Behold, the Issue that arises when you Nerf Revive Farming to the Ground.

PolygonPolygon Member Posts: 4,546 ★★★★★
Disclaimer: this isn’t a post complaining to leave revive farming the way it is, I understand the issues and impact it has for the health of the game. (ironic though that most of the people that are agreeing with the nerf are the same ones that farmed countless revives from there themselves and already did multiple paths of necro)

What I’m instead advocating for in this thread is that Kabam takes a loot at incorporating additional ways for players to get revives as f2p.
Some plausible suggestions are:

1) increase the revive/potion/energy refill cap. These have yet to ever be updated despite other resource caps being updated

2) Add an additional daily quest that we can do similar to Apothecary that can only be done once per day, or once per X amount of days.

3) Revamp EQ to increase the drop rates of revives and potions (this would have to be a substantial upgrade since people would be using energy on EQ which costs a ton of energy, where they could have been using said energy elsewhere)

4) add another content that can drop revives from completion but the catch is that it has a bit of a moderate grind or challenge and cannot just be steamrolled via Autofighting.


Now for the actual problem that I elude to in my thread, the problem isn’t nerfing farming, it’s not doing anything to incorporate alternative f2p ways of getting the revives after nerfing.

Why’s that?

Well, as you know, most players like myself save their free 4 hour crystals for the next big challenging or Everest content because there is only so little time your stash can hold potions and revives before they expire.

So if you’re popping a ton of 4h crystals, you’re gonna get tons and tons of energy refills. Now since Kabam, cannot alter drop rates of these 4 h crystals, it follows that most of these energy refills will just expire into the Shadow Realm.

Note: this thread completely ignores the other obvious issue that those that already farmed the maps were able to explore or complete multiple paths of Necro, and if Kabam didn’t have an issue with changing the spawn rates or even dropping an announcement the first month that players already finished exploring because of this, then i’m sure the small amount of revives from the suggestions I’ve listed here would hardly even make a dent compared to how much revives one could obtain from the revive farm.
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Comments

  • DemonzfyreDemonzfyre Member Posts: 22,027 ★★★★★

    Or just buff apothecary and increase revive cap.
    It is literally enough to stop revive farms.
    But kabam just want us to spend money on the game lmao.

    If that were true, they wouldn't give you like 10 ways to get them and they would have immediately cut off 5.4.6.
  • PrentexPrentex Member Posts: 411 ★★
    Was there any eyplanation on how the rates will be nerfed?
    Like no revives at all in earlier content or just so little that its not worth it?
    Also since the new EQ format there are no revives and potions visible on the maps anymore, but every now and then at the end of the quest you get some, i liked it better before where i could choose a path with the revive on it...what do you think?
  • Drago_von_DragoDrago_von_Drago Member Posts: 933 ★★★★
    For progressing players, the 4 hr crystals giving more energy refills is great. For story content and EQ, it’s usually better to restart a quest and keep practicing than to power through with a bunch of revives.

    If you don’t have any more story content to complete, you’re a true end-game player and extra energy is going to waste unless you want to burn it in BG.

    For true end-game players doing end-game content (EOP/Carinas Challenges/Gauntlet/Necro) when they are released, revive farming allowed those players to convert that unused energy into revives to tackle the content that typically costs a lot of revives. You’re not going to keep restarting necropolis after a couple fights to try to do it with less revives.

    So maybe they can just reduce the drop rate of the energy refills from the revive farms as a start and see what that does? End game players can still find a use for energy refills they don’t have any content to use them on and the farming is no longer “unlimited” but is still an option.

  • KLZKLZ Member Posts: 279 ★★
    First of all, revive farming shouldn't exist, not everyone has to complete/ explore endgame content..
    Second, i never understood how that worked.. i mean, in order to redo the same paths you need a lot of energy, which you get with units, right? So why not just buy revives with units, maybe a bit more expensive, but still...
    And i think we have enough revives in daily content, Apotecary and 22h solo events..if you need more, buy them!! We get enough units just by playing the game.
  • KLZKLZ Member Posts: 279 ★★
    edited December 2023
    Then please explain!!
    We get about 60 revives/month. What more do you need??
    Or you guys want to fully explore Necropolis in one day and then complain that the game is boring, that there is no new content? That 8.3 is too easy? That Cerastes is a joke??
    Of course, if a player can farm 1000 revives, there is no content worthy enough...
  • FeuerschwerFeuerschwer Member Posts: 378 ★★★
    The revive farms typically drop energy refills, so revive farmers can end up approximately neutral on energy if the pick paths that have refills & revives.
  • KLZKLZ Member Posts: 279 ★★
    Then they should have nerfed the energy drops, lol
  • BringPopcornBringPopcorn Member Posts: 5,135 ★★★★★
    KLZ said:

    Then please explain!!
    We get about 60 revives/month. What more do you need??
    Or you guys want to fully explore Necropolis in one day and then complain that the game is boring??

    U get 60 a month with an expiration date of what? 15 days.. so you are not really getting the 60 to use as you need.. Yeah there are ways to manage stack expiration; but then you gotta juggle around. Also you get champions locked in other content which means you gotta work around schedules to actually sit down and do content that takes 3 hours or so.
    I am just explaining, I am not in favor of some things F2P players do. They are the most demanding for rewards and resources while they hog every unit for 4th, CM unit deals or Banquet.
  • KLZKLZ Member Posts: 279 ★★
    This game is all about managing resources, people have to understand that..
  • BringPopcornBringPopcorn Member Posts: 5,135 ★★★★★
    KLZ said:

    This game is all about managing resources, people have to understand that..

    Well if you managed well you would have realized that you really dont get to use 60 revives at the end of the month.
  • GalactikDonutGalactikDonut Member Posts: 393 ★★★

    You mean they want to control how many revives players can have without spending units for them…

    you can say the same thing about every resource in this game. do you complain when whales can get infinite gold and iso? when they get more catalysts? it’s a free to play mobile game. of course people who spend will get more than those who don’t. but they design content around people not buying 300 revives
  • MSTR_FSTR1MSTR_FSTR1 Member Posts: 9

    kabam wants to be in control of how many revives a player can reasonably have. this allows them to design content around that limit that they set. if they give out more free revives then new content will be designed to take more revives.

    Make content that takes 80 ish revives to complete and let them earn 1-2 a day. That sounds like it was well thought out.
  • Drago_von_DragoDrago_von_Drago Member Posts: 933 ★★★★

    You mean they want to control how many revives players can have without spending units for them…

    you can say the same thing about every resource in this game. do you complain when whales can get infinite gold and iso? when they get more catalysts? it’s a free to play mobile game. of course people who spend will get more than those who don’t. but they design content around people not buying 300 revives
    I don’t complain about spenders being able to buy revives. I don’t complain about spending period. I expect spending to get an advantage.

    But everyone keeps ignoring that units are also freely obtained. I’m not an arena grinder at all and I’m sitting on 3700+ units I didn’t spend money on. That’s 90+ revives. Add the 60ish I can earn in a month and I could throw 150 at necro without spending any money. If I were an arena grinder I could have easily had the units to throw 300 revives at a necropolis this month.

    This is just forcing a shift back to using units for revives for end-game content. It’s not reducing how many revives people can or will spend on content. It’s just forcing the use of units which means spenders might spend more and FTP will have to recalibrate the resource management around this.

  • GalactikDonutGalactikDonut Member Posts: 393 ★★★



    I don’t complain about spenders being able to buy revives. I don’t complain about spending period. I expect spending to get an advantage.

    But everyone keeps ignoring that units are also freely obtained. I’m not an arena grinder at all and I’m sitting on 3700+ units I didn’t spend money on. That’s 90+ revives. Add the 60ish I can earn in a month and I could throw 150 at necro without spending any money. If I were an arena grinder I could have easily had the units to throw 300 revives at a necropolis this month.

    This is just forcing a shift back to using units for revives for end-game content. It’s not reducing how many revives people can or will spend on content. It’s just forcing the use of units which means spenders might spend more and FTP will have to recalibrate the resource management around this.

    you still seem to be missing the main point. they don’t want to design content around players having an obscene amount of revives. yes you can spend units to get revives. but they aren’t encouraging it. you don’t have to use units for revives to do end game content. you can have about 75 at one time completely free. if you need more you can buy more, but kabam isn’t forcing you to. you can beat every piece of relevant content with the 75 free ones.
  • Drago_von_DragoDrago_von_Drago Member Posts: 933 ★★★★



    I don’t complain about spenders being able to buy revives. I don’t complain about spending period. I expect spending to get an advantage.

    But everyone keeps ignoring that units are also freely obtained. I’m not an arena grinder at all and I’m sitting on 3700+ units I didn’t spend money on. That’s 90+ revives. Add the 60ish I can earn in a month and I could throw 150 at necro without spending any money. If I were an arena grinder I could have easily had the units to throw 300 revives at a necropolis this month.

    This is just forcing a shift back to using units for revives for end-game content. It’s not reducing how many revives people can or will spend on content. It’s just forcing the use of units which means spenders might spend more and FTP will have to recalibrate the resource management around this.

    you still seem to be missing the main point. they don’t want to design content around players having an obscene amount of revives. yes you can spend units to get revives. but they aren’t encouraging it. you don’t have to use units for revives to do end game content. you can have about 75 at one time completely free. if you need more you can buy more, but kabam isn’t forcing you to. you can beat every piece of relevant content with the 75 free ones.
    My point is that this change is not meaningfully altering the amount of revives a player has access to. It is only shifting the way you have to obtain them. I’m not saying anyone needs more than 75 free ones to do the content. I’m saying before this change and after this change a FTP player can still just as easily throw 300 revives at any piece of content they want.

    The benefit I see for Kabam is that a spender who is on the GM fight and has spent their limited stash of revives and units will now spend some money to finish it instead. In the past, that spender could have farmed up enough revives to avoid the spend but with no farms they are more likely to be in a position to spend to complete the content.

    And I’m ok with that. I just don’t buy the “it’s to limit the design parameters” nonsense.
  • GalactikDonutGalactikDonut Member Posts: 393 ★★★


    And I’m ok with that. I just don’t buy the “it’s to limit the design parameters” nonsense.

    and i don’t buy that the world isn’t flat. and if you think a free to play player can still just as easily get 100 revives a week from farming using units then do it. grind 4k units a week. see how easy it is compared to
    auto playing an act 5 quest.
  • DNA3000DNA3000 Member, Guardian Posts: 19,663 Guardian

    I’m not saying anyone needs more than 75 free ones to do the content. I’m saying before this change and after this change a FTP player can still just as easily throw 300 revives at any piece of content they want.

    If that's the case, then there's no problem for F2P players..

    I just don’t buy the “it’s to limit the design parameters” nonsense.

    It is always more nuanced and more complicated than that, but the fact is that this has been a design concern of Everest-like content since before F2P monetization. It is always a factor in the design of such content, and while monetization always plays a role in a modern F2P game, the notion that the "design parameters" is just "nonsense" is objectively wrong, and literally anyone who has ever come anywhere near a game design studio would know this. You don't need to specifically know anything about MCOC itself to know this, because this is a pervasive universal issue.

    The fact that so many players feel they have things all figured out and they just know why game designers do what they do, and they are almost always completely wrong is why there are so few game design AMAs in the world, and almost none of them have game economy designers volunteering to do them. There is no reason to do that when the most common question you're likely to get are sliding scale politeness variations of "why do you always lie about what you do?"
  • Drago_von_DragoDrago_von_Drago Member Posts: 933 ★★★★


    And I’m ok with that. I just don’t buy the “it’s to limit the design parameters” nonsense.

    and i don’t buy that the world isn’t flat. and if you think a free to play player can still just as easily get 100 revives a week from farming using units then do it. grind 4k units a week. see how easy it is compared to
    auto playing an act 5 quest.
    That’s not the point I’m making. I’m not saying it’s just as easy to grind them in a week. I am saying it doesn’t meaningfully change how many I can access, FTP or not. There are FTP players with way more units than me saved up for the banquet event.

    This shift will just make players reconsider spending units on deals vs content completion. We’ll see players hoard units a little more to be ready for the next big thing. It will not significantly impact the amount of revives someone spends on content. It will significantly increase the units spent on revives for content. That’s my prediction.

    I know I’ll be holding on to more units in the future for content completion because of this announcement. I doubt I’m alone in that.
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