Why Infamous Iron Man failed to live up to Doctor Doom

Rookiie

Let me preface this statement by saying that in terms of base kit, I believe they are equal. Both are excellent power controllers, both have a similar rotation, and niche pieces of utility.

However, as with life, timing in MCOC is everything.

Here is why IIF fails to control the fights that Doom dominates:

IIF:



Doom:



Whether you put it down to 1 millimeter of spacing or 1 millisecond of latency, it’s just enough for the AI to consistently intercept you. Doesn’t happen with Doom.

BigBlueOx

IDoom not being nullify/stagger immune baffles me still. But good find

Wu_Bangerz23

I personally like idoom better. Not sure what it is or why but I just enjoy him more....it is possible that doom is so good he's boring. I get soooo bored when I use him ....I guess that's the definition of dominance though.....still, gun to my head, I'm taking idoom ahead of ogdoom

Zekir

It happens with Doom.

The reason it didn't work in this example is IIM is ending with his second Medium, Doom is ending with his third Light. As far as the game is concerned, IIM has finished a combo, and did not chain into a special, therefore the AI now has priority to retaliate.

Realize if you are gonna talk about a champs interaction not working the same, make sure you end with the correct combo the same as well. Also, Winter Punchingbag is random on if it will throw its SP1 immediately, or hold it. I've had him throw and not throw while doing both combos.

Rookiie

Zekir said:

It happens with Doom.

The reason it didn't work in this example is IIM is ending with his second Medium, Doom is ending with his third Light. As far as the game is concerned, IIM has finished a combo, and did not chain into a special, therefore the AI now has priority to retaliate.

Realize if you are gonna talk about a champs interaction not working the same, make sure you end with the correct combo the same as well. Also, Winter Punchingbag is random on if it will throw its SP1 immediately, or hold it. I've had him throw and not throw while doing both combos.

That’s an excellent point, and I did learn from this, but you need to realize that IIF relies on his 2nd Medium to prolong his Aura of Iron, whereas Doom has no such thing. So essentially, if you want to optimize IIF, you need to end with a Medium. Then you’re susceptible to getting caught out.

Zekir

Rookiie said:

That’s an excellent point, and I did learn from this, but you need to realize that IIF relies on his 2nd Medium to prolong his Aura of Iron, whereas Doom has no such thing. So essentially, if you want to optimize IIF, you need to end with a Medium. Then you’re susceptible to getting caught out.

Unfortunately I don't see how that second medium helps anything. That additional 2 seconds of aura could potentially mess up a rotation into SP2, or time poorly and let the AI go Unblockable.

I find MLLLH is still the better rotation, and just remember to time your Heavy with SP2 so you can have Aura of Iron ready when you get 2 bars.

Overall, IIM wasn't really meant to live up to Doom because they both operate under different circumstances. IMO, IIM is far more useful than Doom for a lot of content. Sure some of his uses are tied to his armor, which.... without it he becomes pretty useless... but he still does more work than Doom does when you can't just face melt everything with SP3-SP2 rotations. Or those stupid Spiked Armor nodes... -_-

Pikolu

Rookiie said:

Zekir said:

It happens with Doom.

The reason it didn't work in this example is IIM is ending with his second Medium, Doom is ending with his third Light. As far as the game is concerned, IIM has finished a combo, and did not chain into a special, therefore the AI now has priority to retaliate.

Realize if you are gonna talk about a champs interaction not working the same, make sure you end with the correct combo the same as well. Also, Winter Punchingbag is random on if it will throw its SP1 immediately, or hold it. I've had him throw and not throw while doing both combos.

That’s an excellent point, and I did learn from this, but you need to realize that IIF relies on his 2nd Medium to prolong his Aura of Iron, whereas Doom has no such thing. So essentially, if you want to optimize IIF, you need to end with a Medium. Then you’re susceptible to getting caught out.

If you care that much about prolonging it, you can MM and then go for a parry and M or if they don't do anything Medium their block and heavy through their block, however iron doom doesn't need that extra 2 seconds of aura time so it is wasteful to do anything except MLLL heavy.

In shorter fights you'll just MLLL heavy sp2 the enemy while in longer fights you'll MLLL heavy sp3 or just M heavy sp3, MLLLM to sp1, use sp1, then just easy game easy life sp2 spam

[Deleted User]

Rookiie said:

Zekir said:

It happens with Doom.

The reason it didn't work in this example is IIM is ending with his second Medium, Doom is ending with his third Light. As far as the game is concerned, IIM has finished a combo, and did not chain into a special, therefore the AI now has priority to retaliate.

Realize if you are gonna talk about a champs interaction not working the same, make sure you end with the correct combo the same as well. Also, Winter Punchingbag is random on if it will throw its SP1 immediately, or hold it. I've had him throw and not throw while doing both combos.

That’s an excellent point, and I did learn from this, but you need to realize that IIF relies on his 2nd Medium to prolong his Aura of Iron, whereas Doom has no such thing. So essentially, if you want to optimize IIF, you need to end with a Medium. Then you’re susceptible to getting caught out.

IMF isn't supposed to keep his Aura up. The proper way to play him is to just let it fall off and keep reactivating it. Him losing it isn't nearly as bad as Doom losing his Aura.

Mr.0-8-4

I disagree. Iron Doom's SP2 power burn more than makes up for any issues.

AverageDesi

Like said above , one you throw a combo ender you are unable to act for a short while. If you were to do the same combo with iDoom as with doom this wouldn't happen.

Not to take away from the point that doom is better.

My main issue, is that with doom you can push the opponent to 3 bars and and most of the tike you're okay. But with idoom it's RNG dependent

CyborgNinja135

AverageDesi said:

Like said above , one you throw a combo ender you are unable to act for a short while. If you were to do the same combo with iDoom as with doom this wouldn't happen.

Not to take away from the point that doom is better.

My main issue, is that with doom you can push the opponent to 3 bars and and most of the tike you're okay. But with idoom it's RNG dependent

You can safely push the opponent to 3 bars with iDoom. Just don't throw the combo ender. They're two different champions, you don't have to play both the same way.

AverageDesi

CyborgNinja135 said:

AverageDesi said:

Like said above , one you throw a combo ender you are unable to act for a short while. If you were to do the same combo with iDoom as with doom this wouldn't happen.

Not to take away from the point that doom is better.

My main issue, is that with doom you can push the opponent to 3 bars and and most of the tike you're okay. But with idoom it's RNG dependent

You can safely push the opponent to 3 bars with iDoom. Just don't throw the combo ender. They're two different champions, you don't have to play both the same way.

I forgot to add that i don't know iDoom very well in that comment. Any tips for pushing the opponent to Sp3 ? I usually deal with it using sp2. Sp1 works if the power burn happens but that's RNG

CyborgNinja135

AverageDesi said:

CyborgNinja135 said:

AverageDesi said:

Like said above , one you throw a combo ender you are unable to act for a short while. If you were to do the same combo with iDoom as with doom this wouldn't happen.

Not to take away from the point that doom is better.

My main issue, is that with doom you can push the opponent to 3 bars and and most of the tike you're okay. But with idoom it's RNG dependent

You can safely push the opponent to 3 bars with iDoom. Just don't throw the combo ender. They're two different champions, you don't have to play both the same way.

I forgot to add that i don't know iDoom very well in that comment. Any tips for pushing the opponent to Sp3 ? I usually deal with it using sp2. Sp1 works if the power burn happens but that's RNG

If you see that the opponent is getting near to 3 bars, just hold block to stop them from throwing specials. Taking hits on the block will help you build power faster. He's got decent block proficiency to take the hits and the sig also gives him a nice boost. When you get to 2 bars, do M-H to trigger the aura and then throw the sp2. Usually that brings the opponent down to 1.5 bars. Ofc if you're doing the sp3 rotation to get the long sp1 special lock then the only concern in the fight is keeping your aura refreshed.

I also have Reed quite often on the team when I run iDoom and that synergy gives him +70% crit rate based on the opponent's power so doing M-H is pretty much guaranteed to power burn when the opponent is at full power.

I_tell_no_tales_1

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

Bulmkt

Re iDoom
Just get to your SP3, but before actioning it, parry heavy the opponent and just after the first slap action the SP3
(the slap starts the aura and when a SP3 is actioned the aura is extended for 24 seconds)

Now this is when a striker is handy to have with iDoom. After the SP3 MM twice the opponent an then action your striker. Push to your SP1, action it and Bingo your opponent is power locked. With the power buff you’ll be able to hit your opponent at least twice with your SP2. game over opponent

Loki_Poki1280

For me, I love him btw, is his absolute weakness to armor break. Unlike og Doom who is armor break immune, IFIM feels flimsy to me. But other than that they are really similar

BitterSteel

I_tell_no_tales_1 said:

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

As a tech champion, generally weak to armour breaks. With cosmic class being armour break heavy, I think it would be odd for him to be armour break immune

Bugmat78

My biggest issue with Idoom's rotation is that he only shocks when he should crit, and yes synergy improves it but otherwise it's RNG if and when he applies the shock. 99% it will happen during a 4 or 5 hit combo but it can theoretically not happen, and so at times you are in the edge of success or failure. Doom's shock is 100% guaranteed on his medium. I prefer that control more.

AMS94

TBH it's not easy to live up to Doctor Doom & I don't think Kabam were looking to make him as good as Doom
The kind of control Doom offers, IDoom just can't match with that
IMO IDoom wouldn't live up to Doom even if he had higher damage output.....bcoz he doesn't offer the same kind of control that Doom does

AMS94

BitterSteel said:

I_tell_no_tales_1 said:

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

As a tech champion, generally weak to armour breaks. With cosmic class being armour break heavy, I think it would be odd for him to be armour break immune

Lately many cosmics have been immune to nullify, stagger etc so it won't be that weird to have IDoom be Armor break immune.....at least against Non-Cosmics

BigBlueOx

BitterSteel said:

I_tell_no_tales_1 said:

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

As a tech champion, generally weak to armour breaks. With cosmic class being armour break heavy, I think it would be odd for him to be armour break immune

Agree, just to elaborate on my earlier point. Mystic immunity on tech champs is something we’ve been seeing more with recent Tech champs like OS and Viv. With iDoom being released in between these two, it’s a head scratcher why he doesn’t have it when so much of his kit and utility rely on that Armor Up and with the established Doom being a mystic it’s just so odd he wasn’t given protection from mystic abilities. Still a great champ but a rather large weakness

So while he shouldn’t be armor break immune for the reasons outlined above, it’s so odd that he’s countered by mystics so effectively as well

AverageDesi

AMS94 said:

BitterSteel said:

I_tell_no_tales_1 said:

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

As a tech champion, generally weak to armour breaks. With cosmic class being armour break heavy, I think it would be odd for him to be armour break immune

Lately many cosmics have been immune to nullify, stagger etc so it won't be that weird to have IDoom be Armor break immune.....at least against Non-Cosmics

How many cosmics

Bugmat78

BitterSteel said:

I_tell_no_tales_1 said:

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

As a tech champion, generally weak to armour breaks. With cosmic class being armour break heavy, I think it would be odd for him to be armour break immune

I'm personally fine with this as he is tech. It's his susceptibility to nullify which i think is a big weakness. If mystics could nullify his regen ..ok . But to be able to negate his entire kit (regen, invulnerability, power drain, aura etc) by nullifying his armour... think they could have designed that better. Give him the pseudo immunity Nimrod has or the full immunity omega sentinel does. Make him weak Vs one class not two.

Bugmat78

BigBlueOx said:

BitterSteel said:

I_tell_no_tales_1 said:

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

As a tech champion, generally weak to armour breaks. With cosmic class being armour break heavy, I think it would be odd for him to be armour break immune

Agree, just to elaborate on my earlier point. Mystic immunity on tech champs is something we’ve been seeing more with recent Tech champs like OS and Viv. With iDoom being released in between these two, it’s a head scratcher why he doesn’t have it when so much of his kit and utility rely on that Armor Up and with the established Doom being a mystic it’s just so odd he wasn’t given protection from mystic abilities. Still a great champ but a rather large weakness

So while he shouldn’t be armor break immune for the reasons outlined above, it’s so odd that he’s countered by mystics so effectively as well

Exactly. I've had him since the prerelease bundle and this is by far his biggest flaw/weakness.

CyborgNinja135

Bugmat78 said:

My biggest issue with Idoom's rotation is that he only shocks when he should crit, and yes synergy improves it but otherwise it's RNG if and when he applies the shock. 99% it will happen during a 4 or 5 hit combo but it can theoretically not happen, and so at times you are in the edge of success or failure. Doom's shock is 100% guaranteed on his medium. I prefer that control more.

iDoom also has guaranteed shock debuffs on his mediums...

GroundedWisdom

Am I the only one that doesn't agree that iDoom is subpar? He's amazing.
They're two different Champs with similar mechanics and different uses.

Bugmat78

CyborgNinja135 said:

Bugmat78 said:

My biggest issue with Idoom's rotation is that he only shocks when he should crit, and yes synergy improves it but otherwise it's RNG if and when he applies the shock. 99% it will happen during a 4 or 5 hit combo but it can theoretically not happen, and so at times you are in the edge of success or failure. Doom's shock is 100% guaranteed on his medium. I prefer that control more.

iDoom also has guaranteed shock debuffs on his mediums...

You are right i mixed up his shock debuffs with his instant shocks. Those are only on crits.

Real_Madrid_76_2

He mostly can't make the ai act more defensive which mostly leads to ai using specials frequently and losing their power, which when burnt, is the source of his damage.

In doom case, he already needs to be at Max power level, so he doesn't need to worry, just reach Max power and then take your opponent to 2 bars of power. Done

In idoom case, he needs only 2 bars of power and his sp3 isn't much useful so his power keeps increasing as opponent uses specials and we hits the opponent to take them to higher power level. Resulting in usually either using low damage sp2 or using weak sp3

This is why i think doom is more efficient and convenient to use

Doctorwho13

Give me Idoom or nobody should have idoom 🤣

TheParasite

iDoom literally loses everything when the opponent is immune to shock or his armor is down. But doom still has control of 90% of his kit even when he has a slow on him or him being magnetised.

There should be some balance made to him which makes him not a noodle when the opponent has immunity

I_tell_no_tales_1

BitterSteel said:

I_tell_no_tales_1 said:

I-doom not being Armor break immune is ridiculous

As a tech champion, generally weak to armour breaks. With cosmic class being armour break heavy, I think it would be odd for him to be armour break immune

Well Nimrod has such mechanic
Pseudo immunity I think is what they call it
Also he is literally doom and Doom is also immune to Armor break