Thoughts on True Focus in Alliance War? [Title edited for clarity]

BitterSteel

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

Demonzfyre

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

BitterSteel

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Worknprogress

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

It's was an incredibly lazy and cowardly way to address a problem they should have addressed ages ago.

StevieManWonder

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Absolutely agree with this. I'm very disappointed that I can't really use Prof X, Tigra, and Surfer as effectively in war anymore. I was a big fan of using Surfer for the Rage mini because he bypassed the Rage node with complete ease, but now he'll be a lot harder to use since I will either have to parry heavy and take chip damage or rely on using the sp1 to get and refresh my buffs.
Tigra is pretty much absolutely neutered now.

Demonzfyre

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Worknprogress

StevieManWonder said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Absolutely agree with this. I'm very disappointed that I can't really use Prof X, Tigra, and Surfer as effectively in war anymore. I was a big fan of using Surfer for the Rage mini because he bypassed the Rage node with complete ease, but now he'll be a lot harder to use since I will either have to parry heavy and take chip damage or rely on using the sp1 to get and refresh my buffs.
Tigra is pretty much absolutely neutered now.

Negative got hit pretty hard in this as well. It's hard enough convincing high tier officers to go along with new counters to fights as it is. Was hoping to see some more Negs and Xavier reps this season but that seems far less likely now

Worknprogress

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Add tags to the specific champs and then add a node that affects that tags to the map or sections of the map. Really not that difficult

BitterSteel

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Kabam have not been subtle about this already, saying “We all know that there are a couple of Champions in the game that play by different rules than everyone else.” The solution to this problem is two nodes.

“Ghost cannot miss in this fight”

“Quake cannot evade in this fight”

Be honest. Tell everyone why you’re doing it and say it’s to make war harder, better, less stressful. You’ve already told us you want ghost and quake to stop being so good, don’t make other champs bad because of it.

BitterSteel

Worknprogress said:

StevieManWonder said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Absolutely agree with this. I'm very disappointed that I can't really use Prof X, Tigra, and Surfer as effectively in war anymore. I was a big fan of using Surfer for the Rage mini because he bypassed the Rage node with complete ease, but now he'll be a lot harder to use since I will either have to parry heavy and take chip damage or rely on using the sp1 to get and refresh my buffs.
Tigra is pretty much absolutely neutered now.

Negative got hit pretty hard in this as well. It's hard enough convincing high tier officers to go along with new counters to fights as it is. Was hoping to see some more Negs and Xavier reps this season but that seems far less likely now

Negative has been hit very hard. A huge chunk of his utility is hidden behind being able to evade.

Avoiding block damage, on demand intercepts. reducing enemy combat power gain, applying a second petrify.

And a huge chunk of his damage, nearly half, has been locked behind it too.

Damage from dark energy + non damaging debuff which could go up to 20 before, now will essentially max out at 9. Halving that.

Degens from sp2 could go up to 20 before, now you can only get 9. Halving that too.

That is most of his damage. You now have a champ, that you can’t play avoiding block damage, you can’t intercept with, he can get max 1 petrify, does half as much damage as he did before and can’t control power as well. All because kabam didn’t decide to be upfront with balancing the game.

Bring in the ghost/quake counter node and call it a day

StevieManWonder

Worknprogress said:

StevieManWonder said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Absolutely agree with this. I'm very disappointed that I can't really use Prof X, Tigra, and Surfer as effectively in war anymore. I was a big fan of using Surfer for the Rage mini because he bypassed the Rage node with complete ease, but now he'll be a lot harder to use since I will either have to parry heavy and take chip damage or rely on using the sp1 to get and refresh my buffs.
Tigra is pretty much absolutely neutered now.

Negative got hit pretty hard in this as well. It's hard enough convincing high tier officers to go along with new counters to fights as it is. Was hoping to see some more Negs and Xavier reps this season but that seems far less likely now

I'm sure he does, I'm not familiar with him though because I didn't get him in my goes at the featured. I would like to keep trying to get him because he looks amazing, but now I need to save my shards for Herc and hopefully Spider-Man 2099 (fingers crossed he's good because he's one of my favorite Spider-Men).

Vendemiaire

I’m a Quake user and I was planning to move on to Tigra. I practiced enough and R3’ed her for War. Bummer. Lol.

I understand that they need to tone down Quake and Ghost’s influence but I feel bummed out that it indirectly affected most of the champ I like to use (Mister Negative, Elsa, Prof X, and particularly Tigra).

I now have lost all motivation to play war.

Demonzfyre

Worknprogress said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Add tags to the specific champs and then add a node that affects that tags to the map or sections of the map. Really not that difficult

That's true. I didn't think of the tags part.

IKON

Worknprogress said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Add tags to the specific champs and then add a node that affects that tags to the map or sections of the map. Really not that difficult

Well, damn, that is a way better way to implement it. Feels like we currently have a sledgehammer solution to scalpel problem.

LuisBvv

I can’t wait to see how many people fully quit war after this garbage announcement. 1 step forward 12 steps backwards. Total embarrassment and they don’t have the balls to comment

SwarmOfRavens

Worknprogress said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Add tags to the specific champs and then add a node that affects that tags to the map or sections of the map. Really not that difficult

Suggested the same thing in another thread and don't see a reason not to go through this route other than laziness.

We've seen tag based nodes and have tag based globals for some variants.
Quake and Ghost have been a problem for long enough that they could have designed something specific instead of this cheap solution

BitterSteel

IKON said:

Worknprogress said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Add tags to the specific champs and then add a node that affects that tags to the map or sections of the map. Really not that difficult

Well, damn, that is a way better way to implement it. Feels like we currently have a sledgehammer solution to scalpel problem.

I really hope we get a response to why they decided to counter a bunch of other champs while countering ghost and quake. Unfortunately I’m going to be very surprised if it’s anything other than accepting it counters other champs, but at the end of the day we will have to deal with it.

awesomesauce

Dudes, ya'll gotta chill. Like you could honestly use Quake being the current state of the game and how the dropped framerate, dropped controls, inability to dex/parry efficiently impacts it. Because of these I wont use certain champs in AW, can't afford to risk the loss.

Pulyaman

Can't believe no one has brought up the most OP attacker in the game Ebony maw @Eb0ny-O-M4w

Demonzfyre

Haji_Saab said:

Worknprogress said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Add tags to the specific champs and then add a node that affects that tags to the map or sections of the map. Really not that difficult

#OverPowered champions cannot evade or cause attacks to miss.

This way they can always add more champions to it to tweak the meta.

I like the tag- #whoneedsrosterdepthwithquakeandghost

Demonzfyre

Ebony_Naw said:

Demonzfyre said:

Haji_Saab said:

Worknprogress said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

BitterSteel said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Demonzfyre said:

Dissapointed said:

Instead of giving us incentive to use other champs, they prefer to nerf Quake, Ghost and Tigra

We're any of these champs fundamental abilities changed?

for war, yes. And War is one of the biggest games modes in the game.

@Dissapointed No, not a single ability is change. There is a node that COUNTERS certain abilities. This is nothing new. It's been happening in the game since this game started. It's in every aspect of this game through champ abilities, synergies and nodes.

So I’m asking this as more of a philosophical question, as opposed to using it to make a point because I genuinely don’t know what I think at the moment and I just want to put it out there.

Say we take this to its extreme, and say that every fight in the game has now had true focus added to it. Would that be a nerf to quake and ghost? Or would it be called something else, like a dramatic meta shift or something.

I know this would never happen, and I’m not saying either way that this situation or the one going on currently is a nerf. Because I don’t think it’s a nerf what is happening.

And to be honest, I don’t think that if the extreme scenario I put forward above would be a nerf either, but I’m not 100% sure.

I think that people call it a nerf because they don’t truly understand what a nerf is, or what to call a meta shift like this. Nerfs are very rarely, if ever, reverted. Meta shifts much more often, so that’s why its not as bad as a nerf.

Again, I don’t mean this to make some grand point, just that I think that people call them nerfs because they don’t know what else to call it, and meta shift doesn’t have the same impact to them as nerf does. I understand why people think it’s a nerf, but I fundamentally disagree - ghost and quake are still just as useful everywhere else, and that’s why this meta shift is ok. Taking it further, and taking a node like this game wide would be cheap and not good, and that’s when the meta shift would be bad.

If every node from here on out had true focus, it would be considered a nerf since you can't use that ability. But, to make that happen, all content would need that, arena, lower MEQ/SEQ difficulties, all story acts, AQ and AW. If the game changed to where everything, literally, had true focus to counter evade and miss, then yes, it would be a nerf.

Like you said, won't ever happen.

I never learned Quake. Don't ever want to learn Quake. When are came out, I became waaaaaayyyyyyyy to dependent on using him and the trinity. Same with corvus and AQ, so much so, I was fighting with ally mates about corvus charges. I hate being dependent on one or 2 champs.

I'm all for these changes because it brings a challenge aspect back to war. It's no longer an easy fight for someone with Quake or Ghost so defenses stand a chance now. This also helps with those tight AW matches, so there's more planning. People wanted a way to not tie so often, here's our chance.

None of these changes are permanent though. They see a drop in participation, they make changes again. But, as it stands Ghost and Quake have lots of value still.

Yep, I agree with you here. I’m genuinely all for quake and ghost being taken down a notch in war, it adds a new layer to the game mode now you can’t use the best options.

What I absolutely hate, is that it’s catching other, not as broken champions in the crossfire. I now can’t use my prof X, Elsa and Negative as effectively, and they weren’t breaking any war results or making things too easy. All of them R3 6*, none of them as useful, just because kabam wanted to take down quake and ghost.

Now I can still use them, sure, but I used Elsa on stun reflect because she’s amazing for it. Can’t now. I used Negative on boss island for any tough degen, power gain match ups. But I can only get max 1 petrify now, so that takes value away from him when I need 160% reversal rather than just 80. I used to use Prof X for Korg bosses or any tenacity match ups or non heavy/parry matchups and I’d use the falter to build my charges. Now that’s not an option. It was great to have G2099 miss as a safety net against Apoc bosses if you mess up, enjoy that combo now.

I was learning tigra and hoping to bring her to war at some point, now she can’t miss projectile specials.

It’s some little, some large things that just show how under-thought or uncaring this node choice was. The game is for fun, and sometimes things need to be balanced, sure. But balance the right things, don’t ruin champs who aren’t breaking the game, by balancing those champs that are breaking the game. It’s lazy and it’s not too late to be fixed.

Correct. It somehow just needs to be Quake and Ghost but I don't know how they do that.

Add tags to the specific champs and then add a node that affects that tags to the map or sections of the map. Really not that difficult

#OverPowered champions cannot evade or cause attacks to miss.

This way they can always add more champions to it to tweak the meta.

I like the tag- #whoneedsrosterdepthwithquakeandghost

I prefer #WeAreSorryWeCreatedTheseChamps

#sorrynotsorry

Eb0ny-O-M4w

Pulyaman said:

Can't believe no one has brought up the most OP attacker in the game Ebony maw @Eb0ny-O-M4w

I did mention that it would slow Maw fights by 4 seconds each, which is the biggest problem this game has ever had till now