I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
I think the fight, while niche is doable. What I don’t like is the last 10%, I’ve been hitting a brick wall with the few days, despite slowing down videos of dexing his specials down to 1/4 speed at going from there. Curled him about 30 times. The red timing is way too inconsistent for a final boss. I think the idea of dexing a special isn’t bad, but on the champion it’s awful
6.2 is the worst thing to happen to this game. What terrible game design. Between the class gates and the number of paths combined with horrid designed boss fights (10 times each?).
As for the Champion, if you don’t have one of the minuscule number of counters for the final 10%, you got no shot. The majority of the community will be stuck here a long time and prevented from even reaching 6.3 & 4.
Their is a reason nobody’s clearing 6.2. Theirs a reason the beta for 6.3 is very different. It’s garbage game design that is purely “pay to win”.
Well I wouldn't say no one is clearing it. Myself and quite a few other people I know are finished not to mention the people who did legends runs. It is certainly a much lower number of people that have finished it than 6.1 was this far after release though.
I'm not sure if reducing the number of people who can finish it quickly was their goal, bc if it was they certainly accomplished it
Hahaha I still haven't touched 6.2. I beat 6.1 the second day of its release but with the mr sinister boss requiring such specific champ counters that I don't currently have (hemdall marvel or crazy flailing arm guy) I cant even be bothered to worry about the collector. Sitting on 90 5*s almost all awakened and 12 max sig and 12 6*s but apparently I lack a deep enough roster for 6.2. Thankfully kabam gated it to prevent small accounts like mine from entering
I too need heimdal for a dumb synergy. I used AA for one fight then quake for the rest to get me to mr sinister and failed miserably. Found out I need to have heimdal
I can speak for a person that has finished it but hasn't explored act 6.2.6. If they made the champion fight easier like him having just 1 indestructible charge instead of 5 or even make it 3 I would complete the rest of act 6.
Right now the whole thing makes me upset but the champion fight put the icing on the cake as to why I don't want to explore. I have Hyperion so Mr. Sinister doesn't bother me like it did others.
I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
Requiring you to have one of 3 or 4 champions in order to beat content isn’t a challenge though, it’s a pay wall. The one champ that a ton of people cheesed the fight with is getting nerfed because of it. I’m all for tough, fun fights. That’s not what this is. This is a money maker for Kabam. Pay to expand that roster till you can get the right champ for the job.
To be constructive any easy fix that would make the last 10% manageable would be that if you removed one of the 5 indestructible buffs and die, when you revive and go back in he now starts with 4 and so on. You could with revives get him down one indestructible buff at a time till he has zero. Once he has Zero Indestructible buffs the fight would be more straightforward. It would still take skill but would make the fight realistic and doable for the majority of the player-base.
This is a great idea. It still wouldn’t be cheap as it would still cost quite a few revives for most people, but at least it will be tolerable somewhat to clear. At the end of the day though, you are still paying to win because of bad game design. Their is nothing fun about this fight.
SheHulk happens to be one of the most accessible 5 stars too because shes been around since 2016. I find it convenient that the nerf came to her. It is laughable. I posted after the first day act 6.2 came out that Kabam will be forced to change act 6 because majority of players won't complete it. They already removed gates moving forward, now with the She hulk nerf the change will come if you have patience in my opinion.
SheHulk happens to be one of the most accessible 5 stars too because shes been around since 2016. I find it convenient that the nerf came to her. It is laughable. I posted after the first day act 6.2 came out that Kabam will be forced to change act 6 because majority of players won't complete it. They already removed gates moving forward, now with the She hulk nerf the change will come if you have patience in my opinion.
If the majority of Players could complete it, it wouldn't be the level that's intended. It's not meant to be done by most people with most Champs.
@will-o-wisp First let me say that I completely agree with your assessment and conclusion... BUT...
We all said this when the Collector first came out in ACT 5.2 as I'm sure you remember. Nevertheless, we ponied up our items/units/cash and did it anyway for the sweet, sweet, promised rewards of being UNCOLLECTED! Yet here the Collector still sits to this day with no new effective counters after all this time (save for Spider Gwen?), no diminishing whatsoever in his abilities, awaiting those bold newbies to the game to encounter and suffer the same fate!
So in my estimation, if we use the Collector fight as the measure for what historically has constituted an "unfair fight", and what results we got for all our cries of money grab this, BS that, no matter how reasoned and concise (which were of course summarily ignored), and we then adjust for meta "inflation" and the next level of elite status (Cavalier) and all that comes with it? I see no option but to conclude that the Champion fight in 6.2 is... "working as intended".
That is true, and I remember it as well. But if we are going to compare The Collector fight and The Champion fight, the second one is way more difficult than the first one. At least against the Collector, any champion would work, and eventually the HP would just go down and down until it got K.O. But against The Champion that isn't the case. Only a specific number of champions, not even in the 2-digit numbers, work against him, and you aren't even given the option to take down a little HP in every fight since he eventually becomes completely immune to damage
except the champion will go down and down again, as someone stated you are overestimating his regen.
You can choose to fight against him until he is about to regen, and then quit to avoid it. But from what I've seen and tested myself yesterday, he is able to heal more damage than what is applied to him during the fight. The example I gave about him going from 90% to 100% actually happened to me
You do realize this is not how his ability works right?
He can only heal that once, even in the same fight:
While attacking or defending on the final node in a Quest, for each active Fury Buff and while his Unstoppable Buff is active, he regenerates 1.7% of the damage taken this fight per second, excluding the amount already regenerated by this ability. This ability can regenerate up to a maximum of 5% Health per second.
So not only is it per fight, but that that damage still cannot be regenerated again during the same fight.
This is correct, but he has 2 forms of regen, the other coming from his sp 1. He can heal, but it's not particularly strong.
@will-o-wisp First let me say that I completely agree with your assessment and conclusion... BUT...
We all said this when the Collector first came out in ACT 5.2 as I'm sure you remember. Nevertheless, we ponied up our items/units/cash and did it anyway for the sweet, sweet, promised rewards of being UNCOLLECTED! Yet here the Collector still sits to this day with no new effective counters after all this time (save for Spider Gwen?), no diminishing whatsoever in his abilities, awaiting those bold newbies to the game to encounter and suffer the same fate!
So in my estimation, if we use the Collector fight as the measure for what historically has constituted an "unfair fight", and what results we got for all our cries of money grab this, BS that, no matter how reasoned and concise (which were of course summarily ignored), and we then adjust for meta "inflation" and the next level of elite status (Cavalier) and all that comes with it? I see no option but to conclude that the Champion fight in 6.2 is... "working as intended".
That is true, and I remember it as well. But if we are going to compare The Collector fight and The Champion fight, the second one is way more difficult than the first one. At least against the Collector, any champion would work, and eventually the HP would just go down and down until it got K.O. But against The Champion that isn't the case. Only a specific number of champions, not even in the 2-digit numbers, work against him, and you aren't even given the option to take down a little HP in every fight since he eventually becomes completely immune to damage
except the champion will go down and down again, as someone stated you are overestimating his regen.
You can choose to fight against him until he is about to regen, and then quit to avoid it. But from what I've seen and tested myself yesterday, he is able to heal more damage than what is applied to him during the fight. The example I gave about him going from 90% to 100% actually happened to me
You do realize this is not how his ability works right?
He can only heal that once, even in the same fight:
While attacking or defending on the final node in a Quest, for each active Fury Buff and while his Unstoppable Buff is active, he regenerates 1.7% of the damage taken this fight per second, excluding the amount already regenerated by this ability. This ability can regenerate up to a maximum of 5% Health per second.
So not only is it per fight, but that that damage still cannot be regenerated again during the same fight.
That regeneration triggers every time the unstoppable buff comes around, which happens for the entire fight every couple of seconds
I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
Requiring you to have one of 3 or 4 champions in order to beat content isn’t a challenge though, it’s a pay wall. The one champ that a ton of people cheesed the fight with is getting nerfed because of it. I’m all for tough, fun fights. That’s not what this is. This is a money maker for Kabam. Pay to expand that roster till you can get the right champ for the job.
It's not 3 or 4 though. Especially initial completion can be done with at least 7 or 8 champs and probably more. Literally any champ with a nullify ability CAN do it. Does that mean they'll be the best or even a good option? Absolutely not. That doesnt change the fact it can be done
Exploration is another story but people can always come back to that later like most people did with 5.2 and even 5.3 with act 5.
I'd go as far as to say that the 6.2.2 sinister is far more champion restrictive than 6.2.6. The only difference is even someone who's terrible can throw infinite items at 6.2.2 and eventually get it down. With 6.2.6, you HAVE to develop a level of skill for that last 10% no matter what you're willing to spend.
We've heard time and time again that this game caters to the whales that just throw money at the game and it doesnt reward skill. Well here we are with a fight that no matter what, you have to have skill to complete and people are more upset than ever. I won't say I enjoyed it by any means but I finished it and I just find the reaction funny personally
I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
I have explored it 100% and even got a Legend's title even though I did not intent to and it took me about 10 days to get it done. I will not be upset one bit nor will I feel it was unfair if Kabam scales down the difficulty of the fight for other players.
I can’t speak much about the difficulty of Champion because I have the best counter for him (SymS). But I really like this post because it gives a great perspective from someone without the exact counters. I used 1 revive on him so I never got that feeling of “Oh, this is really hard content.”
I honestly can’t imagine what the fight would be like if I didn’t have the right counter. All this is to say, I do think he should have more counters than he currently does, and the lack of counters can really cause a massive headache for those without the right champs.
The worst part is that the path leading upto him arent easy either. You have tough fights ahead of you to get to him. I am only on 6.2.5 (trying to get gwenpool down without dying and dont have a power control champ) but it seems like I wont be reaching the Champion boss many times to practice with magik iceman and other tough opponents in the way. I wish there was a way to grind him down instead of hoping you get like 4 or maybe champs in the entire game?
I'd go as far as to say that the 6.2.2 sinister is far more champion restrictive than 6.2.6. The only difference is even someone who's terrible can throw infinite items at 6.2.2 and eventually get it down. With 6.2.6, you HAVE to develop a level of skill for that last 10% no matter what you're willing to spend.
We've heard time and time again that this game caters to the whales that just throw money at the game and it doesnt reward skill. Well here we are with a fight that no matter what, you have to have skill to complete and people are more upset than ever. I won't say I enjoyed it by any means but I finished it and I just find the reaction funny personally
Ironically I didn't have any trouble with the final 10%, it was getting there that was the issue for me. Constant unstoppable and unblockable is about the worst experience this game has to offer. Sure its incredibly hard, but worse is the fact that the experience just flat out sucks. Who wants to play that content? It's not in any way fun or enjoyable, which is the entire reason to play a video game. I'm not going to spend my free time, a time for relaxation and enjoyment, wanting to pull my hair out dealing with this nonsense fight.
I'd say nearly half the revives I spent on him were trying to dex and accidentally parrying instead, but wait he's unblockable and I'm dead. Oh look I hit him 3 times before unstoppable came back and welp I'm dead. And the times those dont happen, I'm spending 90% of the fight just running to avoid those super fun mechanics. If you're not running one of a few champs, most notably Sym who keeps them from happening in the first place, the fight is just pure trash. Sure they completed the mission of making it insanely difficult and rare for a player to explore it, but they also made it so awful that people dont even want to try.
I don't necessarily disagree with most of those opinions. I didn't enjoy the fight at all myself. I'm just saying the difference between the first 90% and the last 10% is you can chip down the first 90 with items should you choose to do so. You just can't do that with the last 10. You have to know how and be able to beat that last 10% in one shot.
The worst part is that the path leading upto him arent easy either. You have tough fights ahead of you to get to him. I am only on 6.2.5 (trying to get gwenpool down without dying and dont have a power control champ) but it seems like I wont be reaching the Champion boss many times to practice with magik iceman and other tough opponents in the way. I wish there was a way to grind him down instead of hoping you get like 4 or maybe champs in the entire game?
The path for initial completion with no nodes up isn't particularly difficult really.
The worst part is that the path leading upto him arent easy either. You have tough fights ahead of you to get to him. I am only on 6.2.5 (trying to get gwenpool down without dying and dont have a power control champ) but it seems like I wont be reaching the Champion boss many times to practice with magik iceman and other tough opponents in the way. I wish there was a way to grind him down instead of hoping you get like 4 or maybe champs in the entire game?
The path for initial completion with no nodes up isn't particularly difficult really.
@will-o-wisp First let me say that I completely agree with your assessment and conclusion... BUT...
We all said this when the Collector first came out in ACT 5.2 as I'm sure you remember. Nevertheless, we ponied up our items/units/cash and did it anyway for the sweet, sweet, promised rewards of being UNCOLLECTED! Yet here the Collector still sits to this day with no new effective counters after all this time (save for Spider Gwen?), no diminishing whatsoever in his abilities, awaiting those bold newbies to the game to encounter and suffer the same fate!
So in my estimation, if we use the Collector fight as the measure for what historically has constituted an "unfair fight", and what results we got for all our cries of money grab this, BS that, no matter how reasoned and concise (which were of course summarily ignored), and we then adjust for meta "inflation" and the next level of elite status (Cavalier) and all that comes with it? I see no option but to conclude that the Champion fight in 6.2 is... "working as intended".
That is true, and I remember it as well. But if we are going to compare The Collector fight and The Champion fight, the second one is way more difficult than the first one. At least against the Collector, any champion would work, and eventually the HP would just go down and down until it got K.O. But against The Champion that isn't the case. Only a specific number of champions, not even in the 2-digit numbers, work against him, and you aren't even given the option to take down a little HP in every fight since he eventually becomes completely immune to damage
except the champion will go down and down again, as someone stated you are overestimating his regen.
You can choose to fight against him until he is about to regen, and then quit to avoid it. But from what I've seen and tested myself yesterday, he is able to heal more damage than what is applied to him during the fight. The example I gave about him going from 90% to 100% actually happened to me
You do realize this is not how his ability works right?
He can only heal that once, even in the same fight:
While attacking or defending on the final node in a Quest, for each active Fury Buff and while his Unstoppable Buff is active, he regenerates 1.7% of the damage taken this fight per second, excluding the amount already regenerated by this ability. This ability can regenerate up to a maximum of 5% Health per second.
So not only is it per fight, but that that damage still cannot be regenerated again during the same fight.
That regeneration triggers every time the unstoppable buff comes around, which happens for the entire fight every couple of seconds
You dont seem to be getting it...
Lets say you take him down to 95% and he triggers the healing, he heals to full. You take him down to 95% again and he triggers it again, guess what, the doesnt heal anything, because that 5% has already been healed once again, so it triggering every couple seconds does not really matter. the only heal he gets to do repeatedly as has been mentioned is his SP1 which is like 1k points.
I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
I have explored it 100% and even got a Legend's title even though I did not intent to and it took me about 10 days to get it done. I will not be upset one bit nor will I feel it was unfair if Kabam scales down the difficulty of the fight for other players.
You might not. Others might not think it so fair that they had to complete it as it is now, and people after them had the abridged version. Just pointing it out is all. I honestly don't know if they will or not. They already adjusted it once.
I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
I have explored it 100% and even got a Legend's title even though I did not intent to and it took me about 10 days to get it done. I will not be upset one bit nor will I feel it was unfair if Kabam scales down the difficulty of the fight for other players.
You might not. Others might not think it so fair that they had to complete it as it is now, and people after them had the abridged version. Just pointing it out is all. I honestly don't know if they will or not. They already adjusted it once.
They didn't adjust anything. They corrected the content to be as advertised. They made a mistake in the power index and when they were called on it by the player base they corrected it
Lol. It will be forever before I explore 6.2. I've only made the first pass through it and I used a R5 Thing for the last 10 percent. It took me quite a few revives to figure him out but I could probably get the last part done about half of the time now or a little less. Hard to say what counters might be available by the time I'm ready to explore though. I wouldn't be upset if they made him easier but really not sure if he needs it. He might be really horrible with linked nodes up, not sure how much worse he is with the nodes up. If he's not much worse then I'd say he's okay but if he's much worse then maybe the linked nodes need looked at.
I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
I have explored it 100% and even got a Legend's title even though I did not intent to and it took me about 10 days to get it done. I will not be upset one bit nor will I feel it was unfair if Kabam scales down the difficulty of the fight for other players.
You might not. Others might not think it so fair that they had to complete it as it is now, and people after them had the abridged version. Just pointing it out is all. I honestly don't know if they will or not. They already adjusted it once.
They didn't adjust anything. They corrected the content to be as advertised. They made a mistake in the power index and when they were called on it by the player base they corrected it
I can't question the feedback because a) I don't really argue what people have experienced, and b) I haven't fought him. What I can say is they've stated they have no plans at the moment to change that Fight. That may change. It IS supposed to be incredibly challenging, and if they change it, I'm wondering how fair that is to those who completed it as-is.
I have explored it 100% and even got a Legend's title even though I did not intent to and it took me about 10 days to get it done. I will not be upset one bit nor will I feel it was unfair if Kabam scales down the difficulty of the fight for other players.
You might not. Others might not think it so fair that they had to complete it as it is now, and people after them had the abridged version. Just pointing it out is all. I honestly don't know if they will or not. They already adjusted it once.
They didn't adjust anything. They corrected the content to be as advertised. They made a mistake in the power index and when they were called on it by the player base they corrected it
It was a fix, yes. It was still an adjustment which was accompanied by Compensation.
Comments
I'm not sure if reducing the number of people who can finish it quickly was their goal, bc if it was they certainly accomplished it
Right now the whole thing makes me upset but the champion fight put the icing on the cake as to why I don't want to explore. I have Hyperion so Mr. Sinister doesn't bother me like it did others.
Exploration is another story but people can always come back to that later like most people did with 5.2 and even 5.3 with act 5.
We've heard time and time again that this game caters to the whales that just throw money at the game and it doesnt reward skill. Well here we are with a fight that no matter what, you have to have skill to complete and people are more upset than ever. I won't say I enjoyed it by any means but I finished it and I just find the reaction funny personally
I honestly can’t imagine what the fight would be like if I didn’t have the right counter. All this is to say, I do think he should have more counters than he currently does, and the lack of counters can really cause a massive headache for those without the right champs.
Lets say you take him down to 95% and he triggers the healing, he heals to full. You take him down to 95% again and he triggers it again, guess what, the doesnt heal anything, because that 5% has already been healed once again, so it triggering every couple seconds does not really matter. the only heal he gets to do repeatedly as has been mentioned is his SP1 which is like 1k points.
I wouldn't be upset if they made him easier but really not sure if he needs it. He might be really horrible with linked nodes up, not sure how much worse he is with the nodes up. If he's not much worse then I'd say he's okay but if he's much worse then maybe the linked nodes need looked at.