if you're awakened you'll be reducing ability accuracy. It sounds weird that an answer to the node that punishes you for debuffing is to use one of the most debuff-happy champions, but there you are.
    Thank you good sir. I think you're right about me being too scared of Masochism and the anxiety is getting me. I usually pull off backdraft intercepts pretty easily but for some reason I can't in this one. As for Heal Block and Heal Reversal, I have She Hulk's Petrify and IMIW's heal block, but it's difficult to land because I need to land it at the exact second when the enemy regenerates from Masochism.
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
    Oliverb1980 said:

    I remember I used a combo of void and x23 on that quest. Void you have ti time when you release his sp1.what I did was if the void debuff timer is almost up I'd trigger a parry to start masochism so that void's debuff would apply then launch an sp1. For x23 just fight as normal. Her bleed will outdamage the heal. Helpful if you have despair and deep wounds

    Thanks! But sadly I neither have X-23 nor Void. My mastery setup is pretty basic too.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,841 Guardian
    FreeToPlay_21 said:




    Here it is. The top 5 champions are the ones I've taken in.

    That's a very light roster for Act 5. Let's see. You have Sabretooth and Killmonger: that is the synergy that @Midnite93 referenced. Those two together and Sabretooth can parry without triggering Masochism. Another alternative is Ant-Man: you try to stack as much fatigure as possible (and Masochism will eat a few of those) and then convert to poison with SP2: the poison stacks should reduce the healing from Masochism. If you can build enough combo, I suppose you could also use Aegon but without him being awakened every fight will take forever. But at a high enough combo he should be able to power right through Masochism's heal.

    If it was me, I would probably back out and level up Sabretooth. He can build passive furies to get more damage and he can use the synergy to get you free parries without triggering Masochism. The combination of those two features are probably your best bet on that map. Really, I would try to get both Sabretooth and Ant-Man ranked up so I had two options for that map, but Sabretooth is probably the strongest option.
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    FreeToPlay_21 said:




    Here it is. The top 5 champions are the ones I've taken in.

    That's a very light roster for Act 5. Let's see. You have Sabretooth and Killmonger: that is the synergy that @Midnite93 referenced. Those two together and Sabretooth can parry without triggering Masochism. Another alternative is Ant-Man: you try to stack as much fatigure as possible (and Masochism will eat a few of those) and then convert to poison with SP2: the poison stacks should reduce the healing from Masochism. If you can build enough combo, I suppose you could also use Aegon but without him being awakened every fight will take forever. But at a high enough combo he should be able to power right through Masochism's heal.

    If it was me, I would probably back out and level up Sabretooth. He can build passive furies to get more damage and he can use the synergy to get you free parries without triggering Masochism. The combination of those two features are probably your best bet on that map. Really, I would try to get both Sabretooth and Ant-Man ranked up so I had two options for that map, but Sabretooth is probably the strongest option.
    Okay I'm sold. I'll back out and take up Sabertooth. One question though, will it be enough if I 3/30 him @DNA3000 and @SquishyjrThe_4TH ? I'm not doing that good on T4 Basic.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,841 Guardian
    FreeToPlay_21 said:

    As for Heal Block and Heal Reversal, I have She Hulk's Petrify and IMIW's heal block, but it's difficult to land because I need to land it at the exact second when the enemy regenerates from Masochism.

    She-Hulk works but it is hard to keep the petrify up constantly. You have to parry or something to trigger the masochism, then land the petrify (otherwise masochism will eat the petrify). I don't think IMIW will work at all, because the masochism heal is basically instantaneous.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,841 Guardian
    FreeToPlay_21 said:

    DNA3000 said:

    FreeToPlay_21 said:




    Here it is. The top 5 champions are the ones I've taken in.

    That's a very light roster for Act 5. Let's see. You have Sabretooth and Killmonger: that is the synergy that @Midnite93 referenced. Those two together and Sabretooth can parry without triggering Masochism. Another alternative is Ant-Man: you try to stack as much fatigure as possible (and Masochism will eat a few of those) and then convert to poison with SP2: the poison stacks should reduce the healing from Masochism. If you can build enough combo, I suppose you could also use Aegon but without him being awakened every fight will take forever. But at a high enough combo he should be able to power right through Masochism's heal.

    If it was me, I would probably back out and level up Sabretooth. He can build passive furies to get more damage and he can use the synergy to get you free parries without triggering Masochism. The combination of those two features are probably your best bet on that map. Really, I would try to get both Sabretooth and Ant-Man ranked up so I had two options for that map, but Sabretooth is probably the strongest option.
    Okay I'm sold. I'll back out and take up Sabertooth. One question though, will it be enough if I 3/30 him @DNA3000 and @SquishyjrThe_4TH ? I'm not doing that good on T4 Basic.
    If you're really good at converting furies with Sabretooth, maybe. Worth a try, and if it doesn't work you can retry at 4/40.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited August 2019
    This content has been removed.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • CoatHang3rCoatHang3r Member Posts: 4,965 ★★★★★
    edited August 2019
    @DNA3000 Masochism is subject to AAR but the action that inflicts the debuff determines if either OAAR or DAAR will prevent it. If you have a character with DAAR you can place debuffs while attacking but a parry stun will trigger masochism 100% of the time since the stun is a result of the enemy attacking, an offense. With proxima she will never trigger maso while parrying (sans aar immunity) but will always trigger it when using a special to place a debuff on the enemy.

    Sabertooth reduces AA, not just defensive.
  • Patchie93Patchie93 Member Posts: 1,898 ★★★★
    @FreeToPlay_21 have you 100% act 4 yet? If not I'd suggest that as you'll get a few more mastery points. Plus some much needed resources.
    Might even get some decent 5*s in that time
  • KalantakKalantak Member Posts: 1,300 ★★★★
    i u have both sabertooth n killmonger, just exit out ,wait for 2-3 days,get them upto R4 n go it'll male it easy.
    i had used 4* og hulk r5 ,miles, electro r4,wolvi r4 undupe,n R4 SW . much simpler times. lol
  • GroundedWisdomGroundedWisdom Member Posts: 36,634 ★★★★★
    Parry to trigger Masochism and apply DoT when the Timer is running. Can't remember if I used AA, GP, Hyp, or all of them. It's been a while. If you need to, just stay in it and Grind for Revs until you beat it. You'll get it eventually.
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • Tony886Tony886 Member Posts: 776 ★★
    Atleast explore all act and rank up you champ to r5 then you will able to do it with that roster
  • Tony886Tony886 Member Posts: 776 ★★
    Sabertooth + KM+ void = best utility synergy
  • WeeHobbit89WeeHobbit89 Member Posts: 146 ★
    Morningstar alone got me through that map, if you have her duped
  • FreeToPlay_21FreeToPlay_21 Member Posts: 1,594 ★★★★
    Thanks everyone!
  • HfchangHfchang Member Posts: 186 ★
    I wouldn’t rush Act 5 mate, you’ve got a little space for Roster growth before you’d smash it. Ideally want a couple of maxed 4*s first. It takes a while and lots of practice.
  • Colonaut123Colonaut123 Member Posts: 3,091 ★★★★★
    DNA3000 said:

    FreeToPlay_21 said:

    As the title suggests. I'm stuck in the 'Lines in the sand' chapter. All my champions are getting knocked out every second fight. I've blown over 250 units on this quest and I'm only halfway through it. Should I quit or keep blowing units until I get done with it?

    Any tips for this quest would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

    Energy is cheaper than potions. If you're dying early on in any map, I always recommend just pushing as far as you can without units to get as much exposure as possible, then backing out and trying again. Maybe push at the end if you think you just need a little more, but don't push from the very start: that's just too expensive unless you have no problem spending past content.

    Lines in the Sand appears to be 5.2.4, which has Masochism. Masochism has a couple of strategies for dealing with it. First of all, you can try to not trigger it. Masochism heals the defender when you land a debuff, but it can only trigger every seven seconds. So if you just don't land any debuffs at all it never triggers. This isn't easy, but there are ways to at least reduce the number of triggers. You can try to intercept instead of parrying for example, and you can use champs that don't debuff. I consider this to be the hardest option to pull off.

    Next, you can use ability accuracy reduction. Masochism has ability accuracy, so anything that reduces defensive ability accuracy will lower the chance to trigger Masochism. As @Midnite93 says above, Sabretooth is an option because he has a synergy where every time he lands a debuff he reduces DAA by 100%, essentially stopping any defensive ability from triggering. So you can use Parry with Sabretooth because Masochism won't trigger (parry lands the stun debuff, and the synergy then stops masochism).

    Another option is heal block or heal reversal. Champs like Void, CapIW (with high sig and the right team) can reverse healing, so you can use Masochism itself to kill the defender. Champs like Vision who can heal block can simply stop the heal. But this is tricky: heal block is a debuff, so if the defender has "recharged" his Masochism and you land heal block, the heal block will be removed and Masochism will trigger. You need to play smart and heal block while Masochism is recharging for this to work.

    And then there's the last option which is to overwhelm Masochism. Many players make the mistake of being too scared of Masochism so they try to use slow tactics to avoid triggering it, but then this allows Masochism to recharge and then heal, while you aren't dealing any damage in return. Some players just dive right into the fight with something that just oozes debuffs, like X-23 or Blade and just go ham: yes you'll trigger Masochism, but you can only trigger it once every seven seconds. If you can deal more damage in seven seconds than Masochism heals back for, you can simply pretend you're fighting Angela or something and just try to damage through the intermittent healing.

    One champ that does multiple things simultaneously is Archangel. If you heavy combo with Archangel you need to remember your first parry won't work because it will trigger Masochism, but the next one will. Then you start stacking up those neurotoxins. You'll be landing so many debuffs that you'll swamp Masochism, plus you'll be reducing the strength of the healing with poison stacks, plus if you're awakened you'll be reducing ability accuracy. It sounds weird that an answer to the node that punishes you for debuffing is to use one of the most debuff-happy champions, but there you are.
    You forgot neurotoxin heal blocks when awakened. But other than that: AA and ST are MVP.
  • SceptilemaniacSceptilemaniac Member Posts: 1,247 ★★★★
    @FreeToPlay_21 I believe IMIW can heal block on heavy?
    Other than that, yeah whatever the guys said.
  • SDPSDP Member Posts: 1,622 ★★★★
    Restart and practice
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