Also since node doesnt apply any debuff or buff to make that work its passive.
This is 100% false. Passive effects are not effects that are not buffs or debuffs. Passive effects are effects flagged to be passive.
"Buff" "Debuff" and "Passive" are labels placed upon effects. They are like colors. Saying passive effects are effects that are not buffs or debuffs is like saying purple rocks are rocks that are not blue or green. It is possible to be another color, and it is possible for an effect to be not a buff, not a debuff, and not a passive effect. Some node effects are not any of the three. The stun effect from relic strikers for example is not a passive stun even though it is not a buff or debuff, in that it does not interact with any ability in the game that otherwise affects passive stuns or passive effects in general.
Also since node doesnt apply any debuff or buff to make that work its passive.
This is 100% false. Passive effects are not effects that are not buffs or debuffs. Passive effects are effects flagged to be passive.
I think the difficulty comes with defining what effects will be flagged as passive or not. Usually when an ability is considered "passive" in games, it's used to describe an effect that doesn't interact the way effects usually do (like Regen passives not being able to be nullified, unlike Regen buffs).
In MCOC, passive effects do partially follow that norm, but there are two kinds of passive effects. For example, Nick Fury has a synergy with Deadpool that gives a Regen Passive. Nick Fury also passively regenerates after his LMD is destroyed. The Regen Passives can be removed by Nimrod and converted to a Shock debuff, but the passive regeneration can't be.
They are technically correct that the node is passive, as it doesn't apply buffs, debuffs, or passives to either champion. But it's not the same kind of passive within the system, which makes Mordo's AAR reduction description technically just incorrect sometimes.
I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."
Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.
All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).
The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.
That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
Glancing doesn't only reduce ability accuracy. Nimrod's ability accuracy isn't reduced when he glances while fighting Mutants.
I also tested mordo right now. His kit also says his ability accuracy cannot be modified but passivly. I went to a glancing node in 7.2.4. his sp1 degen triggered on hit but soul barb didnt. What the hell is this
I think Passive AAR is only considered things like Falcon's Lock On or Magneto's Magnetized. He shouldn't be immune to those node's Glancing AAR. I believe those nodes only give an 85% chance to glance, so you probably just got that lucky 15% on the sp1 and not on the sp2. Sounds like it's working just fine in that case.
Its not just that node. There is also a node that makes medium sized champs glance all of their special attacks. Also since node doesnt apply any debuff or buff to make that work its passive.
That's not how the node works. Particle Protector is the node that makes champions glance their attacks. Size Matters just gives that node exclusions, meaning it would have practically no effect without Particle Protector.
In this case it seems they're just defining passive AAR abilities as coming from a passive placed on the champion, so Mordo isn't immune to it. Maybe that's another bug, but it still makes sense if it isn't.
But i threw like 5 sp1s and all of them inflicted degen?
I'm not sufficiently familiar with all of these circumstantial exceptions, but I will point out that AA's description says "Archangel's Ability Accuracy cannot be decreased by his opponent's abilities."
Most people focus on the "opponent's abilities" part of this description, but there's another catch. It does not say AA is immune to ability accuracy modification. It says Archangel's ability accuracy cannot be decreased.
All champions have a stat called "Ability Accuracy." It is a stat like Physical Resistance or Critical Rating. We just don't normally see it in-game. If you know this, then AA's description appears to be stating *literally* that this stat cannot be decreased by opponent's abilities. That is not necessarily synonymous with being immune to ability accuracy modifications. There are ability accuracy modifications that do not affect this stat in the literal sense. For example, Slow reduces Evade ability accuracy by 100%. But I'm not sure if, under the hood, that touches champion ability accuracy: the precise mechanics are a bit hazy. Much like how once upon a time players thought (in part because of the way the game describes this ambiguously) that there was such a thing as "offensive ability accuracy" and "defensive ability accuracy" when in fact there's just ability accuracy (offensive ability accuracy is more or less ability accuracy while attacking, and defensive ability accuracy is ability accuracy when struck by an attack).
The game is consistent in its handling of ability accuracy in the sense that it is a computer and it can only do what it is told without making judgments or guesses, but I'm not convinced it handles all of these cases in a manner that is consistent with description. Because in many cases the descriptions mask technical details that are not exposed to the players.
That doesnt explain anything? Nimrod kit says he is immune to ability accuracy modification but still gets affected by glancing?
Glancing doesn't only reduce ability accuracy. Nimrod's ability accuracy isn't reduced when he glances while fighting Mutants.
I also tested mordo right now. His kit also says his ability accuracy cannot be modified but passivly. I went to a glancing node in 7.2.4. his sp1 degen triggered on hit but soul barb didnt. What the hell is this
I think Passive AAR is only considered things like Falcon's Lock On or Magneto's Magnetized. He shouldn't be immune to those node's Glancing AAR. I believe those nodes only give an 85% chance to glance, so you probably just got that lucky 15% on the sp1 and not on the sp2. Sounds like it's working just fine in that case.
Its not just that node. There is also a node that makes medium sized champs glance all of their special attacks. Also since node doesnt apply any debuff or buff to make that work its passive.
That's not how the node works. Particle Protector is the node that makes champions glance their attacks. Size Matters just gives that node exclusions, meaning it would have practically no effect without Particle Protector.
In this case it seems they're just defining passive AAR abilities as coming from a passive placed on the champion, so Mordo isn't immune to it. Maybe that's another bug, but it still makes sense if it isn't.
But i threw like 5 sp1s and all of them inflicted degen?
Comments
"Buff" "Debuff" and "Passive" are labels placed upon effects. They are like colors. Saying passive effects are effects that are not buffs or debuffs is like saying purple rocks are rocks that are not blue or green. It is possible to be another color, and it is possible for an effect to be not a buff, not a debuff, and not a passive effect. Some node effects are not any of the three. The stun effect from relic strikers for example is not a passive stun even though it is not a buff or debuff, in that it does not interact with any ability in the game that otherwise affects passive stuns or passive effects in general.
In MCOC, passive effects do partially follow that norm, but there are two kinds of passive effects. For example, Nick Fury has a synergy with Deadpool that gives a Regen Passive. Nick Fury also passively regenerates after his LMD is destroyed. The Regen Passives can be removed by Nimrod and converted to a Shock debuff, but the passive regeneration can't be.
They are technically correct that the node is passive, as it doesn't apply buffs, debuffs, or passives to either champion. But it's not the same kind of passive within the system, which makes Mordo's AAR reduction description technically just incorrect sometimes.