Rankup catalyst requirements need changes

This has been on my mind for some time and this topic has been brought up in many discussions over the past few months. The catalyst requirements for ranking up champions needs change especially the fact that we need 2 tiers of catalysts to rankup champs. Once the requirement of the higher tier of catalyst has been added to the rankup requirement,the lower tier should cease to be required,this started with 5* requiring both t2a and t1a for r4 and r5 which is still manageable because they are generic but now 6* require t5cc and t4cc for rankups which creates a lot of problems because they are so dependent on rng. Yes I agree that rng is the basis of this game but it’s getting to a point where I am being made to plan multiple rankups to manage my rankup resources and before people advice me to be more careful with my rankups,that’s exactly what I have been doing...I pulled 5* apoc in January but I still haven’t been able to r5 him and probably won’t be able to r5 him for a long time because I am close to forming a skill t5cc so I need to save t4cc for the r3 rankup(because I can’t for the life of me pull mutant t4cc...been stuck at under 5 for so long that it’s crazy)..t4cc should stop being a required catalyst once t5cc enters the picture.
The rankup requirements should in total be a max of 3 types of catalyst... 1 basic,1 alpha and 1 class...once t5b becomes the requirement,t4b should cease to be one,once t5cc becomes the requirement,t4cc should stop being one
I am just taking baby steps in the 6* meta with a couple of r3 and 7(soon to be 8) r2 champs and it’s getting really annoying managing the resources before I can take up a champ that I like playing with and one who can help my roster to the level that I want him to be at...can’t even imagine the t4cc problems of people who have moved to the 6* meta
Yes I will have to continue managing my resources as per the current requirements but I hope this post of mine can help bring some change to the present system

Comments

FiiNCH

Paragraphs bro

Demonzfyre

Imagine playing a resource management game and complaining about having to manage resources.

There's .00000000000000000001% of a chance they'll ever change the rank up requirements. If they do, this entire community will implode as ask for infinite rank down tickets because of the changes. When Act 1 or 2 rewards were buffed, there were literal cavalier title players asking for those rewards and they beat those acts ages ago.

Make sure you understand that this isn't designed for you to rank your champs right when you want as often as you want. No game with a ranking system is.

Hera1d_of_Ga1actus

there's still a chance

Ken1378

Yeah, you’re probably going to have better luck getting more catalysts added to the game.

I personally don’t have issues with t4cc, but I could easily see how it happens with larger 6-star rosters. Especially when you stop getting the 3 random t4cc crystals every week as soon as you become a top 800 Alliance in AQ. That makes no sense to me. And you don’t even get that much more Glory to offset it.

SidDDragon

Yes the chance is extremely slim and yes I am complaining because i don’t see anything wrong in complaining about a current system if I feel that it can be improved...never in my post did I ask for freebies and I am managing the resources but the fact that I can’t rankup a champ before making atleast 4 other major rankups meaning that I can’t play around with that champ at the highest level for a good 4 months after pulling him makes me feel that maybe things do need to change..this is just too much dependence on rng as first I have to pull the champ and then pull the right amount of class catalysts and then have to wait for another month because another rankup may need those class catalysts despite the fact that,that rankup need a higher tier catalyst of the same class

SidDDragon

Sorry my bad...just kept typing as the thoughts came into my mind and ended up with a mess

DNA3000

That's intentional. Or rather, the game intentionally rewards players who do that. You don't have to do that, but those who do get better results. Take that away, and there's no reward for managing resources smartly.

The fact that you do means you're ahead of the game. Maybe you don't enjoy it, but you get the benefits of doing it. In a hypothetical game that eliminated this constraint, you wouldn't have an easier time ranking things up. Instead, catalysts themselves would just get universally harder to get, and you'd have a harder time than you do now on a relative basis.

I can give you the 800 page textbook version of game design, but the simple version is this: games like this are designed around averages, much like a class that grades on a curve. If you're getting a B+ now, asking for the class to get easier won't automatically improve your grade. Instead you're more likely to get a worse grade, because being one of those people already working for the B+, all that making the class easier would likely do is make it easier for the C- students to catch up to you. Because the class is graded on a curve, you can't all get As. If it gets a little easier for you and a lot easier for others, your grade will go down.

Progressional games are graded on a curve. There's no such thing as everyone doing better in the long run.

danielmath

managing resources and choosing who to rank is a big part of the game, basically removing the rankup requirements is dumb

Valentinos13

U are saying u are managing your resources but further down in yr post you contradict yourself

If for example you have the rest of resources managed but t4c u don't have enough, it means u done some other rank ups before that, and after all that's one of the basics of the game, choices

SidDDragon

I managed my resources...I used up the t4cc of the other 5 classes before opening up 30 t4cc crystals and ended up with just 2 mutant while the 4 classes which were at around 10 got another boost and I am back to the cycle of using up those 4 classes first...so yes I am managing my resources but I can’t control rng and that resource based on rng is what I need for another probable rankup

unknown

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SidDDragon

I agree with the intentional blockage. There has to be some sort of a bottleneck in order to keep the progression in check but here has been my scenario for the last 4 months(from around mid December)...
I did 2 mutant r5 rankups(these are the oldest of the lot) 1 mutant 5* r4,2 6* mystic r2 1 mystic r4,1 6* skill r3,3 6* tech r2,1 cosmic r5 and 1 cosmic r2,2 science r5,1 science r4)...this is just off the back of my head...so more or less used up equal amounts of t4cc but yet rng didn’t favour me(yes again part of the game) and despite doing the management...I have carefully used up every single t4cc that I have.
And yet I don’t feel rewarded because of the rankup requirements..I have 4 mutant t4cc and I have save them because I might form or get mutant t5cc from act 6 exploraiton which should be done in a month or so whereas I have a champ in my roster who I pulled back in January,who would benefit my roster at r5 but I can’t take him up and this is just the beginning..this will just intensify as I progress further into the game.
I agree that bottlenecks should be there but to what extent??

DNA3000

That's not the most efficient way to manage T4CC. Most people who manage T4CC resources efficiently keep T4CC crystals and T4CC fragment crystals around. When you're low on everything, pop the whole crystals. When you're low on some things and high on others, pop the fragments. The fragments are more likely to average out to similar amounts across the board, and thus are less likely to generate bad luck with too much drops for classes you're already maxed on and not enough of a class you're short of.

You can't control RNG, but that doesn't mean you can't manage RNG.

SidDDragon

Again exactly what I have done...I have 65 t4cc crystals and around 1000 t4cc crystals..but I can’t open them as 4 of my classes are already overflowing/close to overflowing
So I am doing the cleanup first and using up those 4 classes first..eventually I will get them below 10 and then pop my crystals which is exactly what I did earlier but RNG screwed me over
Edit: I also waited to explore 6.3 for those 2 3-4 gems in the hopes of getting 1 mutant but guess what...I got 2 cosmic so I just got frustrated at that point and took apoc to r4 using catalysts
My point is that I am managing the resources to the best of my ability but still not feeling rewarded for my efforts..now I can pop t4cc fragment crystals and get the remaining 2 mutant t4cc to r5 apoc but I can’t do that either because I would need those mutant t4cc when I get around to taking 6* sunspot to r3 which brings me to my earlier question- why do I need t4cc to rankup a champ to r3 when I already need t5cc for that particular rankup

SidDDragon

Ok so what if I didn’t rankup the same class over and over like a dumbass and still am having t4cc problem..what’s your solution then genius??

Demonzfyre

https://youtu.be/LhePpge45J0

Brian Grant is probably one of the most efficient people at managing resources and rank-ups. He explains it really well in this and even has instances of what happened with you and having T4CC go into overflow.

Demonzfyre

Because that's the way Kabam designed the rank-ups. They do it for the longevity of the game. Much for the same reasons why Rank Down Tickets aren't available to buy and use freely. It takes away the purpose of clearing content or participating in Alliance modes like AQ. If less resources are needed, you'll attain them more frequently. kabam will have to lessen rewards for the content, leading them to ultimately reduce difficulty even further than the cakewalk most of it is now.

So they can't just take away parts of rank requirements without redesigning their entire rewards structure for 75% of the game itself.

Also, if you have so many in the overflow and are just ranking to rank and are targeting certain T4CC, might as well trade them in for a higher chance in the store.

TrashyPanda

Resource availability is restricted for Kabam's profit or, in some cases, straight up mismanaged. The former is fine, good even, the last part not so much.

I've always had issue with 15 t1a being required to r3 a 5*. Oh lawd, think of the absolute flood of people completing the abyss with them 5r3s! TB would become the new UC.

As long as you're in an alliance, you can pick up most of the other stuff in adequate amounts. I think the price and availability per cycle (adjusted per prog lvl) could use some tweaking, but that's all. Even the weird T1A thing.

Solo players be screwed tho, lmao. Not sure why Kabam decided to focus so heavily on coop while ignoring the solo base. Lots of people who like solo-play Kabam. Lots of people with money that won't go to mcoc because they don't have time for (or just don't enjoy) alliances, so they just find another hobby. I just don't understand Kabam's position on this.

It's free real estate!

Demonzfyre

Wut

SidDDragon

In the last 3 months I have done the following
Abyss path 1
7.1 completion and exploration
6.3 exploration
6.4 exploration
V6 completion
The resource that I am majorly discussing is t4cc...now none of the above said quests gives t4cc as a reward but there are these resources which give t4cc in form of rankup gems so let’s count that
7.1 1 6* 1-2 rankup gem
6.3 1 5* 3-4 rankup gem
6.4 2 5* 3-4 rankup gem
V6 1 5* 4-5 rankup gem
So u mean to say that if kabam decides to remove t4cc requirement from r3 rankups then these rewards are too much for the difficulty/rarity of the content?

unknown

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Demonzfyre

Not sure why you'd include 5* rank up gems when you're talking about 6*'s since if you have rank up gems, it frees up T4CC for you to use on those 6*'s.

Act 6 exploration has T4CC crystals in them. You should want more rank up gems as we all should. But really I think you are looking for certain classes and are having trouble keeping those classes of T4 in your inventory. I am that way with Mutant. I have wayyyy to many of the top mutant champs that I could rank but can't. But I understand that resources are limited and I know that I'll get them, it's just a matter of time.

TrashyPanda

They sell catalysts. Did you think they do it to save the whales? Lol... Uh, err, real whales, not our our humanoid whales. It, ah, nvm. Anyways:

They have to control the supply so the demand is high enough to spend money on, while also not creating a chokehold that becomes a paywall. It's a very tough thing to balance, especially with so many different catalysts.

Again, not a bad thing. It's good for Kabam to make money as long as they manage the balance well.

Demonzfyre

But they aren't restricted to just paid offers. T5CC is coming up already more and more. T4CC/T4B is everywhere and we all know T5B is the candy of MCOC. Sure they have offers but those resources are readily available in game except T5CC at the moment.

DNA3000

I mean, you say that's exactly what you did, but then you specifically said you didn't do that. In this case, with some classes very high and having just done all the rank ups I could reasonably do to bring them down, which means they are the classes I least want, I would have popped the fragment crystals. This way I would be almost guaranteed to get an even amount, which would also mean the classes I was low on would go up by the same amount as the classes I had ten of already, which reduces the chances of RNG going badly in that situation.

SidDDragon

That reason I included the 5* rankup gems is because they offset the t4cc to be used on 5* champs which I can then use on 6* champs.
And other than 6.1...I don’t remember t4cc in either 6.4 or 6.3(haven’t started 6.2 exploration so I am not familiar with it yet)
My entire gripe is based on the fact that t4cc is too big of a bottleneck because it’s being used in 6/3 rankups
5* 1-2 requires t3cc and after that every rankup requires t4cc
If we were to follow this pattern,t4cc should have stopped being a requirement after 6* 1-2 rankup because after that t5cc becomes the primary class catalyst

Demonzfyre

To use your example against you, 4*'s require t2cc for their first level and then T3cc and then last level is T4cc. So you can't say because 5*'s did "this", 6*'s have to do "this".

SidDDragon

Nowhere did I say that I didn’t do that...that wasn’t the main point of the discussion but lemme clarify my steps
I was short on mutant and mystic t4cc while the other 4 classes were close to maxing out
I used up the t4cc of other classes and brought all of them below 10 thus giving me a buffer of atleast 7 before they start going into overflow and then popped 30 t4cc crystals because I needed to pull atleast 6 mutant t4cc but I ended up pulling just 2.
After that I popped open 100+ map 5 and 100 map 6 crystals and didn’t pull a single fully formed mutant while pulling fully formed of other classes this sending 3 of my classes in overflow and 1 at 16
So where did I go wrong...where did I mismanage my resources??
Now with that part explained
This is the point which I brought up against demonzfyre as well...in case of 5* 1-2 takes t3cc and after that every rankup takes t4cc...why then in the case of 6* do we need t4cc in 2-3 when t5cc is the primary class catalyst needed?

SidDDragon

If we are considering all rarities then no rankup prior to 6/3 has required 2 different tiers of class catalysts...whenever the requirement has moved to the next tier of class catalyst,the previous tier has ceased to be required for the rankup and rightfully so because class catalysts demand too much RNG...generics can still be managed as double tier requirements because they aren’t as reliant on RNG as class catalysts

Demonzfyre

So you want them to require 8 T5cc to R3 a 6? What about ranks 4 and 5 for 6*'s? They have make T6 and T7 class cats?

Look, we're locked in to this ranking schedule. Kabam isn't ready to introduce T6CC anytime soon. We don't even have T6B in the game yet. Kabam designed 6*'s for the long run. R5 5*'s came relatively fast compared to where we are with 6*'s.

It sucks T4CC is your bottleneck but there's always going to be one. Today's it's T4CC, tomorrow it's T5B. I went from T5 in the overflow to have none in 4 days. 🤷 Maybe they remove those from ranking 6*'s to R2.