Ronin Changes

FluffyPigMonster

Well for everyone who just disagrees and doesn’t explain, what did we want? I don’t understand

RJustice_209

Shock29 said:

RJustice_209 said:

Kabam Miike said:

Thank you for the feedback everybody. I want to remind you all that when we set out to do more champion updates, we said that there are 3 types: Overhauls, Moderate Updates, and Value Only. This is a good example of a Value Only update. Ronin is a Champ that we were fairly happy with when it came to the contents of his Kit, but thought he could do with some number changes to give him a little more viability.

In the past, we've definitely overdone the Value Only updates, and some were closer to Moderate. Our monthly list of Champions to buff are selected for a number of reasons, but the combined capacity is one of them. If Ronin didn't receive this Buff, another Champion would have received one of this same calibre. This would not have prevented somebody from getting a more extensive buff.

You should continue to expect varying levels of Buffs, some being small, and some being large. We cannot remake every Champion every month, and when there is already a Champion with a Good kit that needs a slight boost to get to where they would be more viable, we will do that.

Let's get back to the computer, log on, and add something real quick that the player base wanted, and hit save. 5min wont hurt.

Its way more involved than taking 5 minutes to add some stuff. It might be fair to say that tune ups are easier to come up with and take less time to create than an overhaul or update but 5 mins is definately not enough time to create nor fix a buff.

Probably takes longer to login than to increase cruelty numbers and drop from 7 to a 5. Or "Remove 7" to remove 0 or 3 from sp2. Or change sp3 fury from 35 sec to 45+. Really? Ya 5min might be slightly exaggerated but Im not ignorant on what a skilled tech can do in less than 30min.

Ken1378

Kabam Miike said:

Ronin is a Champ that we were fairly happy with when it came to the contents of his Kit, but thought he could do with some number changes to give him a little more viability.

This makes a lot of sense, but I’m confused about the part of the buff that makes him more viable. The part where he does very slightly more bleed damage with the Deep Wounds Mastery? Or the extremely minor update to the sig ability? I don’t think either of those things contribute to the reason people don’t use this guy as much as a lot of other skill champs.

So either he didn’t need a buff in the first place (which could be true), or the buff is too small to change anything. Either way, it seems like a bit of a fail on Kabam’s part.

Masterpuff

Ill wait to test it myself on Monday when the buff goes live. But this was among the only things im really excited for in this game. Probably gonna stop playing and message my alliance if this is as disappointing as it seems.

The_Sentry06

Kabam Miike said:

Catmanndo said:

So lackluster, my excitement for waiting on buffs has become completely numb. Nova, DDHK and now Ronin, does Kabam think these changes are enough for players to invest end user resources on? I was optimistically expecting better…

These Buffs are not solely for End Game players. In fact, I think if could be said they're not really aimed at End Game players at all. Giving more players more options for Champions to deal with certain Challenges really benefits players with a smaller roster, though you'll still get a Champion update every now and then that really skyrockets a Champion to the top of everybody's Roster.

But you guys didn't change anything much that'll make Ronin suddenly more valuable to progressing players than he was before. Adding additional crit rating makes barely a difference and the evade won't be useful anyways most of time because parry and dex exist. Sure it might come useful in the odd scenario when someone accidentally gets hit and that's about it with this buff. No progressing player is going to use him for AAR because it's DAAR and you have to special 1 spam for that meaning no big furies and if you need DAAR from the start of the fight, well...

If this buff was meant for progressing players, the ramp up and playstyle overall should have been made less stressful, if this was meant for endgame rosters, some utility or something should have been added. This buff is none of those and brings an improvement to either people's roster by a very slight margin.

Agresssor

This part needs to be removed. You wasting your time to build up to 7 cruelty to spend them for a fury and after that you need to regain all these cruelty before the fury expires for a MAX damage. Just a stress.



It would be nice if Ronin could gain this fury + kept all cruelty stacks instead of losing

DawsMan

Ken1378 said:

Kabam Miike said:

Ronin is a Champ that we were fairly happy with when it came to the contents of his Kit, but thought he could do with some number changes to give him a little more viability.

This makes a lot of sense, but I’m confused about the part of the buff that makes him more viable. The part where he does very slightly more bleed damage with the Deep Wounds Mastery? Or the extremely minor update to the sig ability? I don’t think either of those things contribute to the reason people don’t use this guy as much as a lot of other skill champs.

So either he didn’t need a buff in the first place (which could be true), or the buff is too small to change anything. Either way, it seems like a bit of a fail on Kabam’s part.

Kabam Miike, regarding this comment, would it be worth it to say hey, we are buffing a champion what is your least favourite thing/reason you don't play the champ. And make a poll with 2-3, maybe 4 options.

There's going to be a ton of people commenting about everything they want to see and their buff ideas, and I understand polls and getting the community involved isn't always a good option or productive. However, I wonder if this would be worth considering.

Obviously, as you've said, you need to maintain balance in the game and not all buffs are going to be good. We've seen with Nova and DDHK, they are slightly more useable, but not great. Hood and Ronin are examples of champions that people liked, but they weren't [as] viable due to damage (Hood) or ramp up (Ronin).

When it came time to buff these champions, you changed the part that people appreciated about the champion. I am seeing lots of people who liked Ronin's damage and kit but wanted the kit to be changed a bit so that his damage was more accessible.

I am not trying to insinuate that you don't know what's best for the game, and I understand you have to wade through a plethora of suggestions and complaints, but perhaps a poll regarding key aspects of a champion could be something to look into in the future. It would have to be in-game so more people see it I imagine.

SkyLord7000

So does this mean value only changes are less impactful then other buffs. This wasn’t the promise when you started with the buffs. If Nova/Ronin type buffs are what’s planned for the future may as well just remove value only buffs from the game entirely. It’s a waste of time for both the devs and the community.

MrInsanity

SkyLord7000 said:

So does this mean value only changes are less impactful then other buffs. This wasn’t the promise when you started with the buffs. If Nova/Ronin type buffs are what’s planned for the future may as well just remove value only buffs from the game entirely. It’s a waste of time for both the devs and the community.

Yup... I believe when they first described tune up they used Human Torch as an example, who went from decent to a really good. Nobody likes these new tune ups.

SkyLord7000

Kabam Miike said:

In the past, we've definitely overdone the Value Only updates, and some were closer to Moderate.

What value only champs have you overdone in the past?

Steel_Ball_Run

TheManMythLegend said:

SkyLord7000 said:

Kabam Miike said:

In the past, we've definitely overdone the Value Only updates, and some were closer to Moderate.

What value only champs have you overdone in the past?

Angela. She was called a value only but def was more like moderate

I feel like Punisher 2099 belongs in that group too, pretty big change

Heattblastt

Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....

Destroy4589

Might as well not do value only buff if ronin or nova is the baseline that we should be expecting. It saves everyone a lot of time.

Steel_Ball_Run

TheManMythLegend said:

Steel_Ball_Run said:

TheManMythLegend said:

SkyLord7000 said:

Kabam Miike said:

In the past, we've definitely overdone the Value Only updates, and some were closer to Moderate.

What value only champs have you overdone in the past?

Angela. She was called a value only but def was more like moderate

I feel like Punisher 2099 belongs in that group too, pretty big change

Shii. I cant remember how he used to be anymore. So correct me if im wrong but i think they only upped his numbers and didnt actually add any new utility. With angie they gave her some new stuff that was pretty great

His Overdrive attack boost used to decrease with his battery, now it stays the same until Overdrive ends. Really good change imo

Rotelly

Buff changes summary
- bleed duration cut in half but damage maintained (Pair with deep wounds for extra damage)
- increase in intercept rating 700 to 1400
- guard stance can parry projecticles
- sp1 increased AAR/BPR and +1 second duration
- sp2 reduced bleed duration
- sp3 increased fury damage
- SIg reduced attack rating but extended duration

Masterpuff

Rotelly said:

Buff changes summary
- bleed duration cut in half but damage maintained (Pair with deep wounds for extra damage)
- increase in intercept rating 700 to 1400
- guard stance can parry projecticles
- sp1 increased AAR/BPR and +1 second duration
- sp2 reduced bleed duration
- sp3 increased fury damage
- SIg reduced attack rating but extended duration

Parry projectiles isnt new

The_Sentry06

Heattblastt said:

Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....

We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.

Shadowstrike

The_Sentry06 said:

Heattblastt said:

Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....

We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.

So who would you have wanted in his place? And remember it has to be a lateral choice, you can't change it into a moderate update or overhaul in its place.

FluffyPigMonster

Shadowstrike said:

The_Sentry06 said:

Heattblastt said:

Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....

We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.

So who would you have wanted in his place? And remember it has to be a lateral choice, you can't change it into a moderate update or overhaul in its place.

I mean, I want Ronin to be really good.

I think people who could benefit from a numbers buff are:

Invisible Woman
Mister Sinister
Daredevil Hell’s Kitchen
Man-Thing
Psycho-Man
Super-Skrull

One from each class off the top of my head.

Texas_11

No_oneuk said:

This feels kinda like the human torch buff tbh. Maybe even smaller.

Made human torch a monster .

mbrace

It looks like Ronin will remain in the “not quite viable” category. I should note that Bishop is going to need a bit more than some bumped numbers to be viable. I don’t care what anybody says, I dread using him even in arena due to his tendency to tickle most opponents. His only real utility seems to be energy resist, and it’s not even that much resist.

Texas_11

The_Sentry06 said:

Kabam Miike said:

Catmanndo said:

So lackluster, my excitement for waiting on buffs has become completely numb. Nova, DDHK and now Ronin, does Kabam think these changes are enough for players to invest end user resources on? I was optimistically expecting better…

These Buffs are not solely for End Game players. In fact, I think if could be said they're not really aimed at End Game players at all. Giving more players more options for Champions to deal with certain Challenges really benefits players with a smaller roster, though you'll still get a Champion update every now and then that really skyrockets a Champion to the top of everybody's Roster.

But you guys didn't change anything much that'll make Ronin suddenly more valuable to progressing players than he was before. Adding additional crit rating makes barely a difference and the evade won't be useful anyways most of time because parry and dex exist. Sure it might come useful in the odd scenario when someone accidentally gets hit and that's about it with this buff. No progressing player is going to use him for AAR because it's DAAR and you have to special 1 spam for that meaning no big furies and if you need DAAR from the start of the fight, well...

If this buff was meant for progressing players, the ramp up and playstyle overall should have been made less stressful, if this was meant for endgame rosters, some utility or something should have been added. This buff is none of those and brings an improvement to either people's roster by a very slight margin.

I think the point is that everyone doesn’t have an extensive roster so they have to make do with what they have. A good example of this value only bath was human torch it took them from being complete garbage to one of the top chance in the game. Wait to see what the buff looks like.

Typhoon

I think the buff category "numbers only" is a bit misleading here. Definitely not just numbers.