MCoC 2022 - Buffs that can’t be stolen or copied

World Eater

A few years back, there was an insightful thread about “unstealable buffs” that can’t be copied by Rogue or stolen by Loki. See below:

https://forums.playcontestofchampions.com/en/discussion/138921/unstealable-buffs#latest

Kabam didn’t take the time to respond and now we’re in 2022 with even more buffs added to the game that these champs can’t steal or copy.

Below is a vid showing 5 more buffs that should be able to be copied or stolen but they don’t:
Energize
Power charge
Immortality
Nova Surge
Aptitude

https://youtu.be/9DCwoSjps1g
CLOSE

It’s be nice to finally get some clarification or explanation about all this. Are any of these interactions bugged and if not, why can’t Loki or Rogue interact with these (and other) buffs??

SirGamesBond

#justiceforloki

World Eater

Here’s some more questionable interactions in the vid below:

Rogue vs Transmutation

Loki vs:
Transmutation
Overpower
Cosmic Energy Overload
Undermine

I’ve spent a lot of time and energy making these vids, writing posts in this thread & in the “unstealable buffs” thread from 2019 linked in the first post above. These are valid questions about how Loki and Rogue (and mystic dispersion) interact with all these buffs. I hope someone from Kabam will help and reply.

https://youtu.be/t_XOeqN2YQA

Be_Somebody

And Falcon's Recon Scan can be stealed somehow

World Eater

Be_Somebody said:

And Falcon's Recon Scan can be stealed somehow

Greetings.

Recon is Falcons ability that you have place on Loki. With all due respect, This doesn’t relate to the issues posted in this thread.

World Eater

Found another buff that Rogue couldn’t steal last night. I can provide a video if needed.

Vigilance

I hope this topic doesn’t continue to get ignored by Kabam.

World Eater

Todays video is brought to you by the letter R for our champion Rogue, who can’t copy any of these buffs

Power charge
Unblockable
Vigilance
Cosmic energy overload
Aptitude
Overpowered
Rout
Combo shield


https://youtu.be/SmKoYjT-1Cs

Can anyone from Kabam comment on this topic ?

DNA3000

Setting aside all of the tangential debates about buffs verses passives, and whether things *should* be stealable or not, what can and cannot be stolen should probably be better documented for the players. I will try to find out why it isn't.

Escornaboi

@World Eater It is a problem that accumulates as the game 'ages'. What you comment in this thread is an anomaly that, with the passage of time, is increasing. Currently there are many more bonuses / abilities that Rogue / Loki CANNOT steal than those that CAN steal (or copy).

But not only these fighters suffer from the 'aging' of the game. For example, The Champion activates a passive ability (Champion of the Universe) when he faces those fighters that he considers the best in the Tournament. Among others, Archangel, Magik or Corvus. But he does not activate this ability against other very good fighters who later entered the Tournament, such as Human Torch, Doom, Apocalypse, Namor ...

Fit_Fun9329

DNA3000 said:

Setting aside all of the tangential debates about buffs verses passives, and whether things *should* be stealable or not, what can and cannot be stolen should probably be better documented for the players. I will try to find out why it isn't.

Why aren’t your letters orange .. Kabam DNA

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World Eater

DNA3000 said:

Setting aside all of the tangential debates about buffs verses passives, and whether things *should* be stealable or not, what can and cannot be stolen should probably be better documented for the players. I will try to find out why it isn't.

Thanks. Any help would be appreciated.

I recall a Kabam mod saying that Rogue can not copy unstoppable or indestructible buffs years ago, but I can’t find the thread that states that.

o_o

Great detective work. Have you found that Loki and Rogue are the same in terms of which buffs they can and can’t steal?

o_o

Also just noticed this in Sigil SWitch’s profile: “Scarlet Witch gains a copy of any Fury, Prowess, Cruelty, Armor Up, or Unblockable buff she nullifies.” She can nullify any buff, but she can only copy those 5. In her case (unlike Rogue and Loki) it’s documented.

DNA3000

Fit_Fun9329 said:

DNA3000 said:

Setting aside all of the tangential debates about buffs verses passives, and whether things *should* be stealable or not, what can and cannot be stolen should probably be better documented for the players. I will try to find out why it isn't.

Why aren’t your letters orange .. Kabam DNA

They are, but I type so fast they are blue-shifted to yellow.

(Kidding: only Kabam employees have the orange names, and Kabam employees cannot astroturf the forums under unacknowledged identities. As a Forum Guardian I'm required to make clear I am not a Kabam employee nor do I speak for them in any official capacity.)

World Eater

This months EQ , chapter 1.1 Ronan boss has the “Steady Perseverance” node that gives him Stun Immunity buff that can’t be stolen by Rogue either.

I can upload a vid if needed , but I feel like I’d just be wasting my time since Kabam hasn’t bothered to address this topic for 3 years

World Eater

Will any mod help to find out why Loki and Rogue don’t work with all these buffs ?

Are they bugged or is this an intended (non)interaction ?

DNA3000

World Eater said:

Will any mod help to find out why Loki and Rogue don’t work with all these buffs ?

Are they bugged or is this an intended (non)interaction ?

This is not a direct answer to your question(s), but unfortunately, as best as I can tell, there's no simple rule for which buffs can and cannot be stolen or copied. In other words, the only way to know which ones can be and cannot be would be to publish two full lists of them. Which then wouldn't likely fit in the in-game descriptions. This appears to be "intentional" in the sense that that's just the way this stuff is designed (in other words, somewhat ad hoc).

Whether the players could get such lists is a question I have posed. That's all I can say about that.

World Eater

Silver Surfer has a “Power Cosmic” buff that can be nullified by Venom , Venompool and even OG Scarlet Witch, but it can’t be copied by Rogue or stolen by Loki.

https://youtube.com/shorts/RUk7YdsqSMI?feature=share

This Raises even more questions. If these buffs can be nullified, even by SW who predates Rogue and Loki; why are Loki and Rogue not interacting with all these buffs? Is it bugged, lazy coding, working as intended ? Who the H knows!!? Kabam refuses to comment or even acknowledge that these 2 champs don’t work per their descriptions. These are legitimate questions and concerns. Refusing to address this, for 3 years now, makes me lose any confidence in Kabam.

AverageDesi

DNA3000 said:

Setting aside all of the tangential debates about buffs verses passives, and whether things *should* be stealable or not, what can and cannot be stolen should probably be better documented for the players. I will try to find out why it isn't.

Maybe those releases after said ability has been implemented?

Venompool in Lab who shrugs all debuffs cannot/does not shrug fragility debuff from karnak. Maybe because it was released later?

Rougue has also in last been updated a couple(?) Times to be able to steal newer buffs

AverageDesi

I think it's mentioned somewhere that unique buffs cannot be stolen . Like overpower from kingpin

World Eater

AverageDesi said:

I think it's mentioned somewhere that unique buffs cannot be stolen . Like overpower from kingpin

Loki can L1 Annihilus cosmic control rod and get rid of it. He doesn’t steal it, but the L1 removes that buff from Annihilus.

Not sure why Loki can’t steal dragon man’s power charge buff & Rogue can’t copy it. They’re able to interact with standard power gain buffs (except the new energize). Also, the Unblockable buff isn’t unique to one champ; it exists as a node and various champs have it.

I appreciate everyone’s replies but it’s really up to Kabam to inform us what is or is not intended.

AverageDesi

World Eater said:

AverageDesi said:

I think it's mentioned somewhere that unique buffs cannot be stolen . Like overpower from kingpin

Loki can L1 Annihilus cosmic control rod and get rid of it. He doesn’t steal it, but the L1 removes that buff from Annihilus.

Not sure why Loki can’t steal dragon man’s power charge buff & Rogue can’t copy it. They’re able to interact with standard power gain buffs (except the new energize). Also, the Unblockable buff isn’t unique to one champ; it exists as a node and various champs have it.

I appreciate everyone’s replies but it’s really up to Kabam to inform us what is or is not intended.

That's part of annihilus kit. Any attempt to nullify will remove the rod.

Dragon man is the only champ with the power charge to my knowledge so that would be a unique buff. Rest not sure. Have to update I gues

World Eater

AverageDesi said:

World Eater said:

AverageDesi said:

I think it's mentioned somewhere that unique buffs cannot be stolen . Like overpower from kingpin

Loki can L1 Annihilus cosmic control rod and get rid of it. He doesn’t steal it, but the L1 removes that buff from Annihilus.

Not sure why Loki can’t steal dragon man’s power charge buff & Rogue can’t copy it. They’re able to interact with standard power gain buffs (except the new energize). Also, the Unblockable buff isn’t unique to one champ; it exists as a node and various champs have it.

I appreciate everyone’s replies but it’s really up to Kabam to inform us what is or is not intended.

That's part of annihilus kit. Any attempt to nullify will remove the rod.

Dragon man is the only champ with the power charge to my knowledge so that would be a unique buff. Rest not sure. Have to update I gues

I understand your point about “ unique” buffs, but that’s never been confirmed by kabam. All we’ve ever been told is that Rogue can not copy unstoppable and indestructible buffs.
That’s it. Everything else is up in the air. More and more buffs get added and these two champs don’t work per their descriptions. It would benefit everyone if Kabam would just respond & clarify what is intended and what is not intended.

Re: Annihilus Cosmic control rod buff
Loki actually does interact with this uniquie buff. He removes the buff, but it’s not a nullify. Loki doesn’t have a nullify ability. His L1 says it steals all the enemy’s buffs.

IcyCoolDudeDoodle

Which is why I don't use my 4* Loki on my mini anynore

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Fit_Fun9329

I think this topic you referring to, is a victim of the progression of the game and it’s endless interactions. For example the buff stealing rogue .. she was programmed in a time where we had very basic buffs like fury or precision. For every new champion release with new buffs they had to update the coding of rogue and Loki every time.

Maybe they will update the code of them within a general buff but I wouldn’t be that optimistic. Think they will stars as they are .. unfortunately

o_o

Looks like Loki can steal evade buffs - or at least Nightcrawler's evade buff. I don't know if it does anything for Loki though. After stealing the buff i stood still to see if i would evade when attacked but instead i just took a combo to the face.

World Eater

o_o said:

Looks like Loki can steal evade buffs - or at least Nightcrawler's evade buff. I don't know if it does anything for Loki though. After stealing the buff i stood still to see if i would evade when attacked but instead i just took a combo to the face.

Yep, I haven’t tested that recently but I have in the past and Loki was able to steal that evade buff from NC.

I don’t believe Rogue is able to copy it but I’m kinda sick of testing since Kabam won’t address this …… but did move the thread over to the “bugs and known issues” section. Why should I do more work than them?

World Eater

The forums used to be a place where you could ask questions about how champions are supposed work and get a moderator to help understand and clarify what is or what is not intended. Over the years, I’ve put in a lot of time and energy to make respectful inquiries and provide videos asking about Loki and Rogue.

Can Anyone from kabam please help me and others to understand why rogue and Loki can not copy or steal all these buffs???

Mister_pl0w

It’s kind of a bummer that we continue to get buffs added to the game that don’t interact with Rogue and Loki and there hasn’t been a response or even acknowledgment to these posts.