Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....
We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.
So who would you have wanted in his place? And remember it has to be a lateral choice, you can't change it into a moderate update or overhaul in its place.
Mordo. He's got what could be a strong kit if it wasn't for absolutely atrociously puny values. Same for Fixit.
Mr. Sinister as well. How many champions are immune to reverse controls, heal reversal, concussion, block unlockable attacks, reflect debuffs and pause debuffs on demand on top of having sick animations? So much utility made useless by tiny attack values
Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....
We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.
So who would you have wanted in his place? And remember it has to be a lateral choice, you can't change it into a moderate update or overhaul in its place.
Mordo. He's got what could be a strong kit if it wasn't for absolutely atrociously puny values. Same for Fixit.
Mr. Sinister as well. How many champions are immune to reverse controls, heal reversal, concussion, block unlockable attacks, reflect debuffs and pause debuffs on demand on top of having sick animations? So much utility made useless by tiny attack values
That's part of the trepidation in balancing. When you have that much utility, you run the risk of making them too OP of you add too high a value.
Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....
We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.
So who would you have wanted in his place? And remember it has to be a lateral choice, you can't change it into a moderate update or overhaul in its place.
Mordo. He's got what could be a strong kit if it wasn't for absolutely atrociously puny values. Same for Fixit.
Mr. Sinister as well. How many champions are immune to reverse controls, heal reversal, concussion, block unlockable attacks, reflect debuffs and pause debuffs on demand on top of having sick animations? So much utility made useless by tiny attack values
That's part of the trepidation in balancing. When you have that much utility, you run the risk of making them too OP of you add too high a value.
I hear you. Honesty though, even at max sig his ramp up is more painful than airwalker and far less feasible in higher difficulty story mode, with significantly less payoff.
His damage doesn’t need to be CGR or Mags level but it needs to be substantially higher to be a plausible option. All the utility in the world isn’t worth a hill of beans if it takes 300 hits to finish a fight that another champ would finish in 50.
Considering how many people say here ronin is good and they like him already and only wanted kabam not to make him worse, why are people so disappointed? On the other hand, idk why bother with it in a first place. Like if you intend to change nothing, rather work on some other champ. Add pause timer on sps for rogue, increase hood base attack, decrease nebula charge timer like Gambit and let her consume shock while below 3 charges, not only the 3 pet fight. You know, simple things
You answered your own question. Hoping Kabam don't make their most "balanced" champion worse after a rebalance is an incredibly low standard.
I did not. My point is they managed to hold to that standard. That's not bad already. When you expect bad thing and it's not happening, you should usually feel relieved, not disappointed
You asked,why are people so disappointed and it's precisely because of how little was changed which was your 2nd para. None of the changes are significant except for the one which nerfs him against Bleed Immune champs. All of this could have been done with a synergy or something and the buff spot could have been someone else such as Psycho-Man, Mister Sinister,etc.
No one or not many people wanted a Ronin buff but since they decided to buff them, well people expected a solid upgrade. Not what we got.
And again, why in the first place should we be expecting a bad thing from these updates? Just because Kabam messed up one or two buffs we can HOPE that the same doesn't happen with other buffs but that's not our expectation and that's not the standard most of us as a playerbase want when dealing with buffs.
I think most here are overreacting, yes the cruelty cap on bleed immune is meh but really isn’t that big of a deal just means u will retain his play style of gaining them the normal way in all fights gaining 1 extra per combo.
- His fury on s3 went up a bit so he’s gonna hit even harder after s3 - his bleeds got shorter making his interactions with deep wounds way more significant buffing his bleeds - now can achieve 100% aa in a pinch - The evade on sig only consumes 3 and has longer evade window as well as the fury he gains is better from that too, so abusing it to evade a tricky sp like gunshots from war machine will gain a bunch of fury - The crit on intercept doubled so his backdraft intercept play style will result in more damage and more bleeds naturally
It’s not like they were buffing a noodle I feel these tweaks are enough to take him from good to great. This one reminds me most of the masacre update, just enough to bring them into relevancy.
@Kabam Miike and the team hopefully u realize not all the forum is raging some are appreciative of what we are getting, i plan on r2ing mine soon with this buff. My only issue is before I didn’t feel like I missed the awaken but now wish he was lol
I think most here are overreacting, yes the cruelty cap on bleed immune is meh but really isn’t that big of a deal just means u will retain his play style of gaining them the normal way in all fights gaining 1 extra per combo.
- His fury on s3 went up a bit so he’s gonna hit even harder after s3 - his bleeds got shorter making his interactions with deep wounds way more significant buffing his bleeds - now can achieve 100% aa in a pinch - The evade on sig only consumes 3 and has longer evade window as well as the fury he gains is better from that too, so abusing it to evade a tricky sp like gunshots from war machine will gain a bunch of fury - The crit on intercept doubled so his backdraft intercept play style will result in more damage and more bleeds naturally
It’s not like they were buffing a noodle I feel these tweaks are enough to take him from good to great. This one reminds me most of the masacre update, just enough to bring them into relevancy.
@Kabam Miike and the team hopefully u realize not all the forum is raging some are appreciative of what we are getting, i plan on r2ing mine soon with this buff. My only issue is before I didn’t feel like I missed the awaken but now wish he was lol
The furies from evade got worse? And this definitely wont make people use my boy. He will stay pretty unused by people who didnt already love him.
Oh ok your right they did go down but still think the 3 cruelty cost will make it much more usable he will be very safe to play once u get to the first 3 if he’s awakened. I think that alone will help him more than the small furies. The s3 playstyle will still be the way to go for damage.
I know he was always on my radar for r2 cause he’s so damn fun, I’m at a point where that’s how I keep the game interesting, ranking up fun champs. My roster can basically already counter anything as I’ve got all content 100%. Fun rank ups to run through side quests and the occasional lanes keeps the game fresh, ronin is a crazy fun champ.
Considering how many people say here ronin is good and they like him already and only wanted kabam not to make him worse, why are people so disappointed? On the other hand, idk why bother with it in a first place. Like if you intend to change nothing, rather work on some other champ. Add pause timer on sps for rogue, increase hood base attack, decrease nebula charge timer like Gambit and let her consume shock while below 3 charges, not only the 3 pet fight. You know, simple things
Because it sets the baseline for what we should expect for value only buffs, which is ultimately dissapointment hence the nova and ronin buffs
I think most here are overreacting, yes the cruelty cap on bleed immune is meh but really isn’t that big of a deal just means u will retain his play style of gaining them the normal way in all fights gaining 1 extra per combo.
- His fury on s3 went up a bit so he’s gonna hit even harder after s3 - his bleeds got shorter making his interactions with deep wounds way more significant buffing his bleeds - now can achieve 100% aa in a pinch - The evade on sig only consumes 3 and has longer evade window as well as the fury he gains is better from that too, so abusing it to evade a tricky sp like gunshots from war machine will gain a bunch of fury - The crit on intercept doubled so his backdraft intercept play style will result in more damage and more bleeds naturally
It’s not like they were buffing a noodle I feel these tweaks are enough to take him from good to great. This one reminds me most of the masacre update, just enough to bring them into relevancy.
@Kabam Miike and the team hopefully u realize not all the forum is raging some are appreciative of what we are getting, i plan on r2ing mine soon with this buff. My only issue is before I didn’t feel like I missed the awaken but now wish he was lol
Ronin damage was fine before that. The only thing he was lacking of was utility. Not even 1 Ronin player would like to see more damage from him instead of more utility. And the added cooldown against bleed immune, it's a big deal. I wouldn't mind having the old sig ability if they remove the cooldown. No-one is really gonna use the evade from his sig ability on purpose. No-one is gonna exchange 3 Cruelties for 1-2 Furies
Exactly. The I have always viewed the evade as a safety net. I occasionally use it for specials. But the cooldown sucks.
Uhhhhhh this may be the smallest and most useless buff ever, maybe even more so than Nova.
I mean he didnt need it, but this seems like Kabam noticed 2 days before the update “Whoops we didnt do an update” and they chose to do almost nothing to Ronin.
Kinda annoying but I still love him
(and he is still better than Elsa)
No, you will see the buffs some more numbers will added and july is the correct month
some quite buffs will be active in july, but tgis is necessary one, don't make a complaint on champion,
if you like normally because the new buffs will be added
I think overall Kabam is now balancing their game properly, and bringing in champs that they don’t have to worry about (Ghost , Doom, quake). I think they are setting the expectations that this is what we should expect from now on. Shang Chi/ CGR will probably be the level of “Top tier”. Prof X , apoc great champs but definitely not game breaking.
I think they are bringing ronin to that level. Also, don’t forget that ronin has one of the highest DPs in the game if we reference Kabams chart. This probably just tweaks him to get him to the level where they are happy at.
These value buffs are healthy for the game , no matter how small or big. Vulture, P99, red hulk, Angela, Moleman, massacre, Mr.F . A lot of these champs got value buffs and aren’t game changing , but definitely more usable and some even became R3 consideration champ.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Data from over a year ago isn't especially reliable after all the new introductions to the game.
Yes, I understand , but I said it could have changed. To be fair , data is something that is referenced consistently because it is still relevant.
Without it , they may have not made this tweak to ronin. So you shouldn’t completely just say it’s old , so not relevant.
Yes, data is always something they consider with these rebalances. It's not just the time they've been released or popularity. As for which specific data, they would have to comment themselves.
Buff or no buff, who actually would pick him over a Nick Fury if you want to rank and use a champ for daily purposes? Unless the buff allows him to surpass Fury, he will just continue to be a b-lister.
Maybe somebody like me who for the longest time didn't have a 5 * Nick Fury but did have a 5* Ronin.
Skill is the only class that I don't have a 5/65...just because I don't have a Fury.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Data from over a year ago isn't especially reliable after all the new introductions to the game.
Yes, I understand , but I said it could have changed. To be fair , data is something that is referenced consistently because it is still relevant.
Without it , they may have not made this tweak to ronin. So you shouldn’t completely just say it’s old , so not relevant.
The problem with that logic is that when new data is being constantly added, the data from a year ago degrades very quickly. If there were only a few new additions then the data would still be mostly relevant, but when there's 2 new additions per month, ontop of any new synergies and buffs to previous characters, the old data becomes unreliable.
If anything I would like to see newer versions of these charts with the updated availability of Champions, buffs, and new synergies.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Lolz "ever played" look he has the damage but nothing game breaking how many people will use him over the likes of Nick fury that's the point.
Man, you have to stop comparing these tune ups to the absolute best champ in games. Everyone doesn’t have a nick fury. Everyone doesn’t have a ghost , everyone doesn’t have a Moleman.
This is the argument that really gets under my skin because it’s so empty.
What if someone struggles with the Reparry against IMIW or Ebony maw.
What if someone struggles with dodging a particular special attack.
What if someone wants to handle a tricky debuff.
You are talking about second life nick fury, who is required to play at a crazy low amount of health, and really is comparable to ronin, and other mid tier skill champs not duped or technically on his first life. This is why people say he needs his sig ability, because all his benefits come from the 2nd phase.
We complain when Kabam makes a fight that’s too specific , but quick to say use this champ; when there are so many options in the game. If someone has a ronin, they should be able to use him as an alternative and it should not be a long drawn out fight.
I’m glad summer of pain is out to be honest , because every champ will have their run to shine.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Data from over a year ago isn't especially reliable after all the new introductions to the game.
Yes, I understand , but I said it could have changed. To be fair , data is something that is referenced consistently because it is still relevant.
Without it , they may have not made this tweak to ronin. So you shouldn’t completely just say it’s old , so not relevant.
The problem with that logic is that when new data is being constantly added, the data from a year ago degrades very quickly. If there were only a few new additions then the data would still be mostly relevant, but when there's 2 new additions per month, ontop of any new synergies and buffs to previous characters, the old data becomes unreliable.
If anything I would like to see newer versions of these charts with the updated availability of Champions, buffs, and new synergies.
I usually can see where you are coming from. But data would hardly be relevant for the new champs as they take about 6 months to enter the basic pool, and are fairly limited in rosters to make any meaningful impact on Kabams decisions and get a good sample size. This is why they waited so long to buff a lot of the champs we are saying. If you look at the data I provided in the previous post , they aren’t just looking at high tier , but all throughout the game.
I think that the 1% of top players really don’t impact the game much from a developer standpoint aside from seeing how powerful their champs are (which in theory they know). I think they are more concerned with how these tweaks affect smaller players ,. Cull obsidian buff was a good example he was so powerful at a low level they could just smash through content.
They see a champion like ronin or invisible woman, and said that it required a very high skill cap to unlock their potential and you can see the data showing that. They see the 1% and understand where it’s suppose to be , but locks out a good portion of players.
Also , the 99% of players aren’t obtaining the newest champs as fast as the top are when they come out , so the data is even more irrelevant.
I guess my main point would be the longer a champ is in the game , the more relevant the data becomes.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....
We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.
So who would you have wanted in his place? And remember it has to be a lateral choice, you can't change it into a moderate update or overhaul in its place.
Mordo. He's got a strong kit with absolutely puny values.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
They also said Namor's old regen was op and needed to be tuned down. That and never going back and acknowledging that that was nonsense makes their conclusions sus. They also released that Nova "buff" and think Thor (Ragnarok) looks acceptable. Just sayin'.
Well people were crying that he does not need any kind of buff. Maybe kabam acknowledged this and made last minute changes to keep him almost same........ Now people are crying that he did not got a good buff....
We are complaining because it's a waste of a buff spot.
So who would you have wanted in his place? And remember it has to be a lateral choice, you can't change it into a moderate update or overhaul in its place.
Mordo. He's got a strong kit with absolutely puny values.
Who told you ronin has the highest dps in the game, very funny
I said “has one” and this was back when Kabam considered his buff they provided data . If you ever played ronin, you will know he has a massive DPS especially with suicides.
They also said Namor's old regen was op and needed to be tuned down. That and never going back and acknowledging that that was nonsense makes their conclusions sus. They also released that Nova "buff" and think Thor (Ragnarok) looks acceptable. Just sayin'.
They said he was healing more Damage than he was taking. So yes, that's data that raises a flag.
Comments
No one or not many people wanted a Ronin buff but since they decided to buff them, well people expected a solid upgrade. Not what we got.
And again, why in the first place should we be expecting a bad thing from these updates? Just because Kabam messed up one or two buffs we can HOPE that the same doesn't happen with other buffs but that's not our expectation and that's not the standard most of us as a playerbase want when dealing with buffs.
- His fury on s3 went up a bit so he’s gonna hit even harder after s3
- his bleeds got shorter making his interactions with deep wounds way more significant buffing his bleeds
- now can achieve 100% aa in a pinch
- The evade on sig only consumes 3 and has longer evade window as well as the fury he gains is better from that too, so abusing it to evade a tricky sp like gunshots from war machine will gain a bunch of fury
- The crit on intercept doubled so his backdraft intercept play style will result in more damage and more bleeds naturally
It’s not like they were buffing a noodle I feel these tweaks are enough to take him from good to great. This one reminds me most of the masacre update, just enough to bring them into relevancy.
@Kabam Miike and the team hopefully u realize not all the forum is raging some are appreciative of what we are getting, i plan on r2ing mine soon with this buff. My only issue is before I didn’t feel like I missed the awaken but now wish he was lol
I know he was always on my radar for r2 cause he’s so damn fun, I’m at a point where that’s how I keep the game interesting, ranking up fun champs. My roster can basically already counter anything as I’ve got all content 100%. Fun rank ups to run through side quests and the occasional lanes keeps the game fresh, ronin is a crazy fun champ.
some quite buffs will be active in july, but tgis is necessary one, don't make a complaint on champion,
if you like normally because the new buffs will be added
I think they are bringing ronin to that level. Also, don’t forget that ronin has one of the highest DPs in the game if we reference Kabams chart. This probably just tweaks him to get him to the level where they are happy at.
These value buffs are healthy for the game , no matter how small or big. Vulture, P99, red hulk, Angela, Moleman, massacre, Mr.F . A lot of these champs got value buffs and aren’t game changing , but definitely more usable and some even became R3 consideration champ.
This could have changed.
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/179324/namor-rebalance-information/p1
https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/179327/cull-obsidian-rebalance-information/p1
Without it , they may have not made this tweak to ronin. So you shouldn’t completely just say it’s old , so not relevant.
If anything I would like to see newer versions of these charts with the updated availability of Champions, buffs, and new synergies.
This is the argument that really gets under my skin because it’s so empty.
What if someone struggles with the Reparry against IMIW or Ebony maw.
What if someone struggles with dodging a particular special attack.
What if someone wants to handle a tricky debuff.
You are talking about second life nick fury, who is required to play at a crazy low amount of health, and really is comparable to ronin, and other mid tier skill champs not duped or technically on his first life. This is why people say he needs his sig ability, because all his benefits come from the 2nd phase.
We complain when Kabam makes a fight that’s too specific , but quick to say use this champ; when there are so many options in the game. If someone has a ronin, they should be able to use him as an alternative and it should not be a long drawn out fight.
I’m glad summer of pain is out to be honest , because every champ will have their run to shine.
I think that the 1% of top players really don’t impact the game much from a developer standpoint aside from seeing how powerful their champs are (which in theory they know). I think they are more concerned with how these tweaks affect smaller players ,. Cull obsidian buff was a good example he was so powerful at a low level they could just smash through content.
They see a champion like ronin or invisible woman, and said that it required a very high skill cap to unlock their potential and you can see the data showing that. They see the 1% and understand where it’s suppose to be , but locks out a good portion of players.
Also , the 99% of players aren’t obtaining the newest champs as fast as the top are when they come out , so the data is even more irrelevant.
I guess my main point would be the longer a champ is in the game , the more relevant the data becomes.